Question in comparing my new starter with my old starter
03-30-2003, 09:42 PM
#1
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Question in comparing my new starter with my old starter
My car has been having starting problems for a while now. 
Of course one of the first things I did was have the starter checked and it tested fine!! Well after trying a million other things (in vain) I decided to try having the starter tested again. Chilton's said a bench test is more accurate then a test on the car so I removed it and brought it to Autozone. This time it failed. I even heard it, it sounded awful!. (I still don't know if it was bad to begin with or if it went bad since the first test). Anyway, I bought a new one from Autozone. When I tried the new one, it was terrible. It made loud, loud clanking noices, I felt vibrations in the cabin and if the car started 1/5 before, it now started 1/20! I took it out and brought it back. I told him my story and said I want a new one. He said he couldn't since it tested fine. I finally talked him into it. Well tonight, just when I was about to install the new one, I decided to look at it one more time, in depth, and compare it to the old one. While everything looks 100% the same externally, I counted 8 teeth on the stock pinion gear and 10 on the new one! Is this the reason I got bad results from the first Autozone starter? Or does the number of teeth not matter?
Cliff's notes:
Should I install the new starter that has two extra teeth than the stock starter or should I bring it back?
Thanks everyone.
Of course one of the first things I did was have the starter checked and it tested fine!! Well after trying a million other things (in vain) I decided to try having the starter tested again. Chilton's said a bench test is more accurate then a test on the car so I removed it and brought it to Autozone. This time it failed. I even heard it, it sounded awful!. (I still don't know if it was bad to begin with or if it went bad since the first test). Anyway, I bought a new one from Autozone. When I tried the new one, it was terrible. It made loud, loud clanking noices, I felt vibrations in the cabin and if the car started 1/5 before, it now started 1/20! I took it out and brought it back. I told him my story and said I want a new one. He said he couldn't since it tested fine. I finally talked him into it. Well tonight, just when I was about to install the new one, I decided to look at it one more time, in depth, and compare it to the old one. While everything looks 100% the same externally, I counted 8 teeth on the stock pinion gear and 10 on the new one! Is this the reason I got bad results from the first Autozone starter? Or does the number of teeth not matter?Cliff's notes:
Should I install the new starter that has two extra teeth than the stock starter or should I bring it back?
Thanks everyone.
03-30-2003, 11:11 PM
#2
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It would seem that number of teeth do matter! I remember my stock starter (97 GXE, built April 97) had 10 teeth. But the older 4th gens had the 8 teeth design.
I would definitely get a proper replacement. It was the auto store's fault for not giving you the correct unit (provided you gave them the year of your car).
I would definitely get a proper replacement. It was the auto store's fault for not giving you the correct unit (provided you gave them the year of your car).
03-30-2003, 11:55 PM
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:o)
Originally posted by Eric L.
It would seem that number of teeth do matter! I remember my stock starter (97 GXE, built April 97) had 10 teeth. But the older 4th gens had the 8 teeth design.
I would definitely get a proper replacement. It was the auto store's fault for not giving you the correct unit (provided you gave them the year of your car).
It would seem that number of teeth do matter! I remember my stock starter (97 GXE, built April 97) had 10 teeth. But the older 4th gens had the 8 teeth design.
I would definitely get a proper replacement. It was the auto store's fault for not giving you the correct unit (provided you gave them the year of your car).
03-31-2003, 12:33 AM
#4
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from what i heard Nissan changed to the 10 tooth starter in late 96. Ive replaced 2 starters, both in a 95, with the 8 tooth starter to a 10 tooth starter. to this date no probs.
03-31-2003, 08:26 AM
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Originally posted by Turbo95Max
from what i heard Nissan changed to the 10 tooth starter in late 96. Ive replaced 2 starters, both in a 95, with the 8 tooth starter to a 10 tooth starter. to this date no probs.
from what i heard Nissan changed to the 10 tooth starter in late 96. Ive replaced 2 starters, both in a 95, with the 8 tooth starter to a 10 tooth starter. to this date no probs.
Turbo, how many miles do you have? Why have you gone through 3 starters?
