Would like to hear about the various clutches people are running with there 3.5 setup. I’m looking for something smooth, pretty as close to stock as possible and very capable of handling the power the 3.5 puts down.


I happened came across a 6puck clutch made by XTD, I’m already skeptical as I’ve never heard of that company, and never heard of anyone using their clutch but here is a small sample of their description of their 6 puck clutch.
This sounds good, but once its up in the car it’s a different story. I’m not too confident in it, and worry it maybe a chattery clutch, or you’d need the leg of the hulk to move it.

 

its weird they rate the hp, most clutches rate torque.

I have a spec stage 2. As light as a stock pedal, seems to hold the power fine. I have made it slip a time or two at the drag strip by hot lapping 5-6 runs in a row with rough launches, but it comes right back after it cools off. I will probably buy another one when this one dies, unless I decide to play with nitrous.

 

you've felt my clutch cant get much better than that

 

Sounds good I’ll look into it. Where did you order it from. How much tq can it hold?

I remember your clutch, light as everything, is it still chatty at launch under 1.5k?

 

I'm going to be running a stock 5th gen clutch disc and pressure plate when I get the engine in the car (hopefully tonight). I don't think it will last 2 months, but we shall see. I'm looking into getting a SPEC, Exedy, or Clutch Masters Stage 1 clutch in a month or so.

 

you already have the 5th gen clutch or going to buy it?

 

You better post the pics, information, problems, everything. I just drool, read, read, read, and re-read 3.5 swap threads. Love them. I can't wait to find a reason to do the swap. I can't justify the money loss yet.

Please read the thread about the guy who had problems lining up his timing case, TDC, all that internal fun (Internals > me). The ORG is in lack of information when it comes to the reinstalling the 3.0 timing case on the 3.5. This is assuming you are even using the 3.0 case. If not, then say "HAHA I am running 3.5 ECU with VTC and can now ruin boosted Civics in my sleep".

 

I already have it, it's brand new. I was in the process of doing a 5spd swap when I decided to do a 3.5 swap because my 3.0 had 232k on it and had oil leaks everywhere.




I know all about the few guys who had timing problems, but I triple checked my timing was correct. The #1 piston is at TDC, and the cams are in there proper positions. Everything is lined up.

The thing that scares me the most about the swap is all the liquid gasket procedure. I swapped the 3.0 oil pan along with the 3.0 timing chain. That's alot of gasket scraping and liquid gasket application. I'm pretty confident I did it right the first time though.

I have the motor bolted to the frame, I just have to get the front bank injector harness because my motor didn't come with one. I also have to plug the EGR ports (header and EGR itself). It should be done next week hopefully.

 

Why don't you think it will last longer than two months???

 

Because I don't think it will be able to handle the torque that the 3.5 will put out when it's tuned.

 

"Why don't you think it will last longer than two months"

I am guessing that is his way of saying he is going to ride the (*&% out of the clutch.


*Drool on Goalie Keg's Max*
By you saying that you are plugging the EGR ports, I am assuming that you got the engine from a 02-03 Max (Internal EGR stuff).
What do you mean by gasket scraping? By liquid gasket application, I am assuming you mean RTV Sealant?

I am asking questions like a hawk, because I know this is me in the far future.

 

Saying that it's only going to last 2 months is my way of saying that the clutch isn't going to handle the power very well. I'm not a noob when it comes to driving a stick. It will slip.


It's actually a motor from an 04 maxima. It has external EGR. The 98 EGR copper piping that goes to the rear exhaust manifold will not fit becuase the tube is shaped going the wrong way, even though the thread sizes are the right size on both ends. I'm getting plugs for both the rear manifold and for where the EGR copper tube goes into the actual EGR system. Also, the EGR on the 04 maxima is electronically controlled from what I can tell (it has an electrical connector on the top, not vaccum controlled like the 98 EGR system. I need to plug it because if I don't, it will cause a huge vaccum leak.

Yes, RTV sealant is liquid gasket.

 

I have the XTD stage 3 clutch in my car. Been having it since January. It's not as good as I thought it would be, though. I have a 3.0 N/A screamer, but with only this much power, it still feels like the clutch didn't grip as hard as I wanted it to be. My brother at the same time just did a 5 speed conversion and has a clutchnet red 2x clutch in his car. I drove the difference and noticed that clutchnet's pedal feel isn't heavy but it grips like a motha compared to my XTD stage 3. Also, after downshifting a couple times consecutively to pass other cars on the interstate, I noticed it to not grip as tight as the tranny gets hotter. After all, I don't think I'll do this clutch again. I got this from EBAY for 130 bucks, so cheap that I am Placebo'ed to think this clutch sucks. One more thing, this clutch gives me the chatters all the time. I wouldn't recommended if you are driving up and down the hills in traffic too much.

