For those who use premium gas.........
06-17-2004, 07:27 AM
#1
For those who use premium gas.........
Thought some of my fellow org members might find this article intresting. I did............................................... ...... Why use premium gas when regular will do?
By James R. Healey, USA TODAY
Marti Mayne once fueled her low-octane Subaru with high-octane gas. Not now. Premium-gas prices "went sky high, and now I just use low grade" to motor around Yarmouth, Maine, where she runs a marketing business.
Cost differences between regular and premium is as plain as, well, the sign at the station, like this one in Chicago.
By Scott Olson, Getty Images
When prices dropped earlier this year, she stuck with cheaper fuel because "I don't think that my car runs any differently on high, medium or lower grade."
She's right. Engines designed for regular fuel don't improve on premium and sometimes run worse. And today's engines designed for premium run fine on regular, too, their makers say, though power declines slightly. (Background: About Octane ratings)
But premium lovers are passionate. "I would simply curtail driving rather than switch grades," says Bill Teater of Mount Vernon, Ohio, who puts high-test in both his Cadillacs, though only one recommends it. He's sure both the DeVille and the Escalade run rough and lack pep on regular.
Prejudice and preference aside, engineers, scientists and the federal government say there's little need for premium.
When fuel's cheap, motorists are willing to pay 20 cents or so more for premium. But as gas prices sneak back up, the mental wrangle begins anew over whether it's OK to burn cheaper, regular-grade gas.
AS PRICES RISE, CONSUMERS
SHUN PREMIUM GAS
Average price of a gallon of premium gasoline:
1993 $1.30
1999 $1.36
2002 $1.58
20031 $1.80
Premium gas share of all gas sold:
1993 19.9%
1999 16.8%
2002 13.5%
2003 12.1%
Sources: Energy Information Administration, American Petroleum Institute
The answer almost always is yes.
"I personally use regular even though my owner's manual says you'll get better performance with premium," says Lewis Gibbs, consulting engineer and 45-year veteran at Chevron oil company. He's chairman of Technical Committee 7 on Fuels, part of the Society of Automotive Engineers (SAE) Fuels & Lubricants Council. Gibbs knows gas.
"My wife runs midgrade (89 octane) in her car, and it's a turbocharged engine" meant for 91-octane premium, he says.
Premium — gasoline having an octane rating 91 or higher — is just 12.1% of sales this year, down from 13.5% in 2002, when it was 22 cents a gallon cheaper, and well below the modern high of 20.3% in 1994, when it was 49 cents cheaper, according to industry and government data. Despite the allure of premium, once they abandon it, most motorists don't come back, the data suggest.
For every dime increase in the price, sales of premium gas drop 1%, Bob Johnson, general manager of gasoline and environmental services for the 7-Eleven chain, figures, based on data back to 1998.
The main advantage of premium-grade gas is that it allows automakers to advertise a few more horsepower by designing and tuning engines to take advantage of premium's anti-knock properties. But auto engineers generally agree that if you use regular in a premium engine, the power loss is so slight, most drivers can't tell.
"I go back and forth, and I'm hard-pressed to notice" whether there's regular or premium in the tank, says Jeff Jetter, principal chemist at Honda Research and Development Americas. He drives an Acura designed for premium.
Import brands, especially, use premium fuel to distinguish their upmarket models. Most Toyotas, for instance, are designed to run on regular or midgrade, while the automaker's Lexus luxury brand prefers premium. Same with Honda and its Acura luxury line.
"Generally, the more expensive the vehicle, the higher the expectation for performance and the more the customer is willing to pay for fuel," says Pete Haidos, head of product planning for Nissan in the USA.
Actually, the price debate is nearly worthless. At 20 cents more for premium, pumping 20 gallons of it instead of regular would cost $4 more. Annually, that's a difference of $171 for a vehicle that averages 14 miles per gallon — as some big sport-utility vehicles do — and is driven 12,000 miles a year.
Gasoline retailers and refiners like high-test because it's more profitable than regular-grade gas is. The retailer paid about 8 cents more for the premium you pay 20 cents more for — though that margin can swing wildly. Refiners make a few cents a gallon more on premium than on regular when they sell to wholesale distributors.
