I ask this because I have a very weird question about it... is it even thaaat big a deal? Believe me, my mom had an 07 passat 2.0 turbo(car I learned to drive on), and my best friend has a 2006 GTI 2.0turbo, stage 2 software(car I learned to drive manual). When hes like ''yo, you feel that boost?'' I'm like yeah... but honestly I feel nothing. And to be completely honest, my car (98 SE) is faster than his with just a full exhaust. I'm getting a new car very soon; its time to move on from automatic to a 6speed. I'm faced with either getting a stock turbo'd german car, or an 02 maxima 6MT. I wouldn't mind paying less for a gti and paying the difference in price from the 02 max on upgraded software and a catback. I'm most likely going to hold out for a 2nd maxima, because I truely think that their incredible cars, but eitherway, what are your comments on turbo? Do you feel completely the same/different?

 

i guess it depends on the turbo size/other mods.. stock size turbo on some cars is not really a big deal

 

yea i do know that the turbo on the gti is a ko3 and thats relatively small

 

it CAN be a "big deal". the turbo car your mom has isnt rated at much higher hp/tq numbers as even a 4th gen. but with any turbocharged vehicle the potential is there and they respond well to mods. as with any car, you just have to unleash it.

 

drive a turbo Z. you will feel it.

 

A stock turbo VW has 200 hp, an aftermarket turbo'd Maxima has almost double that. Yes turbo is a big deal but compare apples to apples not to oranges as they say.

 

what about a stock turbo SRT skittle?

 

Okay, I knew it was a stupid question. I didn't take into play that both cars I experienced were just little vw ko3 turbos. I definitely plan on looking into boosting my 5.5 gen when I get it since I plan to have it for a while. thanks guys

 

Ive driven my friends passat 2.0turbo and its a slow car. The turbo lag is ridiculous and theres barley any boost. I have also driven my boss's Audi S6 with a biturbo v10... when the boost in THAT car kicked in.... you were gone. He now has a Audi S8 with the same biturbo setup, that car again, you feel the boost.

It all depends on the car and the turbo setup.

 

apple to apples, compare your car to a 3.0 turbo car. A turbo will make a motor think its beigger than it is. but a stock 2.0T is only gonna be close to a VQ30. Drive an audi biturbo with 2.7 or 2.8.

 

nope.

 

the turbo on the VW's are very small indeed as another member just pointed out and IMHO gives a very poor turbo experience.
on the other hand, EVO's, STI's, mazdaspeed 6, srt-4's provide a very good turbocharger experience that will make you change your mind about turbochargers.

 

+1 on those. One ride in a "Tuner's Paradise" S4 and you are hooked.

 

It all depends. It doesn't make much sense comparing a stock turbo VW to a turboed Max. Why? b/c I'm sure you'll upgrade the turbo on the VW if you were to get it. tookrzy said it best, sometimes stock turbos are eh. (though many newer turbo cars are closing the gap)

When I first got my DSM, it wasn't even faster than my 3.0 now, but I upgraded the turbo/exhaust etc. and it's by far and wide faster than the 210hp it came with would suggest.

 

 

What's a turbo

 

That's kind of a self-conflicting statement.

 

Drove a twin-turbo RX7 we had at work as a demo back before they turned the RX into an oddly-shaped sedan...man, what a blast! As long as you kept your foot in it (and didn't blow any shifts) you really felt the sequential turbos boot you in the a$$!

 

Yeah, it's a HUGE difference, as long as you look at the right cars. It sounds like your experience is with small engines + low-boost turbos on economy cars (e.g. the 2.0 passat you mention). These are underwhelming as they usually take a heavy car with a very anemic base ~160-180hp 4cyl to 200-220hp. In other words, they go from boring to "just a little bit less" boring. Your larger displacement NA maxima engine will be a lot more fun than these..

Once you get a small engine with a LOT of boost (e.g. a lancer, evo, etc.), -OR- a larger engine with boost it's a whole different ballgame.

I went from a 2000 Maxima SE to a 335i sport (BMW 3L straight6 with parallel twin Mitsubishi turbos). It's an entirely different level of performance. 0-60 in 4.8 seconds stock, and < ~$700 in mods will bring it down close to 4 seconds!

The power delivery is also unbelievably smooth. IMHO, much smoother than even the smooth VQ30DE engine we all know. The boost is electronically controlled by a load-target level, so the torque curve is essentially flat on the dynos I've seen, and you get MASSIVE quantities of it even at low RPM. You put your foot down in any gear at any RPM and it always goes like you just sat on a wasp (vs. the NA V8 in the e92 M3 which is more powerful stock, but you have to really flog in order to enjoy driving around town).

 

The question is pretty well answered. I went from my 99 5-speed with DEK and pretty much every bolt on, to a 04 wrx that is only stage 1 (computer reflash, no bolt ons). Im not building the car for straight line acceleration, but its already marginally faster than the max ever was.

 

I prefer N/A engines generally, at least in large cars where the weight isn't a concern for large N/A blocks. For smaller cars, turbo is the way to do. My 2.5L is putting down a very safe 255whp/280wtq (equates to ~290hp/320tq at the crank, more or less) on the dyno on a stock block, stock turbo, and very mild stage 1 tune - and NO other engine mods.....and even with AWD still getting better fuel economy than my VQ30DE-K Maxima ever did.

It's all about what kind of car and what kind of driving you do. Of course a 2.0T Passat is going to be a pig...

That is the advantage with FI: easy power, lighter weight.

The downsides of course are turbo lag (more or less depending on setup), the need to use Premium fuel (in most cases for performance cars), and more parts to go bad....

 

For a stock application like the one you experienced, the goal was fuel efficency and logevity of drivetrain/engine as opposed to raw power.

