TurDz

iTrader: (3)

My friend came by my house yesterday, we went out to rent American Pie, since we hadn't seen it yet. On the way there and back, I was trying to compare his ride to mine. There's a huge difference. I know this for sure because he traveled on the road I'm very used to (where all of the bumps are, etc) and the Camry felt very smooth and stable regardless of the road conditions.

I just want to know why that is...is it the independent rear suspension (do they even have that?)

Whoa, update. I just checked toyota.com as I was writing this post, and I discovered the new body of the Camry. Have you seen it yet?? It looks a lot more sporty IMO. (The back resembles the Avalon though) Ok anyway, while I was on the site they have the name "MacPherson" all over their suspension specs. Does this have anything to do with the quality of the ride?

Okay thanks for your time everyone.

Nismo

iTrader: (18)

I believe they have independant rear suspension

NisMoMAX01SE

they make struts and other suspension components.plus the camry is a true family sedan with no sporty feel at all, thats its all docile feeling. no responsiveness at all.

CoolMax

iTrader: (7)

"Nissan hammers on horsepower, while we hammer on the whole car."

I've noticed it too; but if you're modded you should factor that in too.

TarHeelMax

Ford invented the MacPherson strut over fifty years ago. Because the shock is housed inside the coils of the spring, it's a space-saving design favored in most front wheel drive cars whose engines and transmissions are housed in the front. However, MacPherson struts are not the best handlers because during cornering; the wheels' camber changes more than it would with a double-wishbone design, for example.

riggy

this pretty much sumarizes it.......

got rice?

iTrader: (2)

softer spring rate, lower valving on the shocks, less sporty sidewall (softer sidewall) plus smaller wheel so there's more sidewall, etc etc etc.

mzmtg

iTrader: (11)

MacPherson isnt a brand name or a company. Its the name of the design. Technically when used in the rear, they have a different name, I just cant remeber what it is...

Eric L.

I bet most of the people replying to this post have never even driven or ridden in a "4th gen" (97-2001) Camry before.

Yes, the Camry has an excellent ride. My mom has a 99 XLE V6 and the ride is so smooth you wonder what kind of voodoo black magic Toyota has pulled off on this car. It's because the Camry has soft springs and very well damped struts, all mounted on a rubber isolated subframe. It's the same principle that BMW uses to keep their ride comfortable as well. I do not believe the Maxima uses an isolated subframe for the suspension. Our ancient technology rear beam doesn't help either. But even the fronts on my Maxima aren't that smooth, so I think it's just the design of the car.

And for all you Camry haters out there, the Camry doesn't handle that bad. Overall, it is a great compromise between ride and handling. And the steering is much better than my Maxima, firm feel, nice steering wheel, good response. I would say that if a Maxima is a 7.5/10 in handling (more if modded), the Camry is a 7/10. Ridewise, the Camry is 9/10, Maxima 7/10 in stock form (modified, my car would be 5/10).

When all is said and done, yes, the Maxima is more sporty, but not as comfortable as a Camry. The Max is a bit faster, has a nicer interior, but doesn't measure up when it comes to ride, road noise, crash protection, and automatic transmission smoothness (Toyotas have GREAT automatics, shifts are hardly noticeable).

MaxedOut

iTrader: (4)

i agree with u.. my mom has a 97 camry.. and it is everything u said.. but i just cant deal with the REALLY plain interiror and the lack of "sportiness"... i know thats not a word but.. it feel like a car u should be driving when ur 40..

SunMax

iTrader: (2)

That's the same reason I chose the Max over a Camry V6, well, until I saw a modded black Camry on the road. Then I realize it can be "good looking" too.

I have to agree that qualitywise, I think Toyota is better.

matt92gxe

my mom has a 97 camry, it has a really nice smooth ride to it. i like the camry, it would be my 2nd choice after the maxima!!

tmds

I'd disagree with you here. I drove a 1998 Camry LE (4cyl) for three years before upgrading to a 2001 I30t.

