gmc74

Someone should send that 1/4 mile time to pontiac, since they think the GP (Great Pile o'****) is so great... lol

I don't find the torque steer to be an issue. You won't ever forget that the car has a lot of torque, but you shouldn't ever have the issues this guy does controlling it, I don't.

DrVolkl

Acura TSX #1? hahahahaha. Come on, really. That car sucks. Who would want that slow POS? LAME. They can look at my tail lights all day long.

MONTE 01&97 SE

iTrader: (1)

I'm sure it was the manual those times seem to be on par with preivous 6spd 04 rest results, also Jaegers and Auds. times differ for G35's trap speed is it 98 or 100?

Jaeger

Damn. Left the mag at the office. Will double-check tomorrow.

Jaeger

soundmike

iTrader: (24)

It's not about who's fastest but which one has a better overall package as a sports sedan.

As much as i love Maxima's and Nissan in General - there is no way even the 6th gen Max can touch the quality of the TSX. Sure the TSX is a slowpoke, but it handles well and feels solid.

Again, total package.

MaxMaybe

"simply not enough suspension control to keep you and your passengers from getting car sick. Sure, the Maxima's tires will carve up an offramp, but this 3534-pound car squirms, plunges, and wallows on a country road."

Anybody out there with an '04 SE agree? This is the very reason I didn't consider another Grand Prix after a two year lease on a '97 GTP.

I took two test drives in '04 SE's and did not particularly notice this. Someone please reassure me that I haven't made a mistake ordering one.

Jaeger

You've ultimately got to rely on your own assessment, not Automobile Mag's, not other Maxima owners. If you took two extensive test drives and didn't feel the car wallowed like a drunken pig then that's the only opinion that matters.

Jaeger

PS - the "car sick" comment was clearly over the top by any measure.

SteVTEC

If any mag's criteria for any comparison is the best "overall package" then the Honda entry is going to win everytime because that's their exact philosophy in building cars. A jack of all trades, but a master of none.

You can get more in some areas with certain cars, but at the expense of making concessions in another. Just line up whats important to you and what's not with the appropriate car. Jack-of-all-trade-master-of-none cars are nice, but not for everybody. After owning a Honda (and being less than impressed), I realized that my needs were a little more specific and that there were better choices out there for me.

Yes, the TSX is a nice "overall" package. It would be mid-pack at best for my needs and my specific selection criteria though. People need to use mags as a reference guide and not as some bible. I bet the TSX guys over at the TSX forums are going crazy right about now.

Jaeger

Trap speed for the G35 was 100 mph. My mistake in the earlier post.

Jaeger

Audtatious

The Max seems to have gotten a position below the GTP only due to the suspension. They actually state that the GTP "keeps its footing in the corners far better than the Maxima, but the sweet spot where the body remains in control is awfully small". Finally: "The Grand Prix's aging engine has to take a lot of the blame as its impressive numbers don't translate into much liveliness on the street, no matter how much you use Tapshift. Like a muscle car of the '60's, the GTP combines lots of exterior style, an interior made of plastic, and a powerful but lazy engine"

Hmmm...The Max is disliked because of the "ride" and they don't seem to like the sluggish engine, plastic interior, nor the suspension of the GTP either. That's 3-1 and the '04 Maxima should have been #11 in the list

Anyway, what is so different between the suspension setups of the Max, G35, Alty, etc that make such a difference in their tests? Aren't they all on the same platform with the same motor ( other than the obvious diff of RWD vs FWD?

SteVTEC

350z/G35 = Nissan "FM" platform (Front-engine, Midship (RWD)Atlima/Maxima = Nissan "FF-L" platform (front-engine, front-drive, Large)

You need a totally different platform for FWD vs RWD setups.

Audtatious

Yes, I understand the diff between the FWD vs RWD susp, but aren't they based on the same "chassis" so the geometry should be similar other than the changes necessary due to drive-wheel location.

