over heating, tons of rust... what to do...
09-15-2013, 08:13 PM
#1
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 17
over heating, tons of rust... what to do...
so... My 99 i30 is overheating within 30 minutes. At first it was only overheating when ac or heater....YES HEATER... was on, but has been getting worse.
I drained and flushed coolant with a cleaner 3 times now.
I took the radiator and radiator fans off my max and installed them as well as a brand new stat.
I swapped radiators because my max currently isn't running, and the fans are only about a year old. And, the radiator on the i30 was full of rust, so i was just hoping that + stat change would fix the problem. I've only had this i30 a year (have to get inspection this month, so a year almost to the day) without any overheating issues up until about 3 weeks ago.
I've checked to make sure there was no foam on the oil cap and dipstick, and checked to make sure no liquid out of exhaust.
Took the i30 a mechanic, told them I've flushed, changed stat rad and fans. They did a chemical test on coolant and oil to verify head gasket was not leaking either way. They messed with it for about 2 days, said water pump was fine. They ended up replacing stat again, to make sure the one i got wasn't faulty.
The radiator i just put in it has rust already, they showed my my stat i just put in 3-4 days prior, covered in rust.
I'm almost betting my heating core is clogged, but i want to try and flush the entire system (not just core) until water is clear. Every time i drain the radiator, it's nasty brown... I know using a water hose is a nono, but after the water is clear, i will fully drain and fill with 50/50.
okay, with the background story out of the way, time for the questions.
1)What would be the best/fastest way to get out all of the rust?
2)How would i flush the entire cooling system with a hose? From what i read, the t adapter is mainly to back-flush the heater core? I can flush radiator separate from the rest if that helps to take it out.
3)should i just buy all new hoses, new core, new rad, new stat, new pump, and hope for the best?
4)if i do number 3, what about the rust that's probably around the head how would i get all of that out? I don't want to mess up a new rad because of it...
I'm sure the rust is through out the entire system, when i take the return hose off the rad i can clearly see it caked on the sides of the hose, i have stuck a water hose in there and ran water hose full blast until water was clear, but rust did not come off the sides.
Sorry for this jumbled up mess of a post...
Any other information needed to clear any of this up, I'll be happy to provide.
Any information given is grateful, thank you in advance.
I drained and flushed coolant with a cleaner 3 times now.
I took the radiator and radiator fans off my max and installed them as well as a brand new stat.
I swapped radiators because my max currently isn't running, and the fans are only about a year old. And, the radiator on the i30 was full of rust, so i was just hoping that + stat change would fix the problem. I've only had this i30 a year (have to get inspection this month, so a year almost to the day) without any overheating issues up until about 3 weeks ago.
I've checked to make sure there was no foam on the oil cap and dipstick, and checked to make sure no liquid out of exhaust.
Took the i30 a mechanic, told them I've flushed, changed stat rad and fans. They did a chemical test on coolant and oil to verify head gasket was not leaking either way. They messed with it for about 2 days, said water pump was fine. They ended up replacing stat again, to make sure the one i got wasn't faulty.
The radiator i just put in it has rust already, they showed my my stat i just put in 3-4 days prior, covered in rust.
I'm almost betting my heating core is clogged, but i want to try and flush the entire system (not just core) until water is clear. Every time i drain the radiator, it's nasty brown... I know using a water hose is a nono, but after the water is clear, i will fully drain and fill with 50/50.
okay, with the background story out of the way, time for the questions.
1)What would be the best/fastest way to get out all of the rust?
2)How would i flush the entire cooling system with a hose? From what i read, the t adapter is mainly to back-flush the heater core? I can flush radiator separate from the rest if that helps to take it out.
3)should i just buy all new hoses, new core, new rad, new stat, new pump, and hope for the best?
4)if i do number 3, what about the rust that's probably around the head how would i get all of that out? I don't want to mess up a new rad because of it...
I'm sure the rust is through out the entire system, when i take the return hose off the rad i can clearly see it caked on the sides of the hose, i have stuck a water hose in there and ran water hose full blast until water was clear, but rust did not come off the sides.
Sorry for this jumbled up mess of a post...
Any other information needed to clear any of this up, I'll be happy to provide.
Any information given is grateful, thank you in advance.
09-15-2013, 09:26 PM
#2
If you think the heater core is somehow a problem, you can take the hoses off that go to ti and either plug them together or seal them off. It is not needed as far as the engine is concerned. However, I doubt that it is causing the problem.
Since you are using a different radiator, I think you can rule that out.
That leaves 2 things, the thermostat and the water pump. Non Nissan thermostats bought at the local parts store seem to be hit or miss when it comes to working correctly. I would recommend that you get a Nissan thermostat.
Then you have the water pump. Unless you take the water pump out of the car, there isn't much that you can inspect. About all you can do is see if it is leaking, you can't tell if it is pumping. If the engine was run for a long time without antifreeze, you will get that brown muck and yuck. And the water pump does not like it. Pics...
