shumax

Wow! I am making dinner with my sister and she notices that we are out of milk and beer. I said no problem, I will go to the local gas station and get some of each. I ask her if I can take her car---2000 Integra GSR--5spd. Only mods are blue lights everywhere and ALTEZZAS So I jump in and cruise about 3 miles to the local gas station--minding my own business---going the speed limit. As I am making a left into the place a guy in a Jeep blocked me so I dumped it at 4k and smoked a bit with the wheels and pulled in and parked--giving him the 'look' the entire time. Got out of the car, turned around and about crapped my pants. Here stood about 20 Asians looking at me...like, WOW--whats his deal--meaning me?! I laughed

I went in and got my beer and milk and was in line with a few of them. They asked what I had in the car and I said a paper air filter from Acura and a nice Stock Exhaust from Acura too....they all laughed with me. I was lucky enough to get out with them when we left. I followed a Blue and a Red Civic SI (2k) both had at least intake and exhaust and were lowered to the MAX. These two were following four other Civics which were a bit older--maybe 3 years. We get to the light which was about 50 yards from the gas station. We were all turning left onto the highway where the limit is 60mph---I was dead last in line. Remember that I am making a left onto a divided highway with two SI's in front of me and four other Civics in front of them. I nail it and am about 3 cars behind the Red Si. I shift to second at 8300 rpm which is into the red line and the front end slides left with a loud chirp and I am closing in on the Red Si who is on it too as I can hear him over my radio and my engine at 8300rpm. At about 6500rpm in second I move by him and am on my way to 8300 and shift to third and the two Si's are going full bore as I pass the red one he looks ****ed. I start to move up on the blue one which was about 1 car ahead of the Red SI. We were all WAY to close together as you can see. However, remember we all started at the same light. At the end of Third I have past the Blue SI and am approaching 100mph. I ran to about 115mph and flashed the hazards. I was then even with the rest of his pack---the older Civics. As I passed two of them they gave me a thumbs up and a nod. I honked and then slowed and waited.

The red Si came flying up on me and did a Fast and Furious move on me to the right--I heard his intake roar when he was about 4 cars back. I had the car in 3rd at 85 which was about 4500 rpm--700rpm lower than the Secondary Vtec 'kick'. He got next to me and pointed straight ahead. I nodded and mouthed 'Ok.' Three honks of his horn and it was on. I ran to 8300 rpm and shifted to 4th and had one car, and pulled to two, then three and then I let off around 130mph. I flashed the hazards and he came flying by me and wouldn't look at me. His friends came up and one leaned out and said "Nice Driving." I then slowed to turn on my side exit. I was shaking so badly from the excitement I grinded 2nd and then took off for my house and got the car in the garage and shut the door. I was shaking for 30min afterwards....what a F'ing rush! I can only imagine what his friends were saying..."how can you let a STOCK GSR beat your modded up rice machine Civic SI?" I am not trying to disrespect as I liked all of their cars but one of them which looked "ghetto" to me. I know where they were going....it's test and tune night at "Dragway 42" near Lodi, Ohio---about 10min from my house.

Hear me out....what I did was STUPID...STUPID..>STUPID...but it was a rush. There was no traffic and the only thing that could have happened was driver error or a deer.


Makes me want the Vtec now...I KNOW that my Auto Maxima would have lost here. The gear hunting of the Auto would have killed me.

SHUMAX

costcowholesale

iTrader: (12)

I had a vtec race too, odyssey EX vs automagic civic EX, I won by 1.5 car by around 70mph

shumax

Hey I can tell you one thing. If I HAD to get a minivan, the Odesey would be it--love that thing. When I was on vaction about 2 weeks ago I had one try to tail me through the West Virgina Montains at speeds that hit 100mph---what a joke for him. At the toll both he was next to me and revved on me. At the take off we both gunned it and I smoked him all the way to 100---I must have had 5 cars on him!

SHUMAX

Cumalot

iTrader: (8)

Nice run! Now, why can't I get thoses kind of races where I live?

Ravq

There's something to brag about. j/p
I like those Odysseys too.

costcowholesale

iTrader: (12)

wait till I do a type S swap and blow you all automagic boys! just wait, anyways the odyssey is capable of taking 4cyc camrys and accord, new civic, protege, probably sentra, focus...the guy probably think you had a 4cyc adn revved @ you shumax, if you were weaving in and out of traffic at 100mph constancly you'll be suprise that odyssey will stick 2 yr tail. odyssey owners are all serious, check out www.odyclub.com its just like this .org only smaller. 2002 odyssey will get a 5spd automatic and the maxima is still left with a 4spd autotrash

LoveSick

not many people know that my bro has a Integra Type-R. That thing is fast. I drove it once and beat a M couope with just a VTEC controller.

