So what you're saying is you lock up the brakes whenever you stop short? No wonder your tires were shot. I am convinced that you don't have a clue.

 

1) I have ABS, so I can't flat-spot my tires.

And I'm not retarded, so I generally never need to stop in MINIMUM distance. When conditions are less-than-optimal, I usually also test-spin them a touch (easy to find during acceleration) to get an idea of what grip is out there. Naturally, that is something I do in a safe place. So I don't get surprised when a light goes yellow on me since I have an idea of what stopping distance the conditions dictate.

2) In a true emergency situation, it's better to risk flat-spotting tires than hit what's in front of you. It would seem you need to re-take Econ 101 as well as driver's ed. Besides, you'd have to skid a long way on a dry road to flat-spot street tires. Good luck doing it on wet roads.

Dave

 

Tires are one of the most important parts of the car.. I don't see how people can goto These chain garages and get 4 tires for 100 bucks.

I ONLY run nokian. They are a bit on the expesive side but they have never put me in a odd position. I do like to push my car and that includes taking rotaries at 45-50 miles an hour. Yes they squeal a bit but i'm 100% in control.

Did i mention that are all weather? Snow and Rain are a cake walk also.

 

I read some of these posts and find certain things extremely funny. For example, people on thise forum will research things like what type of intake to install, or what y-pipe to buy. But one of the most important things on the car, the tires, people just go and buy whatever is cheaper without doing any research. A tires cost does not reflect how it will perform in certain conditions. Certain tires perform very well in the dry but can't do sh***t in the rain. Others have excellent rain traction, but dry traction might not be as good. Research is very important. Also take in account what type of driving you do. People in Florida do not need tires that have a good snow rating. People that live in the Northeast, (if you drive year round) do.

 

get either the bfg kdw ta's or the michilin piolet sports 2 best tires on the market

however they are summer tires

 

Amen. Neglecting your tires is a form of rice.

And don't forget the tires that get bad in rain after wearing down some, too! The first 5k on most tires is good to excellent; it's the balance of the life where you really see the differences.

Dave

 

lmao! hey me too! ahaha my tires suck too. im also kinda wondering why the fronts are diff size than back...? 65's in front and 70's in back? idk what this means but idk if its necessarily a GOOD thing...

 

The whole point is that you can stop faster and with more control when you DON'T lock up the brakes.

 

Ooookay here. What dgeesaman was saying was correct. As long as your brakes are able to lock up your wheels consistantly, they aren't a factor. They already have more than enough power to overcome the tires, which are the next component in stopping.

This obviously doesn't mean that locking up your tires is the fastest way to stop. Doing so will convert a good portion of your brakes' effort to turning your tires into road paste. The quickest way to stop a car is at the threshold of traction. But, if you go over this threshold, you're into paste territory unless you're incredibly quick and accurate with your right foot. It is incredibly hard to do a panic stop without locking up your tires. ABS allows you to keep your tires turning by sensing when they're locking up and decreasing brake pressure immediately, thus returning to slightly below your tire's upper threshold of traction, keeping you very close to the maximum stopping power of your car.

This should be common knowledge to any person who considers themself car-saavy.

If you don't have ABS, you're SOL. Get used to threshold braking, swallow your pride and don't follow cars as closely--you will NOT be able to effectively stop your car in a panic situation unless you are incredibly experienced.

Anyway, obviously, the tire's threshold of traction comes into play next. There are also things like static (and with some cars, dynamic) brake distribution and weight transfer, but in the end your car will only stop as fast as your tires will let it.

Oh yeah, I flat spotted two tires once. They were pieces of crap and I treated them like it. And boy, was it fun... until the ebrake shoes came loose and tore off the disc backing plate and caliper in the process.
Man, was I stupid.

 

well not to make a joke about this but i would really like a pair of tires like that so that i can drift some times i have es100's and they wont let me get too sideways even when it is wet *shrugs* o well

 

I have to be honest - given the current level of discussion of this thread, if I recommended threshold braking at 15% slippage on wet roads it would be a recipe for disaster. It takes some practice, feel, and collectedness to pull that off in a panic situation. The average driver at street speeds, dealing with the average level of variables in the driving environment, is arguably better off mashing the pedal for a straight line stop.

ABS is the best answer for braking, but lets worry about adequate tires first

Dave

 

You probably don't have enough horsepower.

Dave

 

Something else to consider. Many people who have ABS do not know how to properly brake. In order for the ABS system to function properly, a person has to mash down on the brake pedal as if they where in a panic stop, and maintain a constant brake force. Some people are not use to the sensation of the wheels not locking (due to ABS) but instead pump the brake pedal in a effort to stop the vehicle quicker (thereby deactiveating the ABS system).

