Need help so I dont lose my car!
Originally posted by Dave Holmes
I tend to agree with Frank and some others on this one. You are right that as an American citizen, you have certain inalienable rights. And I fully support people exercising their rights (hell, I've fought to gain others those rights and to protect ours). I think what Frank and some others are trying to get across is this: If you are guilty, don't try to turn it in to some sort of game by drawing it out and hoping for some technicality (which in Louisiana, small "technicalities" in traffic court don't matter; such as the officer got the wrong car color,make, etc...). Don't get me wrong, though. If you are not guilty of the offense charged, fight it.
However, from the original post, I gather that you were exceeding the speed limit. The questionable part may be by how much. Here's an example of a court case where that came in to play (keep in mind this is Louisiana; state laws vary). I write a guy for doing 60 something in a 35. I had paced him (no radar/laser, just using my CALIBRATED speedometer, courtesy of Ford) in my cruiser for .8 miles. He fights it. I take the stand, and he "faces his accusor" by trying to drill me. I testify to the truth, referring to the notes on the back of my original ticket which were written immediately following the stop (now 2+ months in the past). He takes the stand, and the assistant DA questions him (remember, this is Louisiana, state laws/procedures vary). He testifies that he was not going 60 something in a 35. When asked how he knew, he testified "because my speedometer said I was only going 45". Judge found him instantly guilty, chastised him for wasting the court's time, and maxed out punishment (fine, court costs, points, mandatory driver improvement course with associated fee, community service with associated fee, etc). The moral here is simple. One, don't say you weren't going what the officer said you were and then give a number that is still above the limit. Two, if guilty, admit it and hope the court shows mercy.
If not guilty, fight it. There is nothing an attorney can do for you in traffic court that you can't do yourself.
Like others have said, probably the best thing you can do at this point is to go to your city/county's traffic court and watch how it is held. Pay a lot of attention to the strategies some of the defendants use, and note which ones have a desired outcome. Also note which ones don't work, and avoid them. Once you've seen how the court system works (nothing like TV), you'll have a better idea of what you face.
Being 17, having a parent with you will look very good on your behalf. Dress appropriately (that can't be stressed enough. Conservative slacks, button up shirt, dress shoes are approriate. Suit and tie can push it a little, but it depends on what the norm is for your area). Be respectful towards the court, DA, and officers, even if you can't stand them. Speak proper English, avoiding any slang, etc... Stand up straight (no slouching), and keep your hands out of your pockets (judges tend to hate that).
These are just some pointers, and I'm sure others may disagree with them. But these are my observations from being in courts hundreds of times. Good luck, and keep us posted.
Dave
I tend to agree with Frank and some others on this one. You are right that as an American citizen, you have certain inalienable rights. And I fully support people exercising their rights (hell, I've fought to gain others those rights and to protect ours). I think what Frank and some others are trying to get across is this: If you are guilty, don't try to turn it in to some sort of game by drawing it out and hoping for some technicality (which in Louisiana, small "technicalities" in traffic court don't matter; such as the officer got the wrong car color,make, etc...). Don't get me wrong, though. If you are not guilty of the offense charged, fight it.
However, from the original post, I gather that you were exceeding the speed limit. The questionable part may be by how much. Here's an example of a court case where that came in to play (keep in mind this is Louisiana; state laws vary). I write a guy for doing 60 something in a 35. I had paced him (no radar/laser, just using my CALIBRATED speedometer, courtesy of Ford) in my cruiser for .8 miles. He fights it. I take the stand, and he "faces his accusor" by trying to drill me. I testify to the truth, referring to the notes on the back of my original ticket which were written immediately following the stop (now 2+ months in the past). He takes the stand, and the assistant DA questions him (remember, this is Louisiana, state laws/procedures vary). He testifies that he was not going 60 something in a 35. When asked how he knew, he testified "because my speedometer said I was only going 45". Judge found him instantly guilty, chastised him for wasting the court's time, and maxed out punishment (fine, court costs, points, mandatory driver improvement course with associated fee, community service with associated fee, etc). The moral here is simple. One, don't say you weren't going what the officer said you were and then give a number that is still above the limit. Two, if guilty, admit it and hope the court shows mercy.
If not guilty, fight it. There is nothing an attorney can do for you in traffic court that you can't do yourself.
