Big tax refund!!!!!! time for Illuminas+S-Techs
02-07-2005, 08:32 PM
#3
What are you lookin for? Looks or Comfort/Better Handling?
S-Techs will give you a very low drop, but harsher than stock even with Illuminas and worse handle-in compared to stock due to understeer. Most comfort is H&R's or H-Techs, which have slightly better handlin than H&R's. Lowest drop is Coilovers, which actually isn't much more than a strut+spring setup.
Me personally am prolly goin H-Techs on my Illuminas.
S-Techs will give you a very low drop, but harsher than stock even with Illuminas and worse handle-in compared to stock due to understeer. Most comfort is H&R's or H-Techs, which have slightly better handlin than H&R's. Lowest drop is Coilovers, which actually isn't much more than a strut+spring setup.
Me personally am prolly goin H-Techs on my Illuminas.
02-07-2005, 08:42 PM
#5
hey do yu think this will be a good set of springshttp://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...spagename=WD1V
02-07-2005, 09:33 PM
#6
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best setup = H&R and illuminas, PERIOD
I personally would never buy Vogtland springs. It's funny how the person advertising them on e-bay states things without proof. He/she bashes H&R springs from the very beginning and is all big on how the Vogtland are "made in Germany". Wow, now where in the f**k does he/she think H&R come from?!
I personally would never buy Vogtland springs. It's funny how the person advertising them on e-bay states things without proof. He/she bashes H&R springs from the very beginning and is all big on how the Vogtland are "made in Germany". Wow, now where in the f**k does he/she think H&R come from?!
02-07-2005, 09:42 PM
#7
Originally Posted by Armani
best setup = H&R and illuminas, PERIOD
I personally would never buy Vogtland springs. It's funny how the person advertising them on e-bay states things without proof. He/she bashes H&R springs from the very beginning and is all big on how the Vogtland are "made in Germany". Wow, now where in the f**k does he/she think H&R come from?!
I personally would never buy Vogtland springs. It's funny how the person advertising them on e-bay states things without proof. He/she bashes H&R springs from the very beginning and is all big on how the Vogtland are "made in Germany". Wow, now where in the f**k does he/she think H&R come from?!
02-07-2005, 10:42 PM
#8
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Originally Posted by Armani
best setup = H&R and illuminas, PERIOD
im callin BS big time. H&R doesnt even drop u by 1" so why bother cashin out almost $600 for an inch when u can go down much lower??? PERIOD
H&R= least drop not BEST. define BEST for us please
02-07-2005, 11:02 PM
#9
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Originally Posted by 98MikeXimaSE
im callin BS big time. H&R doesnt even drop u by 1" so why bother cashin out almost $600 for an inch when u can go down much lower??? PERIOD
H&R= least drop not BEST. define BEST for us please
H&R= least drop not BEST. define BEST for us please
02-07-2005, 11:39 PM
#10
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Originally Posted by Armani
You have got to be sh!ttin me. I can honestly say that was the dumbest, most idiotic response I have ever read here on the rog. It's quite obvious that your definition of "BEST" is the amount of drop it gives...boy you got a lot of reading to do.
whats YOUR defention of BEST
02-08-2005, 12:34 AM
#12
LMAO!! Well, before this Thread gets out of hand, we need to know what exacty you're lookin for "josehernandez94". Like I stated in my original post, do you want to go for looks or comfort/handling?
Struts:
- Tokico Illuminas = Great. Best known strut for our car out there.
Illumina paired Springs:
- H&R's = Great. Level, merely raked 1.4 F, 1.3 R Drop (like stated by Irish.) Also, it's said when paired with Ben's Rear Shock travel Mounts to be a better/moothertighter ride than Stock. So benefits over Stock on all angles.
- H-Techs = Great. Raked, 1.6 F, 1.2 R Drop. PHenry had a write-up on these. More sportier feel and better handling than H&R's, but ever so SLIGHTLY less comfortable compared to H&R's. Prolly when paired with Ben's Rear Mounts, would be just as comfortable as H&R's without the Rear Mounts.
- S-Techs = Great. Raked, 2.2 R, 1.8 R Drop (not 100% positive, but pretty sure.) Superior drop of all Strut/Spring combos out there w/o gettin Coilovers. Def. more Show than Go, as the handling actually suffers due to understeering and is said to be worse than Stock. Also, obviously the ride is not near as comfy as H&R's/H-Techs, nevermind Stock.
