+1 to that as well. I had Injen and in any car I've owned it has to be the most power robbing intake I've ever used. This summer I'll be doing a PR style intake. As Irish said about the dyno's he is right. Dyno's will put bigger numbers on the WAI because the fan is blowing on it as the hood is open.

A true test would be 1/4 mile runs with the setups done by a consistent good driver. But even that will not be the best as there are many factors in play as well.

My opinion.
- Injen SUCKS
- WAI a good stock replacement
- PR CAI, common sense shows that is best due to location

 

PR CAI, whats the real name of that and its location.

 

PR=Place Racing (true) Cold Air Intake -

LOCATION - NOWHERE to be found - they are gone - good luck finding one. Ive seen 1 in the classifieds and it sold in mins..and that was awhile back..

 

Reposted:


Like I told Nmex before, I truely believe people are improperly installing the Injen intake, as I have read alot of reviews/threads... where people actually say the Injen "robbed them of power"....

Well......I say thats total b.s, imo.......

Instead, I think most people shove the Cone filter up too high, shutting off the intake altogether and not allowing the air to pass freely...(I did it once and it ran like chit)

(This would be the only way it could actually rob you of power.......unless something mechanically was wrong)

All you have to do is just catch the lip of the filter to the tip of the pipeing, by about an inch/inch and a half...then tighten......

If you shove it all the way up, like im sure most have done, obviously you'll be robbed of HP....






DIdnt Josh already say this??...you're just repeating what he said...

Oh, I didnt know you had one, for yourself...


Easy to say without scientific data to back this up......

And like i said before, i think misinformed people are cutting of the Intake on the Injen, therefor robbing it of power....a simple mistake that can be corrected!



Injen happens to be a WAI....

btw, What is a WAI.....just wanna see if you actually know?



Commone sense is only what a large group of people thinks is right....it doesnt actually mean they're right though...

I'd rather have scientific data before making a rash comment like, "Injen sucks, yay...I agree!"







PS - AND FOR THE RECORD, I too, agree with most of what Josh (Irish) has said....but I also believe there should be some form of testing done to finally find out if what he says (and other alike), is actually true or not...

Someone took the time to show WAI/CAI comparisons (albeit with the hood open)............Why shouldnt we.............?



.

 

Acid Jake, didnt another guy on the .org come up with a way to make the Injen a CAI?

I remember you mentioning this in one of the threads awhile back...


Thx

 

3" MAF housing, A/F tune, + stock airbox.

 

You clearly have NO idea about how intakes work.



Again to EVERYTHING Josh has said.

 

Its a POS, you are 100% wrong about it.

 

Again, where are the numbers that validate your "theory"?

 

Clearly you do....

Now wipe the brown off your nose


BTW........+1 also to what Josh posted...


Now someone go out and prove it






Is that too much to ask...


or does this work better for ya.....???


"Injen sucks".......YAY!....




lol~


.

 

Ever heard of "Operator error"...


Do you honestly think that every noob that goes out and buy's an Injen intake, also properly installs it?


Like i said once again, if you shove the filter up all the way, it cuts off the air that passes through the intake....

I guarantee 50% of those installed have made this mistake.....(probably much more)

 

Where are yours?

 

Chernmax, AEM intake on his 6gen.

You're right for the most part josh, except for saying that an apex'i filter flows well (flow bench testing will show you otherwise). Also, dynographs are extremely useful for testing intakes if you follow the correct procedure. You can put the hood down and make a pull. However, I've not seen anyone thats made any more than 2-3hp over the curve with just an intake alone.

 

That is a pretty big assumption. How do you plan on testing the validity of this?

 

Ok, right, I forgot you're the master of intake installs. I had the intake installed 3" up the tube, so that the intake tube came right up to where the rubber neck ends and the floor of the filter element starts. I had the POS for 22,000 miles. Changed the filter to a larger K&N unit (installe properly), used the splash guard/heat sheild, wrapped the tube. Nothing worked. It conducts so much heat from the engine block that nothing you do to it could keep it cool enough to work. Also it sucks the hot, low pressure, air from RIGHT behind the radiator. I seriously think that you need to stop posting about things you don't have a clue about. It's been proven time and again.

Also, the dyno that studman did, I was present for (we live down the street from one another). The PR tube (even with the bottom tube disconnected) is thermally isolated from the engine. No heat soak, and no curves to slow air down. Please search some more and actually READ the pages.

 

Its not a huge assumption, imho...(especially with some of the questions asked by those with little experience...lol)



As to proving such a theory,.....I guess I could make another video for the org.....as I've already made a couple "how to video's" a few weeks ago


I could atleast then show the affects of how the Injen works with the filter shoved all the way up, and how it works the way I have it set up...(catching the lip of the filter by about an 1"/1 1/2...)



I'd do it today, but its about 10 degrees out and I've been workin on my VIAS this afternoon.......which, was kind of a bad idea, since the damn screws on the VIAS are so d*mn soft...

Anyways, I'll try makin one in the next few days...


If that doesnt work, then I'd buy a Short-Ram, a Berk, and the Injen I have....and we''ll take it to the Dynos w/the hood closed and see what really goes down...

 

You dont get it do you? You're 3+years late for this debate. The answer is out there. BTW, the effort it would take to get the tube all the way down into the tube is nothing short of staggering. Noone in their right mind would try that hard to get it on.

 

. . . . . .. . Dyno & tune to come.

 

My point was that there is no easy way for you to know what other people have been doing as far as installation goes. It doesn't matter what you do or how many videos you make, your assumption that everyone else has done it wrong is unsound at best.