Since you are using a different radiator, I think you can rule that out.
That leaves 2 things, the thermostat and the water pump. Non Nissan thermostats bought at the local parts store seem to be hit or miss when it comes to working correctly. I would recommend that you get a Nissan thermostat.
Then you have the water pump. Unless you take the water pump out of the car, there isn't much that you can inspect. About all you can do is see if it is leaking, you can't tell if it is pumping. If the engine was run for a long time without antifreeze, you will get that brown muck and yuck. And the water pump does not like it. Pics...
09-15-2013, 10:15 PM
#3
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 17
The stat was replaced twice in the past week or so.
First time i did it was a motorad.
The the mechanic changed it with a stant.
The stat on my max was working just fine i can try it.
Soooo.... could i do this to test those 2:
1) take stat out of max, test it in hot water to see if opens.
2) take water pump out of max, inspect it well.
and put both of those in my i30 to see if that resolves the issue?
And how would I flush all that brown crap out of the system? every time I drained the coolant (after every chemical cleaner flush, as well as after changing parts) it was always nasty brown, and it's sticking all over the radiator i just took off the max and was all over the stat i put in that the mechanic took out to put another new one in...
The radiator looked brand new on the inside, even still had that pretty neon green color coolant still in it after about a year of sitting =)...
__________________________________________________
correction on first post (not like it matters) the fans from the max
are about a year an a half. I bought them because one of the old
ones broke... but the max has been out of service for about a year.
__________________________________________________
First time i did it was a motorad.
The the mechanic changed it with a stant.
The stat on my max was working just fine i can try it.
Soooo.... could i do this to test those 2:
1) take stat out of max, test it in hot water to see if opens.
2) take water pump out of max, inspect it well.
and put both of those in my i30 to see if that resolves the issue?
And how would I flush all that brown crap out of the system? every time I drained the coolant (after every chemical cleaner flush, as well as after changing parts) it was always nasty brown, and it's sticking all over the radiator i just took off the max and was all over the stat i put in that the mechanic took out to put another new one in...
The radiator looked brand new on the inside, even still had that pretty neon green color coolant still in it after about a year of sitting =)...
__________________________________________________
correction on first post (not like it matters) the fans from the max
are about a year an a half. I bought them because one of the old
ones broke... but the max has been out of service for about a year.
__________________________________________________
09-16-2013, 08:41 AM
#4
Replace the pump, it is difficult enough that just inspection is a waste of time. Open radioator drain plug and run with hose in the radiator. Don't bother with chemical flushes. If anything use Cascade dishwasher detergent. Sounds like you are not getting circulation.
09-16-2013, 10:25 AM
#5
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Portland, Oregon
Posts: 2,979
Our engines are made out of aluminum. The radiator is also aluminum. I believe that the only thing that can rust is the impeller on the water pump.
It is possible that the cleaners you have been using are helping to corrode the impeller on the water pump. That might be where the rust is coming from.
You might check if one of the radiator hoses is getting soft and then collapsing in on itself as the engine turns faster.
It is possible that the cleaners you have been using are helping to corrode the impeller on the water pump. That might be where the rust is coming from.
You might check if one of the radiator hoses is getting soft and then collapsing in on itself as the engine turns faster.
09-16-2013, 11:17 AM
#6
I doubt id a cooling system flush would damage the impeller blades. Cast iron engines have been around a lot longer than aluminum engines and are not destroyed by a flush. Even if the flush were to react with the iron, it is flushed out with clear water and any reaction would cease. The only thing to worry about is rust. Adding antifreeze or a rust inhibitor would prevent rust.
09-17-2013, 03:59 AM
#8
WOW!! That was actually someone's water pump that was corroded/dissolved. But I would park the car, start the car and open the hood. While running, rev the engine when it reaches normal temp to see if lower hose binds while revving like previous post stated. If not, remove water pump and replace. A clogged heater core would not overheat your car. You would not get no heat inside and that's all because I just changed mine last summer so I know.
09-18-2013, 01:33 PM
#10
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Portland, Oregon
Posts: 2,979
The pump on the right looks brand new. it has large vanes on the impeller.... the part that turns. They move the water around. The one on the left is old and corroded. The vanes are pretty much gone. The pump will turn, but will not move water anymore. This could be the OPs problem.
09-18-2013, 03:39 PM
#11
The pump on the right looks brand new. it has large vanes on the impeller.... the part that turns. They move the water around. The one on the left is old and corroded. The vanes are pretty much gone. The pump will turn, but will not move water anymore. This could be the OPs problem.
09-19-2013, 03:06 PM
#13
The pump on the right looks brand new. it has large vanes on the impeller.... the part that turns. They move the water around. The one on the left is old and corroded. The vanes are pretty much gone. The pump will turn, but will not move water anymore. This could be the OPs problem.
