To all with 18's
02-05-2004, 08:21 AM
#1
Junior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 24
To all with 18's
do your 18's make your max quicker or slower??? i bought chrome 18's and they are about the weight as my stock wheels but they made my max soooo slooow. Im selling them and i dont know if i should get lightweight 17s or 18s... any help.
Why'd you buy them in the first place? My 18's are heavier than the stock 17's....but then again I knew that before buying them. Sorry dude, I just don't feel sorry for someone who buy 18's and then whines about them. 
02-05-2004, 11:04 AM
#6
Guest
Posts: n/a
bigger the rims, the more distance between the hub and actual ground contact, resulting in more force required to move the car. unless you compensate for the loss (y pipe should do it), it will be slower, no matter how it feels, unless you get some really light 18", that can bend in any hole. it is a trade off.
it will also throw your speedo off... by how much, i have no clue.
it will also throw your speedo off... by how much, i have no clue.
02-05-2004, 11:09 AM
#7
Originally Posted by EvilRoadsVictim
bigger the rims, the more distance between the hub and actual ground contact, resulting in more force required to move the car. unless you compensate for the loss (y pipe should do it), it will be slower, no matter how it feels, unless you get some really light 18", that can bend in any hole. it is a trade off.
it will also throw your speedo off... by how much, i have no clue.
it will also throw your speedo off... by how much, i have no clue.
02-05-2004, 11:13 AM
#8
Donating Maxima.org Member
Join Date: Apr 2001
Posts: 1,085
I have 18's on my Max. At first I thought the car was slower, but later realized the car was just getting MUCH better traction since I upgraded the tires to Toyo Proxes. The wheels weren't spinning like crazy like they did with the stock Potenzas. Are you sure it is slower? Could it be in your head? The reason I say this, my tire/wheel combo is only 1 lb heavier than stock.
02-05-2004, 12:05 PM
#9
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 277
18's don't make the car slow, the weight and final diameter of the wheel and tire selections make' the differnence
i.e. 17" rim with 225/50/17 weight 50lbs
18" rim with 245/40/18 wight 50lbs
car is neither faster or slower, but will handle better with the bigger rim.
i.e. 17" rim with 225/50/17 weight 50lbs
18" rim with 245/40/18 wight 50lbs
car is neither faster or slower, but will handle better with the bigger rim.
02-05-2004, 12:08 PM
#10
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Charlotte, NC
Posts: 1,687
I lost 3 HP to the wheels with my rims, and they weighed the same weight as stock (when off the car).
The 18" rims put the center of weight further away from the center of the wheel than the 17" rims did. In doing so, this causes a slight increase in power needed in order to rotate the wheel.
Depending on what rim selection you choose, you will experience the same thing.
The car does handle better with larger rims.
The 18" rims put the center of weight further away from the center of the wheel than the 17" rims did. In doing so, this causes a slight increase in power needed in order to rotate the wheel.
Depending on what rim selection you choose, you will experience the same thing.
The car does handle better with larger rims.
02-05-2004, 03:38 PM
#13
Originally Posted by EvilRoadsVictim
bigger the rims, the more distance between the hub and actual ground contact, resulting in more force required to move the car.
The issue is 100% related to WEIGHT. It all comes down to rotational mass. Even 1-2 lbs can make a difference.
02-05-2004, 04:59 PM
#14
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 301
Originally Posted by asu174
This is very, very inaccurate. The center of a 15" wheel should sit the same distance off the ground as a 19" wheel when using the correct tire size. Even if you do you use the incorrect size tire, the difference will not be significant enough to make a difference.
The issue is 100% related to WEIGHT. It all comes down to rotational mass. Even 1-2 lbs can make a difference.
The issue is 100% related to WEIGHT. It all comes down to rotational mass. Even 1-2 lbs can make a difference.
Here is an example of how:
Take 2 wheel/tire combinations. We will use a 17" and an 18" as an example. Assume they weigh the same down to the gram. However, the weight of the 18" is distrubeted further from the center (a larger wheel radius makes this very plausible.)
