A thread about gas
02-22-2013, 03:42 PM
#1
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Location: The Northeast
Posts: 681
A thread about gas
So I've owned my I35 for nearly 6 months now and almost always filled up gas at stations with the absolute cheapest prices for 91+. In my area, this means Costco and Raceway. For the last two tanks I decided to run Exxon and Shell V-Power to see if higher priced gas meant higher quality. It is weird because the idle and gas mileage seemed to have improved. I have run the same type and weight oil since I've had the car- good old dino Valvoline 5w-30 and keep the tire pressure at a constant 32.5 psi. I know there are those who say gas is gas no matter where it's from, but the additives in Shell and Exxon seem to make a difference in my car. What do you guys think?
02-22-2013, 04:00 PM
#3
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Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Jacksonville, FL
Posts: 10,349
There's a difference between the hot dog water blended camel **** at discount places and top tier gas.
02-22-2013, 04:03 PM
#5
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Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Jacksonville, FL
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02-22-2013, 04:21 PM
#7
There's a difference between the hot dog water blended camel **** at discount places and top tier gas.
Gasoline is gasoline..period..It all comes from the same distribution terminals regionally...since 1994, the GOVERNMENT mandated that all gas companies put detergents into their gas to deter fuel injectors from clogging...Yes, ALL gas has detergents...Also, all them "special" additives that your local chevron/exxon/shell claim to add to their gas, like techron/v power/etc... well yeah they are in there there all right, at a average of 1 quart of additive to a 8000 gallon truck load of fuel lol....See, that way they dont get busted for not adding their special detergent/additive...but yeah, a quart of any kind of additive isnt gonna do shiet in 8000 gallons of fuel...
Keep in mind, all these gas companies are trying to do is sell you a product..and they will do anything to stay in the black, including lie to you, and everyone else...
To add to the bs these gas companies claim their products clean better than the other guys...I ran my old green maxima for over 200,000 miles using nothing but cheap/no name brand fuels....when i parked it...i removed the engine, took the engine apart, and found the intake and exhaust valves clean as a whistle...thats right...virtually no deposits of any kind on them....Clean.
Don't believe the horsesh1t these so called "top tier" oil companies are trying to feed you...gas is gas...
Last edited by NmexMAX; 02-26-2013 at 07:55 AM.
02-22-2013, 04:43 PM
#8
My only opinion on gas is higher octane better burn more milage due to complete combustion of fuel.the additives on other hand are snake oil think about it a additive is something that is going to leave deposits in itself even tectron additive.
02-22-2013, 07:18 PM
#9
Greeny is absolutely right. All gas comes into the distribution plant via pipeline and is non-ethanol (87 & 93 only the 89 octane is made from blend of low/premium octanes) and absent of detergents and markers.
Each "brand" then tells the distribution plant what percentage of ethanol and detergents go into the fuel. Each brand also must have its own marker to trace bad/contaminated fuel to its source.
The issue and concern about buying "cheap" gas is more about WHO you're buying it from. Does the store maintain its tanks? Are the tanks rusty? Contaminated? Water seeping into them? That's what you have to really watch out for.
Each "brand" then tells the distribution plant what percentage of ethanol and detergents go into the fuel. Each brand also must have its own marker to trace bad/contaminated fuel to its source.
The issue and concern about buying "cheap" gas is more about WHO you're buying it from. Does the store maintain its tanks? Are the tanks rusty? Contaminated? Water seeping into them? That's what you have to really watch out for.
Last edited by Chris Gregg; 02-22-2013 at 07:21 PM.
02-22-2013, 08:47 PM
#11
California does have a different blend of gas because we are sooooo special. And for the POS environmentalists.
I never have a noticed any difference in mileage or performance between any of the different gas companies.
I just stay away from the independent has stations because they don't seem to move as much gas and I fear there may be sediment in their tanks or water infiltration. It probably isn't a valid fear...but one I have with them.
I never have a noticed any difference in mileage or performance between any of the different gas companies.
I just stay away from the independent has stations because they don't seem to move as much gas and I fear there may be sediment in their tanks or water infiltration. It probably isn't a valid fear...but one I have with them.
02-22-2013, 09:07 PM
#12
Related note. I cannot confirm, but a couple years ago I was told the following: oil prices we see "per barrel" is for Texas Crude, no question THE best oil being drilled in the world. However, Texas crude accounts for only a small percentage of oil used to refine into fuel. The majority of oil comes from over seas or other less "pure" sources. However, oil companies still base (in part) fuel costs on what the cost of Texas crude is, even though that is not primarily what they purchase or use for fuel.