The mags seemed to like the 3.5 Alty, but don't like the '04 Max. Placebo effect due to their dislike of the new Maxima's "style"?

jbgoodmax

I couldn't agree more. Some of the cars in that test where the size of the Sentra. So they should have could have used that or the Altima.

The Max handles great, and others "Mags" agree. The Max is a "Near Lux Fullsized Sports Sedan".

TSX, haven't driven it, but I an tried of people putting the "build" quality soo high. They are using the same techique Nissan used in the previos Altima, 95 - 99, Max. This is nothing new, soft touch ... The 04 Max has a differenct luxury feel, everyone that has rode in it says wow, this is a Maxima ... I have driven in a few TL ... and they feel like my wife's 99 SE, different not better ...

Mag racers are going to have thier azz handed to them if they read too much into that article.

Far as total package, the Max has been the best total package for years. Size(big is good to many), handling(with size taken into account), quality, style(subjective, but atlleast not bland), performance(v6 out running v8's and smaller cars ..).

But for us old max guys/gals this is nothing new.

Ceasars Chariot

iTrader: (16)

Im not sure why the 04 maxima would even be compared with some of those cars ? The 04 maxima is a beautiful car, but the 350z and altima 3.5 are pushing the performance/sports side of things. I would like to have seen where the Nissan Altima 3.5 might have came in. The 04 maxima just needs some modifications for battle, but on the other hand im sure there are many things the new maxima beats out on the other cars.

example: new Mitsubishi Lancer EVO's are putting down 13.9's and 14.1's at the track !

the g35's im seeing are putting down high 14's

kingrukus

iTrader: (41)

Wow this list is halarious. I find the Mazda's placement funny. TSX over a 325 or G35...haha. What was this list based on, gas consumption? No wait that doesn't make sense. Probably who ever paid off the magazine the most as is the case with the rest of the media.

JCW915

The IS300 is a rear wheel drive car...

rbloedow

No, the two cars share nothing between each other besides the engine (that in itself is very different too).

Audtatious

Hmmmmm....I was under the impression that the Alty and Max shared the same IRS platform, the Murano was the same(ish) but in a AWD config, and the Z, G35/C were on a shortened platform in a RWD config...

Looks like I have some reading up to do....


As far as the engine, other than intake, exhaust and possibly ECU mods, they have the same internals....

DrVolkl

Total package is fine, but I think that car is WAY underpowered to even be in the group, let alone #1. I think it's missing a big part of the package...the engine!

kingrukus

iTrader: (41)

From what I understsand the Altima and Maxima share the exact same platform. The Murano rides on the same platform too (though it may be altered a bit), and the Quest rides on a supersized version of that platform. The G35/c and 350 and I believe upoming Skyline all share a different FM (front midship) platform.

Y2KMaxGXE-R

iTrader: (4)

I question the validity of above comparison (a total BS). Every damn car magazine out there will post their own comparo, and so did this little-known Automobile mag. 2k4 is a premium midsize car, and competes with Avalon, 3.2TL, Diamante, LeSabre, Grand Prix, Impala & etc.

Audtatious

Yeah, I don't know why the TL was not featured nor the Impala. I understand why the Avalon nor LeSabre were "in the mix" since they are family sedans.

Oh well, could be worse. With TL and Impala SS, the Max could have been 14th

MAXSE-RIOUS

Couldn't agree more.

MONTE 01&97 SE

iTrader: (1)

Le Sabre, no way in hell does it compete with Maxima, neither does Avalon those cars have way more interior space than Maxima look at the EPA stats. The Max main competitors remain the Same the TL,Diamante, used to be Millena,GTP, Impala never has competed with Maxima moreso Altima now.

MaximumMike

You guys need to check out the August edition of Motor Trend. They show that the 6th Gen SL is at 14.9 and the G35 sedan is only at 14.7. The only thing that gives the G35 an edge is the change of gear cycle.

