i tried to do a search for it but i got nothing...ca someone explain what exactly is an automagic compared to an automatic???

 

its when a auto owner shifts manually

 

Believe it or not, there actually is another thread out there which explains this. The reality is that the term "automagic" was created by automatic owners who have 5-speed-envy (or 6-speed).

 

so basically its shifting an auto manually..?but isntthat bad for the car?

 

No...you're still allowing the auto tranny to do the actual shifting (impossible to get around that), you're just taking control of the shift points. The danger would be red-lining the engine just like the danger of doing so with a manual tranny.

 

FEAR the AUTOMAGIC

 

Kev invented this vocabulary to make himself feel better..

 

how do u take control of the shift points? and how does the o/d play into this?

 

Begin driving the car in "1" and when you've come close to redline, push the shifter into "2," etc...etc. Instead of allowing the tranny to decide when to shift, you make the decision by shifting the automatic tranny.

Overdrive won't engage until the car is in D4...so it does not play into this process. If you are driving for max performance, you should leave O/D off understanding that your gas mileage will decrease slightly.

 

Why would leaving the O/D off increase performance if you are already at WOT?? If you leave it on, the computer will shift at a certain RPM, but if you have it off and then turn it on when you want, you have control over that. (Is that what you were referring to?)

 

I was just saying that if you are driving for performance, you should leave O/D off. If you were crusing and wanted to go WOT...having O/D turned off would increase immediate power available and decrease the downshift time of your auto tranny. I suppose if you stand ready to manually downshift the auto, then this wouldn't make a different. I think you and I are really thinking the same thing even if we are not saying it.

 

I kind of see what you are getting at. What about from a stand still (like the 1/4 mile), would be be best to keep it off (do you even get to 4th gear when you are racing the 1/4 mile, I haven't done it yet?)

 

I have an automagic.

 

OK, if you "manually" shift your automagic, (1st gear to redline, 2nd to redline), what makes you think you will be accessing more horsepower?? Your car shifts where it does (under WOT) for a reason - it is the point at which most horsepower can be used most effectively. Redline does not indicate peak horsepower, and in fact, may actually allow the powerband to drop off a bit. Remember, power curves are just that - curves, not straight lines. You dont make more horsepower by using the 1st gear -> redline, and second gear -> redline selector, you just run your engine at a higher RPM. Just turn off your O/D button, the tranny will do the rest. Hope this helps!

 

never underestimate the power of the AUTOMAGIC......

I love my automagic......but to tell ya the truth.....
I wish I had stick.

 

Yeah, but 5th gens never reach anywhere near redline if you just womp on it, hence, the need to powershift.

 

i don't know if the 2k2 autos can turn O/D off, as i have
1,2,3,D4,N,R,P

 

So you are saying, that where the computer shifts is where maximum horsepower is? I am not sure about that. So what if you had peak HP at a lower RPM, say 4000, does that mean you should shift there??? I still don't understand why people say don't shift at redline if the powerband drops off? It's not like your car just stops accelerating at peak HP...your car will pull after peak HP. Can some explain that?

 

rev limiter owns you

 

No, I agree with you off the blocks...as long as you are WOT, O/D does not come into play...particularly not in play since it only engages in D4.

 

"So you are saying, that where the computer shifts is where maximum horsepower is? (Yes, under WOT, the computer knows you want full tilt acceleration, so the shift points are made where power is greatest.) I am not sure about that. (I am ) So what if you had peak HP at a lower RPM, say 4000, does that mean you should shift there???
(Yeah, you ever driven a mustang?? hehe) I still don't understand why people say don't shift at redline if the powerband drops off? (Uhhhhhh? lol ) It's not like your car just stops accelerating at peak HP...your car will pull after peak HP.
(It just wont accelerate as fast as if it were in the powerband) Can some explain that?"

 

But it's still accelerating, so why not use the HP that is there instead of "waste" it. So your car go faster if you shift right where the powerband ends rather than going all the way up to redline? Then how come some people have reported that manually shifting (i.e going all the way up to redline) got that faster ET's in the 1/4.

 

Then how come the 4th gens have 190 hp @ 5600 rpm and the autos go all the way up to redline???? And the 5th gens have 222 hp @ 6400 rpm and don't go up to redline

 

don't laugh at people, I asked this question a few weeks earlier.