Now, I've just blown my motor on the interstates 2 days ago. So, I am getting a 3.5 into my car. I'm exhausted from the finance department to get a new clutch, so I'll still stick with this XTD clutch for a little longer till it goes out. In addition to the 3.5 swap, I have a 14 psi V2 supercharger kit 95% collected. If the 3.5 motor runs fine for a while N/A, I'll install the supercharger this winter, consider a proper "break in, and debug" all the possible ghosts before I boost it.

Hope this helps...

Peter

 

Considering tilleys99 went 11.55 @ over 120mph on a stock 3.5 clutch, I say save your money and spend it on something you really need to upgrade. Unless of course you're planning on putting down more than like, 400lb of tq to the wheels.

 

That is what I wanted to hear I saw the XTD Stage 2 and was curious, the price is what attracted me but a clutch of the magnitude it described I figured would cost more than $140. Thanks for that review I go un and down hill at time, I don’t want a chattery clutch so I’ll pass on the XTD clutch.

So it was your XTD clutch that wouldn’t grip as well after a few downshifts ot the clutchnet red?

I’m looking at the spec clutches. I saw a spec 1 clutch for the max good up to 360 and the stage 2 good up to 390. The stage 1 should be good enough to handle 3.5, still researching.

Is anyone running the stock 3.5 altima clutch? Or 02 clutch?

 

I don't reccomend boosting the 3.5 on stock internals. You WILL blow your motor with the stock pistons/rods/rings. Especially boosting anything above 9psi. Build the block before you drop the S/C in. Trust me. Do it right the first time and you will make a tremendous amount of power with that S/C. Rods, pistons, and rings should do ya. Don't forget some ARP studs too.

EDIT: Check this out.

http://www.vqpower.com/v2/modules.ph...rticle&sid=185

 

Rebuilding the 3.5 is the least of my worries right now because it's already done. I'll release the details once it's in the bay and running. But for now, you can assume the motor to be fully boost friendly. I have the 2.87" pulley to pull up 13-14 psi's, but I am going to consider the 2.61 pulley soon because of the yeilds of this rebuld. So you should have a good ballpark of where I'm standing. Basically, Chris'smax and I are the 2 pioneers who's trying to s/c our 3.5's, and we're both in Baton Rouge. It's a race between the two now. He's prolly going to win this one.

 

So are you telling me the VQ35 cannot withstand as much boost as a VQ30?

I consistently see 350Z guys pushing 400 whp on their stock motors. Not questioning your statement but would like some basis on your opinion.

Mike

 

Well if the stock 3.5 clutch was able to help Tilley run 11.55, then I’m sure it can handle the task very well. Does the stock 3.5 clutch work in our 01 and under MT trannies? I thought the 02+ had an extra ring or doesn’t have an extra ring . . . or the 3.5 clutch will bolt right up, maybe with a transfer of certain parts?

 

I base my statement on when the first S/C kit came out for the 3.5 (Stillen, I believe). Guys were blowing their VQ35's left and right. It's a well known fact that the 3.0 can handle tons of boost without upgrading internals. I don't know if it was a tuning issue at first with the 3.5, but that is what I remember. I haven't looked into the current guys who are boosting their 3.5's, so you could be right. Either way, if he's going to be boosting at 14psi, he's going to need upgraded internals, end of story. The general consensus is that the 3.5 is weaker internally than the 3.0 based on past experiences I've heard about from Z guys. I guess you heard differently. The 3.5 guys around me that are boosting are running upgraded internals.

Now the 3.5 crank, on the other hand, can withstand up to 1300hp. That I do know. When I go boost on the 3.5 it will be getting built, no matter what. I don't need a blown motor on my hands.

 

You can push 400 whp on stock 3.5's, but not at too high rpms, that's all. the internals aren't really ideal for high rpms. That's why he's concerned about rebulding the internals. Also, stock 3.5 compression is a tid higher than the 3.0's, so boostwise, it needs to be considered. My motor is still being worked now, but when it's up and running, I'll release the details. I simply dont' like to smack talk before it's done. So if it's never up and running, then I wouldn't have to feel the embarrassment. but just for the motorhead's info, something is being done here in Baton Rouge.

 

He's using a 6-speed clutch. A better comparison would be the 3.5 altima stock clutch.

 

02/03 max - 750 kg pressure plate - 250 mm dia. UN-sprung disc

00/01 max - 635 or 750 kg pressure plate - 240 mm sprung disc

The dowel pin holes are in slightly different locations between the 5th and 5.5 gen pressure plates.