At the same rotational velocity, the 18" will have more velocity per gram of mass because the mass is further from the center. This means there is more energy in the wheel and therefor required more force applied (well, the same force for longer,) than the 17" wheel to achieve the same rotational velocity.
Physics is good, umkay?
02-05-2004, 06:01 PM
#16
Originally Posted by Ben
You are partially correct sir. However, it is not just the weight, but the distribution of weight.
Here is an example of how:
Take 2 wheel/tire combinations. We will use a 17" and an 18" as an example. Assume they weigh the same down to the gram. However, the weight of the 18" is distrubeted further from the center (a larger wheel radius makes this very plausible.)
At the same rotational velocity, the 18" will have more velocity per gram of mass because the mass is further from the center. This means there is more energy in the wheel and therefor required more force applied (well, the same force for longer,) than the 17" wheel to achieve the same rotational velocity.
Physics is good, umkay?
Here is an example of how:
Take 2 wheel/tire combinations. We will use a 17" and an 18" as an example. Assume they weigh the same down to the gram. However, the weight of the 18" is distrubeted further from the center (a larger wheel radius makes this very plausible.)
At the same rotational velocity, the 18" will have more velocity per gram of mass because the mass is further from the center. This means there is more energy in the wheel and therefor required more force applied (well, the same force for longer,) than the 17" wheel to achieve the same rotational velocity.
Physics is good, umkay?
02-05-2004, 06:19 PM
#17
Supporting Maxima.org Member
Join Date: Mar 2002
Posts: 505
My unsprung weight (rotational mass) was reduced by about 1lb at each corner, going from the OEM 225/50 17 to 245/40/18. My car is faster with my semi-solid forged SSR rims.
What was real noticeable was when I changed the steelies on my wife's Honda to OZ Superleggera rims. They were about 11lbs lighter than the OEM setup. When I drove the car right after the install it was amazing how much more easily it accelerated and braked......
What was real noticeable was when I changed the steelies on my wife's Honda to OZ Superleggera rims. They were about 11lbs lighter than the OEM setup. When I drove the car right after the install it was amazing how much more easily it accelerated and braked......
02-05-2004, 06:20 PM
#18
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 301
Originally Posted by asu174
Yes, but the thicker tires on the 17"s will actually weigh more than those on the 18"s (and they are further away from the hub than the wheel). I think that the two variables (large, heavier wheel with skinny lighter tires vs. smaller, lighter wheel with thicker, heavier tires) would offset and be about equal when looking at weight distribution, right?
I would think the bulk of the weight of the tire is in the steel belt and tred. In other words, most of the weight is at the very outside of the radius any way. You don't change that when you increase the wheel size. By decreasing the size of the tire 1 inch, you only remove 1 inch of cross section.
On the other hand, if you increase the size of the wheel, you add to the part of the wheel that is already the heaviest (the width.) I doubt the two balance out.
Anyway, I'm mostly talking out of my a$$ on this part.
Next time I get my tires balance, I'll ask the guys at the shop if they can measure ineritia on the balancing machine.
02-05-2004, 06:31 PM
#21
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 301
Originally Posted by SterlingMist00
My unsprung weight (rotational mass) was reduced by about 1lb at each corner, going from the OEM 225/50 17 to 245/40/18. My car is faster with my semi-solid forged SSR rims.
What was real noticeable was when I changed the steelies on my wife's Honda to OZ Superleggera rims. They were about 11lbs lighter than the OEM setup. When I drove the car right after the install it was amazing how much more easily it accelerated and braked......
What was real noticeable was when I changed the steelies on my wife's Honda to OZ Superleggera rims. They were about 11lbs lighter than the OEM setup. When I drove the car right after the install it was amazing how much more easily it accelerated and braked......
I'm thinking of ditching mine. I know it's been said before, but does anybody know exactly what they weigh without tires?
Here's something else to ponder on: Is it possible that the extra mass added to the wheels has something to do with the perpetual brake warping 00-01'ers experience?
02-05-2004, 06:44 PM
#24
Maxima Pilot
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Beaverton, Oregon
Posts: 1,467
Originally Posted by Ben
Yeah, the stock 17 inchers are heavy as hell.