Obviously, the Camry's ride was smooth. But contrary to what you say above, I'd characterize its handling as wallowy and SUV-like. When cornering, I really had to baby it, or suffer the consequences of riding out a wobble for 50 feet.

I have not driven a 5th generation Maxima aside from a few test drives, so I cannot remember precisely how it compared. But I know the I30t handles with utmost precision versus the Camry.

My wife's 4th generation Maxima GXE also handles much better than did my old Camry.

Ride wise, I'd agree, that the Camry is high up there. Probably 8/10. But handling wise, the Camry was a miserable 4 or 5/10. I didn't hate the car. I really liked it, but I doubt most drivers would characterize a stock Camry's handling as "good," let alone, "great." I would use the words "sufficient," "tolerable," or "only somewhat irksome."

mAdD MAX

I drove a 2001 Camry CE. While the ride was damn smooth, the handling was crap...honestly..it did not corner to well. The car dives too much! It rides like a Buick. And the steering is sooo light!! It was unbelievable..i thought my Corolla had light steering..but this was soo light.

TurDz

iTrader: (3)

wow, thanks for all of the replies everyone.

I like the idea of the isolated subframe that Eric mentioned. We should submit this idea to Nissan!!

Would that subframe change the Maxima's handling characteristics anyway?


Oh and hey guys, look at toyota.com for the new Camry. Sportier than ever! Looks like a Stratus, hehe.

Black VQ

In the Houston Chronicle, the Wednesday 'Cars and Trucks' section had a feature on the next Camry. The article said that the average age of a Camry owner was 52!! I couldn't believe that. That sounds more like something for Buick, y'know? I thought it was much lower[early to mid 40s]. So that average customer base most likely has something to do with the way the suspension and ride quality are done. Most older people aren't worried about racking up roadkills and taking corners at double the recommended speed. Think of it as a Japanese Buick Le Sabre.

190hpKiLLA

iTrader: (11)

About two month agoI was invited by car&driver, road&track
for a test drive not too from my house. The evnt was called "Ride And Drive Event" With like 20 more poeple at the track we got to test 3 sedans. 2001 stratus, camry, and accord. It was a small acceleration, cornering and stopping course, but it was funn anyway. Camry handled the worst out of the three sedans. It had the biggest body roll and worst steering. brakes didnt work good either but thats maybe because they were already used up. So when we say camrys handling is 7/10 and maxima is 7.5/10 THINK AGAIN!

Zam

Let's see. My family and inlaws are hardcore Toyota & Nissan nuts. My mother-in law has a 96 4 banger Camry and I've got a 96 GXE. If you forget about autocrossing and drag racing the Toyota, it is a pretty sweet ride. The car is very comfortable, quiet and well put together. If I had to choose a car to take my wife and kids out on the town with, I'd roll the Camry. If I wanted to take the back roads for a quick run to my destination, I'd go Max. Maybe it is the 25 year old man in me that's talking, but I'm not always with being in a race car. In my opinion, the Maxima equals sporty and the Camry equals smooth.

On another note, I also felt that the Pathfinder and Xterra, weren't on par with the quiet of the 4Runner. I was excited about the 2000 Pathfinder and its 240hp engine, but it just didn't feel as refined.

I really think Toyota knows how to engineer good QUALITY vehicles. Nissan could learn from Toyota.

Also, what exactly is the average age of a Maxima driver? 21? I bet it is in the 40+ year old range. Matter of fact, my pops (50+), just bought himself a 2001 Maxima. There may be a lot of young-uns on this board, but we represent the minority.

**As a promoter of all import vehicles, I wish ya'll would keep your vehicle bashing to the Domestics.

TurDz

iTrader: (3)

I read somewhere, when I was searching for "Nissan Maxima" on Yahoo I think...that the average age of a Maxima driver is around 45? I dunno...that's what I remember..or it could be around 42.