I still find it hard to believe you drop the clutch at 4k and had only some tire spin. The R with LSD still spins at 4k dump.

Azeem

The guy probably had such a huge exhaust setup that he was
losing HP due to backpressure loss... Or he didn't know how to shift

Craig Mack

I hear alot of good things about the new V-TEC engines. Hear they have good high-end power. The maxima isnt a V-TEC, but you CANT get a better V-6 than the Max (according to wards)...So what im asking is if nissan made the maxima in a V-TEC form would it be better than our DOHC engines ? How do our current 4th gen. engines compare to them ?

nodoubt711

lets just say a ls can run mid 15's with just intake and exhaust so you can imagine what gsr or a type r can do with a few mods. sure we have more hp and torque (190-222) in some cases (while gsr = 170 type r = 195 prelude = 200), we can still easily lose due to the simple fact that weight kills. those little farts have no weight and in the high end the vtec (plus their short gear box setup, which keep it in vtec mode) will just keep pulling on you. i have also driven/ridden in many gsr's and one type r and they have no freakin torque (no fun in the city) but once you get a clear open road, hold on to your *** cause its a blast!

shumax

Just wanted to respond to a few comments here. The Odysey? I like it...but I doubt he could hang with me in the Mountains that well---especially if his wife was in the car with him

The 4K clutch dump? Well I shouldn't have said 'DUMP'--I just released it until it spun a bit and smoked a bit and then shoved it back to the floor board---was looking for effect, not the killing of those pricey Michelans on that car

AS far as this guy not knowing how to shift that some nebie made?! I knew someone would say this. All I can say is that you will have to take my word for it since you had no way of being there. However, his 1-2 resulted in a huge chirp and the 2-3 made his lowered car jump quite a bit---I am almost sure he powered shifted. I don't think it was a matter of shifting---it was a matter of bigger engine with more power and slightly lighter car.


Oh well---I still can't that 'event' get it out of my mind......

SHUMAX

Jeff92se

iTrader: (82)

I don't think the 4-gen maxima has a redline even close to 8300 rpms.

shumax

To bad it doesn't have that redline, huh?

SHUMAX

Jeff92se

iTrader: (82)

Yes it is. So how did you shift at 8300?

bill99gxe

iTrader: (1)

[Y2KevSE style]

Goes to get popcorn, in anticipation of a long afternoon.

[/Y2KevSE style]

shumax

Only when I am in a Honda Product and need every last bit of power will I shift at 8300rpm. If it were my Maxima I would have to say that about 4000rpm would be enough


However, its nice to run one out like that once in a while--makes you feel like you are in an Indy car. Not practical for me though.

My question to you should be, "How often do you shift at 7200rpm?" Not often I would bet.


SHUMAX

Jeff92se

iTrader: (82)

In VTEC equipped Hondas, shifting at 7200 or close to 8000 is easy. These cars are still making power at these rpm levels so it makes sense to do so. Also these cars have much higher numerical gearing so the revs rise fast.

But you knew that

costcowholesale

iTrader: (12)

I hung with a passat 1.8 on highway crusing around 100mph weaving in and out of traffic, we're both turning hard. That guy was probably scared a minivan was chasing him @ 100, In the moutain you're right but I never said mountain

Craig Mack

So, is this engine more intelligently designed and faster than the max's engine in the long run ?

costcowholesale

iTrader: (12)

oh yes there is, its call VG30DETT

shumax

Actually, I did know all of that you said. Vtec engine make little powre below 5k rpm. On the B16A you don't hit Vtec until about 5100 or 5200 rpm, not sure which. Combine that with short gears and every shift is leaving you right in the 'meat' of the power band. It's really to bad that 6+k rpm has to be so darn loud. Most people, myself INCLUDED, don't like all that racket under the hood---I feel like I am killing the engine. However, some obviously thrive on it.


Bottom line to me is that Vtec engines are great up top where 90% of Americans DON'T drive.


SHUMAX

CoolMax

iTrader: (7)

where does this stuff happen?!? I see nothing on i480e/w!

Nice kills.

