12" IB install (plenty of pics)
I'm good with all that excpet the country.
oh and classical. Bach, chopin, mozart. I will look for your review.
I was also wondering... I know it's a good idea to deaden the trunk... But with an ib setup are you going to get a better bang for buck with deadening as compared to a traditional box and sub setup?
If so... whats the best and most cost effective product to use? What does the .org recommend?
I bought some cascade dk-1 for the front doors.
Dunno about that, IB can be VERY capable. Far more than many will give it credit for. A pair of IDMAX's hung IB would probably say otherwise to many of the bassheads out there...
Fi also makes a line of IB. Haven't used them yet, but lots of HT guys seem to like them. They aren't on their website either, so I can only assume they are made to order. The two tens I did in the G35 coupe sound amazing. They were actually ssd's with stiff spiders and an AA Havoc dust cap. They really sound amazing.
Pics?
Even a pair of hung IDMAX 12s in a very well built/dampened vehicle still would not say otherwise to the bassheads. Been there, heard it, check with Stevie. Excellent performance, but not the output that bassheads would want.
I keep dancing around this idea but keep stepping away because you and others say bass heads wont like it. I mean, maybe there is a way to get the bass that we want with certain specs/power?
I would assume that it would take probably twice the power of a normally enclosed setup to get same output but its still possible right? I really wish I could hear a car with this...I'm not going to do it on my max but it would be a great idea I would definitely implement on my next vehicle (lol whenever that happens)
Basically, Im just asking if someone with say a 12" IB (high recommended IB spec sub) and a 1000 watt amp can match someone with like a 12" ported setup with like 400 watts? Or is it just a different sound that you cant really compare, just have to prefer?
I would assume that it would take probably twice the power of a normally enclosed setup to get same output but its still possible right? I really wish I could hear a car with this...I'm not going to do it on my max but it would be a great idea I would definitely implement on my next vehicle (lol whenever that happens)
Basically, Im just asking if someone with say a 12" IB (high recommended IB spec sub) and a 1000 watt amp can match someone with like a 12" ported setup with like 400 watts? Or is it just a different sound that you cant really compare, just have to prefer?
IB significantly reduces the effective power handling of a sub. In simple terms the size of the enclosure increases efficiency. A decent rule of thumb is 1/2 the power when going to an IB design.
Too bad you lose output with that larger enclosure.
To answer your question, I have never seen an IB sub that can handle anywhere near that power. You can build an IB sub that can thermally take 1000 watts, but the suspension would not be able to compensate for the lack of the box. You would most certainly experience mechanical failure trying to produce a comparable output.
Too bad you lose output with that larger enclosure.
To answer your question, I have never seen an IB sub that can handle anywhere near that power. You can build an IB sub that can thermally take 1000 watts, but the suspension would not be able to compensate for the lack of the box. You would most certainly experience mechanical failure trying to produce a comparable output.
Well atleast you get better SQ from it right? I would definitely like to hear a setup. I was also curious what happens inside a box when a subwoofer goes off? Doesnt the inside of a box have massive vibration due to the sub moving back and forth? If this is the case, with an IB setup, doesnt that mean anything inside the trunk is affected by these vibrations, thus anything mechanical like those crossovers may run into issues? or is it just the front of the sub and outside of it that face vibrations?
Wait till I have my exodus 10's in and have a listen.
*crosses out the idea of IB setup*
Well atleast you get better SQ from it right? I would definitely like to hear a setup. I was also curious what happens inside a box when a subwoofer goes off? Doesnt the inside of a box have massive vibration due to the sub moving back and forth? If this is the case, with an IB setup, doesnt that mean anything inside the trunk is affected by these vibrations, thus anything mechanical like those crossovers may run into issues? or is it just the front of the sub and outside of it that face vibrations?