Notice I said "Great" for each one. That's because they are all great, but just are better in certain fields than the others. Don't forget either, that there are other things to take into account as well like whether the ride is level, raked or sagging. The list goes on tho, but I figured I'd do these 3 since they seem to be the most popular ones around. Just make sure, you know what you want and what exactly you're lookin for. Then ask for peoples opinions and suggestions on their usage of them.
Struts:
- Tokico Illuminas = Great. Best known strut for our car out there.
Illumina paired Springs:
- H&R's = Great. Level, merely raked 1.4 F, 1.3 R Drop (like stated by Irish.) Also, it's said when paired with Ben's Rear Shock travel Mounts to be a better/moothertighter ride than Stock. So benefits over Stock on all angles.
- H-Techs = Great. Raked, 1.6 F, 1.2 R Drop. PHenry had a write-up on these. More sportier feel and better handling than H&R's, but ever so SLIGHTLY less comfortable compared to H&R's. Prolly when paired with Ben's Rear Mounts, would be just as comfortable as H&R's without the Rear Mounts.
- S-Techs = Great. Raked, 2.2 R, 1.8 R Drop (not 100% positive, but pretty sure.) Superior drop of all Strut/Spring combos out there w/o gettin Coilovers. Def. more Show than Go, as the handling actually suffers due to understeering and is said to be worse than Stock. Also, obviously the ride is not near as comfy as H&R's/H-Techs, nevermind Stock.
Notice I said "Great" for each one. That's because they are all great, but just are better in certain fields than the others. Don't forget either, that there are other things to take into account as well like whether the ride is level, raked or sagging. The list goes on tho, but I figured I'd do these 3 since they seem to be the most popular ones around. Just make sure, you know what you want and what exactly you're lookin for. Then ask for peoples opinions and suggestions on their usage of them.
02-08-2005, 06:03 AM
#14
Originally Posted by happyricefob
maxspeed is the best 
02-08-2005, 07:51 AM
#15
Newbie - Just Registered
Join Date: Nov 2004
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02-08-2005, 09:24 AM
#16
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IMO best spring and shock setup is progress + illumina. ull be dropped more than H&R and ur ride will be better than S tech's. anyone who wants anything lower should go right to true coilovers.
all H&R gives u is a 1" drop and its probably least harsh ride out there exluding stock springs.
all H&R gives u is a 1" drop and its probably least harsh ride out there exluding stock springs.
02-08-2005, 10:07 AM
#17
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Originally Posted by 98MikeXimaSE
IMO best spring and shock setup is progress + illumina. ull be dropped more than H&R and ur ride will be better than S tech's. anyone who wants anything lower should go right to true coilovers.
all H&R gives u is a 1" drop and its probably least harsh ride out there exluding stock springs.
all H&R gives u is a 1" drop and its probably least harsh ride out there exluding stock springs.
...again, where in the f**k do you get 1" from?
I put them on my car, will have pics soon. I paired mine up with illuminas and right away the drop was approx. 1.3" in the front. When I measured a few days after, it has settled and is now 1.5". That's right, it's 1.5", not 1.4". Yes, I've taken exact measurements so get your story straight and stop posting BS. Seems that you are still under the impression that with a lower drop your car will handle better. That's soooo not true. There are many other things which make your car handle extraordinarily well, not necessarily just springs. You're very narrow-minded, thinking "springs = handling". Ummm, no, it's not like that. Perfect example of this are WRC rally cars, none of which have a drop, at all. If anything, WRC cars sit even higher than what the stock suspension of such a car is because of the rough terrain they are 90% of time forced to maneuver through. Yet, at the same time, they handle 100 times better than stock. It's therefore no surprise that the cost of suspension ALONE on an average WRC rally car is usually $100,000+. Don't believe me? Read up on real WRC rally car specs.
02-08-2005, 10:20 AM
#18
Supporting Maxima.org Member
Join Date: Jul 2001
Posts: 836
Originally Posted by 98MikeXimaSE
IMO best spring and shock setup is progress + illumina. ull be dropped more than H&R and ur ride will be better than S tech's. anyone who wants anything lower should go right to true coilovers.
all H&R gives u is a 1" drop and its probably least harsh ride out there exluding stock springs.
all H&R gives u is a 1" drop and its probably least harsh ride out there exluding stock springs.
