doh...
10-31-2009, 06:14 PM
#1
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doh...
one of the guys from the subie forum made a wee bit mistake at a track day
http://s202.photobucket.com/albums/a...ent=Cap001.flv
http://s202.photobucket.com/albums/a...ent=Cap001.flv
11-01-2009, 02:20 PM
#6
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If you can't afford crashing, don't go to track. It look to me like he maybe let off gas and back end slide around. Should have turned wheels to the right and maybe stay in the middle of the track.
Video is too short too see the result.
Video is too short too see the result.
11-05-2009, 08:04 PM
#15
from what i've read, you can get a multiple day package for like 10 races and the price drops a ton per race
11-06-2009, 10:01 PM
#16
I like how people are all experts on how he should have corrected to avoid the crash...If u never have an off or close call, you'er not going fast enough. Just hope it doesn't cost you a lot of money when you do finally have one.
11-14-2009, 04:47 AM
#17
And no, there's really no way he could have corrected other than to mash both feet in and hope the ABS didn't freak out and release the brakes.
11-29-2009, 03:01 PM
#18
Wow, that makes me a think a little harder about going to more track events at Summit Point. I can afford to pay for mistakes made at auto-x, but not going 110+ on a road course. Thankfully all I have to worry about is understeer 
That is until I can get my beam bent in the spring... 
Josh, are you coming out next year? These Hyper Drive events are awesome....20 minutes on the main course at SP with an instructor for $50!! Can't beat it! I went to one a few weeks ago with Patrick (in the Subie) and Darius (in his 3.5 4th gen). Darius cooked his brakes (pedal to the floor), but they recovered after a few minutes. That's why Cobra rotors>Z32 rotors
That is until I can get my beam bent in the spring... Josh, are you coming out next year? These Hyper Drive events are awesome....20 minutes on the main course at SP with an instructor for $50!! Can't beat it! I went to one a few weeks ago with Patrick (in the Subie) and Darius (in his 3.5 4th gen). Darius cooked his brakes (pedal to the floor), but they recovered after a few minutes. That's why Cobra rotors>Z32 rotors
11-29-2009, 11:25 PM
#19
Wow, that makes me a think a little harder about going to more track events at Summit Point. I can afford to pay for mistakes made at auto-x, but not going 110+ on a road course. Thankfully all I have to worry about is understeer That is until I can get my beam bent in the spring...
Josh, are you coming out next year? These Hyper Drive events are awesome....20 minutes on the main course at SP with an instructor for $50!! Can't beat it! I went to one a few weeks ago with Patrick (in the Subie) and Darius (in his 3.5 4th gen). Darius cooked his brakes (pedal to the floor), but they recovered after a few minutes. That's why Cobra rotors>Z32 rotors
That is until I can get my beam bent in the spring... Josh, are you coming out next year? These Hyper Drive events are awesome....20 minutes on the main course at SP with an instructor for $50!! Can't beat it! I went to one a few weeks ago with Patrick (in the Subie) and Darius (in his 3.5 4th gen). Darius cooked his brakes (pedal to the floor), but they recovered after a few minutes. That's why Cobra rotors>Z32 rotors
Oh and the understeer doesn't totally go away with a bent beam.
Brake fade can also be pad fade or the brake fluid boiling. I got pretty far using stock rotors with the right pads and fluid. Though I do like my '04 two piece rotor setup.
11-30-2009, 11:25 AM
#20
One of these days I'd like to try out Summit Point with my car. Also If it's not to far for you guys NJMP is a good track. I will probally will go at least one weekend next year.
Oh and the understeer doesn't totally go away with a bent beam.
Brake fade can also be pad fade or the brake fluid boiling. I got pretty far using stock rotors with the right pads and fluid. Though I do like my '04 two piece rotor setup.
Oh and the understeer doesn't totally go away with a bent beam.
