Hey guys,
I've had the Suprastick installed for a while and I used the VSS for the speed input. It's ok at part throttle but under full throttle conditions it gets extremely unstable. I either bounce off the limiter or shift 800rpm before my desired shift point. I switched it up to the front left ABS sensor and the reading is absolutely solid, except it doesnt give me a signal below 20 km/h (12.5 mph). At very light throttle I would like it to shift before getting up to that speed. Is our ABS sensor like that by default? Does it not register pulses at speeds lower than 12 mph? I played around with the speed sensor teeth setting and rear end ratio setting in the Suprastick program but no matter what, I cant get a pulse at low speeds.

Any help is appreciated.

PS. I tried both front ABS sensors and got similar results.

 

Mine was all over the map connected to vss as well but that was with the 5.5 gen ECU. I haven't heard of anyone else using the 4th Gen ECU having problems with the VSS signal. Maybe we can generate some feedback on that.

Mine is connected to the ABS sensor but the sensor is not connected anywhere else but it does give a signal right down to 1-2 mph, I currently shift from 1-2 at about 5 mph so I know what you are after.

There are 2 sensors on the trans you might try both of then and see if the signal quality is better. I tried them as well but I was still having difficulty getting a quality signal.

My RPM signal to the Suprastick still doesn't function correctly and I have tried everything to get it working. The good part is that the SS will function without it.

Hope you get it working because that is the heart of the Suprastick and it must function correctly.

PS You have a pretty stout setup there. You have more mods than me, it should be a winner when you get it all working together.

 

The only problem with using any sort of vehicle speed signals from the front of the car is that if you're spinning tires, you'll upshift early. I'd go off of a rear ABS sensor, personally.

Seen a lot of RWD cars with engine management or other systems set up like that, using a front wheel speed sensor.

 

Thought of that, actually that's what I did with my 2k2 to eliminate the traction control. However if you do that for the shifting you could be bouncing off the limiter and with nitrous its not a good thing. N/A would be ok.

 

Yes I tried use the rear ABS and its very unpleasant. The suprastick thinks I'm going 30mph meanwhile I've lost traction and like Jime stated, I'm bouncing off the rev limiter.

 

have you tried connecting it to the speedometer signal instead?

 

I tried the speedometer signal. Its somewhat stable at lower speeds but at WOT it either shifts too early or too late. Also if I'm cruising at like 40, the Suprastick reading fluctuates between 39 and 48.

 

mmm, thats 1 reason why i don't use the automode

i guess my only recommendation is go with whatever source you used that you found better suitable and fine tune your shift table until it accomadates your needs.

 

I experience the same thing, sometimes i hit limiter in the 1-2 shift. I have my suprastick wired up to the speedometer directly from the cluster behind the gauge. My problem I believe is the tps, it jumps around too much but as far as speed its pretty accurate in my case from where im getting the signal. I recently put up the boost on my car so im putting alot mroe power however oddly enough i havent hit the limiter in 1-2 shift for some reason (perhaps due to wheelspin it shifts earlier).

How much MPH should we be programming before the limitier is the question. I figure 2mph earlier to give the auto time to shift, too close and it might touch limiter.

 

I never used the auto mode...
The issue isnt with the shift table. The ABS sensor isnt registering a pulse below a certain speed. At higher speeds it's the most solid signal I've gotten. All wot shift are consistent. I have the 1-2 shift at 52 MPH and its dead on every time. I couldnt get that with the VSS.

 

Have you tried fine tuning the TPS. A higher voltage is registered once the vehicle is turned on. I had the same issue. I had to manually adjust mine. Also check to see if the TPS % increases in a linear fashion when you apply throttle. Do this with the ignition on and the car off, obviously. With a bad TPS I would go to like 80% then dip to 74% and then jump to 90%. I changed my TPS and now the change is linear and there are no dips.

