blackmax2000

Did anyone happen to read Dave Coleman's Technobabble article in the september issue of SCC? Putting the crankshaft from the vg30de from a 300zx or 3rd gen maxima, will increase displacement from 3.0 liters to 3.4 liters and therefore will increase horsepower and torque across the powerband. Dave went on to say that you should expect around 300 N/A horsepower. So all you'd have to do to have a bomb proof engine is drop in a crank, and possibly either put in a reprogrammed ECU or upgraded pistons/rod's. Is this not awesome!!

philpoe

iTrader: (4)

In the article, he states that the bores _almost_ lineup.
Also the pistons don't match, so those upgraded pistons are a necessity and cost $$.

A question I have is that if the VQ30DE (4th Gen) and VQ30DE-K (5th Gen) and the VQ35DE (Pathfinder) all share the same block, is it possible to take the crank/pistons from the pathfinder and drop them in a 4th or 5th gen Max?

mdeal

iTrader: (2)

Is the article available online?

blackmax2000

yeah it would cost some money, but it'd would be an alternative to supercharging or turbocharging..and shouldn't cost more than either one. I for one would rather have 300+ na horsepower, than 300+ turbocharged hp..
Alot less wear and tear on the engine.

As for the article being found online...I doubt it. I can get it scanned and email it to you.

blackmax2000

Plus 2 friends of mine are into the Old school hot rod scene, and know a guy who makes custom forged pistons and billet rods. He has a shop up near the Atlanta Dragway. And does good work, plus i'll get a discount. He also does porting and polishing, valve jobs, and engine balancing

mingo

iTrader: (4)

is that gonna raise the compression ratio to 11:1? if so.. many we got some s2k match up with ponies per liter. good lookin' out blackmax2000. i'll do some research myself on taht as well. real interested.

Nismo87SE

Ohh well but here goes. This swap will never happen wanna know why? Its the because the VQ30DE is an entire different engine family than the VG30DE is. None of the bearings and journals would line up and the rods probably won't fit the crank either. However VQ35DE parts are interchangable with other VQ30DE parts but the increase in displacement comes from the bigger block. NOt a longer stroke. Besides who even knows if the VQ30DE intake manifold would fit on a VQ35DE? If it did that could be one bad *** motor I would believe 260hp easy. Also hp is just a calculation too not something measured. There are 2 ways to get 300hp from a NA motor. Rev it higher or increase the displacement. For this hybrid VQ35DE to work it will need at least 10.5CR pistons (11.1 is preferred) and someway to reprogram the ECU. Which means reverting back to a 95 maxima ECU and wiring harness. Of course someone needs to assembol this engine and install it. Not to mention we don't know if the VQ35 block will bolt to the VQ30 tranny. I just say get a stillen supercharger and be happy .

Maximamike

"Did anyone happen to read Dave Coleman's Technobabble article in the september issue of SCC?"

Sure did.

"Putting the crankshaft from the vg30de from a 300zx or 3rd gen maxima, will increase displacement from 3.0 liters to 3.4 liters and therefore will increase horsepower and torque across the powerband. Dave went on to say that you should expect around 300 N/A horsepower."

Dave Coleman is talking out of his ***. There is no VG30DE in the 3rd gen Maxima. The two VG series engines have little to nothing in common. He also didn't tell you that this won't work. More on this later.

"So all you'd have to do to have a bomb proof engine is drop in a crank, and possibly either put in a reprogrammed ECU or upgraded pistons/rod's. Is this not awesome!!"

Yeah, its pretty awesome considering that the engine and machine work on this would cost more than a new VQ35DE in the Pathfinder. Which would be about $2500+

"In the article, he states that the bores _almost_ lineup. Also the pistons don't match, so those upgraded pistons are a necessity and cost $$."

The bores not lining up means that the crank journals don't line up. So you'd have to machine the bearing journals of the block to get them to measure up right. Totally throwing off the balance and structural integrity of the engine. The pistons match its the stroke you need to worry about. This means custom shorter rods to get the rod ratio back into spec and the piston from not hitting the dome of the combustion chamber.

"I for one would rather have 300+ na horsepower, than 300+ turbocharged hp.. Alot less wear and tear on the engine."

And NOS blows up engines right? Hah..

"Funny thing about 300 Hp N/A is that Honda has already done it."

You can build a 300 hp n/a H22A(Prelude VTEC engine). Thats what they use in their touring cars. 12:1 compression and the highest octane you can get.

"Ever since the day I spanked a S2000 in traffic in NYC, I can give a damm about Hondas."

If he knew how to drive that car in the powerband he would have spanked the **** out of you.

"There is another article in there about a old school 300ZX in there that had the VG33E crank put into a VG30DE and all this work and turbo 'd for 500 some odd HP."

Steve's Z? He posts on Z31.com. Its actually a VG33E crank in a VG30E-T block.

"I remember reading the article, but I know one thing is that to rip open a perfectly good motor in pursuit of power is insane."

So, are you calling *me* insane?

"For this hybrid VQ35DE to work it will need at least 10.5CR pistons (11.1 is preferred) and someway to reprogram the ECU."

Why only 10.5:1? Thats 0.5 more than the stock. I would go for at least 11.5:1 or even 12.

La Jolla Max

"Putting the crankshaft from the vg30de from a 300zx or 3rd gen maxima, will increase displacement from 3.0 liters to 3.4 liters and therefore will increase horsepower and torque across the powerband. Dave went on to say that you should expect around 300 N/A horsepower."