Xsi

The Integra that I used to have had a Japanese engine in it, and I was shifting at 8100RPM ....(I was doing 15.06 on 1/4 mile)This engine are cool but for a daily driven car...no low end torque make you feel sick, that's why I'm looking at the Maxima, because My Integra got stole.

I want low end torque!!!

Xsi

The Integra that I used to have had a Japanese engine in it, and I was shifting at 8100RPM ....(I was doing 15.06 on 1/4 mile)This engine are cool but for a daily driven car...no low end torque make you feel sick, that's why I'm looking at the Maxima, because My Integra got stole.

I want low end torque!!!

SteVTEC

You missed the point of VTEC.

The point of VTEC is that it allows a smaller sized engine to have the horsepower of a much larger engine while maintaining the fuel economy of the smaller engine.

The Civic Si is a pretty capable performer with 160HP and not a whole lot of weight while still getting 28 city / 31 hwy. The performance it gets is comparable to a Ford Probe GT which got much crappier mileage for the same performance and general size.

In Honda's quest to make a 200HP-family-sedan-class V6, they could have done a bunch of things to get that much power.

1) Raise compression ratio.
2) Design engine for premium fuel (requirement of #1)
3) Move to a DOHC design instead of SOHC.
4) Tweak / optimize intake and exhaust valve profiles and placement (goes along with #3)
5) Design a high-performance dual-stage intake manifold system.

Well, Honda didn't have to do any of this for the J30A1 V6 in the Accord.

6) VTEC it.

All they did was design in an intake-only VTEC system and that's all they needed to make the benchmark 200HP while still maintaining good economy and on regular 87 octane fuel.

I think you'll find that the VQ30DE has #1-5 above.

I personally like owning the ONLY import V6 engine that was designed to run on nice, cheap, 87 octane fuel

==================

Of course, the drawback of sticking with a smaller engine design is that the low-end performance is characteristic of the smaller engine. Torque is more directly related to engine size than horsepower. But if you want speed all you have to do is downshift. Smaller engine designs is really just Honda's design philosophy. Their biggest production engine is a 3.5L V6 and they don't even make a V8 - one of the only mainstream automotive companies in the world not to.

So if you want good low-end performance then don't buy a Honda. If I really wanted good low-end I probably would have bought myself a GM car with the 3800 Series II V6.

Sometimes there is no replacement for displacement

Ironlord

No low-end torque means no fun unless you kill your engine. And while its true hondas rev higher than a max it harms their enguine just like yours, ie running a honda to 8k rpm is just a bad for their car as running a max to 6k rpm, and the only way they can enjoy their car is to run it that high ALL THE TIME. Now,most honda's are driven by stupid teens (don't mind teens, i am one, just the stupid ones) and they have no problem beating the hell out of their car. however if you're a responsible person understand that you will not enjoy any vtec engine except for the occasional times you push it. You know how the max feels at about 1500 rpms? that's about how a vtec is up till the changeover. Plus, its very loud after 6k rpms, and not a good growl or burble, its a whiney hissy kind of yelping loud. Yes, its amazing that honda can get such performance out of such small engines, but i don't think its that worthwhile for your average responsible person.

and about the gas mileage...anyone can get good gas mileage if you stay out of the revs, keep a honda under the changeover and you'll get great mileage. But, try keeping your max under 3k rpm all the time and see what great mileage you get, and you'll be getting a boatload more torque than the honda people...

And about the GM Series II 3800 (L36), my mom has one is her 00 Grand Prix GT and gets about 30 mpg on highway...

There is NEVER any replacement for displacement.

Jeff92se

iTrader: (82)

I have driven both my maxima and my brother's GSR. That gsr is about 2x as fun to drive. Light car, free reving engine and one of the most smooth/slick shifters on the market.

You can't possibly equate wear from a Honda to Nissan. Both make very durable engines. The point you are missing is Honda's Vtec equipped engines are DESIGNED to handle the rpms they run. It's why the redline is 8k and not 9k. 4 cylinder cars are much easier to make to last at high rpms becuase they are made w/ less parts. Plus Honda is VERY experienced w/ high rpm engines. They have been doing it for 15 years +. They have been making high rpm engines for over 40 years. They first started w/ motocyles remember? The VTEC engines don't need high torque becuase the cars they propel don't have alot of weight to push around. Why put a v6 that will KILL the front/rear weight bias??

