chazmcgee

iTrader: (5)

I remember a thread that was talking about how you couldn't put it in reverse after a certain mph and how it would make an auto tranny tear itself apart or something well earlier this night i was going meet some friends and i was on the bridge crusing at 80 thats a chillzone only 20over and not many cops on this bridge anyways well sometimes i put my shifter into N,i like to think this saves gas and puts less stress on my engine, as i do when i see a red light or going down a slope, which i was kinda, and for some reason my dumb *** pressed in the button and slid it into R i **** my pants no really i did, good news is I didnt hear anything all my dash lights came on i immediately turned my car off and steered on the shoulder started my car and it had a hard start until i tapped the gas peddle then woke right up and nothing broke which is gangsta as hell i thought i lost my just replaced tranny or atleast lost the lovely R gear, but yea nothing happened and i pondered that it just cut my fuel pump off, which would explain my start, but i didnt notice if my car died or not it must have killed itself it was really hard to tell driving at like 600 rpms with music up loud but yea i bet it did the lil *****, so yea im happy. and consider that myth busted beaches

Edit: look how close i came to the 5 speed swap

the_3d_man

iTrader: (1)

wow... english > you.
and putting it in neutral is not saving you any gas. Just let off the gas when you are coasting.

JwaxMax99

iTrader: (14)

Longest 'run-on sentence' ever. /thread.

chillin014

iTrader: (67)

holy sh*t that was hard to understand.
"and i was on the bridge crusing at 80 thats a chillzone only 20over and not many cops on this bridge"
that doesnt make the SLIGHTEST bit of sense.

f550maranello2

iTrader: (2)

it wont hurt the trans... its smart enough not to go in reverse...

2 days ago i was going 80 (in my 07 impala) and dumped into first.... noting happened

slinky87

iTrader: (1)

yea revese lockout is a great thing. Its not hard to understand what he's saying but putting in neutral rather than coasting does save gas smart one. The engine is still under load when off the gas because its still in gear! Neutral dosent apply any load and notice the idle is at 700rpm and not 1500-2400 rpm. Food for thought

chazmcgee

iTrader: (5)

yea i thought the lower the Revolutions the less gass but 3d man sees different on that then me, and i dont care if they cant understand what i say its how i wrote it deal with it thanks for the back up slinky

MaximaDvr

yeah pretty sure i understood all of this.

pretty sure this means he was doing 80 in a 60 but it was all right because there aren't many cops around there.

chazmcgee

iTrader: (5)

thats exactly what i meant lol edit: and im also glad to know that our autos have reverse lockout now

chillin014

iTrader: (67)

sweet, we got a decoder on the org. i was reading my head throbbin ready to get some sleep(real tird) addicted to the internet.

MaximaDvr

^
yeah i'm right there with you on that sleep/addiction thing too.

pmohr

iTrader: (26)

Hey, 'smart one'? Yea.

The ECU goes into fuel cut when decelerating in gear until engine speed reaches ~idle (IIRC). Decelerating in gear uses no fuel, versus leaving it in neutral where it has to supply fuel to let it idle.

Learn before you speak. Please. This is where ****ing misinformation comes from on this board.

protomor

iTrader: (1)

lol Im love auto trannies. They are so dummy proof.

slinky87

iTrader: (1)

Really, so your saying "fuel cut" ,but yet the RPM's stay higher when cruising in drive uses less fuel than idle. when rpm's are higher than idle its still using more gas to consume at a higher rate of engine speed period. more RPM more fuel, and you of all people should know automatic's keep load on the engine except when in reverse an neutral and park, or in drive at zero MPh. maybe you ashould think about retaking that ASE test partner before you try to correct me again.

JwaxMax99

iTrader: (14)

here we go.

mtrai760

iTrader: (19)

You shouldn't try to call people out unless your 100% sure your correct, which in this case your not. When allowing the car to decelerate in gear, such as when going down a hill, NO fuel is being delivered to the engine. Auto or manual. Period. I have verified this with a wideband A/F controller with a datalogger. Don't need an ASE test to know that one. :

04maxlover

let the bashing begin...

pmohr

iTrader: (26)

How about you think about not being a rude, ignorant ***** before you try to correct me again, newbie?

Think about it.

Have you heard of the FSM? Ever take a gander?

The RPMs are higher, yes. You are decelerating. COMPLETE FUEL CUT WHEN DECELERATING IN GEAR. Shall I make a banner by the highway, would that help you learn?