Please correct me if I'm wrong on this.
Please correct me if I'm wrong on this.
02-22-2013, 09:12 PM
#13
Where is your info on Texas crude being the best? From what I have heard crude out of the Middle East is majority "sweet crude" meaning easier to refine with less byproduct waste and better quality fuel.
02-22-2013, 10:13 PM
#14
02-22-2013, 10:28 PM
#15
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Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 139
What about the TCW3 oil that is all the rage in the general discussions. I thought I read the explanation was the TCW3 will mimic detergents and act as a kind of lubricant? I can't say I noticed my car ran smoother with TCW3, but it does seems a little more rough on a cold start without it.
02-22-2013, 10:53 PM
#16
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Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Near Jacksonville, FL
Posts: 36
I can honestly say I started using raceway gas because it was about 5 cents a gallon cheaper than the station across the street, and I haven't noticed any difference at all between that and the Shell station right across the street. Of course, this station only opened last week, so everything is shiny and new.
02-22-2013, 11:18 PM
#17
Yes and no. It's a filler as far as allowing them to use less petrol. But it does burn. Ethanol is simply grain alcohol. Usually made from corn. It doesn't have the same energy density as gasoline so your average MPG's will drop as ethanol content increases. Also it's not very good for engines that aren't designed to burn it. It can eat through some of the seals and gaskets that were originally designed for pure gasoline. Some people say (usually politicians) that 10% ethanol will not hurt a Gasoline motor. There are studies that show differently though. Your best bet is to find a station that sells ethanol free gasoline in your area if you can. I live in Ohio where ethanol content posting isn't required so you can't tell what's going in your tank without testing it. 
To give you an idea of the MPG difference...
My parents have a FlexFuel Chevy Impala. When using gasoline they average 24-26 mpg. When Using E-85 the average 17-19 MPG. It's like a 25% loss in fuel economy. Forget the fact that it's made from corn; and burning our food supply on purpose is never a good idea.
To give you an idea of the MPG difference...
My parents have a FlexFuel Chevy Impala. When using gasoline they average 24-26 mpg. When Using E-85 the average 17-19 MPG. It's like a 25% loss in fuel economy. Forget the fact that it's made from corn; and burning our food supply on purpose is never a good idea.
Last edited by rebelhell; 02-22-2013 at 11:24 PM.
02-23-2013, 01:53 AM
#18
Greeny is absolutely right. All gas comes into the distribution plant via pipeline and is non-ethanol (87 & 93 only the 89 octane is made from blend of low/premium octanes) and absent of detergents and markers.
Each "brand" then tells the distribution plant what percentage of ethanol and detergents go into the fuel. Each brand also must have its own marker to trace bad/contaminated fuel to its source.
The issue and concern about buying "cheap" gas is more about WHO you're buying it from. Does the store maintain its tanks? Are the tanks rusty? Contaminated? Water seeping into them? That's what you have to really watch out for.
Each "brand" then tells the distribution plant what percentage of ethanol and detergents go into the fuel. Each brand also must have its own marker to trace bad/contaminated fuel to its source.
The issue and concern about buying "cheap" gas is more about WHO you're buying it from. Does the store maintain its tanks? Are the tanks rusty? Contaminated? Water seeping into them? That's what you have to really watch out for.
Sadly Chris, most people won't listen to what i have said in this thread, and will continue paying top dollar for fuel that in essence is absolutely no different than the walmart fuel across the street...Advertising is a powerful tool...A tool that most people think they are immune to...
02-23-2013, 04:37 AM
#19
With the ethanol thing.. I can't remember where I heard it, but supposedly ethanol blend that is posted at 15% can be anywhere from 5% to 30% depending on the price/season of it's components.
We need to get some chemists and combustion engineers in on this.. make it an official end-all-be-all study on this
We need to get some chemists and combustion engineers in on this.. make it an official end-all-be-all study on this
02-23-2013, 06:13 AM
#20
With the ethanol thing.. I can't remember where I heard it, but supposedly ethanol blend that is posted at 15% can be anywhere from 5% to 30% depending on the price/season of it's components.