After reading the results of the track numbers, I feel extremely happy with my choice of the 6th Gen. Just think, if the max was 100lbs lighter it would surpase the G35.

ga2000

it has the sl faster than the se maxima? i thaught the 5spd auto was better?

MaximumMike

Did I say anything about the SE? Nooooo! They only tested the SL in a comparison to the G35. The SE wasn't available, but now that you mention it, the 5spd auto SE might do just a little better. Also, they ran the cars with everything standard. Spare tire was in vehicle and air pressure in tires were normal.

jbgoodmax

You would think that testers would want to test the "new" five speed auto se. But many have opted to do the SL or 6-sp.

Unless they spend a lot of time learning how to launch the 6-sp, the mag numbers will suck.

nevertheless, the 5-sp auto should be tested a lot more than it has.

CoolMax

iTrader: (7)

I wonder what the reaction would have been if the Maxima finished in first place?

Quicksilver

iTrader: (1)

We would be just as shocked as we are to see it so far down on the list...

CoolMax

iTrader: (7)

Shocked, yes. But I doubt any one would contest it.

10e

This comparison is a joke.

First off, the Maxima is a mid-size sedan. You don't compare the handling and acceleration of a mid size sedan with Compacts like the EVO, IS300 and TSX. Bigger=heavier=more momentum and sloppier handling. The whole "sport sedan" title is a joke. Every article I've ever read describes the EVO as having a rock hard ride, and the WRX as being marginally rough.

Ask anyone who owns or has driven both a 5-series (midsize) and 3-series (compact) BMW and they will tell you that the 3-series definitely outhandles the 5-series and feels more connected to the road and much more stable. It's very difficult to tune a suspension system to handle the extra mass/momentum without making the ride ultra stiff and uncomfortable.

I mean who is the target market for this article? 20 to 50 year old androgynous hermpaphrodites?

And I've been in various GTPs. Nothing special.

10e

bluemaxx

maxima, hermaphrodite... hmmm

nismaniac

I have the magazine and it basically says that when the Maxima is on the Highway, it is great. It is when you get on the twisty roads that it does not do so well.

I will now quote some excerpts from the article:

04 Maxima

"But once you leave the turnpike, there is simply not enough suspension control to keep you and your passengers from getting car sick."
"The Maxima's tires will carve up an offramp, but this 3534 pound car squirms, plunges, and wallows on a country road, and the steering wheel is always tugging at your hands to remind you that the front tires are doing almost all of the work. It's like wrestling an alligator."
"The engine is sending so much torque to the front wheels that it overpowers the rest of the car, so the Maxima always feels as if the motor is trying to get out of its cage."


04 GTP

"This car keeps its footing in the corners far better than the Maxima, but the sweet spot where the body remains in control is awfully small. The GTP feels as if GM engineers didn't spend enough time beyond the gates of the proving grounds."
"The GTP's aging engine has to take a lot of the blame, as its impressive numbers don't translate into much liveliness on the street, no matter how much you use tapshift."
"Like a muscle car of the late 60's, the GTP combines lots of exterior style, an interior made of plastic, and a powerful but lazy engine."



Yes, the Acura TSX finished first overall, but check these numbers!
The G35 dominates performance.

G35 tied with the EVO for first 0-60 time of 5.6sec
G35 ranked first in 0-100 @ 14.3sec and 0-110 @ 18.2sec

1/4 mile times and speeds:

G35 14.3sec @ 100mph
EVO 14.1sec @ 98mph
GTP 15.5sec @ 91mph
Max 15.1sec @ 95mph


So despite of the deceptive GTP comercials, the Max obviously still kicks the GTP's ***. But thats no surprise.