With my setup, I hit the limiter at 54 MPH (7250 RPM). To avoid this I set the shift at 52 MPH and according to EU data logs, the shift occurs between 7000 and 7100 RPM. I'm pretty sure I could go to 53 MPH and still avoid hitting the limiter but I'd rather go with 52 MPH just to be certain. With 54 MPH, I would get one bounce off the limiter followed by the shift.

 

Well I have however I am still not 100% sure how the tps setting works. right now i have the min to 66 and max i think 177. When i go to the sensor setting for tps, it shows min as 66 mostly but bouncing around. This tps i have might be a little too old because i always have to recalibrate the WOT on the emanage, it always reads 98% instead of 100. I am going to mess with the tps a lil more and see how it goes. I had bit of trouble with it when doing my 00VI a few years ago.

as for your case, have you thought about trying using another abs sensor to see if it picks up slower speeds?

 

Wow, those TPS numbers are way different than what I have. My min is 4 and my max is 384 which is very similar to what I have in the EU, 0.4V and 3.92V. Are you certain that your TPS is physically calibrated? 500ohms idle and 4K ohms at WOT IIRC. What voltage readings do you get in the EU for the TPS?

As for my case, I've tried both front ABS sensors. I will check both sensors with a multimeter to see if they're in good health and I will also reground the one I'm using. If all else fails I will attempt using the revolution sensor on the tranny and see if I can get a stable reading off that.

 

I have to re-check because usually on my emanage I dont get 100% throttle, even if i calibrate it on the emanage at 1st it reads 100 but then come to fidn out few weeks later when im logging that its at 98%. if my voltage is not like urs, should i load the emanage, and turn the TPS till emanage shows 0.4v? (easier than using multimeter)

 

Yes you could do that. That's how I've been making adjustments lately. Try and get it so it reads 0.4x volts at idle and 3.xx volts at WOT. Once those adjustments are made, turn the car on, and you should notice a higher voltage at idle. Mine reads 0.42v with the ignition on but car not running and when the car is running it reads 0.43v. What I do is check the Manual box for minimum and adjust it to 0.43v so my TP reads 0% in the logger when the car is running. Also with the ignition on but car not running, step on the gas pedal slowly all the way to WOT and see if the TP% increase is linear or if its jumping around.

 

On a separate note but still related to the suprastick, I currently have my TCM controlling my TC. The TCM takes into account some variables (coolant temp?, ATF temp) before going into lockup mode. I want to let the suprastick take control of the TC but it gets pretty cold here in Canada and with the suprastick, lockup would occur regardless of ATF temperature. Is there any harm in locking the TC under very cold conditions when the fluid hasnt reached operating temps?

 

I have it the same way although I also have a manual switch so I can lock it up when ever i want for example in 2nd gear (which TCM dosnt lock at WOT). Jime has it controlled by the suprastick and I havent seen him report any problems. I would believe that you might harm something when its not at operating temperature, just like the engine, you cant be going WOT when engine temp needle still below C, just not a good idea specially when making good power. Question is, how cold is too cold to be locking it? Aaron always tells me that my temps to him are extremly high, how ever to me I think they are acceptable, cruising its usually in the 160's, if its cool out on highway it can even reach to 110s. now after some abuse or track it can reach 180 degree's which is still acceptable (to me) anything above that i shut down and stop racing till it cools. He runs his tranny alot cooler (but its also built). Bottom line, i say you use the suprastick to lock it up. If jime hasnt broken anything like that then its a good sign lol.

 

After reading the post just wanted to monitor the voltage, loaded the emanage, and idle v reads .49v (thats the lowest it read), with car on stays solid at .50. Might be a little high however I realized that my throttle plate is a bit open, since i dont have an IACV due to my 00VI install. So I believe if I close it completly it should read somewhat low .4x's, ill have to do more test and also see if its linear how you say.

 

I believe that's perfectly fine. You dont need to adjust it. Just check to see what the voltage is at WOT...should be high 3s or low 4s (3.xx or 4.xx). I'm not sure why you're getting such low readings in the suprastick program when your EU readings are in the correct range

You mentioned that at WOT, in the suprastick program you're getting 177 (1.77v) right?