We need to get some chemists and combustion engineers in on this.. make it an official end-all-be-all study on this
We need to get some chemists and combustion engineers in on this.. make it an official end-all-be-all study on this
I don't believe that all gasoline is equal. I personally fill my E39 530i with Aral Ultimate 102 RON (ca. 96 AKI). However, it may be sufficient to run a tank of premium every third or fourth tank, if you don't care about performance but want the benefits of "better detergents." That is what I gleaned from an older Prof and "expert" on the subject.
btw. I am have a bachelor of Mechanical Engineering degree and am completing a masters degree in Combustion Engines at RWTH-Aachen University in Aachen, Germany, as you for opinions from engineers.
02-23-2013, 06:41 AM
#21
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Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Indianapolis, IN
Posts: 87
With the ethanol thing.. I can't remember where I heard it, but supposedly ethanol blend that is posted at 15% can be anywhere from 5% to 30% depending on the price/season of it's components.
We need to get some chemists and combustion engineers in on this.. make it an official end-all-be-all study on this
We need to get some chemists and combustion engineers in on this.. make it an official end-all-be-all study on this
The 5-30% range you were referring to may be the amount of gasoline that can be in "E-85"
I'm a biochemist, and several of my colleagues are organic chemists, so if there are specific technical questions, I will probably be able to find the answer. One interesting thing I heard from one of those colleagues is that it costs about $6 to produce a gallon of ethanol. The only reason it can be sold below $4/gallon is because of subsidies.
02-23-2013, 08:14 AM
#22
Not that it clears up everything, but an interesting short read.
http://www.eia.gov/todayinenergy/detail.cfm?id=8130
Last edited by Chris Gregg; 02-23-2013 at 08:37 AM.
02-23-2013, 11:31 AM
#23
A long while ago, in this very Internet board, gas pricing came up as a topic. I weighed in with a lengthy 80 plus page white paper on what affects gas prices at the pump.
If I fancy I'll search for it to see if I can dig it back up. While a long and dry read it was informative. If I recall correctly the gas price at the pump is influenced mostly by two factors.
1. The refining costs.
2. The contract between the refiners and the distributors down to the tank of gas going to a gas station.
Price of crude oil is not a heavy influence on gas price at the pump according to that white paper.
If I fancy I'll search for it to see if I can dig it back up. While a long and dry read it was informative. If I recall correctly the gas price at the pump is influenced mostly by two factors.
1. The refining costs.
2. The contract between the refiners and the distributors down to the tank of gas going to a gas station.
Price of crude oil is not a heavy influence on gas price at the pump according to that white paper.
02-23-2013, 11:53 AM
#24
I hear that, but interesting enough that is the excuse we all get when gas prices go on the rise. There is a correlation, crude barrel prices go up then we see gallon petrol prices go up. Even arguments on the need for the government to release X# of barrels from reserves to bring down/ease the cost of gas at the pump.
I'm not debating, I just think the system as a whole is intentionally made complicated, if only in appearance so that there is always a finger to point elsewhere for high fuel prices at the pump.
I'm not debating, I just think the system as a whole is intentionally made complicated, if only in appearance so that there is always a finger to point elsewhere for high fuel prices at the pump.
02-23-2013, 11:59 AM
#25
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Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Levittown, NY
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Honestly aside from the politics and details of the rest of this thread, a simple Answer for the OP is that you should NEVER use less than 93 octane in our cars. This is mainly bc of the fuel filter that we have being able to filter out less crap from the fuel. It's been gone over again and again in other threads. Also 93 is always better, but not always nessecary. In our cars it's always nessecary.
As far as brand goes I usually use Sunoco bc they're the cheapest name brand in my area, ill get citgo sometimes and I would prefer shell or Exxon/mobile but I will never get Gas from No name brand garbage places. The oil refineries make gas and gas is gas, but how well it's filtered is really what makes the difference as well of the quality of their oil rigs and gas stations at keeping out pollutants.
As far as brand goes I usually use Sunoco bc they're the cheapest name brand in my area, ill get citgo sometimes and I would prefer shell or Exxon/mobile but I will never get Gas from No name brand garbage places. The oil refineries make gas and gas is gas, but how well it's filtered is really what makes the difference as well of the quality of their oil rigs and gas stations at keeping out pollutants.
Last edited by nycibbyryder; 02-23-2013 at 12:17 PM.
02-23-2013, 12:05 PM
#26
Honestly aside from the politics and details of the rest of this thread, a simple Answer for the OP is that you should NEVER use less than 93 octane in our cars. This is mainly bc of the fuel filter that we have being able to filter out less crap from the fuel. It's been gone over again and again in other threads. Also 93 is always better, but not always nessecary. In our cars it's always nessecary.