02-08-2005, 10:32 AM
#19
Not DAVEB the parts guy
Join Date: Aug 2000
Posts: 8,555
My H&Rs dropped my 96 5 speed by 1.5" in the front and rear. I had all types of spring setups and the H&Rs were by far the best in terms of ride and handling. I had Koni yellow struts and those are by far the best struts you can get.
Anything over a 1.5" drop and you compromise ride, handling, and avoidance manuver safety due to lack of wheel travel and out of wack suspension geometry.
Anything over a 1.5" drop and you compromise ride, handling, and avoidance manuver safety due to lack of wheel travel and out of wack suspension geometry.
02-08-2005, 11:19 AM
#21
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2004
Posts: 196
Wow, didn't realize I'd start such a debate.
To those of you who asked what I'm going for:
The Max is riding on 18s right now and there's probably a 4" gap, which looks bad. My number 1 priority is to get rid of that gap as much as possible, without dropping the huge money on coilovers. This is why the S-Techs seemed like a good idea.
I'm willing to compromise a little bit in ride quality if the appearance is that much better. Therein lies my question. Is the 2.2" drop of S-techs that much more noticeable than the 1.5ish" drop of H&Rs, H-Techs, the Tokico setup etc? I've looked around at cardomain and maxmods, but there really aren't that many pictures with S-Techs--and there certainly aren't any that give "before" and "after" shots, so I know how the car would look pre- and post-dropped.
I guess the other consideration is that I live in Upstate NY, which gets pretty hellish winters. Most of the roads aren't too bad, but there's one with F'ing horrible potholes. I'll probably just wind up avoiding that road in the future, just so I don't mess up my rims and what not, but I guess that could be a consideration in deciding how much to drop it.
To those of you who asked what I'm going for:
The Max is riding on 18s right now and there's probably a 4" gap, which looks bad. My number 1 priority is to get rid of that gap as much as possible, without dropping the huge money on coilovers. This is why the S-Techs seemed like a good idea.
I'm willing to compromise a little bit in ride quality if the appearance is that much better. Therein lies my question. Is the 2.2" drop of S-techs that much more noticeable than the 1.5ish" drop of H&Rs, H-Techs, the Tokico setup etc? I've looked around at cardomain and maxmods, but there really aren't that many pictures with S-Techs--and there certainly aren't any that give "before" and "after" shots, so I know how the car would look pre- and post-dropped.
I guess the other consideration is that I live in Upstate NY, which gets pretty hellish winters. Most of the roads aren't too bad, but there's one with F'ing horrible potholes. I'll probably just wind up avoiding that road in the future, just so I don't mess up my rims and what not, but I guess that could be a consideration in deciding how much to drop it.
02-08-2005, 11:34 AM
#22
Not DAVEB the parts guy
Join Date: Aug 2000
Posts: 8,555
Originally Posted by josehernandez94
Wow, didn't realize I'd start such a debate.
To those of you who asked what I'm going for:
The Max is riding on 18s right now and there's probably a 4" gap, which looks bad. My number 1 priority is to get rid of that gap as much as possible, without dropping the huge money on coilovers. This is why the S-Techs seemed like a good idea.
I'm willing to compromise a little bit in ride quality if the appearance is that much better. Therein lies my question. Is the 2.2" drop of S-techs that much more noticeable than the 1.5ish" drop of H&Rs, H-Techs, the Tokico setup etc? I've looked around at cardomain and maxmods, but there really aren't that many pictures with S-Techs--and there certainly aren't any that give "before" and "after" shots, so I know how the car would look pre- and post-dropped.
I guess the other consideration is that I live in Upstate NY, which gets pretty hellish winters. Most of the roads aren't too bad, but there's one with F'ing horrible potholes. I'll probably just wind up avoiding that road in the future, just so I don't mess up my rims and what not, but I guess that could be a consideration in deciding how much to drop it.
To those of you who asked what I'm going for:
The Max is riding on 18s right now and there's probably a 4" gap, which looks bad. My number 1 priority is to get rid of that gap as much as possible, without dropping the huge money on coilovers. This is why the S-Techs seemed like a good idea.
I'm willing to compromise a little bit in ride quality if the appearance is that much better. Therein lies my question. Is the 2.2" drop of S-techs that much more noticeable than the 1.5ish" drop of H&Rs, H-Techs, the Tokico setup etc? I've looked around at cardomain and maxmods, but there really aren't that many pictures with S-Techs--and there certainly aren't any that give "before" and "after" shots, so I know how the car would look pre- and post-dropped.