Additionally, you're trying to debate the theory behind different intakes where the differences between each set-up is barely significant. Your time would probably be better served doing something else.

 

Did I ever claim to be?


Ok, makes sense.....

But I really dont know what you're arguing about...I agree with Josh on most of what he's sayin......That isnt the point though...

The point is that it needs to be proven, and not just stated......I dont get where you think I'm coming across as some f'ing know-it-all, when all Im really trying to do is figure some numbers BEYOND......Ya, its sucks....Its been engineered and tested....ect ect.......

Is that really too much to ask?

I seriously think people dont need to be so critical of others on here.....

After all, arent we all just trying to learn.......

If you say its been proven time and time again, then show me?

So far, no else has....just stated opinion based off of experience...




I did read the "pages"...in fact, I read the entire thread.....

And for the record, I didnt see anymore threads posted by Studman, regarding this issue...

 

Clean up your damn desk.... btw, when can I get mine? I'll PM you my address.

For the record, I do have some 3" PVC sitting at home...

 

 

Maybe I dont get it cause I aint seen the numbers, other than the ones at the TOP of this thread (WAI/CAI comparisons)...

Maybe if we could quit going in circles, you'd actually be nice enough to show where those numbers are..


SOrry, I dont just "assume" like most people do...

 

Yes, people need to learn, but you spewing incorrect information all over the place isn't going to help them do so.

ninja edit FTL

 

These are the numbers that I originally enquired about.....though they are not mine....



The Stock intake produced:
208.61 HP and 234.92 ft/lbs Torque

The CAI intake produced:
209.08 HP and 237.09 ft/lbs Torque

The WAI intake produced:
213.67 HP and 240.03 ft/lbs Torque



I wasnt here to argue, but to ask questions and request validity from answers given in this thread...


And if its been 3 years since its been discussed, then I'd say its about time for a renewed subscription....isnt it?

 

What incorrect info have a I given...?


I merely started a discussion on the numbers provided, and told a legitimate, possible reason, as to why I think its bs that Injen gets a bad rap...

 

I understand what you're saying, Puppetmaster, and appreciate you taking a direct approach towards this debate, instead of uneccesary bashing....

As for, "everyone else has done it wrong", I dont recall saying....but please allow me to clarify


What I said was, "I believe 50% of Injens not operating properly are more likely due to "operator error, than the Intake itself"

I also said, "for those who have said the Injen "robbed them of HP", that in there case, it was likely that the filter was blocking the intake itself...




I hear you, and appreciate what you're saying.....

But the original numbers caught my eye, and I wanted to discuss them in a proper manner...


This thread was never meant to be a competition of ....."your ***** are bigger than mines"..........

lol

 

Who cares where the Injen filter is located. Many view it draws heat. Now another common sense factor is the length of the piping on the Injen, regardless of people believing its hot or cold air, the air has a a further distance to travel losing velocitiy going into the intake. Also regardless of the heat from where the filter sits, there is also tons of heat moving around where the piping sits so if you don't believe the air is hot coming through the filter, it will warm up during its long route to the throttle.

 

I will post my bone stock dyno w/ the injunk when I get home. 160whp from a 3.5 is beyond Sh!te. If you dont believe it's been proven, take your car to a dynojet shop and test it. Then swap the stock intake back, reset the ECU, and do it again. You will be shocked at the results. It's a poor design, and everyone here knows it....which is why pretty much noone has them. In addition, read any book on intake and intake manifold design, and you will see that aluminum tubing is just about the poorest material to use, period.

 

Actually, tube length creates low end torque via pulse amplification. the PRCAI has a longer tube than any intake. The length and radius of the curves in the pipe are what make the difference. PRCAI has only one curve in it, and it's a mild one at that. This is why it works so well (on top of drawing cool air from the fenderwell and being thermally isolated). Longer distance does not equal lost velocity. If that were true, then headers would not work either simply based on the same priciple.

 

I think thats what you ment to say.

 

My .02...

This "debate" is DUMB.

Nothing but unproven BS getting thrown around and the yearly idiot that defends Injen till the death...

It all depends on what you want your car to do, Josh Auto-X's his Max... So he wants the best low and midrange he can get. If you want your car to be a drag car or a dyno queen... You might want something else that post higher peak #'s for bragging rights.

Josh also brought up the fact that intakes react different with the mods you have on your car.

Josh is using COMMON SENSE.... The best thing we have right now. The intake debate has been over for a long time.

 

MaximumPower, buy a bullet and rent a gun. You my friend are an idiot.

PM me once YOU proove your BS claims.

 

Corrected, ty

 

It is rather messy isn't it? Those yellow boxes back there used to have Z33 injectors in them.

 

You could also buy the BMW M62/S62 MAF and tube from a range rover dealer for $160 or so (it may be more now). It has a 3" ID and air smoothing so as not to blow the sensor. You will need injector control or else you're gonna run mega lean.

 

I couldn't find one locally so i just ahd this one made.

I need emange, but for the moment I have SAFC. Runs in the low 14's(AFR) @ wot w/o a tune.

 

Thats pretty lean, you might wanna add a percent to your fuel mixture at WOT. Also, I have a tube for sale w/ step up and down hoses. PM me for details.

 

I just ran it once to see what the difference would be. Too lean for comfort. Under light load it seems to be jsut fine (o2 sensor feedback). But with the 335's, my dash MPG readout is wacky

 

I bet!, let me know if you want that tube.....