Anyway, that's also pretty old

TurDz

iTrader: (3)

I think the Maxima's average age is 43-ish. Hehe, pretty old!

dmontzsta

iTrader: (8)

Camry's suck! Maybe it is because his suspension is newer. And yours is older. This guy by my house has a 2k camry V6 and we went threw twisties up in Riverside on Arlington in the hills and I tottally killed that thing man I was banking this one corner doin 110+ and my suspension is 10 years old compared to his 1-2 year old suspension.

CoolMax

iTrader: (7)

btw, Camry's do not SUCK. How much "better" can a Maxima be to make a Camry SUCK?
As far as handling goes: are we compare modded Maxes with modded suspensions/rims to stock Camrys?
Also, please define "sporty." Rough-riding?
Camry drivers are older...Maxima drivers are by no means young; it's generally a grocery-getter driven by women.

Sometimes Maxima boys go too far in flattering themselves.

Enough of my rant...

dmontzsta

iTrader: (8)

You are on a Maxima board talking about how good camrys are to you for one. Like I said I have raced my neighbors 2k camry bone stock and my suspension is bone stock and shot out ta boot it is 10 years old his is 1-2 years old. And he was no match. I dont want to get into all the different reasons why a Maxima is better but I can name atleast 5 right off the bat. It is a Nissan, Stronger Motor, Styling is better inside and out, I beleive the camrys weigh more correct me if I am wrong, and on the 2k Max's and camrys Maxima has available 17" rims camry dont. I am sure so more members can hop in and think of a bunch that I left out.

CoolMax

iTrader: (7)

Originally posted by dmontzmax
"You are on a Maxima board talking about how good camrys are to you for one."

Ok, and so...?

"Like I said I have raced my neighbors 2k camry bone stock and my suspension is bone stock and shot out ta boot it is 10 years old his is 1-2 years old. And he was no match."

What kind of race? Around some neighborhood turns or up and down the driveway?

"I dont want to get into all the different reasons why a Maxima is better but I can name atleast 5 right off the bat. It is a Nissan, Stronger Motor, Styling is better inside and out, I beleive the camrys weigh more correct me if I am wrong, and on the 2k Max's and camrys Maxima has available 17" rims camry dont. I am sure so more members can hop in and think of a bunch that I left out."

1. Wow! You're correct, it's a Nissan, not a BMW. And Nissan is better than Toyota because their sales are a fraction of Toyota's?
2. Stronger motor...plese define stronger. As far as I know, the Camry during the 4th gen reign was producing more power; not the case now. Or stronger in terms of build? Sure, Nissan's VQ is a world-class V6, but it's stronger?
Can you list at least 5 reasons why the Camry is better?
3. While I'll agree...opinions on styling are subjective.
4. Wow, big deal..rims. How many people on this BBS upgrade their wheels? My point it that they are easily changed and not a fair judgement in comparing the capability of the suspension. Put 17"s on both the Camry and Max and then evaluate the function of the *suspension.*

Can you come up with at least 5 reasons that the Camry is better?

My dad's '98 Camry 4-cyl LE (with pitiful 14" rims) takes everyday turns better than my '91 GXE with Eibach/Tokico on 15" alloy rims); of course, at the limit/on the freeway/higher speeds, the Max is much more controlled.

Lordrandall

iTrader: (4)

I've owned 3 domestics and two imports, and I have to say that each vehicle was great. I don't know why you guys can't just appreciate each vehicle for what it is.

Jeff92se

iTrader: (82)

Lordy, I met Zam. Very nice guy. I think he's 1/2 kidding/serious about the domestic thing.

I had a XR4TI once and I thought it was built very good(built in Germany, Ford). But I don't equate that one to = all domestics. I mean take one look at Consumer Reports reliabity on most domestics and it's pretty bad. The Firebird? :shutter:

Lordrandall

iTrader: (4)

It's all good Jeff. It was more of a general statement than a flame/attack on Zam. After reading it again it does seem to be more poking fun than serious, but you know me, I have to defend our downtrodden American steel.