You do realize that octane level has nothing to do with contaminants in fuel that may or may not be captured by a fuel filter, right?Just like any other commodity...I never said the price wasn't influenced by oil barrel prices, but rather, the oil barrel prices are not the main determining factor as we are all led to believe.
02-23-2013, 12:21 PM
#27
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Location: Jacksonville, FL
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Related note. I cannot confirm, but a couple years ago I was told the following: oil prices we see "per barrel" is for Texas Crude, no question THE best oil being drilled in the world. However, Texas crude accounts for only a small percentage of oil used to refine into fuel. The majority of oil comes from over seas or other less "pure" sources. However, oil companies still base (in part) fuel costs on what the cost of Texas crude is, even though that is not primarily what they purchase or use for fuel.
Please correct me if I'm wrong on this.
Please correct me if I'm wrong on this.
West Texas Intermediate (WTI) is an extremely high quality crude oil which is greatly valued for the fact that it is of such premium quality, more and better gasoline can be refined from a single barrel than from most other types of oil available on the market.
The WTI “API Gravity” is 39.6 degrees, which makes it a “light” crude oil, with only 0.24 percent sulfur, which makes it a “sweet” crude oil. The term “API Gravity” refers to
the “American Petroleum Institute Gravity, which is a measure that compares how light or heavy a crude oil is in relation to water. If an oils “API Gravity” is greater than 10 then it is lighter than water and will float on it. If an oils “API Gravity” is less than 10, it is heavier than water and will sinks.
These combined qualities as well as location make WTI a prime crude oil to be refined in the United States, which is by far, the largest gasoline consuming country on the planet. The vast majority of WTI crude oils are refined in the Midwest and Gulf Coast regions. Even with production of WTI crude oil in decline, WTI is often priced from $5 to $7 higher per barrel than “OPEC Basket” oil and on average, $1 to $2 higher per barrel than “Brent Blend” oils.
Brent Blend is actually a combination of different oils from 15 fields throughout the Scottish Brent and Ninian systems located in the North Sea. Its “API Gravity” is 38.3 degrees, which makes it a “light” crude oil, but clearly not quite as “light” as WTI. It also contains about 0.37 percent sulfur, which makes it a “sweet” crude oil, but then again, not quite as “sweet” than WTI.
Brent Blend is quite excellent for making gasoline and middle distillates, both of which are utilized in large quantities in Northwest Europe, where Brent blend crude oil is most often refined. Brent Blend production, much like that of WTI, is also on the decline, but it remains a major benchmark for other crude oils in Europe or Africa. Brent Blend oil price is often priced at a $4 higher per barrel compared to the OPEC Basket price.
OPEC Basket oil is a collective seven different crude oils from Algeria, Saudi Arabia, Indonesia, Nigeria, Dubai', Venezuela and the Mexican Isthmus. The acronym OPEC stands for “Organization of Petroleum-Exporting Countries” which is an organization that was formed in 1960 in order to create some common policy for the production and sale of oil within its jurisdiction.
Because OPEC oil has a much higher percentage of sulfur within its natural make-up and therefore is not nearly as “sweet” as WTI or even Brent Blend and since it is also not naturally as “light” as well, the prices of OPEC oil are normally consistently lower than either Brent Blend or WTI. However, OPEC’s willingness or ability to quickly increase production when necessary makes OPEC a consistent “Major Player” in the oil industry!
The WTI “API Gravity” is 39.6 degrees, which makes it a “light” crude oil, with only 0.24 percent sulfur, which makes it a “sweet” crude oil. The term “API Gravity” refers to
the “American Petroleum Institute Gravity, which is a measure that compares how light or heavy a crude oil is in relation to water. If an oils “API Gravity” is greater than 10 then it is lighter than water and will float on it. If an oils “API Gravity” is less than 10, it is heavier than water and will sinks.
These combined qualities as well as location make WTI a prime crude oil to be refined in the United States, which is by far, the largest gasoline consuming country on the planet. The vast majority of WTI crude oils are refined in the Midwest and Gulf Coast regions. Even with production of WTI crude oil in decline, WTI is often priced from $5 to $7 higher per barrel than “OPEC Basket” oil and on average, $1 to $2 higher per barrel than “Brent Blend” oils.
