95maxrider

iTrader: (32)

Well I finally got around to dynoing the DE-K engine, and got lower numbers than expected, and my AF ratio was also off, but in the opposite direction than I anticipated. Since the DE-K has 290cc injectors, which are about 25% larger than stock, and not what the JWT ECU is tuned for, I anticipated that I would run rich, but instead I ran fairly lean.
Here are my mods:

Full DE-K engine swap
JWT ECU with 7000 rev limit, 65 shot nitrous program
WSP Y pipe
UDP
cone filter
test pipe
2k muffler
grounding kit

Here is my first run, with the 00VI opening at 5200



Second run with the divider in the IM taken out



Third run with the divider back in, but with stock ECU- no JWT



Fourth run with JWT back in, and 00VI opening at 5000, instead of 5200.

95maxrider

iTrader: (32)

Fifth run, same as above, but engine cooled off a bit and these are my best numbers of the day.



Run 5- Uncorrected and unsmoothed



Comparison of JWT ECU and stock ECU- runs 3+4.



This shows the difference between the IM opening at 5200 and 5000. As you can see, I'm going to have it open at 5000 from now on, and maybe even try 4800 next time I dyno. Runs 1+4

Digital

iTrader: (1)

Good runs, that mevi does do some good!

95maxrider

iTrader: (32)

As you can see, I gained about 9 whp and 5wtq with the JWT ECU over stock ECU. Certainly not the gains that have been posted by other people. The AF ratio is certainly richer with the stock ECU, which may explain why I didn't gain the power others did. Like others have posted, the JWT is too lean up top, and also too lean most other places as well. However, I can't say for sure that it's the ECU's fault. My car isn't throwing any codes, aside from the ones associated with putting a Maxima ECU in an I30 (EVAP codes etc...). Seeing as how stock DE-K's put down about 190/190, I feel as if I should be more around the 210 mark, but I assume my AF ratio is what's throwing me off.

Since I was running so low, we decided against spraying. That will be done later when I get some more fuel in there.

I have all the run files if people want to look at them in more detail.

BTW- I forgot to mention this was done on a Dynojet 248, which is basically the norm.....it was 65* F, 31.1 in-Hg, 8% humidity.

I can't decide if I should get an Apexi SAFC II or SMT-6, but I'm leaning towards the SAFC. I think my power curves are looking pretty good, just on the low side. Any ideas or tips guys?

Nealoc187

iTrader: (23)

Why is the JWT ECU only run out to the same RPM as the stock one?

Also, when you say IM divider removed do you mean the VIAS rod or whatever it's called (I haven't opened up an 00vi so I assume its something along the same lines as the MEVI butterfly rod).

95maxrider

iTrader: (32)

To be honest, I'm not sure. I told them to go to 7000 on it, and 6500 on stock, but either they just let off early, or JWT is going to get a very angry phone call. Maybe my tach is off......

About the IM rod, I actually don't know the name of the part. Tilley was the one who brought up the idea a while ago to me, and he was the one who took out the part. I can only assume it is the VIAS rod. It's removed from the passenger side of the IM.

What do you think of my AF ratio?

SDot82

iTrader: (2)

Your AF ratio looks good for N/A but if you sprayin I would go with the stock and tune with something like a SAFC. I've been experiementing with the different rpms to activate the VIAS (by the good old butt dyno) and came up with 5000 rpms as my setting. I will probably go to dyno after I install my friends 00VI so we can go together.

Zack342

iTrader: (89)

Very Very interesting......Sorry to see your numbers are so low. Would you be willing to share you run files for your best run. I would like to compare it to my best run.
201whp and 191wtq with just
MEVI
Popcharger
Greddy SP Exhaust
UR pulley
Warpspeed Y
Catco cat

AsthmaMax11

iTrader: (3)

This is interesting to me. We pulled very similar numbers but then again I have the MEVI. I didn't get my A/F ratio measured. (they wanted like $100)

I gained about the same HP from my JWT ECU but like 12 ft/lbs of torque though. (I also took my run to 7200 rpms with the JWT in there)
The weird thing is that 96sleeper who has just a few more mods than me pulled like 30+ Hp and Tq over me at the same dyno.

I have MEVI, JWT ECU, UDP, Y pipe, B pipe, stock muffler

I'll see if I can get my Dyno hosted again by someone if you want


Bruce

JeEvE

iTrader: (10)

Its good to see another DE-K dynoed. Mine put down 160whp, with a terrible looking curve. Not really sure what was wrong but it might have just been that day, car does not feel like 160whp. My A/F was very rich. On my wideband that I have now, it shows around 10 in the midrange and when the manifold opens it gets up to 11. When I get some time, I will do a 2.5" exhaust, UDP and S-AFC tune and see what happens.

95maxrider

iTrader: (32)

I was doing some more reading and read that if you already have a JWT/TS ECU, trying to tune with a SAFC won't really give gains due to something in the ECU not letting the changes really work...I hadn't heard this before, and need to find more info on it. Anybody know what I'm talking about?

One more thing- For the dyno, a tail pipe sniffer was used. Is my AF ratio going to be measurably different using that, as opposed to a wideband in the actual exhaust, say, in my test pipe?

JeEvE

iTrader: (10)

Im not really sure about the JWT/TS ecu not allowing a tune with a S-AFC but Im almost positive that it has been done without a problem.