When using a turbo you gotta consider what you want out of the car as well. High spool with large HP numbers... low spool with a broader power band.

If you combine the right engine with the right turbo you will feel it..

 

I had a 05' Subaru Legacy GT that I lightly modded with a Cobb Accessport, UP, DP and catback along with a custom TDR map that really brought the boost on at lower rpm's so it made for really entertaining driving. So, one advantage of turbo is the ease of modification to extract more horsepower. So if you like to tweak, a turbo can be very rewarding.

However if I was not going to do any tuning, I'd take the V6 in my Maxima every time over the turbo 4. Generally N/A is more responsive through the entire rev range and easier to modulate and smoother overall.

Now I have never driven a high end turbo car, like the GTR or a Turbo Porsche so I cannot comment on their power delivery versus a N/A motor.

 

To expand on my previous post, one thing that you will notice is that the power delivery of a modern well-designed turbo solution (e.g. the BMW N54, I mentioned in a previous post) is *very* different from both large NA engines and smaller v4 turbo cars.


Here is the dyno from a stock Mitsu EVO. This is a smaller engine with a LOT of boost. This is what people typically first think of when you say "turbo"!

You will notice that power is essentially nonexistant below 3k rpm (like < 100lb-ft torque). Shortly after torque hits a peak and starts dropping. HP levels off at about 5k rpm. So when you are stopped or just cruising around town (~800-2000rpm) there is a very perceptible "lag" UNTIL your engine spins up to about 3000rpm. You go from virtually no torque to almost max torque right around 3krpm!


Now for comparison look at the N54 (a much larger engine with smaller parallel turbos)


You have a respectable amount of torque in the 1-2k RPM range, and from 2k RPM to 5k rpm it's essentially flat. This means that when you hit the gas from a stop or while cruising around there is little if any perceptible change in torque. You are pretty much at the peak immediately.


Finally, here is a dyno from an E92 M3 (an NA v-8)


It is undoubtedly more powerful than any of the cars above, but makes peak HP at 8k rpm. The much smaller N54 actually makes MORE torque between 2-5k rpm. From personal experience having driven both for a while, the M3 is a god-like track car and definitely faster... but it actually "feels" slower in daily driving around town than the N54's. You have to flog the car, almost reaching redline between shifts to get the benefit of the large NA over the turbo.

 

I can tell you one thing if you do boost your 5.5 you will feel the turbo, for sure.

 

YEAH! boost it and tell us the difference you feel...

 

As a Turbo Z owner, I can't agree more

 

.....looks like thats the dyno sheet for an viii. the IX's put down between 260-270 and the X's slightly higher.

 

Never owed one but drove the stock 2010 335i for a couple of hours and was just gone back streets, highway, red light to red light damn near hitting a 100 that was a nice car and you can get a Performace Chip for like 800 Bucks or less and gives you like 60-100more ponies, depening on the stage you want...

 

Boost is fun. Have a customer with a twin turbo Ford GT making around 1000 hp. Absolutely insane rate of acceleration. We went from 50-160 in about 8 seconds and his car at 160 pulls harder than mine at 20. He did the Texas Mile in March last year and hit 224, about 20 mph more than a Bugatti Veyron does...and a Veyron is a legitimate bone stock 10 second car.

Engine is apart now, owner wants 1400-1500 hp and 235-240 in the Texas Mile this fall.

 

Yup, definitely an awesome engine. Tuning is plug and play. Don't even need to pop the hood, you can do it all via software & the Cobb Accessport (~$700). Plug accessport into OBD2 port, hit program, select appropriate octane map, and enjoy the extra horsepower. There are videos of tuned 335's doing 0-60 in 3.8 seconds and N54's with aftermarket turbos are pushing 500whp!

 

My brother has an '08 335, absolutely loves it. Definitely a quick car. I'd need the typical bolt-ons (headers, spacers, intake, exhaust) and a really good launch to hang with him, then all he has to do is chip it to blow me away again.

Of course, his car was double the price of mine new...

 

Turbo? Oh, thats the replacement for displacement.

I read Ford Probe GT, 1000 hp, 224 mph, and just about went cross eyed.

 

Nope, Ford GT.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3JHAcC-8jqQ

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a_yH6G4Y7sM

This was done legally in Mexico, I swear...NSFW music first 30 seconds, after that all engine music!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4y2FtGtnVWY

If the 2nd and 3rd videos violate forum rules, let me know and I'll remove them.

 

Just do a google search for probezilla and you will see a 1000hp probe. It won't see 224mph though.

 

There was a mid 90s Saturn sedan running around that was running a ton of boost and stomping 4th gen Camaros, type in saturn vs camaro in youtube search.

My brother had a 1987 626 GT that had a turbo'ed 2.0 that was quite quick for the time, high 15s at 90 mph when most small sedans were lucky to run high 17s at 78 or so.

So many boosted sleepers out there.

 

If you want boost go with a Subaru, they are pricey though.
But the difference between a turbo'd engine and a naturally aspirated engine is that the turbo pushes the engine past 100% efficiency. So for example a 2.0L turbo may act like a 2.4L. IMO just get the one with the most Power/Torque, then u can upgrade it for more power.

 

Id rather go with a Evo the Subaru's are cool but the Boxster Engine with a Exhaust that **** is loud a guy where I live has one I start my car a little loud till idles normal he starts his I be like Damnn...Rather the 335i quiet and powerful...

 

The 335i is a very nice car to drive... My cousin has 2006 modified M5, he recently put a chip on his wife 335i and on the 0-100Km she could have a half car lead on him but between 100km and 200km+ that's another story, he blew her like it's not fun anymore. lol

 

If you don't want a loud suby they do make a quiet aftermarket exhaust for it.

If you don't like the rumble get equal length headers.