Well atleast you get better SQ from it right? I would definitely like to hear a setup. I was also curious what happens inside a box when a subwoofer goes off? Doesnt the inside of a box have massive vibration due to the sub moving back and forth? If this is the case, with an IB setup, doesnt that mean anything inside the trunk is affected by these vibrations, thus anything mechanical like those crossovers may run into issues? or is it just the front of the sub and outside of it that face vibrations?
Everyone at the DIYMA meet that had listened to my car, I told them to go listen to Manny's as his is a similar setup but with ballsier amps + IB. It's always cool to hear the differences side by side...can't do that most of the time.
Mecca...you need to keep your stuff and take my platforms!
+1
Everyone at the DIYMA meet that had listened to my car, I told them to go listen to Manny's as his is a similar setup but with ballsier amps + IB. It's always cool to hear the differences side by side...can't do that most of the time.
Mecca...you need to keep your stuff and take my platforms!
Everyone at the DIYMA meet that had listened to my car, I told them to go listen to Manny's as his is a similar setup but with ballsier amps + IB. It's always cool to hear the differences side by side...can't do that most of the time.
Mecca...you need to keep your stuff and take my platforms!
I think he is quite a bit larger than you and would have a terrible time trying to fit.
The vinyl baffle board is bolted down as well as glued using construction adhesive. I had the rear window tinted to 5% so that the driver would not get "cooked" The voids between the metal deck and wooden baffle are filled with expanding foam.
The "useful" passthrough area was eliminated. A piece of 3/4" plywood was routed out to nest into the steel backing plate that bolts in behind the rear seats. The routed out section was covered with a black canvas as this area will be visible when the centre rear armest is lowered. The back of this board will also serve as the mounting surface for the amplifiers and other goodies.
Here is a view of the above plate installed. It is also through-bolted, glued and voids filled with expanding foam. It will be covered with a black canvas before the electroncs are mounted.
Here is a nearly complete shot with the sub and backseat installed.
I fabricated a grille to protect the cone from the occasional projectile that gets launched back there (3 young kids)
The "useful" passthrough area was eliminated. A piece of 3/4" plywood was routed out to nest into the steel backing plate that bolts in behind the rear seats. The routed out section was covered with a black canvas as this area will be visible when the centre rear armest is lowered. The back of this board will also serve as the mounting surface for the amplifiers and other goodies.
Here is a view of the above plate installed. It is also through-bolted, glued and voids filled with expanding foam. It will be covered with a black canvas before the electroncs are mounted.
Here is a nearly complete shot with the sub and backseat installed.
I fabricated a grille to protect the cone from the occasional projectile that gets launched back there (3 young kids)
Im looking at doing this as well with a fi ib312 my only issue is how to seal up the back and the baffleboard with the seatbelts remaining functional for the kids. Just seal off the cups holding the belts?
Thread Starter
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 1,199
From: Ontario, Canada
For my install, the tether anchor points for front/rear facing child safety seats were covered by the baffleboard. It was not a concern for me as my kids are of booster seat age and older.
Thread Starter
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 1,199
From: Ontario, Canada
Excellent job you did! Im also looking on a IB setup and one 12" as well. So you were able to clear the torsion bars and all the trunk hardware so there are no issues with the trunk opening / closing? Also do you have any base rattle back there? It looks liked you only deadened the rear deck. How is the setup working out for you so far? ie, vibrating window etc.
The rear deck and panel behind behind the rear seat are both atleast an order of magnitude stiffer than they were in stock form.
I have no rattles whatsoever. However, I am not a "cranker" and I do not listen to rap or hiphop.
One of the reasons I chose this particular driver was its shallow mounting depth (5.5") The flange sits on top of a piece of 3/4 plywood which gives about 1/2" of clearance to the trunk torsion bars.
The rear deck and panel behind behind the rear seat are both atleast an order of magnitude stiffer than they were in stock form.
I have no rattles whatsoever. However, I am not a "cranker" and I do not listen to rap or hiphop.
The rear deck and panel behind behind the rear seat are both atleast an order of magnitude stiffer than they were in stock form.
I have no rattles whatsoever. However, I am not a "cranker" and I do not listen to rap or hiphop.