Eric L.

Were they 4-cyl, or V6 Camry's? Also, did you realize that they the event was meant to showcase the Stratus? So of course they would pick an inferior Camry model to test it against.

When I drove the 2k Accord and 2k Maxima (EX and GLE) back to back at Edmunds live through the small track, the Accord handled better than the Maxima, but since I am used to the Maxima I was able to push it faster through the course.

It's tough to compare Camry with Maxima on the track. It's in the real world that the Camry really shines as a comfortable car. I find that taking bumpy corners in the Camry is much much easier than in my Maxima (where the bumps rattle car to death). So while on the track the Camry might not be that impressive, in the real world it is a solid car with handling that loses little to a Maxima 99% of the time. If you are going to be barrelling down canyon roads at twice the speed limit, then yes the Maxima has better handling. But in everyday driving, the Camry's advantages in ride, comfort, and solid feel are acceptable tradeoffs to the Maxima's slightly more sporting, but rougher edged, nature. We have a 97 Maxima (mine) and a 99 Camry XLE V6 in my household, and I must say that both cars are very evenly matched.

Remember that handling specs are not all that determines a good car. There are some intangibles (build quality, solid feel, GOOD chip resistant paint) that make some cars stand out among others.

Eric L.

Hmmm...let me see....Nissan...lower resale value, lower build quality, and paint that pits from the wind resistance...I guess that makes it better than Toyota huh?

The last time I heard...your Maxima makes 190hp, 190lb/ft torque. A 2k Camry makes 192hp, 207lb/ft. torque (in CA spec, +2 in each for Fed spec). So, how does Nissan make MORE power? Oh, unless you are comparing against the new Maxima, but from what you wrote you are comparing a 2k Camry with your car.

Vehicle weight can be compensated for by good suspension. A BMW 5-series is smaller in size, but weighs more than a Maxima, yet can run circles around a Maxima.

Edmunds.com compared the handling of a 2k SE with 17's to that of a GXE with 16's. Guess what...the GXE outslalomed the SE. So, wider wheels don't always mean better handling. It is the combination of suspension, tires, and steering that makes a car handle well.

It may sound that I am flaming you. I am not. I am merely pointing out inconsistencies in your argument. The Maxima is a wonderful car, but just remember there are many other fine sedans out there.

mAdD MAX

Pros/Cons about Camry::

It's an excellent commuter car. It's generic and pleases the whole crowd, which is why its so popular. Its sales number speaks for itself. However, its a car that gets you from point A to point B in the least amount of fuss. Its more of an appliance really.

Regarding build quality, I find it to be the same as the Maxima (atleast my Maxima). Many of you complain about rattles in a 4th gen (especially Bill99GXE), however I don't seem to find any of these rattles on my 99 GLE. Maybe cause mine is a GLE. The ride is whisper quiet and smooth. Many people who have ridden in the car say its damn smooth and quiet. You can't hear the engine at idle. Much like a Camry.

The only downfall of the Maxima is the auto. The Camry has firm, yet smooth upshifts. I don't know how it kicks down, but it doesn't have the rush that the VQ provides me when that kickdowns. However the Maxima comes in a 5-spd, which the V6 Camry doesn't (atleast not fully loaded). This is one reason why some people buy Maximas also.

The Maxima has one thing the Camry doesn't...the fun factor. The smile I get when driving the Maxima (driving anywhere, not only country roads) does not come when driving a Camry. However not everyone wants a fun 4-door sedan, hence the choice for the Camry. Many people who have a Camry probably have a fun little 2-door roadster or something...those of us that can't afford one choose a nice compromise, the Maxima.

All in all, both are nice cars, which to some, serve a different purpose.