Quicksilver

iTrader: (1)

And that sentence right there tells me that Nissan targeted an older purchasing group (and concentrated on that GA-FL commute for the geezers of the world) vs. turning it into a canyon carving monster with muscle to boot for the younger crowd (like most of us). They are trying to get Nissan (Maxima specifically) to replace the Oldsmobile with the comfy, safe, and at the same time, extremely boring long highway rides...damn it Nissan!

gmc74

That moron in Canada used the 4speed when he tested the luxury version of the Max vs the sportiest version of the Grand Prix (GTP with Comp G suspension) because he felt that it made the test more fair. Then he argued that it wasn't pontiacs fault that Nissan doesn't put a supercharger on their cars when I brought up the fact that all things aren't going to be equal. Yet the same mentality that he had towards the supercharger, he ignored towards the 5speed auto, and the sport suspension... he is a nimrod. That story was bought and paid for by GM. No way a guy goes from trashing a car in February to praising it in April. Of course this "independent study" was conducted on GM's proving grounds... nice one.

1SICKLEX

I disagree. It's simple. Nissan is MARKETING the Maxima as a 4-door 350Z/Sports sedan but in reality, it is a cruiser/family sedan. And people THINK they have a sports sedan (cause of marketing) and get shocked at basically every review the car has gotten.

It cannot be a coincidence every magazine has stated the same things:
It's big and spacious.
It has a nice new design.
It does not drive like a sports sedan
Tourque steer is way to much
It has never won any comparo or any awards.
The 1995 Maxima weighed barely 3000lbs. The 04 Maxima weighs 3500lbs. THat is a HUGE difference. No matter how much HP you add, nothing hurts a cars sportiness more than weight. That is why with 265hp, the 04 Maxima is barely faster than a 9 year old 190hp Maxima.

Nate579

Remember guys, the article was based on the what type of car (Sport Sedan)you can get for 30k. Then placed them in groups basically according to (their))personality of drive. It was not a comparison perse, but just to inform the buying public what you can expect from you 30k purchase. These cars had nothing in common but price. I agree the maxima should have not come in last in it's group. You all noticed there where a few cars not included because you can not purchase one under 30k, ie, Acura TL, Toyota Avalon to name two,okay, maybe not the Toyota. But the general public, 90-95%, do not see cars as we do. They see them as transportation and only transportation and not as a extention of ones being. Some Saabs and Volvo come under that mark and can be considered a sport sedan...Ekkk!. Depending what magazine you read anyway. Really, If they was on point. They shouldn't had ranked and only giving a short opinion on the drive dynamics of each car and have the reading public go and test drive they one they like. I don't think they attended it to be a comparison, but it came out that way. Maxima last!!! I am sure they will have there email box full for the next month.

ga2000

so the 15.1 at 95 they got for the maxima is for a 4spd sl?? where does it say that. it shows an se model? i think it said the 6spd???

lightonthehill

Those suggesting the Maxima is now aimed at an older clientel are correct if talking about the Maxima tested in the article - the SL. It is specifically aimed at folks who want a little softer ride at some sacrafice of handling and general performance. It is the perfect car for those who plan on making lots of freeway trips, or do mostly normal driving, and aren't into agressive driving.

The SE, however, is not aimed at old folks. It is very responsive, and can be driven hard on highways or byways. It adapts well to agressive driving.

From my point of view, the selection of this set of cars for this test is a total joke. Comparing of cars varying by over half a thousand pounds in weight, and differing in interior room by more than twenty-five percent is meaningless.

There are several cars here that I would not pay $100 for. I'm not interested in a cramped hot rod that turns on a dime, but breaks my teeth on every bump.

Not relavent to the test, but some of these cars in the test would not impress me sitting in a driveway. Many of them could drive by and draw no look from anyone. The '04 Maxima impresses me anywhere and everywhere I see it. I see other folks looking hard at the new Max also.




edit - As Nate579 mentions below, the Automobile Mag test was with the SE. I confused that test with the Motor Trend test with the SL mentioned several times in this thread. Considering the Automobile Mag test was with the SE, that makes the results even less reasonable than I originally thought.