Max_Gator

In the never ending quest by the 2k 5spd Tampa Maxima guys (Madmax2k 2k2demax and MaxGator) to detail the performance of the 2k 5spd, I have provided a link to recent dyno plots of my 2k 5spd (below).

One of them is stock v. Y and SI. You will see an approximate max hp gain of 12hp to the wheels for the Cattman SS Y-pipe and the Stillen Intake combined (no - I didn't test each mod individually). HP is consistently higher than stock above approximately 5000 rpm. In fact, with the mods, I reach the stock max hp at only 5200 rpms rather than 6700 redline it took for stock. Max torque does not change much BUT torque is substantially higher above 5000 through redline.

FYI, all pulls - stock and mods -were done in 3rd gear. I know some may say that exaggerates HP slightly but at least it is consistent. The stock and mods were done about 1 month and 2000 miles apart.

In addition, I have also posted a dyno done with the EXHAUST DETACHED after the catalytic converter(courtesy of Madmax2k's hard work). It shows no significant gain in hp or torque. I believe there was sufficient back-pressure since torque only dropped nominally. I take this to mean that a cat-back system may be of limited value. However, I know that 2k2demax gained approximately 8 hp when he changed his exhaust and went to lighter wheels. In short, I don't expect to find great gains from a cat-back.


http://members.nbci.com/maxgator

madmax2k

Good post John. Hopefully the community at large finds it useful. I know I do

Max_Gator

Thanks for all your help Larry - I've learned a ton from you so far. Should have given you better credit above -it was your idea to drop the exhaust AND your hard work! lol

Max_Gator

By the way, here's the link to Larry's previous post of his dynos of Stock v. CAI and Cattman y-pipe.

https://maxima.org/forums/showthread...?threadid=5910

I've also added it to my directory with the other dynos above.

http://members.nbci.com/maxgator


Essentially, there is no substantive performance difference between the Cattman Y and the Stillen intake compared with the Cattman Y and the CAI.

Larry and I have identical 5spds and dyno'd stock on the same day. Our stock dynos are dead-on. He has (well, had on the dyno) the CAI and I have the Stillen. Difference was very small - less than 1 hp.

[Edited by Max_Gator on 11-25-2000 at 11:03 AM]

madmax2k

Also, for the "doubters" out there....John and I did on the road tests right after dynoing.....no difference between the 2 intakes. The cars were dead even. Ive now switched my intake back to the underhood style so I dont get the annoying creakiness from the lower intake tube.

Nismo87SE

A while back the Socal 4th gen guys tested the CAI vs teh SI intake. THe verdict was the SI makes more toppend power because of a higher MAF voltage. I was thinking since the CAI is 3", maybe its hurting the air velocity from that big ID. Now I wonder with a 2.5" CAI would do, in theory it should increase the intake air velocity and midrange-highend torque.

Max_Gator

I wonder whether the 4th gen analysis applies to the 5th since the 5th has variable intake runners? May be that whatever difference the SI provided to the 4th gen over the CAI has been negated now. I'll let you engineers fight it out!

Nismo87SE

Its nice that you guys can get over 200fwhp with just 2 mods. Now if only there was an ecu to finish the power mods. You could use that 7100rpm limiter set in the JWT ECU and the better optimized fuel/ignition maps.

Max_Gator

Yeah, I'm exploring the ECU thing. I have tried to get ahold of the people who do the PROGRAM - but have received no response. Not sure that I want to do pulleys and for now, no NO2 and no supercharger. So... that leaves very little.

Do you know if JWT makes anything for the 2k??

PIONEER

iTrader: (1)

Good find John, Now I don't have to spend $200 on a CAI like I had planned. As far as the ECU, I think JWT only made it for the 95-96 N/A Max. Gain on that was 8hp I think, the 4th gen guys may confurm that. Our best bet is prolly gonna be UPRD once they get all the 4th Gens done then it'll be our #. for now the AE Exaust is still an option to get 5 more HP.

Max_Gator

Well, the exhaust thing remains to be seen. I haven't seen any confirmation that it isn't marketing hype. Have heard that the part numbers are the same on the muffler.

Also, the dyno I did, showed an increase of 2 hp to the wheels where the exhaust was dropped after the cat. So, I guess there could be 5 hp in the exhaust somewhere. But seems like you wouldn't get that from just the muffler. If you find out anything, let me know.