I guess the other consideration is that I live in Upstate NY, which gets pretty hellish winters. Most of the roads aren't too bad, but there's one with F'ing horrible potholes. I'll probably just wind up avoiding that road in the future, just so I don't mess up my rims and what not, but I guess that could be a consideration in deciding how much to drop it.
Remember that when adding lowering springs, it is important to cut the bump stops in relation to the drop. A 1.5" drop requires cutting 1" of bumpstop. Without cutting the bumpstops, you'll be crashing into them on the smallest of bumps. Due to design, I choose Koni struts because they won't blow if you bottom out unlike most any other make of strut even the Illumnias.
I suggest you live with more gap instead of living with poor handling and a harsher ride.
02-08-2005, 11:46 AM
#23
I guess these are on stock wheels but there are some fotos to compare different springs and drop:
http://www.innerbean.com/housecor/sp..._decision.html
http://www.innerbean.com/housecor/sp..._decision.html
02-08-2005, 12:22 PM
#27
Originally Posted by flthere
I guess these are on stock wheels but there are some fotos to compare different springs and drop:
http://www.innerbean.com/housecor/sp..._decision.html
http://www.innerbean.com/housecor/sp..._decision.html
02-08-2005, 12:24 PM
#28
Originally Posted by josehernandez94
Drop Zone? I've not heard good things about Drop Zone.
i was kidding, dropzones are terrible, and after seeing that guys thread about the spring breaking on him! plus crappy customer servise I'll never give a second thought to them
02-08-2005, 12:46 PM
#29
FYI here's my drop (TEIN High-Techs on Tokico Illuminas, 5-speed).
The reason I picked High-Techs over H&Rs or Tokico springs is their larger front/rear drop differential (1.6" F/1.2" R). Most aftermarket springs for the Maxima seem to be designed to be fairly even on an automatic Max since most Maxes are autos. I did not want that. As you can see, the drop is quite even (keep in mind the front wheelwell is larger than the rear). I don't think it actually dropped 1.6" in front because of my transmission (manual weighs almost 60 pounds less than auto), but that was the whole idea, and even drop. Aesthetically I might want the front a tiny bit lower but for handling it's great. I don't mind that you can see my white Illumina struts from some angles:
See http://vquick.net/gallery/evos for a few more pics.
The reason I picked High-Techs over H&Rs or Tokico springs is their larger front/rear drop differential (1.6" F/1.2" R). Most aftermarket springs for the Maxima seem to be designed to be fairly even on an automatic Max since most Maxes are autos. I did not want that. As you can see, the drop is quite even (keep in mind the front wheelwell is larger than the rear). I don't think it actually dropped 1.6" in front because of my transmission (manual weighs almost 60 pounds less than auto), but that was the whole idea, and even drop. Aesthetically I might want the front a tiny bit lower but for handling it's great. I don't mind that you can see my white Illumina struts from some angles:
See http://vquick.net/gallery/evos for a few more pics.
02-08-2005, 12:53 PM
#31
Armani, you have the most biased voice on this thread
don't think your 1.3" drop is the "best" just since you own the springs
i doubt you've ever had S-techs on your car, so don't make assumptions
also, understeer is not really increased when lowering.....it might be more because we have FWD cars
don't think your 1.3" drop is the "best" just since you own the springs
i doubt you've ever had S-techs on your car, so don't make assumptions
also, understeer is not really increased when lowering.....it might be more because we have FWD cars
02-08-2005, 12:59 PM
#32
Go Hokies!!
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 402
Originally Posted by Dave B
Unfortunately stock ride height you see on the 4th-5th gen Maxima is basically all the upwards wheel travel. When you cut the gaps down really short, you bascially have no wheel travel. Even with quality springs from H&R and Eibach, a decent sized wheel gap remains because these companies understand the necessity of wheel travel in relation to handling. If you want the best handling, ride quality, and the way the car should have looked from the factory, H&R or Eibach springs and Illumnia or Koni is the only way to go. With larger the rims, the gap becomes more obvious even though it's not any bigger unless you tires are shorter than stock. Larger rims and shorter tires are usually heavier than stock therefore the ride quality detoriates. Add in stiffer springs and the ride gets even worse. Don't make the same mistake a lot of us made in getting too low of spring because after 3 month to a year, the ride becomes annoying and dangerous on potholed or rutted surfaces.