03-31-2003, 11:42 AM
#6
Re: :o)
the 10 toothed starter is the one to get...even for 95-mid96. I have an aftermarket one on my 1995 that works flawlessly. Got it from Linney Auto Electric who advertises on ebay and routinely as them for $120 brand new with no core charge.
04-01-2003, 01:17 AM
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Re: :o)
Originally posted by ptatohed
Great, there goes my theory as to why I was getting clanking.
Turbo, how many miles do you have? Why have you gone through 3 starters?
Great, there goes my theory as to why I was getting clanking.
Turbo, how many miles do you have? Why have you gone through 3 starters?
04-01-2003, 03:34 PM
#8
Nissan switched to the 10 teeth model because they were apparently more reliable. Less stress per tooth or something like that.
I replaced mine with a 10 teeth model about 6 months ago. No problem at all.
Did you check your flywheel? With the starter taken off, use a screwdriver or small stick to gently turn the flywheel. See if it's been damaged anywhere.
I replaced mine with a 10 teeth model about 6 months ago. No problem at all.
Did you check your flywheel? With the starter taken off, use a screwdriver or small stick to gently turn the flywheel. See if it's been damaged anywhere.
04-01-2003, 03:41 PM
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Originally posted by JPMax
Nissan switched to the 10 teeth model because they were apparently more reliable. Less stress per tooth or something like that.
I replaced mine with a 10 teeth model about 6 months ago. No problem at all.
Did you check your flywheel? With the starter taken off, use a screwdriver or small stick to gently turn the flywheel. See if it's been damaged anywhere.
Nissan switched to the 10 teeth model because they were apparently more reliable. Less stress per tooth or something like that.
I replaced mine with a 10 teeth model about 6 months ago. No problem at all.
Did you check your flywheel? With the starter taken off, use a screwdriver or small stick to gently turn the flywheel. See if it's been damaged anywhere.
I tried the new 10-tooth last night and I melted it (litterally).
My car is just not starting.
04-01-2003, 08:07 PM
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They changed to 10-tooth because they were replacing too many starters under warranty. The more teeth on the starter, the more mechanical advantage it has and the less load on the starter motor. The disadvantage is that the engine turns slower.
You can turn it by hand, but your not going to do it with a small stick. Put a 1/2" drive socket and ratchet on the crankshaft pulley and have someone turn the engine with the wrench while you look in the starter hole with a flashlight. Put a mark on the ring gear (like white-out) so that you will know when you have inspected the entire thing.
How did you melt the new starter? Did you crank on the starter continuously until you overheated it? If the starter was turning the engine over properly, you've got other problems. Remember, the starter just rotates the engine until the fuel/air mixture is ignited by the ignition system. You can run the starter until the cows come home, but the car won't start if it's not getting fuel, air or spark.
You can turn it by hand, but your not going to do it with a small stick. Put a 1/2" drive socket and ratchet on the crankshaft pulley and have someone turn the engine with the wrench while you look in the starter hole with a flashlight. Put a mark on the ring gear (like white-out) so that you will know when you have inspected the entire thing.
How did you melt the new starter? Did you crank on the starter continuously until you overheated it? If the starter was turning the engine over properly, you've got other problems. Remember, the starter just rotates the engine until the fuel/air mixture is ignited by the ignition system. You can run the starter until the cows come home, but the car won't start if it's not getting fuel, air or spark.
04-02-2003, 08:28 AM
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Originally posted by sinewave
They changed to 10-tooth because they were replacing too many starters under warranty. The more teeth on the starter, the more mechanical advantage it has and the less load on the starter motor. The disadvantage is that the engine turns slower.
You can turn it by hand, but your not going to do it with a small stick. Put a 1/2" drive socket and ratchet on the crankshaft pulley and have someone turn the engine with the wrench while you look in the starter hole with a flashlight. Put a mark on the ring gear (like white-out) so that you will know when you have inspected the entire thing.