 

UTQGS testing procedures for "Traction" is ONLY done on a wet surface. Dry traction is not tested, nor is lateral traction.
So, yeah...And yes DOT is like your big brother - they are out there to help you and everyone else on the roads.

Oh yeah, and testing the traction of your tires in the winter by accelerating until you lose traction will not indicate reliably how well the tires are at stopping in the same conditions. Two very important reasons why 1.) when you accelerate the force being acted on the tire is on opposite side of the tread - so your tread design has a different character on how it attains its grip. During acceleration the backside of the tread design is enacted to grip, but during a braking situation the front side of the tread is enacted. There are measurable differences in how the tire grip depending on what side of the tread is being acted on. And 2.) weight transfer. During acceleration the front traction is reduced because of less weight - and the opposite happens during braking. So with that realization you can come to your own conclusion on how much more the tires will grip during deceleration vs acceleration.

Just trying to add to the conversation.

 

Indeed, you are right. I wrote AFAIK since I couldn't find it quick on google. It comes up fast looking for "UTQGS":
http://www.nhtsa.dot.gov/cars/rules/...te/807805.html

The test is:

"Traction:
Traction grades are A, B or C. Where A is the best and C is the worst.

Traction is the rating of a tires ability to stop a car in straight line motion on a wet test surface. The test only looks at straight line SKIDING
on Concrete and asphalt surfaces. All tests are performed on government skid pads.

20 measurements are taken on a control tire on an asphalt surface and then
averaged. Then 20 measurements are taken on a control tire on a concrete
surface and then averaged. The test tires follow the same procedure. The
results are compared and the tires a assigned a Traction Grade."

But the test uses only brand new tires. Once significant wear takes place, the rubber compound often shows different grip properties and the siping is worn away. So in this sense I feel the DOT test is anything more than a reference point - the real world performance is almost always less than the test values, usually much less.

Both of those tests make my acceleration test conservative, which is the way I want it. The whole idea is to gain a feel for the road and never underestimate stopping distance.

 

I hope they dont use "BRAND-spanking new" tires...It takes a few hundred miles for the production oil to leave the rubber surface...That's why new tires should never be driven aggresively when you first get them mounted because the oil makes them slippery...

That link must be outdated...They dont have an "AA" traction rating heh...

And good point about the acceleration grip test - it never occured to me that you want a conservate result - good thinking.

 

yeah i don't know about you guys but i'm still LMAO at the name of these tires!! this could be something straight out of the Simpsons -- like the "sorny" TV, or Krusty brand partially gellatinated artificial non-dairy imitation frozen beverages (milk shakes).

 

Which Hankook tires are you using? Some of them are actually completely awesome summer hi-perf tires with great wet traction besides... I think RS2 or something of the sort.

 

The cheaper version-ventas or something with a v. Might stick with the Cooper Cobras. I think the Maxima calls for a hard tire. The Goodyears were ok. Dunlops A2's were great but wore down too quick. Hankook was decent and priced right. Had a deal on the Cobras I couldn't pass up.

Now my driver's side brake is grinding when pressed all the way in after I just changed them. Have to figure out what that is all about. Brakes are definately a low point on this car.

 

you wanna talk about scary my 95 five speed had the entire tranny rebuilt in second gear i floor it the pedal is glued to the floor had to use the ebrake to stop

 

Thanks for the lesson. I definitely will remember this when I buy tires. Sorry to hear about that.

 

THATS NOTHING!! my wheel fell off when i was driving.....apparently someone tried to steal my rims, took off 3 of the lugs and left 2 on....

 

I don't own a Maxima. I can't believe I just registered just to tell you guys the pronounciation of the Fate-O tire. It's pronounced Fa(as in father) and Tay. So it's Fa-Tay O. I buy them here locally in South Florida from a wholesale place. Since I'm poor, I will continue to use them and risk my neck, if that's actually the case. Cheap used tires are better than re-treads and more worn-down used tires. They have actually held out really well here in Miami.

 

Newer info on tire grades...

http://www.nhtsa.dot.gov/cars/rules/.../brochure.html

http://www.dot.gov/affairs/nhtsa0704.htm

http://www.safercar.gov/Tires/Index.htm

A little info on the tire...

http://www.tirekingdominternational.com/TKIFate.do

http://www.fate.com.ar/esp/frame.asp...links_prod.asp


Finally can we maintain a logical adult discussion and keep the personal attacks to PM...