When RPMs are higher and accelerating or cruising, yes, it takes more gas than idle. THOSE SITUATIONS DO NOT APPLY HERE.

BTW, automatics keep load on the engine only when the vehicle's moving, which INCLUDES reverse. You think that isn't a drive gear? That it doesn't connect to the engine through the TC like the 1st-4th?

****ing christ, I know I'm no nismology, Freeway, or the like, but how about you respect those that know more than you, and don't try to find every little thing that you think you may be right about with your high school 'auto shop' knowledge.

Do you know what an ASE test is? Do you have ANY automotive experience beyond installing your JDM tyte neons and strobes, double-decker wing? Do you have any certifications?

...that's what I thought.


****ing a.

IlyaK

iTrader: (47)

It ruins the tranny. I did this accidentally aswell when I was 16 lol. Blew out 1st, 3rd, and 4th gears. Only had 2nd.

ouzo99max

iTrader: (2)

i understood everything he said

slinky87

iTrader: (1)

[QUOTE=pmohr]How about you think about not being a rude, ignorant ***** before you try to correct me again, newbie?
newbies dont swap engines and transmissions out of maxima's or have over 50 posts and because you took your ASE dosent mean you know s*** ive seen some real dumba** ASE mechanics in my lifetime. lets also go back to your first post which started the whole thing. maybe you should learn to show respect when you post. thats what educated upstanding people do maybe the above was a self reflection of your qualities???

Think about it.

Have you heard of the FSM? Ever take a gander?

The RPMs are higher, yes. You are decelerating. COMPLETE FUEL CUT WHEN DECELERATING IN GEAR. Shall I make a banner by the highway, would that help you learn?
hey ******* more RPM's more fuel if the fuel was cut the engine would shut off. therfore more rpm's more fuel even when under zero load (i.e coasting...)

When RPMs are higher and accelerating or cruising, yes, it takes more gas than idle. THOSE SITUATIONS DO NOT APPLY HERE.
above statment

BTW, automatics keep load on the engine only when the vehicle's moving, which INCLUDES reverse. You think that isn't a drive gear? That it doesn't connect to the engine through the TC like the 1st-4th?
[I]the situation at hand is when the car is moving jacka** and what you said makes no sense to support your statment, when the car is in drive theres a load on the engine exccept 0mph LOAD isa parasitic term meaning the engine still has to use more gas becauce its under load unlike the neutral gear becauce zero load is present[I]

****ing christ, I know I'm no nismology, Freeway, or the like, but how about you respect those that know more than you, and don't try to find every little thing that you think you may be right about with your high school 'auto shop' knowledge. how do you figure im not ASe certified already? oh cause its not in my sig? i know you must be thrilled your almost done with your test but guess what youre still not a ase master or certified so you have zero ground to talk smack to anyother person who post something that conflicts with your b.s

Do you know what an ASE test is? Do you have ANY automotive experience beyond installing your JDM tyte neons and strobes, double-decker wing? Do you have any certifications?
thats has to be the dumbest thing youve said today. and yea ive been in the auto repair game for almost 8 years now. Ive already been a parts manager i have my diagnostic certifaction oh th biggest thing i left ive been Ase certified for over a year now since i actually finished my tests maybe you should sit down lil man and stop the b.s

slinky87

iTrader: (1)

you shouldnt co-sign for people who think they know it all. besides that crap whats your a/f when cruising and at idle. and to be prove me wrong about this get a liquid flow meter or get a scan showing your IPW's and so on idle vs. Cruise. and please stop saying theres no fuel delivered, if their was no fuel your car wouldnt run.

the_3d_man

iTrader: (1)

... There are so many things wrong with what you just posted... do you think the engine is just going to seize up and the car will screech to a halt if it stops getting gas? He doesn't have to give you any proof. It IS in the FSM. If you are decelerating and you don't give it gas, it cuts the fuel.
and do you really think they would design the car so that it has to be put into neutral to get the most efficiency out of it?

the_3d_man

iTrader: (1)

mtrai760

iTrader: (19)

You have a lot to learn about how EFI works. The fuel pump can run all the time, and with the 4th gen Maxima having a return style fuel system, if you installed a flow gauge then it would STILL show fuel passing by, even if you wired the fuel pump to run while the engine was completely shut off. Does that mean fuel is getting into the cylinders? NO. Fuel injectors are not controlled by fuel flow, but by electrical pulses sent by the ECM, so your flow would prove NOTHING. Now, a Innovate LM-1 wideband airfuel controller shows the ratio of air and fuel coming out of the exhaust. How could that NOT be accurate? Please, explain this, or shut up. Would you like to read about this new fangled technology before your foot gets any further in your mouth? Here: www.innovatemotorsports.com
That is what you ACTUALLY use to properly tune and engine, because it actually shows how much fuel to air your car is using. Now, if you go to the website and look up some FACTUAL information, you will see that, and I quote: "For free air it should show 20.9%."