Brake fade can also be pad fade or the brake fluid boiling. I got pretty far using stock rotors with the right pads and fluid. Though I do like my '04 two piece rotor setup.
Are you using a RSB with the bent beam? Does anybody?
Darius has Z32 rotors/calipers with good blue fluid and Hawk HPS pads. I suppose it could have been the pads, but I also have HPS pads and while I glazed them/the rotors over, my pedal never went to the floor.
11-30-2009, 05:31 PM
#21
Looks like he just locked em up and didn't try much of anything. Granted, you only have a couple seconds to feel it coming around, countersteer, drive out, etc.
IMO - he was fortunate to only bend the frame and total the car. Could've been even worse. Glad he's ok.
IMO - he was fortunate to only bend the frame and total the car. Could've been even worse. Glad he's ok.
11-30-2009, 08:20 PM
#22
Depending on the drive I might be down to try out NJMP. Post something up when you figure out when you're going!
Are you using a RSB with the bent beam? Does anybody?
Darius has Z32 rotors/calipers with good blue fluid and Hawk HPS pads. I suppose it could have been the pads, but I also have HPS pads and while I glazed them/the rotors over, my pedal never went to the floor.
Are you using a RSB with the bent beam? Does anybody?
Darius has Z32 rotors/calipers with good blue fluid and Hawk HPS pads. I suppose it could have been the pads, but I also have HPS pads and while I glazed them/the rotors over, my pedal never went to the floor.
I've heard of one Sentra guy that ran a RSB, bent beam with some slight toe out, and really stiff rear springs. Basically alot of stuff to get oversteer on a FWD car. Did his first lap on a roadcourse with the new setup. However he didn't know how to handle oversteer and did something similar to that Subie.
ATE blue & yellow is good brake fluid. I'm not sold on the HPS pads for track use. They lasted one track day for me though I'm rough on brakes especially with the R-compounds.
12-01-2009, 11:04 AM
#23
Also, what are people doing for brake cooling ducts?
12-03-2009, 10:03 PM
#24
6/22 TUE New Jersey - Thunderbolt
9/13 MON New Jersey - Thunderbolt
9/14 TUE New Jersey – Lightning
NJMP schedule for SCDA, to bad the June event didn't overlap with Maxus it would of made for a fun optional road course event. Watkins Glen and Monticello track days are also up if that isn't to far for you. So far the only event I'm commited to is at Watkins Glen, I will be there on May 31st and June 1st with Phoenix CMR.
12-04-2009, 07:17 AM
#25
PEdal to the floor = boiled brake fluid. Flush the system with good fluid and that will go away.
Hawk HPS ARE NOT a track pad. They're fine for Auto X, since you never get the brakes hot on a 40 second course at 60mph. On a road course, your brakes get hotter in the first turn than on an entire auto X run.. Hawk HP+ are a minimum for a road course once you get past green group.
Hawk HPS ARE NOT a track pad. They're fine for Auto X, since you never get the brakes hot on a 40 second course at 60mph. On a road course, your brakes get hotter in the first turn than on an entire auto X run.. Hawk HP+ are a minimum for a road course once you get past green group.
12-04-2009, 12:39 PM
#26
PEdal to the floor = boiled brake fluid. Flush the system with good fluid and that will go away.
Hawk HPS ARE NOT a track pad. They're fine for Auto X, since you never get the brakes hot on a 40 second course at 60mph. On a road course, your brakes get hotter in the first turn than on an entire auto X run.. Hawk HP+ are a minimum for a road course once you get past green group.
Hawk HPS ARE NOT a track pad. They're fine for Auto X, since you never get the brakes hot on a 40 second course at 60mph. On a road course, your brakes get hotter in the first turn than on an entire auto X run.. Hawk HP+ are a minimum for a road course once you get past green group.