The life of the engine is much more about how people take car of it, more than how it's designed. Run both Nissan and Honda engines at their normal operating rpm ranges + regular oil changes and BOTH will last 150-200k easy. Hell Honda engines last 200k when you DON'T take care of them.

bioyuki

Honda is changing its ways, esp with the luxury divisions. Its finally realized that a luxury veichle can't have a high pitched engine sound, it has to be smooth and realtiveltly torquey. Case in point, the J32A2 (Type-S) engine delivers peak torque at 3500rpm, well before the VTEC changover at 4800rpm. Yes, the engine does get very loud (not whiny though, IMO) after VTEC kicks in but the engine is strong enough that in daily driving its not often used. There are many different forms of VTEC (SOHC VTEC, DOHC VTEC, VTEC-E, iVTEC) all implemented for different reasons so you can't make an inclusive statment about VTEC. The HX model of the Civic employs VTEC-E to get its class leading EPA MPG rating while the EX employs normal VTEC for more power.

Shingles

How often do I drive above 5000rpm? Everyday, many many many times a day.

It takes me as long to rev to 9k in my S2000 as it does to rev to 5k in the Maxima... and it's about 100 times as fun to drive.

I'll give you that people in this country like torque, they like to feel that they are going fast. Take a look at the rest of the world, most power plants are pretty small. Remember, torque makes you *feel* like you are fast, hp makes you go fast.



-Shing

shumax

No--you missed the point, buddy! Reread my message---VTEC engines are made to make 99% of there power where 99% of the population doesn't drive---OVER 5200RPM. The VQ series makes 95% of its power at a mere 2500rpm where everyone drives.

Gas milage? My Maxima gets about 30mpg going ~80mph with the A/C on and in the mountains with one bad rear heated oxygen sensor. I hate to imagine what I would get with a new O2 sensor, no A/C and going 70--maybe 33-35mpg? Sounds like it would be better than the 160hp "SI" engine that is spinning at 4,100rpm at 80mph--my Maxima? Maybe 2,900 rpm at 80mph.


High octane gas? You are right---I hate paying for it, but it has been shown it is only about an extra $150/year for the average driver at 15,000 miles/year. I drive about 9,000/ year so the cost will be lower. Not to mention I have usable, everyday power and don't have to change a timing belt & water pump every 60k. I would also trade in my fancy Vtec to have dual overhead cams which make an incredible sound IMHO. I think you are also failing to realize that just because Nissan doesn't call it "Vtec" doesn't mean they don't use a variant of variable valve timing. Then again, it's only a Maxima, not a race car---Happy revving!

SHUMAX

bioyuki

Not all VTEC engines change over at 5200rpm. Some change over lower and some higher. You make it sound like all VTEC engines are completely and utterly weak unless they are in their high power cam configuration. Once again, you can't make all inclusive statements about VTEC engines . My car makes its peak torque at 3500rpm, a RPM I hit during normal driving in automatic.

shumax

Outside of this or any other car performance club, I think you are the minority in your opinion of how OFTEN people drive above 5200rpm. There are FAR more people out there who never see about 4,000rpm in there car.

I agree, the S2k is a fine machine and a blast to drive---sounds like a big crotch-rocket, however I will say it again---"most people don't drive at 5200+rpm.


SHUMAx

Shingles

Never disagreed with you, you asked a question, I answered. when I get in a car the first thing I do is look at the tach, I see how much I've got. 6500rpm is the bottom line for me, anything less than 6500, I define as "pathetic".

I am not most people, never have been... never will be. There's a reason why we are drive the cars we drive. It's true, the car you drive defines your personality... I enjoy, no, I LOVE revving my CRX and S2000, both happens to have a 9000rpm red line. I would NEVER drive my CRX long distance though because it's not fit for that duty. I would only drive my S2000 on long distances from time to time, that's not it's "job".

So my question is: why is it "bad" or "POS" just because those people making the statement can't enjoy it? Just because people like low end grunt doesn't make the "great". There are also far more people out there that like SUVs, but that doesn't make SUVs better just because people like them. If there were true reasons other than preference, you can call it bad or what ever. But if it's a simple preference difference, that's just lame. I see a lot of comments about how you have to rev a honda high blah blah therefore it sucks... that's a very narrow minded statement. Who is it there are folks that think Honda can't make a big motor engine with lots of low end torque? Trust me, if that were the intentions, they could make one. As a demonstration of their engineering ability, there first truck like vehical(MDX) since the VERY first 4 wheel vehical is a huge success. If it were in the design scope, it would be done. (Did you know that Hondas first 4 wheeled vehical was a truck AND RWD??)

