So I have the issue of clunking coming from the front passenger side. looked around and thought it was my strut but found out that it is my sway bar endlink. Not the actually endlink but the bolt that holds it to the lower control arm. I changed these out to Moog around this time last year. Well it is loose and causing the bolt to move around in the control arm hole. I tried to tighten it but couldn't get ahold of the backend bolt causing the bolt to spin. Tried the vise grip with no luck. Took it to a shop and they said they were able to tighten it a little with their air tools but it's still loose. My question is (finally, lol) do you guys think that since it's been loose for a while now that with it moving around in the hole it has made the hole bigger. and would I have to purchase a whole new lower control arm just to fix this little bracket that it connects to, or is their any other way? watch the video and you'll see what I'm talking about. click on picture to play.

Front passenger side. (the messed up one)



Front right side. (the good one)

 

Quick question... Have you attempted to grease it again?

 

yes, replaced my outer tie rods ends and ended up greasing the endlinks while i was there.

 

wow...all i can say

 

I use a flat metal bicycle wrench, which is only 2-3mm thick, to hold the backside bolt on the endlink when I tighten it. The bolt size on the Moog is 15mm, which is standard on the bike wrench. If you still have play my guess would be the hole on the LCA bracket has enlarged. I'd remove the endlink, verify the dimension of the hole, then have the hole weld filled and redrilled rather than get a new LCA.

 

yeah i ended up buying a 15mm socket and got a wrench to hold the backend bolt but still it wouldn't tighten. the shop even thought they tighten it with their air tools but apparently they didn't. I'm thinking it won't tighten anymore b/c that's all the thread left on the bolt. It's gotta be that the hole has enlarged. Kinda want to go ahead and get a new control arm. not sure though.

 

What if for a quick fix I had the shop just weld the whole bolt to the control arm so it wouldn't move. Would that affect me getting any kind of alignment when I needed to?

 

if you weld a bolt to it and need to change it later for being worn again your in a hole. Either what Steveb said. Get someone that can weld and then redrill the hole. For someone that knows how to weld it is not a hard job, just getting in there is the toughest part. i quick fix is put some washers in there to space out the nut so it will have something to grip into. Then tighten it. It may not fix it but it may end the movement until the weld job.
For some reason i think that hole is oblong to start with. I would remove the good side to see if it actually is just a circle hole or and oblong hole.

 

The hole on the LCA is oblong to start with. Why Nissan did this and how the OEM links don't move, I'll never know.

I've replaced mine twice. Once to MOOG, still got the same movement and clicking noise you have in your video. Then I got some AM end links that are closer to OEM...still getting the sound.

I've tried washers and lock washers...no change..still get the movement and clicking.

 

Why not wallow it out and put in a bigger bolt?

 

The "bolt" is an integral threaded rod part of the link. When I changed both end links way back because I had the annoying front end "knocking" which as it turned out was caused by wear/looseness in one of the end link ball sockets but all the rod attach nuts were still torqued (actually they were f...ing tight) and the rods were not loose in either the LCA brackets or at the stab bar ends. I did not see any hole elongation in the LCA bracket holes. When you install the end links it's critical that the nuts are not threadbound and that the nuts are really torqued up. The stab bar is "working" all the time and if the end links attach nuts are not really tightened up they are going to work loose and just complicate things for you, as we've seen.

 

PSamson, Are you saying the LCA attachment point for the end link on the 5th generation is a round hole and not an elongated hole?

Mine were elongated the first time I changed out my endlinks (about 70k miles). I tightened down the Moog end links several times...really tight with a breaker bar. Finally took it to a mechanic and had him tighten them down with air tools...still get a clunk/pop from the passenger end link.

Can anyone post a picture?

 

My bracket holes were not elongated that I remember, but as I stated there was no wear issue there because the threaded rod attach nuts were still "really" tight (and not due to corrosion). If you find the nut/s loose at the LCA bracket/s, then invariably you'll have an oval hole and the bracket faces worn. Even with an oval hole and some minor wear of the bracket if you can torque the nut up really tight then it seems to me that you should eliminate any further chance of relative motion there. If you're positive that the threaded rods are solid with both the LCA brackets and the stab bar ends, then any noise is coming from another source, such as the ball sockets (hidden by the rubber boot) themselves. It took me two attempts before I found that out.

 

FSM torque spec is about 40 ftlb. This number can be exceeded pretty quick with a breaker bar and most shop air tools. Over-torquing can be just as bad as not tightening enough.

 

The torque specified is 36-42 ft/lbs but I would torque it to the maximum, and that torque value should be added to whatever the run-on torque of the nut is......I think it was a self-locking nut. The torque on these nuts has no bearing on the operation/movement of the link/s.

 

weird designs. anyway I said screw it and went to the shop and had them put a few welds on the bolt to keep it in place so I wouldn't get that aweful noise, sounded like my car was gonna fall apart. Quick fix for now, probably for a while. Hell it worked, no more noise. now on to new struts.

 

Maybe not, but I wanted to clarify for others reading this thread that these nuts should not be over-torqued. It will effect the operation/movement of the link if you snap the shaft off. If you have a problem torquing anything down to proper specs, you have another problem. It may be time to investigate as opposed to cranking it down passed torque specs.

 

I've seen this issue more than once. And it's the exact reason why I use hardened washers on every Moog endlink I install for my customers.