As for the AFR, a wideband in the actual exhaust will give a more acurate reading then a tailpipe sniffer. A tailpipe sniffer would read a bit more leaner but it was fairly close to what my wideband read now. On my wideband it hit around 10 AFR then it goes up to 11 but the tailpipe sniffer showed about 11 across.

michaelnyden

iTrader: (15)

it's gotta be your AFR...cause most stock DE-k's do put down around 185-190@wheels...

what timing graph do you have? is it just what the upgraded jwt ecu 4th gen's have...or did they put in a different one for the de-k when you got it...ie. had it reprogrammed with your specs...

95maxrider

iTrader: (32)

I'm using the normal JWT timing for 4th gens- not tuned specifically for the DE-K....

michaelnyden

iTrader: (15)

you don't get any codes with using a 4th gen board and jwt daughterboard on a de-k?
wow...makes me wanna get a 4th gen ecu and send it out to JWT now...if you don't get any codes...
but you should definitely be getting more power than you are getting since with your mods alone a regular 4th gen vq gets around what you got...without a mevi or ecu...

95maxrider

iTrader: (32)

No codes that I am aware of. Like I said earlier, I do get about 8 codes from putting a Maxima ECU (The JWT ECU) in my I30 since the EVAP systems are different.
I do feel like I should have more power, but it's true that I can't totally rely on dynos to tell me how much power I have, although it sure would be comforting if you could rely on dynos. I know that for NA cars, an AF ratio around 13 is fine, so I don't know how much power I will get by adding more fuel via SAFC or SMT-6.

JeEvE

iTrader: (10)

I dont think it will really work the other way around. The plug for the ECUs are probably different and its would not be worth the hassle to make it work.

michaelnyden

iTrader: (15)

that's true...it would take a lot of rewiring...

on a side note...(and not to hijack this thread)...what size are the injectors on a de-k again? I forgot...

NmexMAX

iTrader: (22)

290cc .

BlackBIRDVQ

iTrader: (15)

Something aint right here.... if you remove the VIAS power valve your peak power should change dramastically. My DE-K doesn't peak out till when it hits redline ! And even then if I had a TS ECU with raised rev limiter it would pull better numbers as the power doesn't drop off at all. It does look like you loose a lot of midrange and low end power by pulling the power rod out, but something is just not right here. Numbers seem too low, possibly the timing curve is screwed up ? Try to get some numbers from a scan tool of your ignition timing as you dyno. Another thing is, how heavy are your wheels ? My bone stock DE-K put down more power than your modified one. Can you let us know what is your MAF voltage reading at higher RPMs ? I tend to tune with my PLX wideband, MAF voltage readings (to veriffy if some power is being extracted or lost). I belive I got a Emanage Ultimate laying under the Xmas tree, all I need is some timing advance and I should be over 240WHP Ofcourse dyno sheet will be in order for the non-belivers.

JeEvE

iTrader: (10)

Do you have a log of your timing and MAF voltage? I logged mine and the DE-K seems to be running at the normal 4th gen timing.

95maxrider

iTrader: (32)

What sort of scan tool will read my timing and MAF voltage? My wheels are Enkei RPM2, and should weigh about 17 pounds, nothing too heavy. I was thinking about getting an Innovative Motorsports wideband w/ gauge, but I'm not sure if that's the best one to get. What do you think about your PLX? I've never heard of that brand before.
At this point I need to figure out what my next step is, wether EU, SAFC II, VAFC, or SMT-6/7. Apparently the VAFC is pretty much superior to the SAFC, and I assume the EU is far superior to that. SAFC/VAFC are like $250. How much does an EU run?

BlackBIRDVQ

iTrader: (15)

EU will run around 650 bux with the harness n support tool.

Auterra will read your MAF and timing, but 4th gen ECU is kinda slow with sample rates on a generic scan tool- Consult would be ideal as it can log and show real time data.

http://www.plxdevices.com/ I have the M300 model- it doesn't have dataloging capabilities so you need to watch the display as you dyno/drive etc. It works flawlessly and its reading data within 10 seconds of it starting up. I might upgrade to the new M500 model in the future.

Enkei RPM2 are 19lbs for the 18x7.5" model, I assume from the pic in your sig line that you run 18s ? 18x8 are 19.5lbs and 18x9 are 21.5lbs. They are not terribly heavy or super light, but they are not as heavy as the 5th gen OEM 17s which are almost 24lbs.

95maxrider

iTrader: (32)

17x8"
Do any widebands have datalogging?
How much do Consults cost?
Apparently a SAFC/VAFC or SMT-6 won't work very well with the JWT ECU.....makes me wonder if there are any viable options left for me....

BlackBIRDVQ

iTrader: (15)

I don't understand why JWT ECU will not work well with S-AFC ?? I have seen plenty of JWT ECUs and S-AFCs on SR20s and they work just fine for fine tuning the A/F.

Lots of widebands have datalogging capability, and with Emanage Ultimate you can use their output to plot the AF info right into the EU for a good tune.

Consult is bout 5K bux, its a OEM Nissan scan tool.

PLX M400 has dataloggin I belive, and I seen them on Ebay going for around 350 bux.

JeEvE

iTrader: (10)

The PLX M-300 does have output so I plan to use it with the EU. As for datalogging, I used a Consult logger with may or maynot work on some later year Maximas. I was able to get one program to connect to my ecu and it seemed to log fine but I still have to mess around with it some more. Heres the place I bought it from...

http://www.plmsdevelopments.com/consult_if.htm