As long as it's clean
Profit is meaningless to the modern engine, which, regardless of what's specified in the owner's manual, hardly cares what you use — as long as it's clean.
Today's engines use highly evolved versions of a device called a knock sensor to adjust settings automatically for low-octane gas. And more engine control computers have adequate memory to allow separate sets of instructions for various octanes. The engine control computers keep pushing to maximize performance on whatever grade of fuel is used.
Extreme pressure inside the cylinders causes knock, which is the sound of the pistons literally rattling inside the cylinders. Too much too long can damage the engine. A little now and then won't.
The only modern engines that should really need premium are those with superchargers, which force-feed fuel into the cylinders. "You're driving along and just tramp the gas and the knock sensor cannot sense the knock fast enough in some cases," because the supercharger boosts pressure so fast, says Bob Furey, chemist and fuels specialist at General Motors.
Burning regular when the owner's manual specifies premium won't void the warranty, nor damage the engine, even the most finicky automakers say. "You're giving up perhaps just a little bit of performance that a customer wouldn't really even notice, it's so slight," says Furey.
Automakers say they don't test premium engines on regular to check the difference, but some auto engineers estimate that power declines roughly 5%.
"We can't guarantee the vehicle will perform as specified if other than premium fuel is used," says Mercedes-Benz spokeswoman Michelle Murad. All U.S. Mercedes engines specify premium.
All Porsche engines are designed for premium, too, but it's not available everywhere. "Our cars must be able to drive all over the world, and so we are able to run on regular," says Jakob Neusser, director of powertrain development at Porsche's research and development center in Weissach, Germany. "You don't have to feel that a mechanical problem or anything else will happen" using regular gas, even in the highest-performance, regular-production Porsches.
Premium, in fact, sometimes is worse fuel than regular. It resists knock because it's harder to ignite than lower-octane fuels. As a result, some engines won't start as quickly or run as smoothly on premium, notes Gibbs, the SAE fuel expert.
High-test does have a potential fuel economy benefit. It is slightly denser than lower-octane gas, meaning there's a little more energy in a gallon. But the small difference is hard to measure in real-world use, and that same density can contribute to undesirable buildup of waste products inside the engine.
No data show that engines designed strictly for regular run better or longer on premium.
The Federal Trade Commission, in a consumer notice, emphasizes: "(I)n most cases, using a higher-octane gasoline than your owner's manual recommends offers absolutely no benefit. It won't make your car perform better, go faster, get better mileage or run cleaner."
There is "no way of taking advantage of premium in a regular-grade car," says Furey.
"There is no gain. You're wasting money," insists Jim Blenkarn, in charge of powertrains at Nissan in the USA.
"No customer should ever be deluded into thinking there's any value in buying a higher grade of octane than we specify," says Toyota's Paul Williamsen, technical expert and trainer.
But premium retains a mystique.
Even Mayne, the sensible Subaru owner who has switched to regular, says she'll buy premium when her neighborhood station has a special price. "It's my perception that I might get better gas mileage or that it might be better for my engine," she says.
"I would stop driving rather than use a lower grade of gasoline," says Andrew Martschenko of Boston, who drives a 2003 Nissan Maxima. Nissan says premium is "recommended" for that engine — automaker code for regular is OK, but you'll only get the advertised power on premium.
If the price difference between regular and premium grew to $1, Martschenko says, "Then I might consider trading down" to regular.
Guilt plays a part
Some people feel almost guilty, as if they are abusing their cars, when they don't burn premium, says gasoline retailer Jay Ricker, president of Ricker Oil of Anderson, Ind., which operates 28 stations. "They go all the way down to 87 (octane), but maybe every fourth tank they put in the good stuff."
Sam Turner has seen the appeal, too. He's president of Favorite Markets of Dalton, Ga., which operates 139 outlets in three states.
He recalls visiting one of his stations during a price war with a nearby station, which had cut the price of premium to just 4 cents more than regular, instead of the usual 20-cent difference.
