R U READY, 2k2 DYNO with and without Franken Intake
01-05-2002, 10:59 PM
#81
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Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Ft. Sask. AB Canada
Posts: 166
Originally posted by Nismo87SE
The dyno machine is correct because it is directly getting the rpm from the coil. Its just that your tach is off by 200-300rpm. I think the cars hit fuel cut around 6600-6700rpm, so the tach will read in the 6900-7100rpm range.
The dyno machine is correct because it is directly getting the rpm from the coil. Its just that your tach is off by 200-300rpm. I think the cars hit fuel cut around 6600-6700rpm, so the tach will read in the 6900-7100rpm range.
01-05-2002, 11:49 PM
#82
Originally posted by Stereodude
Run it until you hit the fuel cut. And as I detailed a few pages back there is a significant difference. An Auto 2k2 has 255HP at the crank. I highly doubt that the 6 speed has less power than the auto.
Stereodude
Run it until you hit the fuel cut. And as I detailed a few pages back there is a significant difference. An Auto 2k2 has 255HP at the crank. I highly doubt that the 6 speed has less power than the auto.
Stereodude
Steve, I am very interested in the semi Y-pipe sectioned you mentioned. Do you have any idea when this may become available?
01-06-2002, 05:50 AM
#83
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Originally posted by emax95
Bad idea, if you hit the fuel cut off the car goes into limp mode. I learned this first hand the hard way.
Steve, I am very interested in the semi Y-pipe sectioned you mentioned. Do you have any idea when this may become available?
Bad idea, if you hit the fuel cut off the car goes into limp mode. I learned this first hand the hard way.
Steve, I am very interested in the semi Y-pipe sectioned you mentioned. Do you have any idea when this may become available?
01-06-2002, 06:33 AM
#84
Really? Is that different from the rev limiter? When i did my dyno i asked them to keep going until it would bounce back.
I drove off the dyno without a hitch.
I drove off the dyno without a hitch.
Originally posted by emax95
Bad idea, if you hit the fuel cut off the car goes into limp mode. I learned this first hand the hard way.
Steve, I am very interested in the semi Y-pipe sectioned you mentioned. Do you have any idea when this may become available?
Bad idea, if you hit the fuel cut off the car goes into limp mode. I learned this first hand the hard way.
Steve, I am very interested in the semi Y-pipe sectioned you mentioned. Do you have any idea when this may become available?
01-06-2002, 08:27 AM
#85
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Join Date: Apr 2001
Posts: 4,154
good job on the dyno, but you guys gotta remember something about drivetrain loss: it varies per individual car. The only way to test HP/torque and get a true rating is to do an engine-only dyno; no drivetrain loss numbers are set in stone. Remember, Deezo got some good numbers on his stock auto. These power loss and HP ratings really vary per car. I also have a theory about 4th gens and hp/tq, but I'll save that for another time.
01-06-2002, 09:02 AM
#86
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Join Date: Aug 2001
Posts: 1,362
There was another thread where someone photo shopped the two dyno charts together for easy comparison, but I can't seem to find it now 
Any way - While there is a definate increase in power across most of the power band, it looks like there are two signifiant dips in the power curve at 4.5k RPM and 6.25k RPM with the Franken intake.
Are these dips noticable while driving? Is there any way to 'tune' them out, or are they inherent in an aftermarket intake? Would you expect similer gains on a 4th Gen? Would you say the overall gains are worth the two small dips?
Any way - While there is a definate increase in power across most of the power band, it looks like there are two signifiant dips in the power curve at 4.5k RPM and 6.25k RPM with the Franken intake.
Are these dips noticable while driving? Is there any way to 'tune' them out, or are they inherent in an aftermarket intake? Would you expect similer gains on a 4th Gen? Would you say the overall gains are worth the two small dips?
