Torchcorvette

Just sold my 2006 Ford Explorer and bought a new 2007 SE.

After reading dozens of posts here, I have decided to use the same synthetics I use in the MB and Corvette in the new Maxima....Mobil 1 and/or Penzoil Platinum with either the Nissan 9E000 or Mobil 1 M1-105 filters and change the oil & filter every 5,000 miles due to a lot of city driving.
I am used to stepping up for the more expensive oil and filters....small prices to pay for long term results on the cars.
I am fortunate to have a local MB-BMW repair shop who will change oil/filters on all three cars if I bring the Corvette and the Maxima filters. I would never use a JiffyLube style place or a dealer's shop for oil changes.
I appreciate all the advice I have picked up here on the new Maxima.

Joel in Atlanta

Bobo

The conventional wisdom on this website is to not convert to synthetic oil on a 6th Gen Maxima until you have about 15,000 miles on the engne, if I remember correctly.

Torchcorvette

Bobo...thanks.

Wonder what the reasoning is to wait till 15K miles??? Doesnt seem to make sense if both are meet the SL rating specified by Nissan.

d00df00d

iTrader: (4)

You want to be sure your engine is fully broken in before switching to synthetic oil because synthetics are so slippery that they can impede proper break-in.

Bobo

Apart from what d00df00d said, you might want to get some 6th Gen members to weigh in on this.

It has to do with the engine break-in, but the technical terminology escapes me right now.

All I know is: don't go directly to synthetic oil when the vehicle is brand new.

sky jumper

torchvette, you can switch to synthetic at any time. most high performance cars come with synthetic oil as factory fill. and the VQ is a high performance engine.

the myth that dino is required for engine break-in started long ago when manufacturing tolerances were sloppy, and there was a significant amount of break-in happening with new engines. in such cases, high amounts of ZDDP and moly (anti-wear additives) could actually impede proper break-in (piston ring seal), and synthetic oils were traditionally rich in these additives whereas dino was not. this is not the case anymore. most dinos have moly, and many have equal the ZDDP as syns.

furthermore, modern engine manufacturing methods significantly lessen the amount of break-in. nissan uses micro-polished bearing journals, moly coated pistons, etc. so the break-in oil choice becomes even more irrelevant.

having said that, I believe it is good practice to dump factory fill at 500-1000 miles. this will get rid of any contaminants left over from the manufacturing process, and any water that may have condensed in the sump.

I just changed the factory fill on a friend's 2007 Range Rover at 500 miles, and the first 12oz or so that came out was dirty water, not motor oil. apparently this is not uncommon with new vehicles. many cars built overseas seem to arrive in the states with water in the sump. even if your '07 was built here in the states, I'd still dump it early. consider it cheap insurance.

Bobo

Well, I'll take your word for it skyjumper.

When I bought my Maxima new, I was told there was absolutely no need to change the oil before 6,000 kilometres (3,750) miles.

Being old school, I changed it at 3,000 kilometres anyway. Obviously that wasn't 500 to 1,000 miles, but I am glad I did it anyway.

I haven't visited the 6th Gen Forum for a year or two and don't know whether most of the new members are delaying the use of synthetic with their new cars now or not.

SilverMax_04

I swithced to Mobil 1 when my 04 was ready for the second oil change (at 7,500 miles). I thought the engine was fully broken-in. I was wrong. I think that waiting until 15K miles is waiting too long, but I now believe I should have gone with another dino oil change at 7,500 miles. (I changed dino oil every 3,750 miles and synthetic every 7,500 miles.) The reason, the VQ in my Max continued to "burn" about a half a quart of oil between oil changes. That has slowly gone down so that now it burns about 1/4 of a quart between oil changes. So it has slowly finished the engine break-in while running Mobil 1. I believe it would have reached this state much faster had I not switched to Mobil 1 until about 10 K miles or so (actually would have been 11,250 miles on the OCI used with dino oil).

I'm coming up on (about 3,500 miles away) 60 K miles, when the powertrain warranty runs out. I will be increasing my OCI to about 10 K miles at that point. I will also have a lab test of this higher drain interval oil to be certain there are no problems.