"A customer was waiting and asked me if I was going to match the guy across the street. I said, 'Yeah,' and he said, 'Good. For 4 cents, I'm gonna buy super.' "
Contributing: Barbara Hansen
By James R. Healey, USA TODAY
Marti Mayne once fueled her low-octane Subaru with high-octane gas. Not now. Premium-gas prices "went sky high, and now I just use low grade" to motor around Yarmouth, Maine, where she runs a marketing business.
Cost differences between regular and premium is as plain as, well, the sign at the station, like this one in Chicago.
By Scott Olson, Getty Images
When prices dropped earlier this year, she stuck with cheaper fuel because "I don't think that my car runs any differently on high, medium or lower grade."
She's right. Engines designed for regular fuel don't improve on premium and sometimes run worse. And today's engines designed for premium run fine on regular, too, their makers say, though power declines slightly. (Background: About Octane ratings)
But premium lovers are passionate. "I would simply curtail driving rather than switch grades," says Bill Teater of Mount Vernon, Ohio, who puts high-test in both his Cadillacs, though only one recommends it. He's sure both the DeVille and the Escalade run rough and lack pep on regular.
Prejudice and preference aside, engineers, scientists and the federal government say there's little need for premium.
When fuel's cheap, motorists are willing to pay 20 cents or so more for premium. But as gas prices sneak back up, the mental wrangle begins anew over whether it's OK to burn cheaper, regular-grade gas.
AS PRICES RISE, CONSUMERS
SHUN PREMIUM GAS
Average price of a gallon of premium gasoline:
1993 $1.30
1999 $1.36
2002 $1.58
20031 $1.80
Premium gas share of all gas sold:
1993 19.9%
1999 16.8%
2002 13.5%
2003 12.1%
Sources: Energy Information Administration, American Petroleum Institute
The answer almost always is yes.
"I personally use regular even though my owner's manual says you'll get better performance with premium," says Lewis Gibbs, consulting engineer and 45-year veteran at Chevron oil company. He's chairman of Technical Committee 7 on Fuels, part of the Society of Automotive Engineers (SAE) Fuels & Lubricants Council. Gibbs knows gas.
"My wife runs midgrade (89 octane) in her car, and it's a turbocharged engine" meant for 91-octane premium, he says.
Premium — gasoline having an octane rating 91 or higher — is just 12.1% of sales this year, down from 13.5% in 2002, when it was 22 cents a gallon cheaper, and well below the modern high of 20.3% in 1994, when it was 49 cents cheaper, according to industry and government data. Despite the allure of premium, once they abandon it, most motorists don't come back, the data suggest.
For every dime increase in the price, sales of premium gas drop 1%, Bob Johnson, general manager of gasoline and environmental services for the 7-Eleven chain, figures, based on data back to 1998.
The main advantage of premium-grade gas is that it allows automakers to advertise a few more horsepower by designing and tuning engines to take advantage of premium's anti-knock properties. But auto engineers generally agree that if you use regular in a premium engine, the power loss is so slight, most drivers can't tell.
"I go back and forth, and I'm hard-pressed to notice" whether there's regular or premium in the tank, says Jeff Jetter, principal chemist at Honda Research and Development Americas. He drives an Acura designed for premium.
Import brands, especially, use premium fuel to distinguish their upmarket models. Most Toyotas, for instance, are designed to run on regular or midgrade, while the automaker's Lexus luxury brand prefers premium. Same with Honda and its Acura luxury line.
"Generally, the more expensive the vehicle, the higher the expectation for performance and the more the customer is willing to pay for fuel," says Pete Haidos, head of product planning for Nissan in the USA.
Actually, the price debate is nearly worthless. At 20 cents more for premium, pumping 20 gallons of it instead of regular would cost $4 more. Annually, that's a difference of $171 for a vehicle that averages 14 miles per gallon — as some big sport-utility vehicles do — and is driven 12,000 miles a year.
Gasoline retailers and refiners like high-test because it's more profitable than regular-grade gas is. The retailer paid about 8 cents more for the premium you pay 20 cents more for — though that margin can swing wildly. Refiners make a few cents a gallon more on premium than on regular when they sell to wholesale distributors.
As long as it's clean
Profit is meaningless to the modern engine, which, regardless of what's specified in the owner's manual, hardly cares what you use — as long as it's clean.