01-06-2002, 09:13 AM
#87
Originally posted by Lime
good job on the dyno, but you guys gotta remember something about drivetrain loss: it varies per individual car. The only way to test HP/torque and get a true rating is to do an engine-only dyno; no drivetrain loss numbers are set in stone. Remember, Deezo got some good numbers on his stock auto. These power loss and HP ratings really vary per car. I also have a theory about 4th gens and hp/tq, but I'll save that for another time.
good job on the dyno, but you guys gotta remember something about drivetrain loss: it varies per individual car. The only way to test HP/torque and get a true rating is to do an engine-only dyno; no drivetrain loss numbers are set in stone. Remember, Deezo got some good numbers on his stock auto. These power loss and HP ratings really vary per car. I also have a theory about 4th gens and hp/tq, but I'll save that for another time.
01-06-2002, 09:29 AM
#89
Originally posted by Lime
sorry I just meant 1/4 times at this point. I was just saying that every individual car is different.
sorry I just meant 1/4 times at this point. I was just saying that every individual car is different.
01-06-2002, 10:30 AM
#96
Not DAVEB the parts guy
Join Date: Aug 2000
Posts: 8,555
After looking closely at the STOCK dynos of the Altima vs the Maxima, it's pretty easy to see these cars produce nearly the same hp and tq. DMBMaxima makes 204fwhp and 225fwtq and the Altima makes 200fwhp and 219fwtq. Sorry fellas, both of these cars were dynoed on different days and on different machines. I've said this numerous times before, all Dynojet 248s read a little differently therefore you need to dyno ON THE SAME MACHINE to develop a true comparsion between two cars. That miniscul 2% difference in power.....2%!!!!....can EASILY be attributed to a difference in machines and runs done on different days. It should also be noted that the Altima was dynoed with only 1500miles. I don't know what DMBMaxima's mileage was at the time. On the track, the Maxima vs Altima will clearly come down to driver.
Another thing we can see from the dynos is the fact that shifting at 6000+rpms is completely pointless. Again, like I've said before, these 3.5 VQ behaves very much like the 4ht gen VQ. It's not a high winding motor. You can choose to shift your 2002 at redline, but you'll be slower. The shift points should be more like this:
1-2 6200
2-3 6000
3-4 5800
As for the auto 2002s dynos. Sorry, you can't compare a auto dyno to a manual dyno. Automatic dynos need to be done 3rd. You also have to take into account torque converter slippage and torque converter mulitplication. You guys are alos very wrong in assuming the Nissan auto looses 25%. No auto is that inefficent. 25% is more along the lines of AWD. Most autos loose ~18-20%. Some autos are extremely efficent. A good example would be GMs 4L60E used in turcks/Corvette/F-Body. These autos only loose 15%.
Dave
Another thing we can see from the dynos is the fact that shifting at 6000+rpms is completely pointless. Again, like I've said before, these 3.5 VQ behaves very much like the 4ht gen VQ. It's not a high winding motor. You can choose to shift your 2002 at redline, but you'll be slower. The shift points should be more like this:
1-2 6200
2-3 6000
3-4 5800
As for the auto 2002s dynos. Sorry, you can't compare a auto dyno to a manual dyno. Automatic dynos need to be done 3rd. You also have to take into account torque converter slippage and torque converter mulitplication. You guys are alos very wrong in assuming the Nissan auto looses 25%. No auto is that inefficent. 25% is more along the lines of AWD. Most autos loose ~18-20%. Some autos are extremely efficent. A good example would be GMs 4L60E used in turcks/Corvette/F-Body. These autos only loose 15%.
Dave
01-06-2002, 10:48 AM
#98
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Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Detroit Metro Area
Posts: 1,617
Originally posted by Dave B
After looking closely at the STOCK dynos of the Altima vs the Maxima, it's pretty easy to see these cars produce nearly the same hp and tq. DMBMaxima makes 204fwhp and 225fwtq and the Altima makes 200fwhp and 219fwtq. Sorry fellas, both of these cars were dynoed on different days and on different machines. I've said this numerous times before, all Dynojet 248s read a little differently therefore you need to dyno ON THE SAME MACHINE to develop a true comparsion between two cars. That miniscul 2% difference in power.....2%!!!!....can EASILY be attributed to a difference in machines and runs done on different days. It should also be noted that the Altima was dynoed with only 1500miles. I don't know what DMBMaxima's mileage was at the time. On the track, the Maxima vs Altima will clearly come down to driver.