 

Are you referring to your engine coolant temperature or automatic transmission fluid temps? My ECT at normal operating temp is 90 celcius (~195F). Not sure what my ATF temps are.

I'm gonna go ahead and wire up the TC to the suprastick. Its annoying how the TCM delays the lockup for so long when its cold. Today I was on the highway for about 10 minutes before the TC finally locked up. Outside temp was about 10 degrees Fahrenheit. The ECT had reached normal operating temps even before I got on the highway.

 

I was referring to ATF temp, you should monitor that as well. I always know when to go easy on the car once the atf temp starts to go up. hook it up anyway im sure u wont have issues. Im in miami, so the cold is no big deal (unless temps are like 60 outside and im on the highway, then the atf temp can reach like 100 degree or lower).

as for the suprastick, i gotta check again, because i know for a fact the closed tb is .66, going to see what the WOT is. i could have sworn it was a 1## but i may be wrong.

 

let me correct myself. i just spent sometime checking that actual voltages, suprastick reads .66 closed and .399(with car off), with car on almost same closed but WOT is .420, I just left it with setting at car off. emanage reads .50 and wot. about 3.79 or so. i slowsly moved the pedal and its linear, however when car is on, there might be some noise causing it to bounce around a lil bit, the closed voltage. ill leave it as is for now, car is responding as I like so i dont wana start messing with it and end up worse lol.

 

Ya my voltage bounces around a bit too at closed throttle when the car is on. It doesnt seem to have an effect on shifting though. What kind of gauge are you using to monitor your atf temps? Did you tap into the atf temp sensor?

 

I have an autometer phantom tranny temp gauge, it comes with a sending unit. I made a T at the outlet of the tranny before the cooler, and screwd in the sensor.

 

So as you guys know, I was having issues with the VSS due to unstable readings and I couldnt get the ABS sensor to read below 12 mph. Today I tried the revolution sensor on the tranny and I got similar results as the VSS. The vehicle speed was dipping and spiking. I went back to the ABS sensor, but this time, I grounded the sensor to the same location as the Suprastick ground and voila, it reads right down to 1 MPH and it's incredibly stable

Things are finally coming together, all that's left now is wiring up the TC.

 

Good to know you found a solution to that and also good for future reference. Once you control the TC with the suprastick and set it to lock 1st and 2nd gear, man ur going to love it. When i lock 2nd the car gets sudden rush of extra power. feels great. In my case i dont lock up 1st gear because I dont get full boost in 1st, you wanna have it locked when your at your peak HP more or less, otherwise if you lock it too early (out of your power band), it will take longer to reach your peak hp range, btw this is all from my experience with my turbo setup, n/a might be different (I think I used to lock 1st when i was n/a)

 

Thanks for the tip. Question though, how does the stall speed setting in the Suprastick program effect the TC lockup in 1st and 2nd gears? What do you have your stall speed set at? Does it matter what type of converter we have? (Stock vs. high stall)

And do you mean peak HP or peak torque?

 

well i dont have it set with the suprastick, i use it manually with a switch i have. You really have to test it out urself to be honest, to determine when its the best time to lock it up. Im not 100% familiar on how to set up the stall speed since i havnt done it, hopefully jime can pitch in about that. Each setup is different the nitrous guys lock at at certain point (jime and gray), i lock it at another time due to how my boost performs, n/a will be different, all depends on the power curve Im guessing based on your mods your power is all at high rpm which means, wouldnt be great to lock it early instead when u get closer to ur power say 5500+ which im sure thats when ur motor really wakes up.

 

Wanted to verify something, what are your settings as far as rear end ratio (or final drive), tire size, etc... i would like to compare my settings with yours.