Today's engines use highly evolved versions of a device called a knock sensor to adjust settings automatically for low-octane gas. And more engine control computers have adequate memory to allow separate sets of instructions for various octanes. The engine control computers keep pushing to maximize performance on whatever grade of fuel is used.
Extreme pressure inside the cylinders causes knock, which is the sound of the pistons literally rattling inside the cylinders. Too much too long can damage the engine. A little now and then won't.
The only modern engines that should really need premium are those with superchargers, which force-feed fuel into the cylinders. "You're driving along and just tramp the gas and the knock sensor cannot sense the knock fast enough in some cases," because the supercharger boosts pressure so fast, says Bob Furey, chemist and fuels specialist at General Motors.
Burning regular when the owner's manual specifies premium won't void the warranty, nor damage the engine, even the most finicky automakers say. "You're giving up perhaps just a little bit of performance that a customer wouldn't really even notice, it's so slight," says Furey.
Automakers say they don't test premium engines on regular to check the difference, but some auto engineers estimate that power declines roughly 5%.
"We can't guarantee the vehicle will perform as specified if other than premium fuel is used," says Mercedes-Benz spokeswoman Michelle Murad. All U.S. Mercedes engines specify premium.
All Porsche engines are designed for premium, too, but it's not available everywhere. "Our cars must be able to drive all over the world, and so we are able to run on regular," says Jakob Neusser, director of powertrain development at Porsche's research and development center in Weissach, Germany. "You don't have to feel that a mechanical problem or anything else will happen" using regular gas, even in the highest-performance, regular-production Porsches.
Premium, in fact, sometimes is worse fuel than regular. It resists knock because it's harder to ignite than lower-octane fuels. As a result, some engines won't start as quickly or run as smoothly on premium, notes Gibbs, the SAE fuel expert.
High-test does have a potential fuel economy benefit. It is slightly denser than lower-octane gas, meaning there's a little more energy in a gallon. But the small difference is hard to measure in real-world use, and that same density can contribute to undesirable buildup of waste products inside the engine.
No data show that engines designed strictly for regular run better or longer on premium.
The Federal Trade Commission, in a consumer notice, emphasizes: "(I)n most cases, using a higher-octane gasoline than your owner's manual recommends offers absolutely no benefit. It won't make your car perform better, go faster, get better mileage or run cleaner."
There is "no way of taking advantage of premium in a regular-grade car," says Furey.
"There is no gain. You're wasting money," insists Jim Blenkarn, in charge of powertrains at Nissan in the USA.
"No customer should ever be deluded into thinking there's any value in buying a higher grade of octane than we specify," says Toyota's Paul Williamsen, technical expert and trainer.
But premium retains a mystique.
Even Mayne, the sensible Subaru owner who has switched to regular, says she'll buy premium when her neighborhood station has a special price. "It's my perception that I might get better gas mileage or that it might be better for my engine," she says.
"I would stop driving rather than use a lower grade of gasoline," says Andrew Martschenko of Boston, who drives a 2003 Nissan Maxima. Nissan says premium is "recommended" for that engine — automaker code for regular is OK, but you'll only get the advertised power on premium.
If the price difference between regular and premium grew to $1, Martschenko says, "Then I might consider trading down" to regular.
Guilt plays a part
Some people feel almost guilty, as if they are abusing their cars, when they don't burn premium, says gasoline retailer Jay Ricker, president of Ricker Oil of Anderson, Ind., which operates 28 stations. "They go all the way down to 87 (octane), but maybe every fourth tank they put in the good stuff."
Sam Turner has seen the appeal, too. He's president of Favorite Markets of Dalton, Ga., which operates 139 outlets in three states.
He recalls visiting one of his stations during a price war with a nearby station, which had cut the price of premium to just 4 cents more than regular, instead of the usual 20-cent difference.
"A customer was waiting and asked me if I was going to match the guy across the street. I said, 'Yeah,' and he said, 'Good. For 4 cents, I'm gonna buy super.' "
Contributing: Barbara Hansen
06-17-2004, 07:49 AM
#3
Originally Posted by spirilis
My fuel filler door says UNLEADED FUEL ONLY, PREMIUM FUEL RECOMMENDED FOR MAXIMUM PERFORMANCE.