09-19-2013, 07:16 PM
#15
09-19-2013, 11:08 PM
#17
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 17
well, i think my water pump looks fine... looks almost exactly like my new one... looks like it could pump water just fine =/ (sarcasm)
was changing the pump... a screw fell into the timing housing... took rest of day to fish it out...
putting it all back tomorrow, hopefully before the rain comes in.
Working a lot, and in middle of packing. So, took a while before i could even get started on this. the pump its self was fairly easy and quick to get out. took be about 10-15 mins to get the belt tension off, pin the timing tension, chain off pump, etc... a bit of a b_-_- though in the amount of space given... lots of ways to bust a few knuckles and tear up back of hands...
[edit]
The original water pump still had "nissan" on it... wonder if it was ever changed, could have been... but probably not...
was changing the pump... a screw fell into the timing housing... took rest of day to fish it out...
putting it all back tomorrow, hopefully before the rain comes in.
Working a lot, and in middle of packing. So, took a while before i could even get started on this. the pump its self was fairly easy and quick to get out. took be about 10-15 mins to get the belt tension off, pin the timing tension, chain off pump, etc... a bit of a b_-_- though in the amount of space given... lots of ways to bust a few knuckles and tear up back of hands...
[edit]
The original water pump still had "nissan" on it... wonder if it was ever changed, could have been... but probably not...
Last edited by donniemo; 09-19-2013 at 11:21 PM.
09-20-2013, 01:01 PM
#19
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Portland, Oregon
Posts: 2,979
Congratulations!
You found your rust problem. Looks just like the pump the other guy had. Oh wow.....
You found the mystery without spending tons of money or selling the car. The new stat and radiator are good to have anyway.
I am an older guy..... I know I am somewhat clueless about the modern slang of most of you.
You found your rust problem. Looks just like the pump the other guy had. Oh wow.....
You found the mystery without spending tons of money or selling the car. The new stat and radiator are good to have anyway.
I am an older guy..... I know I am somewhat clueless about the modern slang of most of you.
09-20-2013, 02:43 PM
#20
Just curious, how many miles do you have on your max?
I took my original water pump out at 196k and it looks brand new. Already bought a new one, so oh well, preventative maintenance
09-20-2013, 03:32 PM
#21
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Portland, Oregon
Posts: 2,979
bprice92 said that he replaced his water pump with 192k miles on it, and it looked brand new, preventative maintenance......
My radiator failed recently. I had just bought all of the coolant hoses this car uses at amazon.com. they were so much cheaper than the local auto parts stores that I bought a water pump with the savings. So I replaced all of the hoses. The old hoses appeared to be original Nissan labeled hoses. My 96 Max has 185k miles on it. This might not have been necessary. Better safe than sorry though. I will install the water pump sometime this winter. (I have a heated garage).
Hoses are better than they were in the 1970s.....
I feel that it makes more sense to replace the water pump and hoses when I want to instead of when a broken hose makes me fix it when it wants me to. That is often on the hottest day of the year. When I am stuck in traffic while climbing Bad *** Pass with the wife and kids in the car.....
My radiator failed recently. I had just bought all of the coolant hoses this car uses at amazon.com. they were so much cheaper than the local auto parts stores that I bought a water pump with the savings. So I replaced all of the hoses. The old hoses appeared to be original Nissan labeled hoses. My 96 Max has 185k miles on it. This might not have been necessary. Better safe than sorry though. I will install the water pump sometime this winter. (I have a heated garage).
Hoses are better than they were in the 1970s.....
I feel that it makes more sense to replace the water pump and hoses when I want to instead of when a broken hose makes me fix it when it wants me to. That is often on the hottest day of the year. When I am stuck in traffic while climbing Bad *** Pass with the wife and kids in the car.....
09-20-2013, 06:30 PM
#23
yes switch the o rings around, you can tell because the "top" ring on your new pump isn't as tight as it should be.
09-20-2013, 08:33 PM
#24
this is why it's so critical to change the anti-freeze, it helps keep the corrosion out of the block and protects the heads. i do mine every 2 years and it looks brand new. i just replaced the upper and lower rad hoses cause they were 18 years old. and new clamps.
09-20-2013, 10:02 PM
#25
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 17
d@mn it =/... took me for ever to get the screws in (was hard to line up the holes with such little space, and scared to drop bottom on back into timing housing... that was a pain in meh a$$...) and i already put new liquid gasket and put plate back over... HOW DID I MISS THAT!!!
was so ready to finish this up tomorrow.
started raining today before i could finish up last little bit. guess by the time i'm done, i could knock one out in 15 minutes xD.
as for how many miles my max has, 256k. but this isnt my max.
my i30 has ~165k i'd have to check again.
09-22-2013, 03:50 AM
#27
Member
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Fort Worth, TX
Posts: 153
Yeah, regardless of condition the 4th gen Max's just don't fetch that much cash. Only reason I'm keeping mine is cause I'll never recoup near as much money as I've got sunk in it. Rock solid motor, everything else breaks.
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