Also, seems like I remember hearing some of the 4th gen guys say that the JWT didn't make a higher max hp, just provided higher hp in some parts of the band. Even so, that sounds good. I would love to have 10 more hp to the wheels at 5k RPMS!!

PIONEER

iTrader: (1)

Boy aren't we all HP Hungry Lets hope it doesn't make the piston come out of the block

Max_Gator

Don't think those kind of mods will do that. That's why I'm staying away from Nitrous!

MrBurner

max gator, if you think Nitrous is so bad, take a look at the newest issue of super street...there is a common misconceptions about nitrous section which you might want to look at...if you do everything right you can run a 200 shot on our engine for years w/o any problem...just look at the article...it all depends on installation...don't do it yourself, bring it to the best shop you can find...i plan on putting nitrous in soon (planned on a 75 shot...might go higher now because of the article)

madmax2k

Have fun with the 200 shot

Y2KevSE

iTrader: (13)

No way can your engine and tranny hold up that much power. Anything around 300 and you'll have to do some internal work... or <b>*BOOM*</b>.

PIONEER

iTrader: (1)

Kev I know U baby our car, shouldn't have a problem with too much Piston Cracking, Valves bending, Cam Shaft twisting power

Nismo87SE

This is from someone powered by a 3.125 midget

PhatGuy

Nismo87SE : wassup with you bringing old post back from the dead? Was there any real point in you replying to this after that time has past??????????????????

Greg's2kGLE

Links don't work, it says the page cannot be found....

Tony Fernandes

Just out of curiosity, when the dyno showed a 12 hp increase to the frot wheels, what do you tell people what your new hp is? If you have 222 hp stock, and you get 12 hp to the front wheels, you just don't add the 12 to the 222 do you? Because the 222 hp is not a true fwhp rating, it's the engine's rating before you actually put it into the car with additional loads of the a/c, power steering, transmission, etc. I tried the link you gave and it won't work, so I'm not sure what the stock fwhp was. But let's just say it was 180 hp. If you now get 192 fwhp, then this would correspond to a 236 hp engine, not the 234 hp you would get if you merely add the 12 and 222.

180x=192*222
180x=42624
x=236

So you're "new" modded engine would be a 236 hp engine. Right? Hope I didn't confuse everyone...I might be waaay off base.

Tony

Max_Gator

Well, the link is ALMOST 1 YEAR OLD - just like the post. So it should be no surprise that it no longer works.

Don't know that I have that plot on line anywhere. My plots are at:

DYNO PLOT: Stock(Run2) v. Y/SI(Run 5) v. Y/SI/UDP (Run 11)

DYNO PLOT: Air Fuel ratio (with all mods)

You are correct regarding what you list as hp to the crank. It is just a backwards guess from wheel hp. That is, if stock crank is 222 and wheel is 190 then driveline loss is (222-190)/222 or about 15% Just divide the wheel hp by 85% and you'll get an approximate crank hp.

serin

iTrader: (2)

is it just me or do the links not function?

Max_Gator

If you tried the links in the above post, it is you. If you tried the original links, they don't function.

maximuss

Max_Gator, I made a dyno run with and without the stock exhaust muffler, what was the difference in HP?

Maximuss

RussMaxManiac

Stock Dyno Graph on my 2000 Auto:

http://www.5thgenmaximas.com/russmax.../images/2kmax/

And chart:

http://www.5thgenmaximas.com/russmax...ax/2kdyno2.jpg

Here is the one when the ypipe was installed.

http://www.5thgenmaximas.com/russmax...ax/D1199-1.jpg

http://www.5thgenmaximas.com/russmax...ax/D1199-2.jpg

http://www.5thgenmaximas.com/russmax...ax/D1199-3.jpg

maximuss

I need to find out what was the difference with all of Max_Gator's mods with and without the stock muffler. What was the difference in HP that the stock mufflers robbed from him.

Does the stock muffler rob you from HP, and by how much?

Maximuss

Max_Gator

I'll have to dig them up, but as I recall, Madmax2k and I ran the test with muffler detached after the cat. At the time, I had the SI and Cattman y. I believe the difference was around 3hp higher detached (or so) with a couple ft-lbs drop in Torque. From that, we concluded that there was not much to gain by changing exhaust or b-pipe.

That's not to say there is no gain, just not substantial enough in my opinion to justify it on purely a performance basis.