I buy premium fuel.
Enough said.
I buy premium fuel.
Enough said.
06-17-2004, 09:35 AM
#11
Guest
Posts: n/a
That long piece of biased article besically says don't pour in 4000000 octane when your car needs 87.
Any car will run on 87 or heck, even lower. That's doesn't mean that all cars should be ran on low octane fuel. Half the people I see at gas stations around here use 91+, even in trucks. Maximas specify use 91 and above. Sure, it will run on lower but that is besides the point.
Any car will run on 87 or heck, even lower. That's doesn't mean that all cars should be ran on low octane fuel. Half the people I see at gas stations around here use 91+, even in trucks. Maximas specify use 91 and above. Sure, it will run on lower but that is besides the point.
06-17-2004, 10:15 AM
#12
Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 1,860
Sure my car will run on 87, just like it would run with non Mobil 1 oil... But that dosnt mean Im going to do it. Pinging is bad for your engine. Why would you promote something that is bad for your baby?
Hell, Diesels will run on peanut oil! That doesnt mean you should just to save a couple bux.
Hell, Diesels will run on peanut oil! That doesnt mean you should just to save a couple bux.
06-17-2004, 10:43 AM
#14
That article has absolutely NO bearing on us. It only applies to cars that are designed for Regular octane.
Nissan recommends Premium octane for the Maxima (92 over here) so that's what you should use. Period.
Nissan recommends Premium octane for the Maxima (92 over here) so that's what you should use. Period.
06-17-2004, 11:53 AM
#15
Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 338
I have never seen a 91 octane pump. All I see it 87, 89, & 93. And since I'm planning to keep my maxima forever, maybe even try see if I can be buried with it, I use 93 OCTANE for maximum performance, and because I love her...
06-17-2004, 11:56 AM
#16
Another misinformed person trying to make a point on gas and octane ratings... 
If you guys/gals want, I'll run regular in my Maxima for 3 months just to prove the point that I've proven on every other automotive board I've belonged to. I'll keep everything the same maintainence wise except for the gas, and not only will I see less power, but I'll see decreased mileage as well. The difference in the price of gas will not make up for the difference in gas mileage I'll be losing by using a lower grade fuel. I did this very same experiment with my '99 Ford Contour SVT and my '02 Dodge Dakota 4.7L V8 (used premium vs. using the "reccomended" 87 octane). My CSVT got worse mileage by far (3 MPG less, sometimes more in the city) and ruined two O2 sensors to boot. It also made 15 LESS WHP on the dyno than every single other CSVT with the same mods as I had. Dodge Dakota was the same story. With premium fuel I was getting 17-18 MPG on the highway, and as low as 14 in the city. When I went back to regular gas, I got my city mileage back up to 16-17 and the highway mileage all the way to 21 MPG.
So, as I state in every other post on this matter...do what you want to in your car, and I'll do what you're supposed to do in mine. Mine will run better for longer and give me all the performance that it should during that span. Yours will NOT give you the same performance or longevity...
If you guys/gals want, I'll run regular in my Maxima for 3 months just to prove the point that I've proven on every other automotive board I've belonged to. I'll keep everything the same maintainence wise except for the gas, and not only will I see less power, but I'll see decreased mileage as well. The difference in the price of gas will not make up for the difference in gas mileage I'll be losing by using a lower grade fuel. I did this very same experiment with my '99 Ford Contour SVT and my '02 Dodge Dakota 4.7L V8 (used premium vs. using the "reccomended" 87 octane). My CSVT got worse mileage by far (3 MPG less, sometimes more in the city) and ruined two O2 sensors to boot. It also made 15 LESS WHP on the dyno than every single other CSVT with the same mods as I had. Dodge Dakota was the same story. With premium fuel I was getting 17-18 MPG on the highway, and as low as 14 in the city. When I went back to regular gas, I got my city mileage back up to 16-17 and the highway mileage all the way to 21 MPG.