Now the Accord vs Camry, that's a hard one!

CoolMax

iTrader: (7)

I hope it sounds like I'm flaming him...because I am. So where is he now? Where are all the guys to back him up?

Eric L.

I think they are busy installing alteezas and "NISMO" and "GTR" emblems on their Maxima. heh

dmontzsta

iTrader: (8)

Now if you want more lets start comparing new for new 2k2 Max vs. 2k2 Camry oh wait that is no match now we have to compare the 2k2 altima to the 2k2 camry which the altima runs all over the camry.

1. Wow! You're correct, it's a Nissan, not a BMW. And Nissan is better than Toyota because their sales are a fraction of Toyota's? Sales dont mean jack well it shows that toyota is selling cheaper product people buy it because it is cheaper.But the Maxima is more expensive because it is quatlity.
2. Stronger motor...Yes,The camry had 4 more HP than the Maxima whooooo...But the Maxima had I beleive correct me if I am wrong 26 more ft lbs of torque.I dont know if the camry is OHC but the 4 bangers certainly are no match.
3. While I'll agree...opinions on styling are subjective.
4. Wow, big deal..rims. How many people on this BBS upgrade their wheels? True, But you were comparing stock for stock.

Can you come up with at least 5 reasons that the Camry is better? No Because it isnt.

My dad's '98 Camry 4-cyl LE (with pitiful 14" rims) takes everyday turns better than my '91 GXE with Eibach/Tokico on 15" alloy rims); of course, at the limit/on the freeway/higher speeds, the Max is much more controlled. [/B][/QUOTE]

Eric L.

[/B][/QUOTE]


Ah, why are you even comparing 2k2 cars? Your original post was saying how your 10 year old Maxima is way better than a 2k Camry. You said "Maxima is better in this and that" and those of us who have owned Camry's (but now drive Maximas) just wanted to set the facts straight.

Plus, your horsepower numbers are off comparing camry and maxima. The values are as follows:

Maxima:
3rd gen VG - 160hp, 181 lb/ft
3rd gen VE - 190hp, 190 lb/ft
4th gen VQ - 190hp, 205 lb/ft
5th gen VQ - 222hp, 217 lb/ft
5th (2k2) gen 3.5L VQ - 255hp, 246lb/ft

Camry:
3rd gen iron block V6 - 185hp, 188 lb/ft
3rd gen alumimum V6 - 188hp, not sure about the torque
4th gen V6 - 192hp (194 non CA), 207 lb/ft (209 non CA)
5th (2k2) gen V6 - same as 4th gen


Regarding quality of cars. The Camry is a SOLID car....no rattles, silent ride, no harshness whatsoever. Trim doesn't fall apart either. Compared with my 97 Maxima, our 99 Camry is much much better put together. It may look cheap but everything is well built and functions with precision.

Most Maxima owners here who have owned Camry in the past will agree that the Camry is better in terms of build quality.

In the future, before you go flaming other cars, please do some research and come armed with facts, not opinions.

dmontzsta

iTrader: (8)

I will flame any car I like...Look at the HP ratings you can see Maxima is clearly the dominate car...If you want a camry go buy one and stop bosting about how much you love camrys on a Maxima board.Sheeeez

TurDz

iTrader: (3)

Wow! I never thought my thread would get this intense!

Since I started this thread, I should finish it.

The Camry is a very nice car. Personally, 4th Gen Maximas and the 97+ Camrys are practically the SAME. Really. I was driving my friend's 97 XLE V6 today, on the freeway, and on the streets. Very nice on moderate turns and such, not too good on the freeway

Someone mentioned fun factor on the Maxima. That's the only major difference. The way the Maxima looks (I like the back of my 96 BTW, nice spaced out letters ), how the Maxima looks with aftermarket wheels, the beautiful interior, and the beautiful engine bay!!