It has been reported that Nissan recommends not switching to synthetic until somewhere above 20 K miles. Have not seen this except on this site, but suspect it to be true.

andrei3333

i duo if this applies but when i my was buying her 06 camry the guy told us we should change the oil the first time early, at 3000 KM not 6000 KM because the new engine will leave small metal shavings in the engine, as it breaks in and all the components tolerances get worked in.

d00df00d

iTrader: (4)

That's a crude but generally correct description of exactly what we're talking about.

sky jumper

have you been running M1 exclusively the past 55k? many people report consumption with M1. I don't know if it's a PAO thing or viscosity thing, or what. mobil used to have a note on their website about it (I think they referred to it as "seating" - implying the ring seal needs to adjust to their oil?? just a guess).

how did you break in the engine? easy going, or brisk & varied?

in any case, 1/4 qt in 7500 miles is not much at all. even 1/2 qt was nothing to worry about, and I really doubt it had anything to do with switching too soon.

you might try a different oil to see if that reduces consumption.

I've never run M1 in my max, but I burned a little on walmart supertech synthetic and valvoline maxlife. I didn't burn a drop on catrol 0W30, which is a bit thicker. my current fill of pennzoil platinum does not appear to be burning at all. Mobil 1 EP in my fiancee's '99 accord has burned about 1/4qt in 5k miles -- and that engine never burned a drop before, etc..

talkinghorse

iTrader: (121)

There's many different opinions on this; and while I respect them, I'm not sure there is a correct answer...people have to do what they're comfortable with. Nissan has had a lot of issues lately with excessive oil consumption in some of their engines, and synthetic oils, or premature conversion thereto have had nothing to do with it.

I've converted most every new car I've owned to synthetics (AMSOIL engine oil, transmission fluid/gear oil) at the 1000-mile point with absolutely no problems. We had a '93 Quest which we bought new...we replaced the vehicle with a Honda Odyssey in '02 and sold the Nissan to a friend...he's continued to run AMSOIL; the vehicle's still running great with no leaks, no seeps, and no oil consumption between changes...the engine/transmission currently have in excess of 200K. My '98 Maxima (converted to synthetics @ 1000 mi) has 103K miles and it too uses no oil between 10,000 mile drain intervals....I commute 65 miles/day, mostly hwy driving @ 70-80 mph in south TX heat. Prior to the Maxima, I had a '94 Subaru which I also converted at the 1,000-mile point...sold that vehicle to a friend; he also continued with AMSOIL, and last I knew it was also approaching 200K with no oil consumption issues.

I changed the Honda engine over to synthetics at ~6,000 miles (first change) as the owners manual contained an affirmative statement to the effect: "do not change the engine oil until the first normally scheduled service". We've made several cross-country trips in this vehicle in the middle of summer and it doesn't use a drop of oil with AMSOIL 5w-20 in it.

Again, there's a lot of thoughts on this topic; but based on my experience there's no correlation between an early change-over to synthetics and oil consumption later in life.

SilverMax_04

Yes. But I've used both 10W30 weight and 5W30 weight. Given that my Max is garaged, I prefer the 10W30, but have 5W30 that needs to be used.

I would say easy-going, but varied. I did not exceed 3 K RPM (as recommended by Nissan) until I'd passed their benchmark for break in. But with a manual trannie, there were times I'd take the VQ to just short of 3 K.

I have quite a bit of M-1 and also a stock of Pennzoil synthetic (that I have been using in my truck). When all of that existing motor oil supply has been used, I plan to go to Amsoil for my motor oil in both vehicles. I am concerned that Mobil has cut the quality of their synthetic, so don't plan to buy any more.

forumboy2k2

I've heard of people using synthetic blends {part synthetic, part conventional}...is there any merit to this? Why would or wouldn't this be good for your car?

SilverMax_04

If you believe in the benefits of synthetic, why only go half way? I do believe and think that pre-mixed blends are a cop-out. IMHO, either go dino oil or synthetic oil -- half way shows an inability to decide what you want to do.

As Talkinghorse said in an ealier post -- there are no wrong answers, it all depends on what you want and what you are willing to pay.

Jeff92se

iTrader: (82)

IMHO on the filter thing. It's really no effort to partially fill the filter. I'd rather not have to rely on whatever properties the oil has to save my engine if I can get oil to the parts a tad faster.

d00df00d

iTrader: (4)

On the whole, synthetic blends are pretty much where they say they are: right in between conventionals and synthetics. Compared to conventionals, they protect a little better, work under more extreme conditions, and last a little longer. Compared to full synthetics, they're... cheaper.