 

Update:

I took my car into my independent mechanic. They tightened down my current endlinks (Deeza IN-L603/IN-L601). It helped, but I'm still getting a popping/metal tap when going over large bumps < 25 mph.

You can see where the end links slide up and down in the oblong holes. I still have no idea why Nissan would design it this way.

 

Have you got washers on the control arm bracket?

 

I agree, have no idea why nissan designed them like this. but since i had mine welded it's still a quick fix but it's working for me anyways. and i don't have washers on mine. what exactly would washers do anyways? wouldn't it still slide up and down in the hole?

 

Guys......common. The end links should not be loose or have any relative motion with the LCA attach brackets. None, zero, nada. They are NOT designed this way.

 

They give more surface area for the nut to grab onto the bracket, and when tight allow for more friction, thus, no movement. Like I said, I use them with every install and have never seen movement. Plus, it prevents the hole from enlargening and the nut popping through, which I've also seen - not pretty or fun to fix.

 

I was just going on what the other guy said on here. I wasn't sure that the holes were like that or not. Anyhow I will end up getting new lower control arms when the money is there.

 

If the hole has not elongaged/worn excessively and the bracket thickness is still reasonable, don't change the LCA.....just use an additional appropriate washer on the "backside" and under the nut, if required, just as djfrestylad has suggested. Torque the nut to 42 ft/lbs. The idea is to have actual clamping or pinchup with the bracket......and not have the nut threadbound. With proper clampup the link shouldn't loosen up.

 

^^^ What he said

 

Cool I'll have to try the washer thing out when my weld gives out

 

Make sure it's hardened, they work the best compared to others I've tried.

 

Yes, washers will still slide. I tried washers with the Moog end links (before switching to Deeza) and it made no difference.

I did read where someone welded washers to the LCA and that helped...but it seems like Nissan would have just made this opening a hole not an elongated hole.

 

P.Samson,

This is the best picture I can find of the part (I'm not sure if this is OEM) but you can see the hole is not round:



Could you add a bit more when you say put a washer "on the 'backside' and under the nut"? When you say under the nut, you just mean between the nut and the LCA bracket, right?

Where can I find the particular hardened washer djfrestylad suggests?

 

Even though the above post is not addressed to me, I'll answer.

The OEM hole IS elongated, this is standard.

Yes, that's correct. The order that I install is: back nut-washer-LCA bracket-washer-front nut, where 'front nut' is the one that you can remove from the threads, and 'back nut' is the one that you have to hold stationary with a wrench when loosening/tightening.

I get the hardened washers from Ace hardware around the corner from me. They have a huge selection of hardened hardware. Haven't seen any other stores (whether they're home or auto) that carries them.

 

Thanks djfrestyl!

OK, so reading this you're using a washer on both sides, not just the back side.

Is there a particular size you've found works best (thickness, small outer diameter or larger outer diameter)

 

I use two, just for good measure.

Lol, yes there definitely is one that I use - it's the 3rd tray from the top, all the way on the left

...I don't know what the exact measurements are, I will get it next time I go.

 

LOL, that makes it too easy....whatever I find in that bin at my Ace is what I'll use.

I know the Moog end links practically require washers (but don't provide them) but I'm using Deeza (very much like OEM using prop nuts).



Do you think, even with the prop nuts, that two extra washers can stop the movement?

 

If your Deeza links have prop nuts on BOTH sides of the LCA bracket, then there *should* be no movement. How's the size of the prop nuts compared to the elongated hole? I hope they're significantly larger. If so, then perhaps instead of a washer you can use a lock washer.

 

Yes, prop nuts on both sides and the diameter of the prop nut is much bigger than the hole. My mechanic mentioned lock washers but did not feel they would do any good.

My mechanics only other suggestion was to switch out the Deeza links to OEM (which also use prop nuts).

Now, it's possible that there is another source of the noise...but I'm at a loss of where else to look (so was my mechanic after going over every other nut and bolt on the suspension).

 

I don't see how one prop nut would differ from another....

Try the lock washers, or see if you can find some large hardened star washers.

 

The OEM links have a wrench hex which is on the "backside" and I don't remember that there was a washer on the backside, but use a washer on the backside to make up any bracket thickness loss due to wear and to supply a larger surface area, and you definitely want to use a washer under the nut. It makes absolutely no sense that the bracket would have a manufactured oval hole and I see no reason to use "hardened" washers. Use washers with as large an OD ("penny" style) as will fit flat to the bracket. Guys......the critical thing here is to ensure that the damn thing is torqued up. I replaced my links about three years ago (because of a worn ball/socket) using OEM links and the original washers and nuts, and nothing has loosened up.

 

I went out this morning and painted a line under and above the end link nut on the passenger and driver side. You can see an outline where the previous end link nut had moved, so filling that in with paint would show if it was still moving. I then went for a drive and got it to "do it's thing" . When I came back, neither end link had scratched the paint. So, my end links aren't moving in the LCA. I've ordered a new set of OEM end links from Nissan.

My mechanic suggests removing the end links, tying off the sway bar and seeing if it still makes the noise. He mainly deals with Honda and Toyota and over the phone wasn't sure where I could tie it off. Any ideas on where I could tie my sway bar to test this out?

 

Update:

I removed the end links and "went for a drive".

Up the road we have a market with huge speed bumps, I was able to get the metallic "tap" from both sides with the end links removed.