So, as I state in every other post on this matter...do what you want to in your car, and I'll do what you're supposed to do in mine. Mine will run better for longer and give me all the performance that it should during that span. Yours will NOT give you the same performance or longevity...
06-17-2004, 12:17 PM
#19
Donating Maxima.org Member
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 142
The article doesn't say there isn't a benefit, it just said that it's too small for most consumers to notice. They said you could expect about a 5% loss in power... that's roughly 10whp in a 5.5genr which IS VERY significant to me... although my G/F in her CVT Murano might not notice it much. Of course, I'm not telling her that as I just managed to convince her to use 91. 
Where the heck is premium $.20 more than regular? It's usually around $.10 more up here.
I usually run 91 although I'll throw in 93 whenever I manage to find it.
Where the heck is premium $.20 more than regular? It's usually around $.10 more up here.
I usually run 91 although I'll throw in 93 whenever I manage to find it.
06-17-2004, 01:29 PM
#21
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 187
A well respected motorcycle tuner in the NE did back to back to back dyno runs with mid-grade, premium and 110 race gas.
The results:
No power gain with mid-grade vs. premium.
It takes the 110 to get more power at a casual $4.75 gallon.
Dont' forget that anything over 100 will eat your cat as ap!
The results:
No power gain with mid-grade vs. premium.
It takes the 110 to get more power at a casual $4.75 gallon.
Dont' forget that anything over 100 will eat your cat as ap!
06-17-2004, 01:38 PM
#22
Senior Member
iTrader: (1)
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Manhattan Beach, Ca / Dallas, Tx
Posts: 3,751
I use nothing but premium but by accident I put about 3 gallons of 89 octane mixed with 15 gallons of 93 octane. I was trying to top off/fill up for a trip. I didnt notice any difference, the Max deserves for you to spend that extra 2-4.00 dollars.
06-17-2004, 01:47 PM
#23
There is a distinct difference, and it becomes more apparent when you have more highly tuned engines. Our E55 will knock on anything less than 91 (i tried it, out of curiosity) and I will never run less than 93. If they had 100 for street use at a decent price, id do that even (for the E, not the maxima). 93 for my max, I dont care what the morons have to say.
06-17-2004, 02:01 PM
#24
20 cent differencial is here in nyc!
i fill up in jersey, aka, the land of the cheap gas. you know it's kickass when premium in NJ is sometimes cheaper than regular in NYC!
and 91 or higher for me. never under 91.
i fill up in jersey, aka, the land of the cheap gas. you know it's kickass when premium in NJ is sometimes cheaper than regular in NYC!
and 91 or higher for me. never under 91.
06-17-2004, 02:09 PM
#25
I'm sticking with the 91 in cali. I have my timing advanced so I need all the higher octane I can get!
My pocketbook will be lightened soon enough with gas as I plan on getting a motocycle very soon.
My pocketbook will be lightened soon enough with gas as I plan on getting a motocycle very soon.
06-17-2004, 03:38 PM
#28
Wow...........
WOW.......24 responses to an article I thought me be an intresting read. And I get responses like " My baby only drinks 93" "Might as well buy a hybrid or join a hybrid forum" I myself never recommended anything but premium fuel all I was stating is that there is apparently no benifit in useing 93 or 94 octane over 91 . Around my neck of the woods 93 and 94 although Sunoco doesent sell 94 here in NewYork anymore is around 15 to 20 cents more per gallon than 91. And according to the article a higher octane might cause some kind of buildup. The manual clearly states 91 octane as the recommended fuel not 93 or 94.
06-17-2004, 05:25 PM
#31
yeah, around here we have 87, 89 and 93. The only place I can find 91 or 92 is at cheap-azz gas stations like Sheetz, and I wouldn't buy their gas anyway unless I really needed to.
06-17-2004, 07:37 PM
#32
I dont get why people do this. The more gas prices go up, the LESS % EXTRA premium will cost. What if regular costs $0.10 a gallon and premium costs $0.30? Now you are paying $2.00 a gallon for regular and $2.20 for premium. For 10% more you get premium rather than 300%.
