wat stats on a sub do i have to look for if i want really loud bass instead of very deep, for example a 20hz to 500hz wats the difference between that and a 10hz to a 100hz and also a 20hz to 2khz just need a lil info before i get my subs thanxs for any help........

 

So you want spl bass. If you have to ask this question then you really won't notice the difference IMO. I would go with the 20hz to 2khz myself so I can get some nice mids in there too. But it's all in the amplifier. You can't buy a pyramid amp and expect it to play like that on some high quality sub. Basically find a NICE sub that has a high RMS and a NICE amp that has a matching or close to matching (never more) MAX RMS. Don't buy according to max wattage. You'll be reamed lovely for it.

 

To answer your question http://www.bcae1.com/frequncy.htm

 

Don't look at the frequency response of the sub. There's no industry standard for measuring this and too many other factors to consider.

Tony

 

^^^

about getting an amp close to the rms rating of the sub, you can get a larger amp for some extra headroom, but just be careful when setting the gains and you should be ok.

 

Actually, it's all in the install...not the amplifier. The amplifier merely provides the power. And a Pyramid amp will play fine, it's just that they overrate their power output. And in fact, using amplifiers with too much power is a common practice. By using your ears to keep from overdriving the speaker (or sub in this case) you can keep the amp from clipping and stay in its optimal power range.

Tony

 

thanks for the help, i was looking at the power acoustic 10s with 600 rms anybody know a nice 2 channel amp with arount that much rms for an afordable price???

 

Affordable? That's subjective. I think THIS amp is affordable. Maybe you won't.

Tony

 

so your saying it's better to use over powered amplifers for your car speakers/subs?
why.
so i have a chance to blow them?
yes it's all in the set up. but personally, and i know alot of other people, will not know when they are on the limit of ****ing there **** up simply when they turn up the gain or adjust the bass on their HU...

also, i find that if you match the rms of the sub and amp you don't have to worry about ever blowing it up or damaging anything.

maybe DON the Org's car audio god could speak up and give his opinion.
but what i'v always been told is it is better to underpower a speaker then overpower.

--jon

 

yeah, if you can, you should try to get an amp that can put out slightly more power than your subs/speakers can handle. the problem i see with smaller amps is the whole issue of clipping. you overdrive your amps, it can clip.

http://www.jblpro.com/pub/technote/lowpower.pdf

http://forum.ecoustics.com/bbs/messages/1/4679.html

 

so the amp i have does 150rms x2 at 4ohms. It powers my 2 JLW1s which are rated at 150rms @ 4 ohms a piece.

so i'm risking damaging my subwoofers?

please explain.

the Jl seems to be NOT talking about sub woofers.

everyone knows distortion kills more speakers then anything else.

 

No...overpowering your speakers kills them more than anything else. It would take a long time to damage them playing all sorts of distortion through them, but only a short time if you sent too much power.

And I doubt you're damaging your subs. According to JL, your subs are rated 125 watts continuous power handling. I don't know what their peak power handling is, but I'm sure is quite higher than 125 watts. And who knows what kind of "real" power your amp is actually putting out.

Tony

 

Well, I'm not saying it's "better", but a lot of people prefer this route, including myself. I think Fosgate Fan already provided you with some info, but since I love watching myself type...

First of all, if you can't tell when and if you're providing too much power to your subs, then you need to learn. They'll making a POPPING or CLANKING sound. If you hear that, back OFF the volume!!

Yes, you can match the power of the amp/sub and never have to worry about damaging them (from overpowering). But you could also get a 500 watt amplifier for a 250 watt sub, set the gains, and never have to worry about overpowering it. You could also just use your ears to never overpower it.

Amplifiers clip when they exceed their rated power output. This causes distortion. While this won't necessarily damage your sub, it will sound distorted. But, like you said, a lot of people can't hear this. I can. By using a very high-powered amp, I won't be pushing it to its limits (keeping it from clipping) but I will still get the volume I need.

I will agree with you that it is better to underpower a speaker than overpower it, but we're talking about using an amplifier that's CAPABLE of overpowering it, not actually overpowering it. Make sense?

Tony

 

i think i'm following what you guys are saying...thanks for the clarification...