How did you melt the new starter? Did you crank on the starter continuously until you overheated it? If the starter was turning the engine over properly, you've got other problems. Remember, the starter just rotates the engine until the fuel/air mixture is ignited by the ignition system. You can run the starter until the cows come home, but the car won't start if it's not getting fuel, air or spark.
They changed to 10-tooth because they were replacing too many starters under warranty. The more teeth on the starter, the more mechanical advantage it has and the less load on the starter motor. The disadvantage is that the engine turns slower.
You can turn it by hand, but your not going to do it with a small stick. Put a 1/2" drive socket and ratchet on the crankshaft pulley and have someone turn the engine with the wrench while you look in the starter hole with a flashlight. Put a mark on the ring gear (like white-out) so that you will know when you have inspected the entire thing.
How did you melt the new starter? Did you crank on the starter continuously until you overheated it? If the starter was turning the engine over properly, you've got other problems. Remember, the starter just rotates the engine until the fuel/air mixture is ignited by the ignition system. You can run the starter until the cows come home, but the car won't start if it's not getting fuel, air or spark.
I think you are right, there is another problem.
This is so depressing. I have tried a million things. I am ready to just take it to Nissan and pay whatever it costs.
Do you really think it could be the flywheel? Or should I just take it in already?
04-02-2003, 04:46 PM
#12
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Since you have to replace the starter anyway, you might as well inspect the ring gear. If you don't you will always wonder about it.
I'm still not sure what the symptoms are. What is the 1/5 and 1/20 mean in your description? Please give as complete a description as possible. Are you still getting the loud clanking noises with the second starter from Autozone?
Did you pull codes from the ECM?
I'm still not sure what the symptoms are. What is the 1/5 and 1/20 mean in your description? Please give as complete a description as possible. Are you still getting the loud clanking noises with the second starter from Autozone?
Did you pull codes from the ECM?
04-04-2003, 08:33 PM
#13
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Originally posted by sinewave
Since you have to replace the starter anyway, you might as well inspect the ring gear. If you don't you will always wonder about it.
I'm still not sure what the symptoms are. What is the 1/5 and 1/20 mean in your description? Please give as complete a description as possible. Are you still getting the loud clanking noises with the second starter from Autozone?
Did you pull codes from the ECM?
Since you have to replace the starter anyway, you might as well inspect the ring gear. If you don't you will always wonder about it.
I'm still not sure what the symptoms are. What is the 1/5 and 1/20 mean in your description? Please give as complete a description as possible. Are you still getting the loud clanking noises with the second starter from Autozone?
Did you pull codes from the ECM?
I just meant "one out of five" and "one out of twenty". Ironically, when I brought back the fried one (I love lifetime warranties - lol), the new had 8 teeth! I installed it last night. Before I did so, I took a quick look at the flywheel but to be honest I wasn't exactly sure what I was looking for. While I saw some wear on the teeth, I don't really know what is considered excessive. Anyway, the new 8 tooth starter didn't help but didn't hurt. I can start the car but only after a number of attempts.
I appreciate you offer to help sine but, I have tried a gazillion things. I don't care anymore, I just want it fixed. I made an appt. at Nissan tomorrow. I don't even care about cost anymore, I just want my baby back.
But FYI, I will list my symtoms:
Awful, awful time starting the car. It shakes, it's loud, it stinks, it puts smoke out the exaust, etc. But it sounds sooooo close to starting. So close. However, once it does finally start, there are absolutely no signs that there is anything wrong. It runs strong and powerful, no sounds, no stalling, no rough idle, no decrease in gas milage, etc. Things I have tried: going from one step colder plugs back to stock, new fuel filter, changed fuel pump, changed O2 sensors, changed knock sensor, changed starter, new (800 c.a.) battery, bypass the Vortech auxilary fuel pump, ask all the boosted guys here for advice, made a million calls to Nissan and other mechanics, etc., etc. Any ideas what it could be?
Thanks.
04-05-2003, 03:45 PM
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Originally posted by Turbo95Max
well, its not your starter
without seeing the car and checking it out. to me it seems like its a leaky injector.
well, its not your starter
without seeing the car and checking it out. to me it seems like its a leaky injector.
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