 

My TC control is manual I don't let the Suprastick do it. The only time I use it is on the road to lockup 4th. At the track I don't lock it up at all. Maybe if I run out of rpm in 3rd I will give it a go. Was always going to try it out at the track but just never got around to it. I only went to 1 T&T this year all the rest were races and you don't get much free time to screw around. Only had one weekend free from April til Oct so thats a lot of driving and racing.

 

Interesting, i didnt know you did not lock it at all at the track. By my experience, I performed a dyno with it locked (letting the tcm lock 3rd with od off, although at certain rpm its not 100% locked as you know), and also dyno'ed with it unlocked completly. the locked dyno gave me 312whp while having it unlocked gave me like 250someting, a HUGE difference by not having it locked. You should try it out on your next visit to the track.

 

Rear end ratio: 10
tire size: 255 (25.5", 205-65-R15)
Speed sensor teeth: 89
RPM teeth: 3 (Unstable but I know why, its off the tach signal. I'm assuming I would get a much better signal off the crank sensor)

Rear end and sensor teeth is going to be different than yours because I'm using ABS sensor, unless you switched over.

 

Jime, I was playing around with the TC settings in the Suprastick. I set it up so that it would lock up in 2nd at 5000 RPM with a throttle position greater than 40%. When I hit 5000 RPM, I almost lost control of the car, the wheel literally jumped out of my hands and the car accelerated like I've never felt before in 2nd gear. I dont know how healthy it is to lock up the converter in 2nd gear...just wanted your input.
I'm not planning on locking it up in 1st cause I believe I'll instantly lose traction upon lockup.

 

Since I am using the speed signal from behind the cluster speedo, what should me settings be?

And good to hear ur testing the TC out, i told you 2nd gear was going to be interesting when you locked it up lol.

 

IIRC my settings were as follows when I had it wired to the VSS:

Speed sensor teeth: 18
Rear end ratio: 3

If you have ABS, I would highly recommend you go that route. The signal is unbelievably stable. And its super easy to tap into. There are sub connectors beside each strut tower and that's where I tapped into it and brought the line in through the firewall. I didnt want to go messing around with the main ABS/TCS harness.

Also, if you can answer my question...is it healthy for the torque converter to be locked up in the lower gears like we're doing? It seems like it has to deal with a massive amount of power specially in your case.

 

I am going to see exacly how accurate my speed is and perhaps change it to abs.

as for the TC, I usually lock it as soon as i get into 2nd gear. Iv asked around before and been advice to not lock it in 1st. Just to be safe, lock it in 2nd and on, not 1st.

 

I've ran into a bit of a snag. I've disconnected wire #3 at the TCM (TC solenoid) but for some reason in 4th gear when there's no lockup, my revs are way higher than they should be. I'm talking like 1000rpm higher. And why is it that the OD button still has an impact on the Suprastick? I pressed the OD button and the tranny downshifted. I dont have any of the shift solenoids or the TC solenoid connected to the TCM. This is getting a bit confusing.

 

Disregard the OD button and done use it, actually in my car when u attempt to downshift from 4 to 3rd with OD button, it does it then goesback to 4th and gets all confused. so just dont mind that, its fine.

When the TC is not locked it will give you higher rpms, thats normal. try locking it in 4th or setting it up to lock in 4th at cruising speeds and you'll see rpms go down right away. nothing to worry bout

 

Thanks for the quick reply. I didnt realize the OD button would still have an impact like that but I'm glad I'm not the only one experiencing this problem.

The reason I was getting a higher RPM was because I tried to let the Suprastick run as a stand alone unit. I disconnected the TCM all together. This resulted in some very weird things happening. IIRC with the TCM disconnected the tranny goes into a safemode where the highest available gear is 3rd gear (I could be wrong) That would explain the higher RPMs. I guess people who are running without the TCM connected (Jime) could chime in and let us know what else they did to eliminate the TCM all together. One thing that comes to mind is the Drop Resistor, but that's an easy fix.

 

Oh i see. well i still got my TCM hookd up so i wouldnt be able to tell you. hopefully jime can.