He never said that. He said that 300 n/a horsepower is "not out of the question". You reall think that just dropping in a VG crank and new pistons will automatically boost you to 300hp? Even if such a scheme worked, it would require lots of tuning.

"They were talking about putting the VQ35DE crank into a VQ30DE."

Nope, the crank to be dropped in was a VG crank. The reason Dave had the idea of dropping a VG crank into a VQ block was because the VG crank is much beefier than the VQ's.

I agree, the idea of such a swap is silly. Even if the crank fit, you'd lose the smoothness and rev-happy nature that is so characteristic of the VQ (which we all know and love).

I want lotsa power as well, but I wouldn't even think of getting Stillen's POS supercharger kit. I have a 4th gen, and what I intend to do is drop in a VQ30DE-K, port and polish the heads, extrude hone the intake, get cams (if JWT ever develops them), forged pistons, and since the bottom end of the VQ is good for 8000rpm, find a way to raise the redline to about 7500. This is what I intend to do, and I think it would be one sick motor.

Maximamike

A revline of 7.5-8 would probably require different valve springs and stuff. Don't want valve float at 7.5k rpm That would be bad..

blackmax2000

Thanks for the input guys.
I'm kind of new at this and assumed that all that he wrote was true. I'm glad you guys put the information straight to me. That would have been alot of money wasted. Thanks again.

And one last thing...is the VQ30DE-K the engine in the 2k and 2k1?

blackmax2000

Where do you guys get all your info at?
Ya'll really do know alot about the maxima.

Nismo87SE

It comes from reading lots of info on Nissan engines. For example I borrowed a service manual from a friend for a 91 300zx. I also have one for my 87 maxima. By looking at the engine specs I was able to find the parts are interchangeable. This is because they are in the same engine family VG series. Now the VQ is a totally different engine. Its all aluminum with different bearings, crank, rods, pistons. No parts from the VG30 engine will fit a VQ30 engine. However since the VQ35DE is from the same engine family as the VQ30DE is there parts are interchangeable. The heads or intake manifolds might be different but the internals are simular if not the same. Matter of fact if one had the time and money, they could do a VQ35DE bottom end with VQ30DE intake manifolds. Also given a hotter cam profile higher compression (11.1), rev limiter set to 7500-8000rpm. This "hybrid" motor could reliably put down 230-260hp at the wheels NA with bolt ons. For comparision sake the 300zx twin turbo puts down around 235-250hp stock from its 300hp turbo engine.

Guest

The 300hp Accord is from a j30a V6 block with the intake manifold and throttle body (if I'm not mistaken) from an Acura CL Type-S, the 3rd gear from a Honda Odyssey (The Accord 3rd gear goes up to 115mph which is not good for drag racing), aftermarket headers, a home made intake based off the factory intake. They also have some higher compression pistons and a few other things I can't think of. Besides the headers and an aftermarket torque converter, I believe every part they used for the 300hp Accord was taken from other cars. It is also rumored that they somehow reprogrammed the TCM/TCU for quicker/firmer shifts but that could very possibily be a hoax. BTW, there are actually TWO 300HP Accords, one is a show car with a Chameleon Purple paint job, fancy seats, etc etc, that was featured in a magazine like Super Street or something, and the other car was developed by HART (Honda/Acura Racing Team) strictly for drag racing at the track.

I would much rather a 300hp j30a than a 300hp h22a since the torque in the j30a would be much higher and you wouldn't have to rev to over 7,000rpms to get to 300hp.

Nismo87SE

I believe I can vouche for what he his saying. After driving the SE-R for sometime I still prefer the torque of my max. When my max had a CAI as only mod it probably dynoed the same as the SE-R does now (damn auto ). However the extra 40lb-ft is very noticeable. BTW Bnut you should put that accord on the bottle. A wet 40-50shot is all you need, you could dyno tune it with a V-AFC. This should have you running mid-low 14's with traps around 93-96mph. I was gonna put my max on the bottle till I blew the engine. But then again I can bottle feed the SE-R .

philpoe

iTrader: (4)

I think I saw a quote of ~$2500 for a VQ35DE in this thread
Would that combo of parts + intake + ecu mods get you where you need to be? Also, add in pistons/crank from VQ30DET (Japan Cima? Anyone know the compression ratio?), and we're talking members of the same family and a boost-friendly compression ratio?
Also, when all's said and done, the spare parts have a resale value...

brianw

iTrader: (3)

VQ35DE may not even fit.... I'd check on that first.

You guys are jumping the gun and reading too much into Dave Coleman's article. He is saying that that the VQ30DE could easily be stroked due to the factory dimensions of the bore and stroke-- not that it would be cheap or free (although he hopes it would...)

300 NA HP out of a VQ30DE should be possible. No one said it would be cheap, free, or even cost-effective.

(edit) Yes, I do believe some of the article is fanciful at best. However, I have spent some time with SCC staff at SE-R events and at the track and I do have tremendous respect for their knowledge.... so.... lighten up!!! And 300hp definitely would cost LOTS of money. NOT next to nothing!

Pmp-n8a

If you guys could get me some more information on this that would be great...I would do this tomorrow if i found people who would do it=P
Does anyone know someone who does excellent engine work up in new york?...and would the I30's titanium pistons(or rods? forget which one it was) fit the max?



[Edited by Pmp-n8a on 11-09-2000 at 05:52 PM]

Maximamike

Titanium pistons? Nope sorry. Not in the I30...