i actually feel like i lost some low end, my car used to pull damn hard even at 3000, well not damn hard but hard for low rpms. top end seems the same, the aftermarket pipe just looks and sounds so damn good!!!!

 

If anyone knows of a convenient way to put the nitrous fitting in the stock resonator please speak up, otherwise the mid pipe is staying. I laughed very hard when a couple of years ago someone posted about how the mid pipe gave you the lowend back...it was funny because you could clearly feel a loss, the mid pipe has kind of an empty feel to it, it's kind of hard to explain. But it still sounds good.

 

I miss the sound already....but I can finally hear my exhaust I might just put it back on considering I paid $80 for the damn thing! that's like $80 sitting around...

 

I apologize if I missed this but I also think the benefit of the stock midpipe is in the insulation....when testing midpipes on my '93 Altima I had noticed the aluminum midpipe was much warmer inside the tubing than the thicker accordian pipe....That and the fact that I missed the lowend tq more than I cared for the top end pull, esp w/auto gearing....

Jeremy

 

interesting little thread here. time to do a little swap back to functionality over form.

 

Exactly, I didn't want to start this ball rolling. But I'm not a firm believer in any of this. I'm not doubting you get 1 hp more and less air turbulance, but I have a buddy that owns a dyno. And the room for variance in a dyno is much more than people think. I have witnessed a 02 grand am gt stock. Dyno, Get off the dyno. Cool down re strap dyno agin and gain 6 horse power. Same cool down time. Re strap dyno agin and loose 4 horse power and be plus 2 from original. I also think that the fact that he did the stock intake first has something to do with numbers if cool down time was not exact. I personaly use the stock intake with a jwt filter. I'm not doubting the fact, just the numbers.

 

what about the fact that the resonator actually drops the velocity within the intake? i would think this would not be a good thing, actually lessoning the ram air effect as someone mentioned here.

 

It does? How?

 

The carefully calculated volume of the resonator is what creates the ram effect.

 

so...this whole thread...is about air intakes...
which we all know add about +/- 5hp and alot of sound...
and no air intake i'm aware of on a maxima ever changed anyone's 1/4 times...
so basically the engineers who made our intakes know more(designed it better) then the aftermarket companies!!! *gasp* who would have thought.

maybe it's me but i think there is WAY to much time thought about air intakes on this forum.

all i see air intakes as are a way of making a car sound fast. while it's really just as slow as it was stock. but hey...it sounds fast right?

 

ok ive been doing some reading, since this topic became very intresting and found this awsome info, this is A+++ stuff! im not even sure i understand all of it, so if someone inteligent would care to elaborate im sure we can all benift!
page...http://www.grapeaperacing.com/GrapeA...ionsystems.pdf

if anyone would like to take the time to read it it is highly infomative. there are actually some formulas (which i am not about to do, lol) you can use to figure out exactly which pipe would be better. plus other info on how a V6 is affected by the resonator.

 

Um, did you look at the dyno graph that was posted?

 

i could be wrong, i just figure the smother and longer the pipe the better flow, or velocity. the pipe with the resonator and accordian section seemsto break up the flow, although it may be true that the extra "stored" air may be a benift. honeslty i dont know. if i would i wouldnt be here trying to learn

but people are right this is a lot of comotion over 1 or 2 extra hp at max! we know those 8 hp claims for an intake gotta be cr@p. maybe ill go back to the berk midpipe just for the look of it.

 

The volume of air in the intake system resonates like a spring. By tuning the volume of the intake tract, you change the resonant frequencies of the "spring."

If tuned right, the oscillations line up with the opening of the intake valves, resulting in the ram effect.

As mentioned earlier, there's more to it than just a perceived flow capacity.

 

Disclaimer: This information was provided and based on my dyno which was performed on a dynojet dyno. By no means does this mean that you should throw away your midpipes if you think +/- 5hp is insignificant then keep your midpipe.
This was just ment to inform those who cared.
P.s you can always spend $130 an hour for a dyno like i did and try intake setups back to back if you think this information is inaccurate and wrong but i have another org member who was there and also withnessed this first hand.

 

I have no read everything that you have posted super6 but from what i know your car is a 5th gen and therefore you have both excellent lowend and highend power. This information may not apply to you since my dyno testing was done using a USDM Intake Manifold which is ment to produce excellent lowend power. From this data an inference can be made that this is why the 4th gen cars lose a decent amount of lowend torque. I believe in the stock intake Midpipe. if it was that simple to make hp Nissan was have placed a straightpipe there in the first place. It would have been cheaper than designing this resonated chamber.
Remeber this is not ment to tell anyone to do anything, i am just sharing some information i thought would be useful.

 

I too have seen the dyno numbers change 3-4whp on the same car, same day, same dyno, just different pulls. BUT! and a huge but at that is there is a VERY CLEAR difference in the shape of curves with and without the resonator. It's not just an elevated curve. That's the key, not the peak numbers.