So is the reason you sealed up behind the seat to make the trunk more play the role of the sealed box? or just to mount your amp? I see you traced something there that resembles mounting points for the amp.
Thread Starter
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 1,199
From: Ontario, Canada
Don't think of the trunk as a box because that is not what you are trying to achieve. To avoid cancellation, you need to separate the front and back waves. Infinite baffle means exactly that. A driver mounted in the middle of an infinitely large baffle plate.
You cannot build it up much more as you still need to be able to get the sub in and out and still clear the rear window glass.
Don't think of the trunk as a box because that is not what you are trying to achieve. To avoid cancellation, you need to separate the front and back waves. Infinite baffle means exactly that. A driver mounted in the middle of an infinitely large baffle plate.
Don't think of the trunk as a box because that is not what you are trying to achieve. To avoid cancellation, you need to separate the front and back waves. Infinite baffle means exactly that. A driver mounted in the middle of an infinitely large baffle plate.
Last edited by maxprivate; Feb 27, 2009 at 02:21 PM.
Now Im thinking of the passtru and sealing off the rear deck and going larger than 12.
maybe a 15? or 18? The name of the game with IB is surface area right?
gotta measure and see if I can pull a those off in the passthru. Anyone checked that out in the past?
maybe a 15? or 18? The name of the game with IB is surface area right?
gotta measure and see if I can pull a those off in the passthru. Anyone checked that out in the past?
Junior Member
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 60
From: St. Louis
wow dude nice job! i have 2 12" and was trying to figure out how i was going to put them in and save room in my trunk, i jokingly suggested this idea. i cant believe you actually did it, it looks amazing! great job!
You cannot build it up much more as you still need to be able to get the sub in and out and still clear the rear window glass.
Don't think of the trunk as a box because that is not what you are trying to achieve. To avoid cancellation, you need to separate the front and back waves. Infinite baffle means exactly that. A driver mounted in the middle of an infinitely large baffle plate.
Don't think of the trunk as a box because that is not what you are trying to achieve. To avoid cancellation, you need to separate the front and back waves. Infinite baffle means exactly that. A driver mounted in the middle of an infinitely large baffle plate.
Here is a nearly complete shot with the sub and backseat installed.
I fabricated a grille to protect the cone from the occasional projectile that gets launched back there (3 young kids)
[/QUOTE]
Did you fabricate your grill out of a piece of plywood? I have been searching for a grill for mine and really cant find anything I like. So I guess Im copying your install what type of material is that you wrapped the grill cover with and how did you go about fabricating the grill cover? Thanks again for all the info.
I fabricated a grille to protect the cone from the occasional projectile that gets launched back there (3 young kids)
[/QUOTE]Did you fabricate your grill out of a piece of plywood? I have been searching for a grill for mine and really cant find anything I like. So I guess Im copying your install
what type of material is that you wrapped the grill cover with and how did you go about fabricating the grill cover? Thanks again for all the info.
Thread Starter
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 1,199
From: Ontario, Canada
1/2" G1S fir plywood
grill cloth
http://www.speakerworks.com/dark_gre...ic_p/gcdgr.htm
Here is a view of the backside.
Cloth is attached with spray adhesive
Grill is attached to rear deck with eight of these:
http://www.speakerworks.com/large_gr..._p/gtlarge.htm
Final result looks somewhat OEM
grill cloth
http://www.speakerworks.com/dark_gre...ic_p/gcdgr.htm
Cloth is attached with spray adhesive
Grill is attached to rear deck with eight of these:
http://www.speakerworks.com/large_gr..._p/gtlarge.htm
Final result looks somewhat OEM
1/2" G1S fir plywood
grill cloth
http://www.speakerworks.com/dark_gre...ic_p/gcdgr.htm
Here is a view of the backside.
Cloth is attached with spray adhesive
Grill is attached to rear deck with eight of these:
http://www.speakerworks.com/large_gr..._p/gtlarge.htm
Final result looks somewhat OEM
grill cloth
http://www.speakerworks.com/dark_gre...ic_p/gcdgr.htm
Here is a view of the backside.