 

 

Cause it's a 5th gen.

 

I think we should make this a sticky

 

Can you explain what it means when the torque convertor locks up? You said as the rpms pass 4000rpm @ WOT, the torque convertor locks up in 3rd gear...what exactly does that mean??? Sorry for so many questions, I want to be able to understand this stuff

 

Noooooooooo.


Me have 5-speed...me hit redline

 

5th gen makes max HP near redline, simple as that.....if u dont shift at redline then that 222 number means nothing, cuz teh tranny shifts at like 6000 so we never get to it.

 

Finally someone has the right idea.

 

Here's the drive power curve for a Gen4 Maxima:



See how the drive power curve falls off real sharply at the top of each gear? This is because the Gen4's don't have the variable intake manifold and with their power peak at 5600rpm it's better for them to shift before redline in all but 1st gear.

Now here's the drive power curve for a Gen5.



See how none of the gears overlap and you maintain the most power at the wheels by holding each gear to redline? This is because the Gen5 make peak power at redline thanks to the dual-stage intake manifold. If you shift before redline on a Gen5 you're losing ground.

 

OK, so in a 5th gen (or an gen) according to those drive power curves, do you want to shift before the force at the wheels starts dropping???

 

steve, where can I find that version of cartest free?

 

Drive power = acceleration.

You want to shift at the point where either:

1) You hit redline
2) The next gear will give you better acceleration than the one you're in now.

On Gen5's you just shift at redline.
On Gen4's you'd want to shift before redline.

If you look on the Gen4 chart, you'll see there's a crossover on the 2nd gear plot just past 60 mph with 3rd gear. Because the power on the Gen4's falls off past 5600rpm if you try to run 2nd gear all the way to redline you have so little power that you'd actually get more acceleration (more drive power) if you shift before redline. So in this case, you'd want to shift to 3rd at about 62 mph or so on the Gen4 instead of holding it up to 67 mph or whatever it is.

Drive power = acceleration.

So in a Gen4, as you wind up towards redline and power drops off a crossover will occur before redline where the next gear will give you better acceleration. That's when you shift.

5th Gen guys don't have to worry about this. They just hold each gear until redline. But on cars that make their peak power a good bit before redline and power drops off, you sometimes get better performance by shifting before redline.

A good example of this is an older Mustang

 

It's sort of making sense now. Thanks Steve
I guess if you have a 4th gen, you need to practice on the track where the best place to shift is or even dyno it to find out where peak hp is.

 

hehe...I'm not explaining this very well.

You don't want to shift where the power falls off unless the power curves say that you'll get better acceleration in the next gear.

The 4th Gen Chart



Look at 2nd gear. The force at the wheels starts to fall off at 40 mph. But does that mean you should shift to 3rd just yet? No. Why? Because you still have more power at that point in 2nd gear than if you upshifted to 3rd.

2nd Gear @ 40 mph: 1250 lb of force
3rd Gear @ 40 mph: 800 lb of force

Keep it in 2nd here on a 4th Gen.

But now look at what happens at redline in 2nd.

2nd Gear @ 65 mph: about 700 lb of force
3rd Gear @ 65 mph: about 850 lb of force

You should have shifted before redline here...

2nd gear @ 62 mph: 880 lb of force
3rd gear @ 62 mph: 880 lb of force

This is the crossover point. So it looks like on a Gen4 5spd you'd want to shift at about 62 mph instead of 65 mph right at redline to get the best acceleration...

Greg - go to www.howstuffworks.com and take a look at transmissions or gearing in the automotive section and that'll probably explain it better.

 

Now that is what I wanted to hear. That make it so much clearer now. Thanks Steve!

 

My 2k2 seems to do better when I shift just before redline, more so from 2-3 though. The problem is when "sawing the lever" or manually shifting an auto, I find that when you shift, the tranny takes to d@mn long to go to the next gear. You almost need a 200 rpm buffer zone when you shift. This delay is even more pronounced at higher rpms. Athough, once the VB Mod is done, things will hopefully be different.

 

So basically when the curves intersec (if they do) that's where you want to shift becuase if you go any further, there will be less power, correct??