Brent Blend is actually a combination of different oils from 15 fields throughout the Scottish Brent and Ninian systems located in the North Sea. Its “API Gravity” is 38.3 degrees, which makes it a “light” crude oil, but clearly not quite as “light” as WTI. It also contains about 0.37 percent sulfur, which makes it a “sweet” crude oil, but then again, not quite as “sweet” than WTI.
Brent Blend is quite excellent for making gasoline and middle distillates, both of which are utilized in large quantities in Northwest Europe, where Brent blend crude oil is most often refined. Brent Blend production, much like that of WTI, is also on the decline, but it remains a major benchmark for other crude oils in Europe or Africa. Brent Blend oil price is often priced at a $4 higher per barrel compared to the OPEC Basket price.
OPEC Basket oil is a collective seven different crude oils from Algeria, Saudi Arabia, Indonesia, Nigeria, Dubai', Venezuela and the Mexican Isthmus. The acronym OPEC stands for “Organization of Petroleum-Exporting Countries” which is an organization that was formed in 1960 in order to create some common policy for the production and sale of oil within its jurisdiction.
Because OPEC oil has a much higher percentage of sulfur within its natural make-up and therefore is not nearly as “sweet” as WTI or even Brent Blend and since it is also not naturally as “light” as well, the prices of OPEC oil are normally consistently lower than either Brent Blend or WTI. However, OPEC’s willingness or ability to quickly increase production when necessary makes OPEC a consistent “Major Player” in the oil industry!
02-23-2013, 04:41 PM
#29
Octane Rating is by definition the measure of the fuels ability to resist detonation. In high performance engines with a high compression ratio, the pressures created in the cylinder are high enough to cause the fuel air mixture to auto detonate. This is often called pinging or engine knock. Detonation can destroy your engine by cracking piston heads, skirts, rings, and damaging heads or cylinder walls.
If your engine is operating properly there will not be any detonation occurring with the recommended octane fuel. Improperly operating cooling systems, modified heads (or heads with excessive carbon buildup) with increased compression, or timing that is advanced further than factory specs can cause detonation.
The VQ35 motor (and many others) have what's called an Engine Knock Sensor. If it detects detonation it will tell the computer to decrease the ignition timing advance to eliminate this potentially catastrophic event. This is why the VQ35 has the ability to run on lower octane fuel. However, reducing the timing advance can negatively affect fuel efficiency and power output. This is why many report having an increased fuel efficiency (usually slight) when running higher octane fuel.
The terms that fuel companies use such as "Premium Fuel" does not have anything to do with the fuel's quality. 87 octane is generally of the same quality as 93 octane. The only difference is it's anti-knock rating.
02-23-2013, 11:42 PM
#30
Octane Rating is by definition the measure of the fuels ability to resist detonation. In high performance engines with a high compression ratio, the pressures created in the cylinder are high enough to cause the fuel air mixture to auto detonate. This is often called pinging or engine knock. Detonation can destroy your engine by cracking piston heads, skirts, rings, and damaging heads or cylinder walls.
If your engine is operating properly there will not be any detonation occurring with the recommended octane fuel. Improperly operating cooling systems, modified heads (or heads with excessive carbon buildup) with increased compression, or timing that is advanced further than factory specs can cause detonation.
The VQ35 motor (and many others) have what's called an Engine Knock Sensor. If it detects detonation it will tell the computer to decrease the ignition timing advance to eliminate this potentially catastrophic event. This is why the VQ35 has the ability to run on lower octane fuel. However, reducing the timing advance can negatively affect fuel efficiency and power output. This is why many report having an increased fuel efficiency (usually slight) when running higher octane fuel.
The terms that fuel companies use such as "Premium Fuel" does not have anything to do with the fuel's quality. 87 octane is generally of the same quality as 93 octane. The only difference is it's anti-knock rating.
If your engine is operating properly there will not be any detonation occurring with the recommended octane fuel. Improperly operating cooling systems, modified heads (or heads with excessive carbon buildup) with increased compression, or timing that is advanced further than factory specs can cause detonation.
The VQ35 motor (and many others) have what's called an Engine Knock Sensor. If it detects detonation it will tell the computer to decrease the ignition timing advance to eliminate this potentially catastrophic event. This is why the VQ35 has the ability to run on lower octane fuel. However, reducing the timing advance can negatively affect fuel efficiency and power output. This is why many report having an increased fuel efficiency (usually slight) when running higher octane fuel.