So what your trying to tell me, is that when I'm cruising or in neutral, and my AFR is going between 14.0-15.2, which tells me the O2 sensors in my car are doing there job to keep the car running stoichiometricly, and then, when I go down hill, with the car in gear, and the reading goes to 20.9 THE WHOLE TIME UNTIL I PRESS THE GAS PEDAL, that I'm wrong, that is not really what I am seeing? I know, it is somehow tricking the wideband, and even though it is reading free air, there is really fuel burning still?

I think your burning something, and inhaling, and its time to put it down. You have been proven wrong, walk away.

slinky87

iTrader: (1)

this is getting better and better each turn. Now let me clarify something for everybody my main idea throughout this is that mileage would be better if you were to go down in a hill in neutral rather than drive. Th flow meter would be on both feed and return lines, im going to test my idea versus you guys if im wrong i will openley admit it and lesson learned. or vice versa

pmohr

iTrader: (26)

My BS? You mean Nissan's BS, the BS that's in the FSM? The BS that has been going on with different manufacturers for a while now? Yea, such a bull**** idea, cutting fuel when decelerating because it's not needed. Let's just waste it all.

Incorrect. /thread.

pmohr

iTrader: (26)

I never said I knew it all, did I? Please, find me a SINGLE post I've ever made where I've stated this.

If you look, I haven't. Don't know where you got that from.

chazmcgee

iTrader: (5)

so yea im glad my tranny's ok. this thread snowballed into a monster i thought it would be better to put it in N but i geuss i was wrong but i will do it anyway just cause im my minds eye it feels right

andrei3333

Dont ever put the tranny into N to "save gas" its useless, what if some idiot steers in front of u and u need to hit it to avoid an accident ? guess what those 3 extra seconds it takes u to shift and the tranny to lock, is gona be spent on hitting the idiot in front of u

+ do this: for ONE full tank of gas do that N thing and record how many miles u drive until u need to fill up, then fill up when u have to and record the amount of gallons you put in. divide miles by gallons and thats your MPG

next tank u dont do that N thing at all, and calculate the MPG again, do this several times, lets say for 2 months, come back and find this thread and let me know how much gas u saved, oh and good luck cause the N thing will not save u any gas that u can notice or calculate.

and BTW, can we stop the arguing here? **** its annoying to see mature adults endulge themselves in this nonsense. Just post the facts and proof, and if u got no proof then say so -- just experience. Period!!!

chazmcgee

iTrader: (5)

i dont care i see how leaving it into D is more sufficient like i see the arguments above, and i came to my conclusion as if you push a tire down the street and then you quit and watch it roll away just because your not pushing no more means its gonna flat out stop it slowly loses force, once again people are gonna be like wtf this dude is so not clear but yea i understand but its my habbit to put it into N at stop lights mostly not like i go hill seeking and N down all of them i just feel like if my cars sitting still why not be in N no brake wear no tranny load or nothing probably more engine load but idc im leading the Nuetral army.

Nismo

iTrader: (18)

stick it in park next time and post results

hiren_patel_83

iTrader: (2)

let the man do what he wants, if he wants to put the car in neutral that's his thing.

Tver_Chupra06

iTrader: (1)

Questiong that is kind of related. When you are at a light and put the car into D from N and it starts rolling: that doesnt mean that you're supplying more gas right? All it is, is taking those 700 rpms and using them to move instead of just sit. How would you explain that you're rolling down a hill at 2400 rmp and using the same ammount of gas as when youre at 700 rpm? If you were standing at a light in neutral and pressing on the gas to 2400 rpm you would be using much more gas than just sitting there. The fact that the engine is achiving a higher ammount of revolutions means that its using more gas. There are more combustions per minute so how c ould it be using the same amount of fuel? Im not trying to start the arguments up again and will be the first to admit that im a newb but from what i know from simple morcycles engines(and i know a decent amount) the higher the rpm- the more fuel ur using. Again, im just trying to learn something so dont start b***
*ing at me for it.