 

so will the 5.5 gen still work with it being a bit larger in diameter plus dowel pin in a slightly different localtion.

 

Your engagement may be a little rough as the shock would normally be absorbed by the dual mass flywheel.

The 5.5 gen disc sits OK on the face of the 4th gen flywheel. It clears all the balancing holes (on mine anyway)

I have a 6th gen disc and PP in my garage. (it came attached to the flywheel when the wrecker shipped it to me)
The dowel pin spacing is the same between 02/03 and 04 as they use the same flywheel.

The other important dimension would be the axial distance from the face of the pressure plate to the top of the springs where the release bearing sits. I will compare the 4th and 6th gen PPs I have.

If you re-drill the pressure plate, to fit on the flywheel, you would need to get them dynamically balanced as a unit.

 

LOL you got me wrong. I wasn't trying to suggest you are a noob with a stick. I was trying to say that it was probably going to endure repe***ive dumps/excessive aggressive driving. But, you corrected me in a sense by saying that it cannot handle the 3.5 power so I am wrong either way.

I am very confused about your EGR setup. The way you are going about makes perfect sense ... plug the *&^% up. I was under the impression that you were supposed to use all 4th gen EGR equipment anyway. Are you using the 3.5 Exhaust manifold or 3.0.

Common sense leads me to 3 conclusions:
1.) You are trying to use 3.5 EGR equipment on a 3.0 exhaust manifold ... "EGR on the 04 maxima is electronically controlled"
2.) You are using the 3.5 Exhaust manifold (Big no-no according to the FAQ and since you aren't a noob, there is no way you are doing this unless you have aftermarket headers) ... "even though the thread sizes are the right size on both ends" ... this makes it sound as if you were
3.) The positioning of the EGR equipment after the swap does not permit everything to connect up ... "The 98 EGR copper piping that goes to the rear exhaust manifold will not fit becuase the tube is shaped going the wrong way"

I am guessing both #1 and #3. Since I am a complete EGR noob, (Couldn't point to a single EGR pipe or switch/solenoid minus the rear exhaust one in my 98) I have no right to try to correct you or tell you otherwise. I am just trying to figure out if you can connect the EGR back up when you have a 3.5 with external EGR. I like the idea of saving the environment ... not that I am a tree hugger or anything, but you get the point.

 

I'm going to do this swap soon so this would be great info to have.

So the 5th gen clutch/PP will not be able to handle the power?

 

I am using 3.0 XS Racing headers (stone racing).

You don't have to run the EGR at all. Tavarish isn't using it, and his car is running fine. The EGR system, if I'm not mistaken, is a relief for engine knock. When the engine knocks, the ECU sends a signal to the EGR to activate ( the ECU goes into safe mode as well), thus releasing exhaust gasses back into the manifold to somehow control the knock. It's sort of like a safety thing for the engine. I've had the EGR explained to me in great detail before, but this is the general idea.

1. Yes.
2. No. I'm using a 98 EGR tube that connects the 3.0 exhaust manifold to the 3.5 EGR system. If I had a 3.5 EGR tube, this might bolt right up if the threads matched on the header.
3. Yes, that is correct.

So you are correct on your assumption.

That's what I'm trying to figure out as well. The tubing will be able to be reconnected if you get the right bend in the tubing, but the EGR won't work because I'm not running a 3.5 ecu, period. It's electronically controlled, like I said. The 3.0 can't run it. That is why I'm going to plug it up.

 

i have a spec stage 2. It holds fine, and i'm sure it won't slip down the track. I have no EGR or EVAP stuff, and no CEL. I don't think they installed the EGR as a fail safe, but more as an "always on" thing to lower exhaust gas temps. it dirties the inside of the IM, i'll tell you that much.

 

Ive have thrown 75 shot of juice with my spec stage 2 clutch and it never slipped.

 

spec stage 2 sounds like my kind of clutch.

 

The EGR system is there to reduce NOx emmissions by lowering combustion temperatures. Retarded ignition timing is the ECU's response to knock.

You could use the 99 ECU to control it since it has an electric EGR system as well but swapping one in wouldn't be worth the trouble.

 

Has anyone ever compared these 3.0 XS Racing headers (stone racing) to the hot shot headers for the 3.0 or the cattman headers? Where did you purchase them and how much were they any complaints, sounds?

 

Well then my last question is can you not swap the 4th gen vaccum controlled EGR onto the 3.5 and remove the electric controlled 6th gen stuff?

By lower combustion chamber temps, it reduces the amount of knocking so it is definitely a performance advantage. Not 50 WHP, but maybe 1 or 2. This may not apply on a straight line, but if you were going up an incline, you may end up knocking without EGR equipment.

 

this thread has been offical Hijacked

 

seriously