I'm thinking of ditching mine. I know it's been said before, but does anybody know exactly what they weigh without tires?
I'm thinking of ditching mine. I know it's been said before, but does anybody know exactly what they weigh without tires?
02-05-2004, 07:01 PM
#27
Wild at Hurt
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 580
Originally Posted by asu174
Yes, but the thicker tires on the 17"s will actually weigh more than those on the 18"s
The additional weight of the extra sidewall and air is not much.
Even the ligthest of Wheels... say volks are gonna weigh 3 lbs more
going from a 17 to 18.
A volk type 18 is about 9 lbs lighter than a stock 17 Nissan wheel.
Even though the bulk of the wheel is further out it is still lighter with less rotational weight.
Some of the Rota wheels are 15-18 lbs in an 18 for the low $500s for a set.
Best of both worlds IMHO
02-05-2004, 08:01 PM
#28
Supporting Maxima.org Member
Join Date: Mar 2002
Posts: 505
Originally Posted by asu174
My 18"s weigh 28 lbs. Heavy as hell, but shiny.....
The reason that I lost only 1lb of rotational mass as I stated above is due to the fact that the S0-3s are heavy tires.......
02-05-2004, 08:36 PM
#29
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 242
i have 18s on mine, the handling is definitely better...i noticed it the moment i drove it..18s will or should make your car slower then 17s if the car is stock...my car is still as fast or faster then my friend's IS300 and he has 17's and they weigh less then my 18s do...
02-05-2004, 11:34 PM
#31
Guest
Posts: n/a
Couldn't find a defenite answer anywhere (not that i put much effort into it), but here is my logic to it. For you to get engine power to the road, you need to transfer it to the wheel, via the hub/axle and then from there, the pivoting point of the wheel, aka center, will tansfer that to the outer rim, where the tire will be set in motion and finally down to the road where it matters.
in the drawing below (its uneven but oh well), assuming the total area as sitting on the ground doesn't change (different rim size, different tire sizes to compensate), in the bigger wheel, it will take longer for the force in the center to move to the end of the wheel. now, knowing my forces from physics way back, that will make a difference, since you basically are changing the balance in sorts. or i could be wrong. either way, i hope someone has a solid asnwer (butt dyno don't count folks), since it's defenitely something to consider when changing wheels.
in the drawing below (its uneven but oh well), assuming the total area as sitting on the ground doesn't change (different rim size, different tire sizes to compensate), in the bigger wheel, it will take longer for the force in the center to move to the end of the wheel. now, knowing my forces from physics way back, that will make a difference, since you basically are changing the balance in sorts. or i could be wrong. either way, i hope someone has a solid asnwer (butt dyno don't count folks), since it's defenitely something to consider when changing wheels.
02-06-2004, 12:52 AM
#32
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 475
what brand 18s should i look at if i dont want to lose performance with my 3.0 ( a lot less torque than the 3.5) but i dont want to spend more than $1700-1800. I really want to buy ace zeus like asu because wheelmax sells them for 1600 but if they are going to slow my car down a lot i want light rims. So what brand sells lightweight 18s that have a width of at least 8"
02-06-2004, 10:02 AM
#34
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2002
Posts: 686
Originally Posted by Shift_VQ
what brand 18s should i look at if i dont want to lose performance with my 3.0 ( a lot less torque than the 3.5) but i dont want to spend more than $1700-1800. I really want to buy ace zeus like asu because wheelmax sells them for 1600 but if they are going to slow my car down a lot i want light rims. So what brand sells lightweight 18s that have a width of at least 8"
02-06-2004, 11:17 AM
#36
My 18's weigh in @ 18.9lbs for the wheels only. I need to weigh the wheel/tire combo. You do loose a bit of acceleration due to the increased weight, (if you get relatively lightweight wheels), or loose a lot if you buy boat anchors. The increased handling is more than worth it, especially for us 4th gens going from 205/65/15 stock tires to 225/40/18 Z-rated tires. Sidewall flex and off the line traction with the stock tires was unbearable to put it in words without swearing. If i had the money, i'd be wearing SSR Comps, too bad that is still only an IF.
LEMAR
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