And yes, I'm aware HPS isn't good for track use, but I don't feel like swapping out rotors and pads before I go to the track. However, although I glazed over the pads (which went away after a day or two) and my pedal got a little soggy, I was actually quite impressed with how well the HPS pads took the abuse, considering they are 3+ years old and have been through 20+ auto-x events. I know most people just swap pads, but I've heard that isn't ideal because they aren't bedded in (?) with the street rotors, so having a dedicated set of track rotors that you use to break in the race pads is a better, longer-lasting bet. How true is this?
12-04-2009, 01:42 PM
#27
The flluid boiled because it was dirty/contaminated/watered down with age. it may not have been completely flushed properly on the last fluid change.
In 10 years of tracking a car, I've lost the brakes a couple times due to pad fade, but never have I boiled my fluid- even when using cheap stuff.
Lack of circulation may have exacerbated the problem, but your brakes should never get hot enough to boil the fluid with the driving that we're doing in Maximas- even boosted cars with R comps.
Swapping in track-only rotors is a nice idea, but many dual-use cars I know of (that's a pretty high number considering the 8-10 car clubs I generally track with) just take a change of pads with them. Install their pads at the track and then use the first few laps of the first session to bed them in.
That's all you really need. just be wary your first session or so until you feel them really start to bite (that's when you should be driving easy to relearn the track and lines anyway before starting to push things). After that you're good to go.
when the day is done, take the 5 minutes to change back to your street pads and go home.
All that said, it takes me about 1 additional minute to change rotors when I'm changing pads. Buy the cheapest $20 Autozone crap rotors you can find and wear them out at the track. throw 'em away after a few track days and buy another set. keep your good shiny Brembos for the street brakes. iron discs are iron discs- don't matter what brand they are.
In 10 years of tracking a car, I've lost the brakes a couple times due to pad fade, but never have I boiled my fluid- even when using cheap stuff.
Lack of circulation may have exacerbated the problem, but your brakes should never get hot enough to boil the fluid with the driving that we're doing in Maximas- even boosted cars with R comps.
Swapping in track-only rotors is a nice idea, but many dual-use cars I know of (that's a pretty high number considering the 8-10 car clubs I generally track with) just take a change of pads with them. Install their pads at the track and then use the first few laps of the first session to bed them in.
That's all you really need. just be wary your first session or so until you feel them really start to bite (that's when you should be driving easy to relearn the track and lines anyway before starting to push things). After that you're good to go.
when the day is done, take the 5 minutes to change back to your street pads and go home.
All that said, it takes me about 1 additional minute to change rotors when I'm changing pads. Buy the cheapest $20 Autozone crap rotors you can find and wear them out at the track. throw 'em away after a few track days and buy another set. keep your good shiny Brembos for the street brakes. iron discs are iron discs- don't matter what brand they are.
12-04-2009, 02:27 PM
#28
The flluid boiled because it was dirty/contaminated/watered down with age. it may not have been completely flushed properly on the last fluid change.
In 10 years of tracking a car, I've lost the brakes a couple times due to pad fade, but never have I boiled my fluid- even when using cheap stuff.
Lack of circulation may have exacerbated the problem, but your brakes should never get hot enough to boil the fluid with the driving that we're doing in Maximas- even boosted cars with R comps.
Swapping in track-only rotors is a nice idea, but many dual-use cars I know of (that's a pretty high number considering the 8-10 car clubs I generally track with) just take a change of pads with them. Install their pads at the track and then use the first few laps of the first session to bed them in.
That's all you really need. just be wary your first session or so until you feel them really start to bite (that's when you should be driving easy to relearn the track and lines anyway before starting to push things). After that you're good to go.
when the day is done, take the 5 minutes to change back to your street pads and go home.
All that said, it takes me about 1 additional minute to change rotors when I'm changing pads. Buy the cheapest $20 Autozone crap rotors you can find and wear them out at the track. throw 'em away after a few track days and buy another set. keep your good shiny Brembos for the street brakes. iron discs are iron discs- don't matter what brand they are.