Like others have said, probably the best thing you can do at this point is to go to your city/county's traffic court and watch how it is held. Pay a lot of attention to the strategies some of the defendants use, and note which ones have a desired outcome. Also note which ones don't work, and avoid them. Once you've seen how the court system works (nothing like TV), you'll have a better idea of what you face.
Being 17, having a parent with you will look very good on your behalf. Dress appropriately (that can't be stressed enough. Conservative slacks, button up shirt, dress shoes are approriate. Suit and tie can push it a little, but it depends on what the norm is for your area). Be respectful towards the court, DA, and officers, even if you can't stand them. Speak proper English, avoiding any slang, etc... Stand up straight (no slouching), and keep your hands out of your pockets (judges tend to hate that).
These are just some pointers, and I'm sure others may disagree with them. But these are my observations from being in courts hundreds of times. Good luck, and keep us posted.
Dave
Derek
Senior Member
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 865
Originally posted by DerekJ212
Thank you for an imformative and respectful response. Would it be bad to go to court knowing I was guilty just to request an alternative punishment to a point on my insurance? There is no doubt that I was speeding, I would just like it not to go on my insurance.
Derek
Thank you for an imformative and respectful response. Would it be bad to go to court knowing I was guilty just to request an alternative punishment to a point on my insurance? There is no doubt that I was speeding, I would just like it not to go on my insurance.
Derek
It is not in the state's best interest most of the time to haggle too much about sentencing for a minor traffic violation, and the DA knows this all too well. Depending on any other circumstances, most DA's would accept a guilty plea with a stipulation regarding amount of fine, no points, etc... because of personal circumstances. This however may be out of his hands if there are mandatory sentencing requirements in the state law. It can also depend on his mood that day. DA's are human and most will work with you up to a limit.
I still advise to attend court before your court date to see how the system works. Every state is different regarding their laws/procedures. You can also possibly talk to the DA and get more info.
These are just my opinions from my experience. State/local laws vary. Good luck.
Dave
Originally posted by Dave Holmes
Judges and DA's understand about points and insurance (or else they wouldn't put points on your license). Find out if a DA actually prosecutes traffic offenses for your jurisdiction, or if it is just judge alone. Talk with the DA before court. They usually call people who will be pleading to talk with them before court to work out details. Explain about the point being your primary concern due to insurance (which most likely will be the most expensive part). Ask if you can get the point waived if you plead guilty. This would be a good time to have a parent with you, but with YOU doing the talking (parents presence shows concern, but you doing the talking shows your acceptance of responsibility). Most DA's aren't too concerned about sentencing for minor traffic violations; they just want to get as many people to plead guilty right off so as not to bog the system down (and increase their workload).
It is not in the state's best interest most of the time to haggle too much about sentencing for a minor traffic violation, and the DA knows this all too well. Depending on any other circumstances, most DA's would accept a guilty plea with a stipulation regarding amount of fine, no points, etc... because of personal circumstances. This however may be out of his hands if there are mandatory sentencing requirements in the state law. It can also depend on his mood that day. DA's are human and most will work with you up to a limit.
I still advise to attend court before your court date to see how the system works. Every state is different regarding their laws/procedures. You can also possibly talk to the DA and get more info.
These are just my opinions from my experience. State/local laws vary. Good luck.
Dave
Judges and DA's understand about points and insurance (or else they wouldn't put points on your license). Find out if a DA actually prosecutes traffic offenses for your jurisdiction, or if it is just judge alone. Talk with the DA before court. They usually call people who will be pleading to talk with them before court to work out details. Explain about the point being your primary concern due to insurance (which most likely will be the most expensive part). Ask if you can get the point waived if you plead guilty. This would be a good time to have a parent with you, but with YOU doing the talking (parents presence shows concern, but you doing the talking shows your acceptance of responsibility). Most DA's aren't too concerned about sentencing for minor traffic violations; they just want to get as many people to plead guilty right off so as not to bog the system down (and increase their workload).
It is not in the state's best interest most of the time to haggle too much about sentencing for a minor traffic violation, and the DA knows this all too well. Depending on any other circumstances, most DA's would accept a guilty plea with a stipulation regarding amount of fine, no points, etc... because of personal circumstances. This however may be out of his hands if there are mandatory sentencing requirements in the state law. It can also depend on his mood that day. DA's are human and most will work with you up to a limit.