EnervinE

iTrader: (11)

You know, ignoring all of the pointless arguing, I've actually learned a lot from this thread. Thanks guys.

DJ420

iTrader: (77)

I have too. Do not switch into 'N' when going downhill or at stop lights because it could cause a massive argument on the forums!

chazmcgee

iTrader: (5)

lol, Reverse got over looked as being the culprit lol

slinky87

iTrader: (1)

i finally have way to isolate my results for mileage i rewired a instang MPG meter to the max and went from there. I found by going down hills while in drive causes a 6%increase in fuel consumption over neutral. while nothing ground breaking its due to the fact that the car is slowing down while going in drive or coasting. In neitral theres nothing to slow the car down but the brakes meaning that would yield a less parasitic event on the whole motion of having to acclerate after coasting or going down hill. FYI as well if nissan engineers were so smart why the hell do we have all these electrical and so on problems with maximas??? hmm we all know here **** from the factory was ment to be disputed or re-proven and nothing should be taken as hard truth until you test it youreself. im through with this i gave my day off to this b.s and look foward to enjoying my cognac tonight you all have fun-

Jesse729

I've actually been in a vehicle where someone put it in park while moving about 40 mph. The funny thing about it is they had to move through the highly controversial gear of N and then the some what controversial gear of R and then P That is like a triple no no.

When shifting to P it doesn't really do much the parking pin just grinds on the transmission and won't lock into place kinda like grinding the gears in a manual.

mtrai760

iTrader: (19)

Let me guess, you used a vacuum type gauge to test this? If so, That will not provide you with an accurate picture of your fuel consumption while not under a load. Think of the engine as a big air pump, that is all it really is. While vacuum will change when the throttle is depressed, while not under a load, such as traveling down a hill while still in gear, you could shut the car off, and the vacuum level will not change. An engine does not require fuel to turn over. Need proof? Go park on a hill, with your car in gear, facing downward of course, and release the brakes. If the hill is anything over 3 degrees or so, you will notice that your car starts to move, gravity will drive the car down the hill, and since the car is in gear, it will turn the motor over. Your car will not start, it does not need to be running for the engine to turn over, it is just a big air pump. Overcome the compression stroke of the engine, and you can turn the motor over freely, it's not hard.

What is the engine running, that it cannot run without combustion? Lets see, the oil pump is mechanical, as long as the engine is turning, which we know it can do without combustion, then the oil will pump. Water pump, same thing, power steering, same thing, a/c compressor, same thing, alternator, run off of a belt, so we still have electrical power, so really, other than for acceleration, why do we need combustion? Short answer is, we don't. The momentum of a moving 3000lb vehicle down a hill is enough to overcome the compression stroke, and the parasitic loss from the engine accessories. With the transmission basically turning the engine over, we have no reason to keep supplying fuel to the engine while going down hill. Ever notice how your car ever so slowly decelerates while going down a hill? That is a combination of your compression stroke, and the parasitic loss from your engine accessories, along with the rolling resistance of your tires and transmission, coupled with the fact that the engine is recieving no fuel at a zero load condition.

Do I have my ASE certification? No. I do have my A&P however, and have worked on helicopters for the military for 10 years. Does this make me an automotive expert? No. But it has given me the ability to understand the concepts of how pretty much anything mechanical functions. I used to think the same thing, that going downhill in neutral must save some gas, even if it was only a tiny bit. Then I got a wideband a/f gauge, which is the ONLY accurate way of measuring whether or not fuel is flowing in your engine, unless you have a consult hooked up and your watching your injector flow in real time. After actual testing (I was tuning a turbocharged car at the time) I found that only pure air flowed at a zero load condition going down a hill. A wideband will not measure pure air if there is fuel present, its just not possible. It even states in the FSM that at a zero load, no fuel is delivered. Now if you get back down to your set idle level while at zero load, then yes, it will begin to deliver fuel again, even going down hill. That is because the engine must keep running.

I'm not trying to argue with anyone, just educate. I would say go down to your local nissan and ask them, but most of them are idiots anyway. I would encourage anyone with more questions to ask, and to check out www.howstuffworks.com Its a real BASIC understanding on engines and transmissions, but it will give you a basis to go off of for further learning and the seperation of fact from internet myth.