The Maxima is a great car to me, as a highway cruiser. It's not a drag racer, it's not a sports car, it's a family sedan. I enjoy it for what it is, and do not pretend what it isn't. The VQ is a *great* motor... put it in a sports car it would do great as well, but alas, it's in a family sedan. I don't make my cars do things they are not really designed to do, well expect the crx. I don't race 'vettes in the S2k because it's not in the "specs". On the same token, I don't race my maxima down the 1/4 mile because it's a family sedan.

You are right, most people don't drive above 5000rpms, but just because I do doesn't mean I will say they are wrong or bad or what not.

If one was a true enthusiasts, one would appreciate all cars for what they are, if they deserve it.

0Shing

SteVTEC

uhh...this is a little uninformed and overexaggerated. Without VTEC, the J30A1 in my Accord would probably make around 180HP @ 5252rpm as compared to the 200HP @ 5700rpm it makes with VTEC.

I would say with good certainty that it makes more than 1% of its power below 5200rpm. Peak torque is at 4700rpm, compared to the Maxima which makes peak torque at 4000rpm. So yes, the Maxima has a little more low-end oomph, but your description of a VTEC engine is clearly an exaggeration.

Oh and just so you know, VTEC engagement in the Accord V6 is at 3500rpm. The engagement is higher on the H22 (Prelude) and the B16 in the Civic Si, and the F20C in the S2000, and the K20C in the new RSX-S - all of which have extremely high redlines and are DESIGNED TO REV HIGH.

I can't help but think this is an exaggeration too. Not many guys here are getting mileage this good... What's your secret ??


I drive 30k+/yr, like I said before. To me being able to put 87 in equates to one less car payment!!

Uhhh...so do I. I might not have as much down low but there's still a good bit of useable power down low for us too...

The timing CHAIN is one nice thing on the Maxima, but we don't need to replace timing belts every 60k. It's more like 100k. And by the time we actually reach 100k we'll have saved more than enough money by being able to put in nice cheap 87 octane fuel to pay for a few timing belt replacements

So does VTEC, even on an Accord V6. I think what you're hearing is the secondary runners opening up in the intake manifold.

Really? I didn't think Nissan used any type of variable valve timing. I know the new VQ35 has "VTC" (Variable Timing Control") but I wasn't aware of anything like that on the VQ30's. I think you might be thinking of the variable (dual stage) intake manifold, or the variable capacity exhaust design.

...and it's only an Accord. Thanks - you too :-D

costcowholesale

iTrader: (12)

I 100% agree with you, I love the maxima as a "highway cruiser", but for other things like going to downtown or driving on winding road, I'll take a small car (civic)that is easier to handle and less power with more revs.

if this is still on topic abt v-tec race, tonight it was 3.5 SOHC V-TEC odyssey vs 2001 1.6 SOHC V-TEC Acura EL (honda civic EX with leahter seats and sunroof in US)
I had almost a car on it by 100km/h

Ironlord

So, you're telling me that if you looked at a 70 Charger with a 426 and saw that its redline was below 6500 (which, if i remember correctly - it was) you would define that car as pathetic? Or a c5 corvette? you want to accuse us of making generalizations, don't make any of your own...

Yes, that's true. I agree completely with this statement. And I am glad that you can be an individual.


Now we're talking about opinion's. Everyone has their own, and everyone thinks everyone else's stinks... Now, let me just say this, forget mainstream america, lets talk just about enthusiasts... We like cars, we liek speed, we like to run our cars. however, most people i know don't like to beat on their beloved car by running it hard all the time. Most enthusiasts spend a lot of time just cruising, letting it go easy. They can enjoy the thrill of driving, without bogging down or getting left behind by traffic. With most vtec engines and cars, you have to push the car to get the same result. example: two identical cars, one with 2L 4-cyl vtec that changes at 5k ropm and has peak output of 200hp and 200 tq at 8k rpm, the other has 3.5L v6 normal larger engine that has peak output of 200hp and 200tq at 6k rpm. They both have the same output, but cruise around town at 2k rpms in both, see the difference. Where the larger engine will make a much flatter torque curve, say 85% at 2500 you might have to push the vtec to 5k to get the same. That's why people don't like hondas and vtec engines. It's my personal opinion that honda would do much better with larger v6's and whatnot in their sports cars. There is no replacement for displacement...


That's awesome, a responsible honda driver (sorry making generalizations again). you might be the second honda driver i like (stevtec was first). I agree with you here that many peiople have delusions about their cars...i'm one ofthem, i take my max to the races weekly...