I still advise to attend court before your court date to see how the system works. Every state is different regarding their laws/procedures. You can also possibly talk to the DA and get more info.
These are just my opinions from my experience. State/local laws vary. Good luck.
Dave
Derek
Senior Member
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 448
I can see why your are scared. Times have sure changed since I was 18 in 20-something years ago.
70 in a 25, running 2 stop signs, evading, eluding, reckless driving, excessive speed, all in less than 2 minutes. Didn't get a ticket till the next day,
All that and I not only kept my licence, but my insurance did not go up: The Judge did not put it on my record, so NO points. Whew!
(I'm keeping a long story short here).
I've only gotten 1 ticket since. Guess I learned a lesson: Don't be stupid, and don't get caught.
We all speed. Most of us here like our car because they go fast, and we make them do so. Hopefully, you learned yours, and your Judge will be a lenient one.
By the way, I still have that ticket, framed, to remind me of the stupidest thing I've ever done, and the dangers and trepidations of testosterone and blue ***** facing young men. Also to remind myself not to judge others to harshly.
70 in a 25, running 2 stop signs, evading, eluding, reckless driving, excessive speed, all in less than 2 minutes. Didn't get a ticket till the next day,
All that and I not only kept my licence, but my insurance did not go up: The Judge did not put it on my record, so NO points. Whew!
(I'm keeping a long story short here).
I've only gotten 1 ticket since. Guess I learned a lesson: Don't be stupid, and don't get caught.
We all speed. Most of us here like our car because they go fast, and we make them do so. Hopefully, you learned yours, and your Judge will be a lenient one.
By the way, I still have that ticket, framed, to remind me of the stupidest thing I've ever done, and the dangers and trepidations of testosterone and blue ***** facing young men. Also to remind myself not to judge others to harshly.
Originally posted by DerekJ212
Hey guys, its a speeding ticket, not a murder....22 over...Im asking if theres an approach *i* should take on it to the judge...anyone? No lawyers here..
Hey guys, its a speeding ticket, not a murder....22 over...Im asking if theres an approach *i* should take on it to the judge...anyone? No lawyers here..
-Nick
Newbie - Just Registered
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 1
Originally posted by Bgohan
Being honest might help. Judges like that. Ask if there are alternatives to having a ticket on your record. Go sit in on traffic court to see what may be a possible alternative to a fine and record of the ticket. Community service is one thing to offer.
When you go to court, be honest, humble, polite, and intelligent. If your pants hang below your ***, your hair is purple and you have a nose ring, get rid of the ring and color your hair brown, and wear some clean pants that fit. Put on your clean and lucky underwear. Offer and ask to make ammends and to work things out somehow. If you plead guilty, continue speaking (politely) with questions or your offer before the judge can move on.
That is all you can honestly do. You screwed up. Nobody got hurt this time.
Now take reponsibilty for your actions. Or hire a lawyer and maybe weasle out of it.
It's a bummer that insurance is so high, but that's life.
How much is just liability on a clunker?? Because that is what you will probably have to drive until you can either afford the high insurance, or your driving record clears, and you learn when and where to speed.
Good luck.
Being honest might help. Judges like that. Ask if there are alternatives to having a ticket on your record. Go sit in on traffic court to see what may be a possible alternative to a fine and record of the ticket. Community service is one thing to offer.
When you go to court, be honest, humble, polite, and intelligent. If your pants hang below your ***, your hair is purple and you have a nose ring, get rid of the ring and color your hair brown, and wear some clean pants that fit. Put on your clean and lucky underwear. Offer and ask to make ammends and to work things out somehow. If you plead guilty, continue speaking (politely) with questions or your offer before the judge can move on.
That is all you can honestly do. You screwed up. Nobody got hurt this time.
Now take reponsibilty for your actions. Or hire a lawyer and maybe weasle out of it.
It's a bummer that insurance is so high, but that's life.
How much is just liability on a clunker?? Because that is what you will probably have to drive until you can either afford the high insurance, or your driving record clears, and you learn when and where to speed.
Good luck.
How did you react with the officer?
You should be lucky, in my county minors automatically loose their license for a minimum for 3 months for the second driving offense. I was honest with my judge and got out of that somehow. I was also nice to the police officer and he told the DA to go easy on me.
Good luck and slow down.
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