The terms that fuel companies use such as "Premium Fuel" does not have anything to do with the fuel's quality. 87 octane is generally of the same quality as 93 octane. The only difference is it's anti-knock rating.
Just asked my chemical engineer brother (who works at an oil refinery) about the subject. He confirmed that the "quality" of fuel delivered from the refinery - regardless of brand or octane - is the same, as it is determined by government standards. He said that differences between discount and "brand name" gas stations is probably limited to how much profit they make (e.g. Costco may not make much on fuel sales, but they see it as a service to the customer and way to get them in the door). Gas station owners in general make very slim profits per gallon sold. Differences in fuel, then, are limited to the anti-knock rating (mid-grade is mixed at the pump between the lower and higher octane tanks) and station-/brand-specific additives.
I think that the latter makes a small difference, and I definitely run higher octane fuel, but those are my preferences/opinions. I also have a reflashed ECU.
Last edited by tcb_02_max; 02-23-2013 at 11:48 PM.
02-24-2013, 01:54 AM
#31
Junior Member
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Houston Texas
Posts: 76
A long while ago, in this very Internet board, gas pricing came up as a topic. I weighed in with a lengthy 80 plus page white paper on what affects gas prices at the pump.
If I fancy I'll search for it to see if I can dig it back up. While a long and dry read it was informative. If I recall correctly the gas price at the pump is influenced mostly by two factors.
1. The refining costs.
2. The contract between the refiners and the distributors down to the tank of gas going to a gas station.
Price of crude oil is not a heavy influence on gas price at the pump according to that white paper.
If I fancy I'll search for it to see if I can dig it back up. While a long and dry read it was informative. If I recall correctly the gas price at the pump is influenced mostly by two factors.
1. The refining costs.
2. The contract between the refiners and the distributors down to the tank of gas going to a gas station.
Price of crude oil is not a heavy influence on gas price at the pump according to that white paper.
the reason fuel prices a high these days is because of the low dollar value.
oil is traded in dollars. the dollar is the world reserve currency. the truth is the dollar is worth less and can't buy the same amount of crude it use to.
the price is then run up and down but in general it goes 2 steps forward one step back. this years low is last year's high.
02-24-2013, 09:04 AM
#32
Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Muncie, IN
Posts: 436
Honestly aside from the politics and details of the rest of this thread, a simple Answer for the OP is that you should NEVER use less than 93 octane in our cars. This is mainly bc of the fuel filter that we have being able to filter out less crap from the fuel. It's been gone over again and again in other threads. Also 93 is always better, but not always nessecary. In our cars it's always nessecary.
02-25-2013, 10:40 PM
#33
Member
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Murfreesboro TN
Posts: 261
Got a good one for you.
-93 octane kroger gas.
-TCW-3 marine oil added at 1oz/5gallons (5th tank).
-Recent installation of 6th gen valve covers and reworking my intake tract(leaks on covers and pcv hose)
-Level ground (mid tn), straight road at 55mph, slight tail wind(50 degrees), and steady throttle.
previous best it would register is 28-29mpg, pretty sure it was due to a small leak in the pcv hose.
-93 octane kroger gas.
-TCW-3 marine oil added at 1oz/5gallons (5th tank).
-Recent installation of 6th gen valve covers and reworking my intake tract(leaks on covers and pcv hose)
-Level ground (mid tn), straight road at 55mph, slight tail wind(50 degrees), and steady throttle.
previous best it would register is 28-29mpg, pretty sure it was due to a small leak in the pcv hose.
Last edited by Finchum; 02-25-2013 at 10:44 PM.
02-26-2013, 05:15 AM
#35
Junior Member
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Indianapolis, IN
Posts: 87
This would be a fun new competition. I made mine say 45 a few times. 6th gear, 55-60mph. Central Indiana highway (flat of course). I think I may have been drafting a semi. And I probably had my 16in wheels on the front, with my sticky set of 225/50/16s!
If anyone does take pic while driving though, please keep your eyes on the road. Or better yet wait til you stop.
If anyone does take pic while driving though, please keep your eyes on the road. Or better yet wait til you stop.
02-26-2013, 06:09 AM
#36
You can't rely on that for MPG...you have to do it by tank at each fill up. Of course, if you are thinking about MPG you are automatically changing your driving habits subconsciously to improve your MPG.
The only real test is to do it tank by tank over a long-term such as a month, or better yet, a few months.