Personally, I tend to agree with the above two posts: don't go halfway. If you want the best bang-for-the-buck, Castrol GTX wins hands down: it's every bit as good as it needs to be for almost all street-driven cars, and being a conventional oil, it's really cheap for what it is. If you want extra protection or the ability to run >5,000 miles between changes, the best choice is a good full synthetic.

sky jumper

http://forums.maxima.org/showpost.ph...7&postcount=29

sky jumper

so it's 3k rpm for the 6th gen? wow, that's low. I think it's 4k for the 4th gen, and no more than 60mph or something ridiculously slow. I'm not so sure I buy into the gentle break-in theory. I think you need to strain the engine a bit at high rpms to properly seat the rings into the cylinder cross hatch.

I can't find it now, but there's a website where a guy has a bunch of photos of pistons from identical motorcycle engines (yes, I know, but stay with me for a moment)... some were broken-in gently as per the manufacturer guidelines, while others were driven hard right off the showroom floor. without exception, the pistons from the "properly" broken in engines showed significant amounts of blowby (burned/varnished sides) whereas the "abused" motors all had nice clean piston sides with no visible blowby below the rings.

not scientific by any means, and not even automobile engines for that matter. but one anectodal story of break-in and ring seal.

also, when racing engine builders dyno a new motor, they always do an extended/varied high RPM break-in before they take power measurements. this assures good ring seal & compression for maximum power.

Torchcorvette

The local MB-BMW guy compared syn blends as being a little bit pregnant....it's either YES or NO.....either use the carbon oil or the synthetic but not the blend. Being old school, I'll change the oil at 1,000 miles and, out of respect to the opinions here, will run conventional oil until about 6,000 (but not 15,000) when I'll switch over to synthetic. Both the Corvette and MB came with synthetic from the factory and I have used it since with no problems at all.

mr_a_ali

I recently bought a used '04 Maxima SE with 42,000 miles. I don't know what it's oil change history was like, but I immediately had the oil changed with 5w-30 oil.

I am considering switching to synthetic oil only for the sake of filling it less often (every 7500 mi instead of 3000 mi). Is this safe/wise?

Thanks.

d00df00d

iTrader: (4)

Yes it is/yes it is.

mr_a_ali

I got my oil changed at Jiffy Lube and they put in Pennzoil Full Synthetic.

What's the difference between Pennzoil Synth and Mobil 1 (I heard Mobil 1 is the best)... should I care about the brands at all?

Also, they said "change synthetic every 3000, but you could go up to 5000 max"... whereas I thought you only change every 7500. Are they trying to rip me off?

All I wanna do is take care of my Max and have it last long... when should I get it changed, and what brand of oil should I use?

Thx

d00df00d

iTrader: (4)

Pennzoil Full Synthetic is just fine. For your purposes, Mobil 1 is not really much better. If you're using a decent filter, you can go at least 5,000 miles between changes on that oil.

mr_a_ali

Would I be able to go more miles on a different oil? (I keep hearing "7,500", maybe I'm mistaken...)

d00df00d

iTrader: (4)

Yes, you would. It would just cost more, and you'd have to either pony up for an expensive filter or change your existing one regularly.

If you're looking to stretch it out as long as possible, your best bet is Amsoil TSO and an Amsoil EaO filter. That stuff is designed to run for a LONG time. One oil change with that stuff will run you something like $50 with shipping, but depending on your driving you could probably run it for more than 10,000 miles without breaking a sweat.

I used that when I had my Maxima. One time, after 7600 miles of HARD use, I sent some in for an oil analysis and was told I could easily have taken it out to 15,000 miles. FWIW...

SilverMax_04

d00d is correct about Amsoil being the best. But before you pony up the money for Amsoil, you should wait until your power train warranty from Nissan runs out at 60 K miles. Until that time (in the event you have an engine problem), you need to be able to prove to Nissan that you did not exceet their maximum recommended OCI (Oil Change Interval) of 7,500 miles.