Remember that when adding lowering springs, it is important to cut the bump stops in relation to the drop. A 1.5" drop requires cutting 1" of bumpstop. Without cutting the bumpstops, you'll be crashing into them on the smallest of bumps. Due to design, I choose Koni struts because they won't blow if you bottom out unlike most any other make of strut even the Illumnias.
I suggest you live with more gap instead of living with poor handling and a harsher ride.
Remember that when adding lowering springs, it is important to cut the bump stops in relation to the drop. A 1.5" drop requires cutting 1" of bumpstop. Without cutting the bumpstops, you'll be crashing into them on the smallest of bumps. Due to design, I choose Koni struts because they won't blow if you bottom out unlike most any other make of strut even the Illumnias.
I suggest you live with more gap instead of living with poor handling and a harsher ride.
I have 18" rims with the tokico illumina/tokico spring setup, and there was still some noticeable wheel gap. Are s-tech's really a bad choice? If so, I might just keep my setup and live with the gap.. I already ordered the s-tech's, though. Hmm, got to make a decision.
02-08-2005, 01:18 PM
#35
Originally Posted by MDeezy
ebay
02-08-2005, 01:20 PM
#36
fadeaway if you cut your bumpstops you won't have any problems
I DIDN'T cut my bumpstops and i've never had a problem.....i've hit my bumpstops prolly 3 times in 9 months
dealing with understeer.......i really haven't heard s.techs causing this but who knows, its hard to believe though b/c these springs actually pitch your car down in the front a little bit.....i've never personally had problems with understeer since having the springs on
I DIDN'T cut my bumpstops and i've never had a problem.....i've hit my bumpstops prolly 3 times in 9 months
dealing with understeer.......i really haven't heard s.techs causing this but who knows, its hard to believe though b/c these springs actually pitch your car down in the front a little bit.....i've never personally had problems with understeer since having the springs on
02-08-2005, 01:22 PM
#37
Here's some info on why not to lower your car too much: http://e30m3performance.com/myths/We...t_transfer.htm
(Great site; also check out the strut tower bar theory and splitter theory)
I did my suspension months ago but somehow I missed that I should have cut the bump stop. I thought that was only for really low drops. First of all, what is the bump stop? Is it the top part of the black dust boot? Do you just cut an inch off that? And is this for both front and rear? I have Ben's modified strut mounts in the rear which give me almost an inch more of travel.
(Great site; also check out the strut tower bar theory and splitter theory)
Originally Posted by Dave B
Remember that when adding lowering springs, it is important to cut the bump stops in relation to the drop. A 1.5" drop requires cutting 1" of bumpstop. Without cutting the bumpstops, you'll be crashing into them on the smallest of bumps. Due to design, I choose Koni struts because they won't blow if you bottom out unlike most any other make of strut even the Illumnias.
02-08-2005, 01:32 PM
#38
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Posts: n/a
there is a GD #2 on illuminas. They come out to be cheap, $408 shipped. I bought mine like 2 weeks ago. You will NOT find them cheaper anywhere.
As for H&Rs, there's also a GD which sells them for $226 shipped, which is where I also got mine. I didn't feel like waiting, but I saw them brand new on e-bay before for a little less than that. It's your call, I wanted them fast so I didn't care to save the $10 or whatever.
As for H&Rs, there's also a GD which sells them for $226 shipped, which is where I also got mine. I didn't feel like waiting, but I saw them brand new on e-bay before for a little less than that. It's your call, I wanted them fast so I didn't care to save the $10 or whatever.
02-08-2005, 01:40 PM
#39
http://forums.maxima.org/showthread....ing+bump+stops
http://forums.maxima.org/showthread....ing+bump+stops
Some people in the above two threads are advising NOT to cut bump stops, including Matt93SE who is a god of Maxima suspension....
Edit: more good theads that largely support cutting or KYB bump stop/dust boots:
http://forums.maxima.org/showthread....ing+bump+stops
http://forums.maxima.org/showthread....ing+bump+stops
http://forums.maxima.org/showthread....ing+bump+stops
Some people in the above two threads are advising NOT to cut bump stops, including Matt93SE who is a god of Maxima suspension....
Edit: more good theads that largely support cutting or KYB bump stop/dust boots:
http://forums.maxima.org/showthread....ing+bump+stops
http://forums.maxima.org/showthread....ing+bump+stops