Cloth is attached with spray adhesive
Grill is attached to rear deck with eight of these:
http://www.speakerworks.com/large_gr..._p/gtlarge.htm
Final result looks somewhat OEM
Thread Starter
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 1,199
From: Ontario, Canada
Yes, I did them myself.
There are a few spots where I could have pulled it tighter but it came out OK. I have lots of hog rings left if I am ever inclined to tighten it more.
That was the darkest shade that this company had. I purchased the grill cloth first and then had the leather seat company send me swatches of all the shades of gray that they had. I ordered the seats with the inserts and embroidery in the colour that matched the best.
Yes, I did them myself.
There are a few spots where I could have pulled it tighter but it came out OK. I have lots of hog rings left if I am ever inclined to tighten it more.
The camera flash makes the gray seem a lot lighter than it actually is.
G1S is just an acronym for Good One Side. It is just fir plywood where the knot holes have been filled in on one side. I had a sheet lying around so that is what I used.
That was the darkest shade that this company had. I purchased the grill cloth first and then had the leather seat company send me swatches of all the shades of gray that they had. I ordered the seats with the inserts and embroidery in the colour that matched the best.
There are a few spots where I could have pulled it tighter but it came out OK. I have lots of hog rings left if I am ever inclined to tighten it more.
The camera flash makes the gray seem a lot lighter than it actually is.
G1S is just an acronym for Good One Side. It is just fir plywood where the knot holes have been filled in on one side. I had a sheet lying around so that is what I used.
That was the darkest shade that this company had. I purchased the grill cloth first and then had the leather seat company send me swatches of all the shades of gray that they had. I ordered the seats with the inserts and embroidery in the colour that matched the best.
Your baffle board that your Sub sit on.. Did you fill in spray foam in between the space of the two pieces of wood you used to build up completely ? or just any gaps you saw?
Thread Starter
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 1,199
From: Ontario, Canada
This picture represents the grill cloth colour a little better. Of course, the tighter you stretch it, the lighter it will appear (also depends on the colour of what is behind it)
There is only one piece of 3/4" plywood on top of the metal rear deck. I filled in as many of the voids that I could. I shoved the expanding foam tube in as far as it would go and kept filling until it started coming out holes on the opposite side
There is only one piece of 3/4" plywood on top of the metal rear deck. I filled in as many of the voids that I could. I shoved the expanding foam tube in as far as it would go and kept filling until it started coming out holes on the opposite side
The baffle board, a 3/4" plywood section was made using the original deck finsihing cover as a template. Here it is being test fit to make sure that the driver will clear the rear window glass.
The baffle board is being covered with vinyl so all the surface imperfections are filled and sanded. T-nuts are used to bolt the board to the metal rear deck.
[/QUOTE]
It looks like used two pieces of wood. I guess the pics are deceiving. Im curious.. why did you have to make that separate ring painted gray with the grill cloth and then you also have the larger grill cover over that it looks like. Or does the ring just sit in the center of the grill cover with an entire grill cover over everything?
The baffle board is being covered with vinyl so all the surface imperfections are filled and sanded. T-nuts are used to bolt the board to the metal rear deck.
[/QUOTE]It looks like used two pieces of wood. I guess the pics are deceiving. Im curious.. why did you have to make that separate ring painted gray with the grill cloth and then you also have the larger grill cover over that it looks like. Or does the ring just sit in the center of the grill cover with an entire grill cover over everything?
Thread Starter
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 1,199
From: Ontario, Canada
It looks like used two pieces of wood. I guess the pics are deceiving. Im curious.. why did you have to make that separate ring painted gray with the grill cloth and then you also have the larger grill cover over that it looks like. Or does the ring just sit in the center of the grill cover with an entire grill cover over everything?
That ring painted gray with the grill cloth was done just a few days ago. It is for the new mids in my front stage. That will be the topic for another thread