You should have no problem going to 7,500 mile OCIs if you use a good filter like the Mobil 1 filter. I suspect your oil change shop is putting cheap Fram filters on your Max. They are a piece of junk.

mr_a_ali

They put in a Pennzoil oil filter "PZ37". Is that a major concern? I just had this oil change done yesterday, so should I make sure they do Mobil 1 filter etc after 5,000 or am I safe waiting for 7,500 w this oil and filter...

(I know I'm sounding paranoid, but I kinda love my new car)

SilverMax_04

Well, this Pennzoil filter in not in either list on the first post on this thread in the stickies:

http://forums.maxima.org/showthread.php?t=227996

You should be happy that it is not in the list of filters to avoid. On that basis, I suspect you are OK to take the filter to 7,500 miles before changing oil and filter. I don't have any experience with this filter, but you could try "cruising" that thread to see if there are any comments about it by other members of this organization. From my experience, you can trust what bill99 tells you about oil and filters.

Bobo

Join BITOG and ask what the collective opinion of that filter is on the Oil Filters forum.

talkinghorse

iTrader: (121)

AMSOIL was the first company to offer an extended drain oil, and this is certainly not the first discussion to surface relative to warranty coverage. OEMs can not arbitrarily deny warranty coverage because the customer did not follow their recommended oil change intervals. There has to be a direct correlation between the equipment failure and the customer's maintenance practice. And in the remote event of a mechanical problem resulting from the use of AMSOIL in accordance with their recommendations, customers are covered under AMSOIL's warranty. I am not aware of any other oil company who offers this warranty.

From the AMSOIL web site:

" All of the vehicle OEMs in the U.S. have agreed that a warranty cannot be denied because a customer was using any brand of motor oil at any length drain interval unless an engine failure was directly attributable to the oil or drain interval. For example, if your radio, power steering unit, air conditioner, etc. broke down, they could not void the warranty that covers those items because you were changing your engine oil at extended drain intervals. If it is not an oil related failure, they cannot void the warranty. The law supports this position.

If your engine failed, and the manufacturer denied your warranty for repair due to your using extended drain intervals, then you would submit your claim to the AMSOIL Technical Services Department for handling. (See the AMSOIL Limited Warranty.) Our staff will analyze the oil, and if we are able to provide documentation that proves the source of the problem was something other than the oil, and that in turn allows your claim to be processed under the original warranty, then we will. If no proof can be assembled regarding the source of the problem, our insurance adjustor will be dispatched to resolve the claim. A warranty claim being denied because of the use of extended drain intervals is an extremely rare occurrence. That’s because motor oils do not cause engine failures; dirt, glycol and other mechanical problems do.

Ironically, in Europe the auto manufacturers’ recommended drain intervals are from 12,000-18,000 miles using petroleum products, and they are moving even higher. In the U.S., it has been published that auto manufacturers are also going to be moving toward extended drain intervals of up to 15,000 miles in the not too distant future. Some auto manufacturers include systems in their vehicles that tell you when to change oil based upon a computer program that evaluates driving habits. As these changes develop, so will the language in owner’s manuals and extended warranty policies.

As an AMSOIL customer, you have our warranty coverage to fall back on in the unlikely event of an engine failure that is not covered by your vehicle warranty. I hope you will not be intimidated by the language in your extended warranty policy and will continue to use the highest quality and best performing products that you can, AMSOIL."

However, if warranty concerns are still a concern to you and you still want to use AMSOIL, I would recommend using AMSOIL XL Synthetic oil and a Wix Filter. This combination is designed to provide a full 7500 miles/6-months of protection (or longer as stated by the OEM) and they are more cost effective at these drain intervals.

Concerning Pennzoil filters, they are bargain-basement filters designed for frequent changing...and that's why they are commonly used by Quick-Lubes. They'll do the job, but they are not to be confused with a premium filter.

SilverMax_04

Good post talkinghorse. Because I am still using up a large supply of Mobil 1, it will be years before I can switch to Amsoil motor oil. So I follow Nissan's maximum recommendation on OCI. But I am coming up on 60 K miles (end of the powertrain warranty) and will push the oil past the 7,500 miles OCI (hits at exactly 60 K miles) because I will be in the middle of a road trip (and I do all of my oil changes). I'm not worried.