Another thing we can see from the dynos is the fact that shifting at 6000+rpms is completely pointless. Again, like I've said before, these 3.5 VQ behaves very much like the 4ht gen VQ. It's not a high winding motor. You can choose to shift your 2002 at redline, but you'll be slower. The shift points should be more like this:
1-2 6200
2-3 6000
3-4 5800
As for the auto 2002s dynos. Sorry, you can't compare a auto dyno to a manual dyno. Automatic dynos need to be done 3rd. You also have to take into account torque converter slippage and torque converter mulitplication. You guys are alos very wrong in assuming the Nissan auto looses 25%. No auto is that inefficent. 25% is more along the lines of AWD. Most autos loose ~18-20%. Some autos are extremely efficent. A good example would be GMs 4L60E used in turcks/Corvette/F-Body. These autos only loose 15%.
Dave
After looking closely at the STOCK dynos of the Altima vs the Maxima, it's pretty easy to see these cars produce nearly the same hp and tq. DMBMaxima makes 204fwhp and 225fwtq and the Altima makes 200fwhp and 219fwtq. Sorry fellas, both of these cars were dynoed on different days and on different machines. I've said this numerous times before, all Dynojet 248s read a little differently therefore you need to dyno ON THE SAME MACHINE to develop a true comparsion between two cars. That miniscul 2% difference in power.....2%!!!!....can EASILY be attributed to a difference in machines and runs done on different days. It should also be noted that the Altima was dynoed with only 1500miles. I don't know what DMBMaxima's mileage was at the time. On the track, the Maxima vs Altima will clearly come down to driver.
Another thing we can see from the dynos is the fact that shifting at 6000+rpms is completely pointless. Again, like I've said before, these 3.5 VQ behaves very much like the 4ht gen VQ. It's not a high winding motor. You can choose to shift your 2002 at redline, but you'll be slower. The shift points should be more like this:
1-2 6200
2-3 6000
3-4 5800
As for the auto 2002s dynos. Sorry, you can't compare a auto dyno to a manual dyno. Automatic dynos need to be done 3rd. You also have to take into account torque converter slippage and torque converter mulitplication. You guys are alos very wrong in assuming the Nissan auto looses 25%. No auto is that inefficent. 25% is more along the lines of AWD. Most autos loose ~18-20%. Some autos are extremely efficent. A good example would be GMs 4L60E used in turcks/Corvette/F-Body. These autos only loose 15%.
Dave
If both cars dyno'd so they had 255HP at the crank that would be one thing. Nissan can't get in trouble for having more power than they advertise, but they can get in trouble for not having as much as they advertise. You're contention is clearly that they both have 240HP. I highly doubt Nissan is stupid enough to over-rate the Maxima and open themselves up to recalls and lawsuits.
How can both cars have the same amount of power when they have different compression ratios, different exhausts, and different intakes?
Why can't you just admit that Nissan isn't lying?
Stereodude
01-06-2002, 12:21 PM
#104
Not DAVEB the parts guy
Join Date: Aug 2000
Posts: 8,555
Originally posted by Stereodude
If both cars dyno'd so they had 255HP at the crank that would be one thing. Nissan can't get in trouble for having more power than they advertise, but they can get in trouble for not having as much as they advertise. You're contention is clearly that they both have 240HP. I highly doubt Nissan is stupid enough to over-rate the Maxima and open themselves up to recalls and lawsuits.
How can both cars have the same amount of power when they have different compression ratios, different exhausts, and different intakes?
Why can't you just admit that Nissan isn't lying?
Stereodude
If both cars dyno'd so they had 255HP at the crank that would be one thing. Nissan can't get in trouble for having more power than they advertise, but they can get in trouble for not having as much as they advertise. You're contention is clearly that they both have 240HP. I highly doubt Nissan is stupid enough to over-rate the Maxima and open themselves up to recalls and lawsuits.