 

I am going to chime in a little here.. First thing is sure a pyramid amp will play fine (to an extent) but for god sakes do not buy one.Yes they are cheap but not worth the money since you could take your $100 and spend it on a better amp that will be more relaible and dont have to have a stupid design or over rated power to be able to sell.

As far as underpowering overpowering... you are constantly underpowering your subs AND speakers wheny ou lower your volume so liek stated above there is no way to blow a speaker by underpowering it.Anyone that says that without clarifying that you CAN blow the sub by clipping it to death.Another thing not mentioned is the only thing that can also clip is the headunit so it sends a clipped signal to the amp.

As far as matching rms per rms is very good advice but even then you can still clip the amp and overdrive the sub.The thing is with the more power you feed to your sub the less THD (distortion) you will get since you cna leave your levels all down there fore getting a cleaner sound.

BJ White

 

BJ brought up a really good point and I wanted to clarify some more. If you are not capable of understanding when you're sending clipped signals to your speakers, then it would be a good idea NOT to get an amplifier that is capable of overpowering your speakers. It would be safer to stick with an amp that's underrated, that way if you clip the signal there's a significantly less chance in damaging your speakers. If you have an ear for distortion and what it sounds like when your speaker reaches its mechanical limits, then getting a overrated amp with more power than your speakers can handle is a viable option.

Someone explained a technique to me for a way that an inexperienced listener (or anyone for that matter) can tell if they're getting a clipped signal. Turn the volume up on your system to a level that is considered VERY LOUD to you. Open the doors and walk behind your vehicle several car lenghts. Is the noise more distorted now than it was while you were sitting in your car? This is CLIPPING, regardless how it sounds to you inside the car! Go back and turn the volume down a little bit at a time until the distortion goes away from your original listening point from outside the car.

Tony

 

Good points made by Tony....I like power...I like lots of it. It is to my understanding in the 11yrs in car audio that I prefer to use amplification that exeeds the rated power handling of a speaker. You can drive a sub with an amp withRMS wattage anywhere between its RMS power handling and its peaks power and have exellent control of the sub. Yes, heat from excessive power kills speakers,as well as the power-to-enclosure relationship of the speaker- BUT take this- just because my Maxima puts down 220whp to the ground on a dyno, doesnt mean that I'm seeing that much power driving around town or that its beneficiary to the car to push the car constantly where its making that power all the time- same applies to an amplifier

Torgus- for your JL subs to see that 150rms x2 rated output from your amp, the amp has to be bordeline clipping to put out its max rated rms power. Meanwhile if you send 200-300rms rated power to each sub, by properly adjusting your gains of course, your amp will deliver that 150rms and then some of CLEAN power to the subs without the amp barely breaking a sweat- far from clipping, with its lowest thd levels and highest damping. That extra power is graciously called 'dynamic headroom' and its a great thing-
Dont be afraid of power,just learn how to use it.....Its not a hard thing to do, I have no science behing it either. As Tony said, I do as well- set your gains by ear to the loudest you can get before hearing audible distortion- you should never push it past that and you'd be ok

how is then I have a 300rms x2 amp on my 110rms rated components?

 

Here is the way to properly set yourt gains with a dmm (digital multimeter) this is about as close as you can get wihtout buyign an oscilloscope.settign gains by ear will work to an extent but if you want to set them correctly use this.

Set head unit volume to 3/4 of maximum. Turn off all eqs/presets in the head unit.

DISCONNECT SPEAKERS

P = Power in watts
I = Current in amperes
R = Resistance in ohms (effectively the nominal impedance)
V = Potential in volts (Voltage)

Knowns:
Resistance (nominal impedance of your speakers)
Power (desired wattage)

Unknowns:
Voltage (we'll measure this)
Current

Formulas:
P = I*V (formula for power)
V = I*R (Ohm's law)

So after a little substitution to get Voltage in terms of simply power and resistance we get

V = square_root(P*R)

So, for example, say you have a 4 ohm load presented to a 150 watt amp.

V = square_root of (150*4) = 24.5 volts

This means you should increase the gain until you read 24.5 volts AC on the speaker outputs of your amplifier.

Create a tone cd within the range you want to amplify (sub woofer say 40 hz) using an audio program recorded at 0db. Test Tone Generator works well for this.