 

Dave IMHO, what is the determining factor of the factory resonator? Placement is pretty solid. Can't really change it. But the 3-gen resonator is quite different than the 4-gen version. We just have a hole at the bottom of the accordian tube and a resonator chamber below. 4-gens have a box around the accordian tube and a resonator below. If one were to make their own resonator, should it be bigger than oem, same as oem or smaller?

 

to what's the verdict here? anyone else tested this on a dyno?

what is the total loss (integral) between the midpipe and stock resonator throughout the entire rpm range?

 

As for those of you that don't "feel" anything when going back to the stock resonator, you've got to give the ECU time to learn it's part throttle settings. You're also probably use to the excessive wail and rasp on the midpipe. I've tested every style of intake possible and it's clear that keeping the resonator does improve streetability in terms of part throttle acceleration, tip-in acceleration, and upon entry into a gear at WOT.

 

And you're using the stock hacked airbox, right?

 

Under that same premise wouldn't this dyno be illegitimate since sufficient time was not provided for the ECU to adapt to the Frankencar intake?
-Cyrus

 

I think that when the computer is in WOT mode, the settings stay the same, regardless of bolt ons. I think it takes time to learn when not in WOT mode (is it open or closed loop?).

 

so are dynos not able to measure some hp increases or decreases?
people say the same runs in the same day can vary, because of engine temp, ambient air temp, etc.
is there any chance the dyno graph posted could simply be showing the inability of a dyno to register small increases/decreases based on the idea that each run is 'a little different' ?

 

I confused the 350z has no resonator but the g35 does same engine? What does 00-03 maximas have later 3.0 to 3.5?

 

I've seen dynos of G35 sedans with the stock resonator and then the 350Z non-resonated pipe and there is no difference in power. Just sound. A lot of sedan owners still believe that the 350Z pipe gives them 5hp though. I guess it's hard to suck up your pride and admit that $120 tube didn't do anything I'd venture to say the lack of the resonator on the Z is simply a marketing ploy to make the 350Z sound sweet at WOT.....which it does.

5.5 gens including the Altima have resonators too. The 5.5 gen guys have noted that the stock intake is what's best at the track and around town.

 

Keep up the discussion everyone. Until spring I'm done testing on mine but all info meanwhile is welcome. Oh, and I'd kill to just spend $100 per 2-3 hp. I'm already underwater with the Auterra, PDA, manometer, CryO2 kit(s), Apexi, Autospeed subscrip, static vs dyn pressure tests, and battery relocation just for the intake stuff. Santa please bring me some fwtq.

 

i hear you on that i would pay if they could give me more hp and tq.

 

Dave i have to say thats why im so confused i was at a dyno and watched them put a z tube on a g35 and it gained around 5 hp every time this was a dynopack known to show very small changes like small sparkplug gap changes and lights commin on in real time .
When the 350z pipe went on the g35 the power went up.Thats why im very confused with all of this.
I do know that thing is called a oil seperator on our cars im very sure of that.

 

What oil?

Once this oil is seperated, where does it go?

 

My brothers G35 coupe with six speed manual saw no changes from the Z tube with stock air box other than sound(which is wonderful by the way).He has since added a pop charger but needs to redyno. Would you like to see his dyno from the Z tube Vs. Stock?

 

The 6th gen is a lot more straight as well, though it does have one resonator, still not as large asd the 4-5.5 g.

 

See u don't know if these comparisons can be made while the designs of the midpipes/resonators are diffrent on the 5th and 6th gen engines it maynot mean that the addition of a "frankencar/berk style midpipe would have a negitive affect". These engines have diffrent manifold designs and the 5.5/6th gen engine has variable valve timing. I am sure because of these diffrences they would react diffrently.

this is what my brothers dyno on his 6speed G35 Coupe looked like before Z tube and after Z tube. The stock G35 tube us pretty straight through but does have chambers for sound control. At the time the car was all stock with just intake tubes being changed.
run 002 is stock tube
run 003 is Z tube



For giggles this is my best dyno Vs. his best stock dyno
i have all mods listed in my sig in this dyno

 

Modded Max Vs. G dyno


Stock Gtube Vs. Z tube on G

 

5.5g max has a VERY similar resonator compared to the 3.0, and the 6th gens intake res. is very differen't, that's all I'm saying, trying to understand why different applications are employed and seeing the differences.

 

...just to update I put the stock resonator back on tonight. Sound is a little quieter but it howls under WOT and sounds 'clearer'...more muscular. The Frankencar midpipe gave it a hollow sound at WOT in the higher rpms. I can also hear the exhaust a little better.

Running cone filter with stock resonator...fyi.

 

actually there are fram air hog cone filters if the stock setup in what ever car is a cone shaped like the integra have cones stock so fram air hog does make a cone filter for that application.

 

omg i'm so confused, i hear this and that and don't know wht to decide.

lets say you have a y-pipe and the weather is cold for couple months. would a stock w/ k&n filter box be better than lets say place racing cold air intake?

 

Don't worry about which intake to get. The difference is not as grand as you would think. The bottom line is: If you're looking to go fast, spend your money elsewhere.

 

Amen to that brotha lol. Now please delete this thread. y would u bring this thing back to life??

-Paul