Well, I guess this is where we butt heads, i and it seems like many others just don't think most hondas, drivers, and vtec engines deserve that much respect. I personally have been raised on american muscle, my father almost shot me when i wanted a nissan. I think we might have to just agree to disagree and let it go...

BTW, wanna race?

guitaraus

Man, I should have taken auto mechanics or something like that in high school...you guys know WAAAY more about engine works than I could ever hope to learn. Props to all of you...you's my heros...

SteVTEC

First off thanks for the compliment

Secondly, lemme clean up your example a bit ;-D

The example you described with the 2.0L 4 making that much torque wouldn't be possible without forced induction. The example I'm going to use is the example I've used to get the 4-cyl Accord boys to shut up when they say that an Accord 5-spd with a Prelude engine would be faster than an Accord 5-spd with the existing V6.

Prelude Engine: H22A, 2.2L DOHC VTEC I4
Peak Power: 200HP @ 7000rpm
Peak Torque: 156 lb-ft @ 5252rpm

Accord V6 Engine: J30A1, 3.0L SOHC VTEC V6
Peak Power: 200HP @ 5700rpm
Peak Torque: 195 lb-ft @ 4700rpm

So both engines have the same peak horsepower, so if you put both in the two of the same cars with the same transmission and everything else was equal except for the engine then which car would be faster??

The answer is the V6 because it has much more low end horsepower. An engine's capability to do work at any instant is determined by how much horsepower (not torque) it's making at a particular RPM. Remember, horsepower is directly calculated from torque and RPM and it's the combination of the two that tell you the performance potential, so horsepower is what you want to look at.



So as you can see, the larger V6 engine has more power throughout the entire RPM range. And assuming the same transmission both would drop down to around 160HP at shifts and then head back up to 200HP. So the larger engine would get a huge jump at the start because of superior low-end power and even though the horsepower ranges would be equal once the revs are up and you're shifting, it would merely be equal then, and the smaller Lude engined car would never recover the ground it loses at the start.

This is the same reason why a Mustang V8 might smoke you guys off the line, but you can still take them on the highway from a roll. The older 4.6's and 5.0's had around 215HP (less than a Max) but had around 285 lb-ft of torque so they had more horsepower down low for much better launches, but about the same or slightly less horsepower up high which is why you can take them from a roll on the highway...

Around town and in everyday driving, yes, a larger displacement engine is of great advantage because of superior low-end HORSEPOWER (because of greater low-end torque). But when you're racing, top-end horsepower is what really counts, but having lots of it at the low-end (from more displacement) still helps too although it's of less importance.

In the real world from the above comparison it turns out that an Accord V6 will beat a Lude off the line, but from a roll they'll take us because they have a damned 5-spd stick available with closer gearing which helps them keep a higher amount of horsepower on tap than our wider (and auto) 4-spd. Around town we'll still smoke 'em though :-D

If only us Accord V6'ers had a damned stick available!!! sigh.... :-)

Xsi

Remember I used to have a japanese B16A....modified and I was getting 180 HP from a 1.6 liter...OK no torque but horsepower is there...only after 5.5K RPM

The reason why this engine was Bullet proof, it's due to is Rod length/ Stroke Ratio of 1.745...the ideal ratio would be 1.75 which is really close..with this ratio (the stroke was short I think it was 77 mm) there will be less cylinder wall wear, so the engine can rev 8K for hours...the only issue is that you have (highly recommended) change the valve spring after 100 K Mile on it)

My friend as a Civic With a Integra GSR engine in it...it's fast 14.5 on 1/4 mile at 98 Mile/H...Type R cam in it...But is engine doesn't like high Rev as much as the B16A due to the Rod / Stroke Ratio of 1.58 which accelerate the wear of cylinder wall and ring...is engine is taking 2 liter of oils every 3000 mile! (mind was taking 1/2 liter Max after 3000 mile)

VTEC is really cool...but not for a daily driven car specialy true for the B16A ... Civic SI 99 and 00, cause like some one esle said, you have to kill the engine to make HP ... I was doing 18 Mpg driving it the way I was...the best I did was 23.8 Mpg....does it give you an idea...

Mustang1999

Not trying to flame here, but that statement is odd since Shing swapped a B16A into his CRX and that is his daily driver. When I drove it, it was fine, plenty of power both up top and down low.. and you don't have to kill the engine to make horsepower.