The Camry really is a family car...The engine bay isn't nearly as nice as a 4th or 5th Gen, but to most people, that doesn't matter. The Camry's target consumers are families, and bascially the whole middle class majority of everyday drivers.

The Maxima is a slight alternative, with a sportier touch, and while not match the Camry's ultimate refinements, it still holds its on.

I don't know if I made any sense but it was worth a try.


BTW, I had this thread going before I had the chance to drive my friend's Camry. So I was observing very carefully, the different characteristics of the Camry to that of the Maxima. Basically, it has a smoother ride, with a quieter interior (to that of the 95-97).

But hey, do any of you remember my thread of wind noise near the A pillars? I found out the Carmy has that too!! LOL

Eric L.

If you haven't read, we already own a camry in my household. I enjoy driving my Maxima, but I just wanted to keep the comparisons FAIR over here so as not judge cars for what they are not. You say Camry sucks because of this and that....I say that I have driven a Camry extensively and it is a great car. It is not as different from a Maxima as you would think or that the people on this obviously Maxima biased BBS would have you believe.

So you can go on burning Camrys in your 92 Maxima. That's fine with me. But don't go saying how Camry's suck because they don't have the handling of a Maxima. Like I said, there are other intangibles such as build quality that determine whether a car is right for a certain kind of person. Just because a Camry driver trades a little bit of cornering performance for ride comfort does not make the Camry an inferior car, nor does it suggest that the driver is making a stupid decision.

dmontzsta

iTrader: (8)

Zam

I hear you bro. I've had my **** handed to me plenty of times by good ol' American made vehicles. One of the low points in my life was being beaten repeatedly by a 1998 V8 Cherokee. I was hoping to squash this idea that the Maxima was the pinnacle of vehicle design and that all other competitors are merely shadows of its Maximaness. Hopefully I didn't rub you or anyone else the wrong way.

Jeff92SE: You are too kind.

Dmontzmax: Not to flame you, but the 3rd gen Maxima is well known for its excellent suspension and drop dead good looks. Your car is also smaller and thus more nimble than the mid-size Camry. It isn't really fair to compare a 3rd gen to the larger Toyota. Dump the VQ into a Camry and you've got a d@mn good vehicle. From the flow of this thread, no one is arguing that the Maxima isn't better in some respects. You've just got to realize that the Camry is also better in some respects. Unfortunately for Nissan, the excellent build quality, quietness and resale value are what keeps those cars outselling Maximas.

Zam

gLok

It depends what you mean by fully loaded. My 5 speed v6 camry came with 6 speaker cd/tape stereo, front/passenger/side airbags, alloy rims, power seats, power everything else. The XLE only has leather, sunroof and a slightly better stereo, two things i didnt want and one i'll be replacing anyways. I only regret not getting the CE model since its 100 lbs lighter than my LE.

First off i wouldnt want either a camry or maxima if they didnt come with 5 speed V6 versions. I would have gotten an accord if the choice was an auto v6, but thats just me.

The maxima is a better car for performance. My car is very tuner unfriendly and im going through a lot of crap to even do nitrous. I picked the camry for a few reasons, sometimes i regret it and sometimes i dont. One thing that enticed me was the option of a dealer installed supercharger (although i wont even be going that route now). I also like having a car most people dont even know exists, its rare.

As far as build quality... My friend has a 4th gen 5 speed maxima and its had its fair share of problems. My car has been far from perfect also but its solid. People always talk about squeeks and rattles or poor dependability but thats a small percentage of cars. You hear about the bad more often than the good cause people dont b1tch about how good their car is as much as they do if it has a problem.

Also...You guys say camrys dont handle in stock form which is true, but modded i think its just as good if not better than a maxima. I can spank my friend through turns but thats mostly cause hes a crappy driver The cars definetly tuned for granny a$$ in stock form with balloons for tires but a few TRD mods here and there and its just fine. My big ole family sedan hangs with my friends modified civics. Once again probably the drivers that equal things out.