How can both cars have the same amount of power when they have different compression ratios, different exhausts, and different intakes?
Why can't you just admit that Nissan isn't lying?
Stereodude
You really need to go back and look up the stats in the Maxima and Altima 3.5 VQs. As specified by Nissan, they both have variable intakes, VTC, and the same compression ratio. The only difference is the exhaust system. The Maxima uses a single muffler and the ALtima uses a fake dual exhaust. If you truely believe Nissan in that the "variable" flow muffler is responsible for any type of power increase, I've got some beachfront property to sell you in Idaho. Dyno results have proven the variable capacity muffler is worth about 1hp. It may work on the super breathing twin-turbo Skyline GT-R, but it does little on a NA 3.0-3.5 V6 that flows half the air the Skyline does.
Dave
01-06-2002, 12:24 PM
#105
Not DAVEB the parts guy
Join Date: Aug 2000
Posts: 8,555
Originally posted by deezo
Now the thread is going to hell. Aren't Steve's test to power advantages with his new intake and without?
Now the thread is going to hell. Aren't Steve's test to power advantages with his new intake and without?
Dave
01-06-2002, 12:31 PM
#106
I dont get this, you've seen the dyno charts and the video, but you still find a reason to babble about if it works or not. Steve is doing a great job making this intake and it giving you more power(i think) then the rest. So stop bugging out about it, you know it gives more just let the numbers lie and stop fronting(ghettoness)
Steve is doing a great job making this intake and it giving you more power(i think) then the rest. So stop bugging out about it, you know it gives more just let the numbers lie and stop fronting(ghettoness)
01-06-2002, 02:24 PM
#108
Re: Re: Re: Re: I told you so!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Originally posted by Stereodude
All autos are about 25%. Where have you been? That is standard fare for a auto. AWD is a lot more than 25%. The 5th gen auto loses about 25%. Are you living in denial or something?
Stereodude
All autos are about 25%. Where have you been? That is standard fare for a auto. AWD is a lot more than 25%. The 5th gen auto loses about 25%. Are you living in denial or something?
Stereodude
01-06-2002, 02:27 PM
#109
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thanks for bringing this back on track. it looks like im gonna have ot order way more k/n filters and have more apadters machined. i still need a 2k1 to proto type on. it won't take long SOMEONE HELP. FREE INTAKE FOR HELPING.
01-06-2002, 02:35 PM
#111
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Join Date: Mar 2001
Posts: 3,373
Originally posted by dmbmaxima88
thanks for bringing this back on track. it looks like im gonna have ot order way more k/n filters and have more apadters machined. i still need a 2k1 to proto type on. it won't take long SOMEONE HELP. FREE INTAKE FOR HELPING.
thanks for bringing this back on track. it looks like im gonna have ot order way more k/n filters and have more apadters machined. i still need a 2k1 to proto type on. it won't take long SOMEONE HELP. FREE INTAKE FOR HELPING.
01-06-2002, 02:38 PM
#112
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Originally posted by Greg's2kGLE
Hey, where are you located? I am in Central NJ, if you can come down here, I be willing to help out...free intake mmmmmm
Hey, where are you located? I am in Central NJ, if you can come down here, I be willing to help out...free intake mmmmmm
01-06-2002, 02:49 PM
#113
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: I told you so!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Originally posted by RussMaxManiac
Should we say all Auto Nissan's loose that much...
Fbodys don't loose any to a auto!
Should we say all Auto Nissan's loose that much...
Fbodys don't loose any to a auto!
01-06-2002, 02:53 PM
#115
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Originally posted by deezo
Why don't you start working on the 4th Gen autos. I'd be willing to head out there next Saturday for testing.
Why don't you start working on the 4th Gen autos. I'd be willing to head out there next Saturday for testing.
01-06-2002, 03:06 PM
#120
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Posts: n/a
Originally posted by dmbmaxima88
generic
generic
If generic got you 10hp extra, then I found no reason for switching to the more expensive K&N. Rod Millen is selling the "Generic" filter (the one currently on your Max) for $250 and claims it is a Rod Millen signature product.......