06-17-2004, 08:50 PM
#34
Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 306
I use premium always also. My Uncle has an 03 SE and he told me that he never uses premium and has had 0 problems. I'd rather stay on the safe side and use premium myself... Nowadays my car is costing me almost $50 to fill up 
06-18-2004, 02:49 AM
#36
Member
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 82
Here in FL, we have 87/89/93 and the premium and there is roughly a $.10 price difference between each grade. For those of you that say that 93 is the only higher octane available, you know that you can get to the 91 octane that is the recommended octane for our cars simply by doing a 50-50 split of 93 octane and 89 octane, since mixing the gas octanes is a linear combination? Of course, sometimes the laziness can kick in for the stations that don't have pay-at-the-pump (who wants to walk inside twice). I'm not saying that you should do 93 or 91; I just wanted to make sure that those of you who want 91 where it doesn't come that way can get it.
As a sidenote, has anybody else noticed prices starting to fall in their areas? Around here, a number stations have come down about $.10/gallon. In fact, I filled up yesterday morning with the 93 premium for only $1.99/gallon!?! I can't recall the last time premium was under $2 around here. Of course, I think the owner is smoking cr@ck, since that's still more than $.10 less than anybody else! Heck, his cheap stuff is $1.79 and the average in our area for the cheap stuff is $1.95!
As a sidenote, has anybody else noticed prices starting to fall in their areas? Around here, a number stations have come down about $.10/gallon. In fact, I filled up yesterday morning with the 93 premium for only $1.99/gallon!?! I can't recall the last time premium was under $2 around here. Of course, I think the owner is smoking cr@ck, since that's still more than $.10 less than anybody else! Heck, his cheap stuff is $1.79 and the average in our area for the cheap stuff is $1.95!
06-18-2004, 03:50 AM
#37
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 6,190
The lower gas prices of late reflects the US$3 a drop in oil prices on world markets in the last month. In my area, there is usually a two or three week lag in the effect on gas prices of the swing in oil prices. However, with the recent concerns over oil disruptions out of Iraq and an oilworkers' strike in Norway, oil prices have backed up. So expect a hike in gas prices in about two weeks. In addition, we have not entered the full-fledged "summer driving season" which really kicks in when school is out. So expect higher gas prices in July!
06-18-2004, 06:12 AM
#38
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 631
I just filled up at $1.86/gal for 93 octain yesterday at FlyinJ truckstop. You can check prices online. They seem to be cheaper than Costco 91 octain.
As far as all premium/non premium conversations are concerned - Just use Premium. If the manufacturer recommends it, just do it. Look thru several TSB's. First step in many of them is "Verify that premium gas is used".
Given that gas prices are high, still 87 is not that much cheaper then premium. Lay off your starbucks coffee instead of skimping on gas...
As far as all premium/non premium conversations are concerned - Just use Premium. If the manufacturer recommends it, just do it. Look thru several TSB's. First step in many of them is "Verify that premium gas is used".
Given that gas prices are high, still 87 is not that much cheaper then premium. Lay off your starbucks coffee instead of skimping on gas...
06-18-2004, 06:31 AM
#40
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 1,280
I run 93 only. We don't have 91. People spend a couple hundred dollars on mufflers that give them 1 hp. This article says 5% power. That is nothing to my Mom, but enough for me. And this paragraph sums up the reason I argue with the cheapskates on here:
"Actually, the price debate is nearly worthless. At 20 cents more for premium, pumping 20 gallons of it instead of regular would cost $4 more. Annually, that's a difference of $171 for a vehicle that averages 14 miles per gallon — as some big sport-utility vehicles do — and is driven 12,000 miles a year."
And the Max gets much better than 14 mpg. So we are spending much less than $171 extra annually. Peanuts.
Despite this thread's original purpose, I think this article strengthens the argument for premium.
"Actually, the price debate is nearly worthless. At 20 cents more for premium, pumping 20 gallons of it instead of regular would cost $4 more. Annually, that's a difference of $171 for a vehicle that averages 14 miles per gallon — as some big sport-utility vehicles do — and is driven 12,000 miles a year."
And the Max gets much better than 14 mpg. So we are spending much less than $171 extra annually. Peanuts.
Despite this thread's original purpose, I think this article strengthens the argument for premium.