Thanks for the info on the Pennzoil filter. I suspected this was the case, but there was no record of this being the case from stickies on this site until you provided the info. Talkinghorse did not say it, but I will: You should not push this cheap filter to a 7,500 mile OCI.

mr_a_ali

Today I started the car, and noticed some whitish/bluish gas coming out of the tailpipes... mind you I had the oil change done 2 days ago, so I've put on 100 miles since then.

I looked in the oil chamber and it looks *empty*. Is it supposed to look empty? I was just paranoid for a minute that they forgot to put the cap back on the bottom and it all leaked out or something. (2004 Max SE)

Although it could be that my gas tank is near empty. BY THE WAY, I *heard* that you should fill up the gas on a Maxima when the tank is half empty (or only half full :-D ), because it affects performance if you let it go to the end of the tank... any truth to this?

And point noted SilverMax, I won't take it past 5000. From the sticky that you shared, I'll just ask for "Mobil 1 M1-105" next time

talkinghorse

iTrader: (121)

No, you should definitely see oil on your dipstick. Does your oil pressure light go out? Perhaps since you just had the oil changed, the (clean) oil level is difficult to see on the dipstick. Recommend you let it sit for a while on a flat surface and then re-check it.

And "whitish/bluish" smoke/vapors/gas coming from your exhaust is not the result of low fuel level in the tank...

Once you get by this immediate question as to whether or not you have sufficient oil in your engine, monitor the oil level on a regular basis (weekly) to make sure the engine does not have any serious oil consumption issues.

mr_a_ali

No, there is oil on the dipstick. What I mean is, should there be a pool of oil visible when you open the oil cap on top of the engine?

SilverMax_04

Where would there be a pool of oil when you take off the oil filler cap? If you saw oil when you took off the cap, your engine would be flooded with oil.

Read the oil level on your dipstick. There are two thoughts about when to do this:
1) read the oil level about 5 minutes after you stop the engine (enough time to fill the gas tank at a gas station).
2) read the oil level in the morning after the engine has cooled down and all of the oil has flowed back to the sump.

I follow the second, but its reported that the oil levels on the dipstick were designed for the first.

andrei3333

^^ i think my 97 (4th gen) was designed to have its oil checked the 1st way that you mentioned.

here is what the manual says:
1. Park the vehicle on a level surface and apply the parking brake.
2. Run the engine until it reaches operating temperature.
3. Turn off the engine. Wait more than 10 minutes for the oil to drain back into the oil pan.
4. Remove the sipstick and wipe it clean. Reinsert it all the way.
5. Remove the dipstick again and check the level. It should be between the "H" and "L" marks. If the oil level is below the "L" mark, remove the oil filler cap and pour recommended oil through the opening. Do not overfill.
6.Recheck the oil with the dipstick.

Bobo

WTF are you thinking when you state that you need to have a minimum of 1/2 a tank of gas at all times. That is utter nonsense!

The primary reason you don't run your gas tank down to fumes is to ensure:

a) you don't run out of gas
b) you don't suck debris/rust etc. from the bottom of the gas tank into the fuel pump
c) you don't overheat the fuel pump by running the car at extremely low fuel levels.

Since your car is relatively new, point b is not a concern.

If your idiot light comes on, put gas in the tank. Don't run it much beyond that.

SilverMax_04

This is the way the engine was designed -- based on checking your oil as the last thing you do before you leave a gas station. But I've found that this method does not give consistent results. So I went to the second method (in the morning) and get consistent results. It also has a tendency to slightly underfill you oil pan -- which is certainly better than overfilling it.

Take your pick. I will stick to the second method.

sky jumper

regarding oil change intervals and warranty coverage -- I've heard a few stories of manufacturers denying warranty claims based on failure to follow maintenance schedule and/or lack of maintenance documentation (e.g. guy changes his own oil, can't prove he did it --> Nissan denies a subsequent warranty claim).

there's a thread in the 5th gen forum where a guy got screwed out of warranty coverage for this very reason. it appears his only option is to sue, which is not really worth it.

technically & legally, the OEMs may not be allowed to deny claims due to exceeding scheduled OCIs. but it looks like some are willing to bet that the customer will not sue if they do.

I have no reason to doubt Amsoil's warranty coverage, but I would not push it past the Nissan scheduled intervals with any other oil. the real bugger is how to prove you followed the maintenance schedule when doing it yourself.