If I get my Maxima at the top of a large hill I can hit infinite MPG...just turn off the car and coast down the hill.
Right, like I said, the two factors I mentioned were only a couple of the many that influence the price of gas. From the white paper I read those 2 factors were the largest influence on the price of gas.
The only real test is to do it tank by tank over a long-term such as a month, or better yet, a few months.
If I get my Maxima at the top of a large hill I can hit infinite MPG...just turn off the car and coast down the hill.
what about the dollar value?
the reason fuel prices a high these days is because of the low dollar value.
oil is traded in dollars. the dollar is the world reserve currency. the truth is the dollar is worth less and can't buy the same amount of crude it use to.
the price is then run up and down but in general it goes 2 steps forward one step back. this years low is last year's high.
the reason fuel prices a high these days is because of the low dollar value.
oil is traded in dollars. the dollar is the world reserve currency. the truth is the dollar is worth less and can't buy the same amount of crude it use to.
the price is then run up and down but in general it goes 2 steps forward one step back. this years low is last year's high.
Last edited by NmexMAX; 02-26-2013 at 07:55 AM.
02-26-2013, 07:25 AM
#37
My wife and I are always arguing this point back and forth, and she still insists on putting 87 in our tank (due to the cost). Her argument is (after I showed her the manual) is that 91 octane is "recommended" not "required." I notice knocking on cold starts and hesitation when she dumps 87 in the tank. Plus I have a 2-3 MPG drop. Recently I've given up arguing with her and just throw 93 in the tank when I have the car.
Seems to be some fuel experts in this thread, so let me ask this... Will this back and forth between octanes do any real damage? I do have the car more than her, and I'm usually the one to fill it up. But I'd say she gets to the pump 1 out of every 3 fill ups.
Seems to be some fuel experts in this thread, so let me ask this... Will this back and forth between octanes do any real damage? I do have the car more than her, and I'm usually the one to fill it up. But I'd say she gets to the pump 1 out of every 3 fill ups.
02-26-2013, 07:49 AM
#38
No damage on a stock - moderately modified car. The timing advance would be the only basic mod I'd be attentive with when running 87 octane. So, outside that, you'll be perfectly fine. As discussed, your ecu can tell the difference and adjust accordingly. Even with timing advance, may be fine, but given other factors such as ambient temp and elevation (which can contribute to knock), its something each individual should be aware of. Sounds like you've already established your car operates without issue on 87.
02-26-2013, 07:54 AM
#39
Got a good one for you.
-93 octane kroger gas.
-TCW-3 marine oil added at 1oz/5gallons (5th tank).
-Recent installation of 6th gen valve covers and reworking my intake tract(leaks on covers and pcv hose)
-Level ground (mid tn), straight road at 55mph, slight tail wind(50 degrees), and steady throttle.
previous best it would register is 28-29mpg, pretty sure it was due to a small leak in the pcv hose.
-93 octane kroger gas.
-TCW-3 marine oil added at 1oz/5gallons (5th tank).
-Recent installation of 6th gen valve covers and reworking my intake tract(leaks on covers and pcv hose)
-Level ground (mid tn), straight road at 55mph, slight tail wind(50 degrees), and steady throttle.
previous best it would register is 28-29mpg, pretty sure it was due to a small leak in the pcv hose.
02-26-2013, 08:05 AM
#40
My wife and I are always arguing this point back and forth, and she still insists on putting 87 in our tank (due to the cost). Her argument is (after I showed her the manual) is that 91 octane is "recommended" not "required." I notice knocking on cold starts and hesitation when she dumps 87 in the tank. Plus I have a 2-3 MPG drop. Recently I've given up arguing with her and just throw 93 in the tank when I have the car.
Seems to be some fuel experts in this thread, so let me ask this... Will this back and forth between octanes do any real damage? I do have the car more than her, and I'm usually the one to fill it up. But I'd say she gets to the pump 1 out of every 3 fill ups.
Seems to be some fuel experts in this thread, so let me ask this... Will this back and forth between octanes do any real damage? I do have the car more than her, and I'm usually the one to fill it up. But I'd say she gets to the pump 1 out of every 3 fill ups.
I doubt "switching back and forth" would really cause a problem, as the engine with reduce the timing when it senses knock. Apropos knock: make sure your knock sensor is in working order.Or, the best solution imo would be doing the calculation of the cost of running low and high octane fuel and then showing her the math. It doesn't cost that much more. Tell her: "It's science!"