In 10 years of tracking a car, I've lost the brakes a couple times due to pad fade, but never have I boiled my fluid- even when using cheap stuff.
Lack of circulation may have exacerbated the problem, but your brakes should never get hot enough to boil the fluid with the driving that we're doing in Maximas- even boosted cars with R comps.
Swapping in track-only rotors is a nice idea, but many dual-use cars I know of (that's a pretty high number considering the 8-10 car clubs I generally track with) just take a change of pads with them. Install their pads at the track and then use the first few laps of the first session to bed them in.
That's all you really need. just be wary your first session or so until you feel them really start to bite (that's when you should be driving easy to relearn the track and lines anyway before starting to push things). After that you're good to go.
when the day is done, take the 5 minutes to change back to your street pads and go home.
All that said, it takes me about 1 additional minute to change rotors when I'm changing pads. Buy the cheapest $20 Autozone crap rotors you can find and wear them out at the track. throw 'em away after a few track days and buy another set. keep your good shiny Brembos for the street brakes. iron discs are iron discs- don't matter what brand they are.
I know we're not driving Corvettes, but getting on the brakes repeatedly from 120 mph in a 20 minute session seems, in my uneducated opinion, to be enough to get the fluid pretty hot. However, I had my brakes flushed and filled with good, but not great, fluid the night before the event and my brakes worked relatively well. Who knows
All I know is that both of our brakes were smoking when we got off the track!
12-04-2009, 03:44 PM
#29
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Josh, are you coming out next year? These Hyper Drive events are awesome....20 minutes on the main course at SP with an instructor for $50!! Can't beat it! I went to one a few weeks ago with Patrick (in the Subie) and Darius (in his 3.5 4th gen). Darius cooked his brakes (pedal to the floor), but they recovered after a few minutes. That's why Cobra rotors>Z32 rotors
by biggest fear is that once I start open tracking again, that's all I'll want to do....and I can't afford that shiz or the tires/brakes I will destroy in the process....autocross is a "no worry" activity and it's cheap and easy on the car (I still have 3 years of payments on the car!).
That, or I'll pick up a track beater of some sort...I'd like to do a GRM challenge car, or a LeMons car. Those would force me to keep it cheap!
Last edited by irish44j; 12-04-2009 at 03:46 PM.
12-04-2009, 06:30 PM
#30
Not trying to be a d1ck, but I know his brakes were flushed properly not that far before the track event
I know we're not driving Corvettes, but getting on the brakes repeatedly from 120 mph in a 20 minute session seems, in my uneducated opinion, to be enough to get the fluid pretty hot. However, I had my brakes flushed and filled with good, but not great, fluid the night before the event and my brakes worked relatively well. Who knows All I know is that both of our brakes were smoking when we got off the track!
I know we're not driving Corvettes, but getting on the brakes repeatedly from 120 mph in a 20 minute session seems, in my uneducated opinion, to be enough to get the fluid pretty hot. However, I had my brakes flushed and filled with good, but not great, fluid the night before the event and my brakes worked relatively well. Who knows
All I know is that both of our brakes were smoking when we got off the track!
12-05-2009, 12:38 AM
#31
stopping from 120mph on Hawk HPs will definitely overheat things quickly. you're spending so much time on the brakes, you're transferring a LOT of heat to the pads and through to the pistons and calipers. Those kinds of speeds are definitely too much for the HPS to handle more than once or twice. I wasn't aware you were looking at those kinds of speeds, as there's only one track in the area (out of seven) that we see those kinds of speeds.
I would recomend anyone running higher than green group run a track pad.
So Matt I'm guessing TWS is the fastest track in your neck of the woods?
12-05-2009, 06:22 AM
#32
I'm not that fast but agree. It takes 5 nuts to get the wheels off and only 4 bolts for both calipers & brackets. It's a great opportunity to do regular inspect of pistons, pads, and rotor backside no matter what type of driving you do.
12-05-2009, 08:20 PM
#33