i have a couple friends that have mechanics that have told them they need new timing chains...is this full of crap? i thought the 1 the timing chain lasts the life of the car and 2 u cannot tell if it is bad, it either is good or snaps on you and you're screwed...input please cause i dumb thanx....

 

I had an '85 BMW 325e in a previous life. The timing chain broke at 77,000 miles.

The engine was completely thrashed-had to be replaced. That happens with close-tolerance engines. As far as when the timing chain needs to be replaced, well, it varies from car to car. It was supposed to have been replaced at 60k on my Bimmer. The Miata I had was scheduled to have it replaced at 100k. I'm not sure on the Max, though.

It's not the cheapest thing in the world to do, but it's cheaper that replacing your engine.

 

Hard to say when a timing chain will go, the side cover does have a plate that can be removed to check the condition of the timing chain.

Please refer to the FSM for its location, takes a few minutes on a lift or w/ the passenger tire off as well as the inner lining splash shield.

Most Timing chains last 100K+ Alot of the VQ30DEs in 4th gen's have never been replaced even after 150K+, the consensus says you're still safe, but doesn't hurt to check.

-Peace

 

but how can u tell if the chain is going bad? hollywood, did u notice anything wrong on your car, or did the chain just snap? if i do pop off the cover, what should i look for? stresses in the chain? hmmmmm

 

mostly tension, already has some pretension in it, the only reason a chain goes is because of lack of tension, which causes stress as it rotates around. Timing Chain guides by Nissan are notorious in breaking like 4.5 V8 used in Q45s. I doubt it applies to VQ motors, but never know.

 

Umm, the E30 BMW's had timing belts, which, like you said, should be replaced every 60K. A timing chain is a lot different. For them to go bad, there either has to be a mechanical problem like the tensioner, or they should have a ridicuously high mileage on them. They are not normally a wear item and shouldn't need to be replaced in normal use.

Actually, I njust noticed you have a '94 Max, what years are your friends. The 3rd gens DO have timing BELTS that need to be periodically replaced, and the mechanics may be right on. If they have a 4th or 5th gen, which have timing chains, I would tell them to go screw.

 

this guy has a 94SE which has the VE30DE engine in it. the VE engines have chains, not belts. VG has a belt.


You can remove the cover and check the tension on it for a quickie test, but the only way to properly check the condition of the belt is to remove it and measure it for stretching and/or wear.

As for your friends cars, what cars are they and do they have a timing chain or belt?

 

Well like you said if the chain breaks you will know it when your engine smashes its valves up. I think having your timing chain tensioner checked every so often is not a bad idea, perhaps at the 90k service.

 

Nope, when my belt (not chain-I stand corrected) broke, it was pretty much without warning. Of course, I was on the interstate doing 75 mph, and turning some decent RPMs.

My engine never had a chance.

My first Max was an '89 SE. First thing I did when I bought it (it had 78k on it) was replace the timing belt.

Anyway...uh, yeah, what Matt93SE and iwannabmw said...

 

the cars in question were a 94 saturn (i'm sorry already) and the other i don't remember...it seemed kinda strange that a cheap car like a saturn had a chain, but thats what my friend told me and i was too lazy to search on the net ...for everyone that keeps talkin about belts and crap, guess what? this is not about freakin belts!!!!!

 

bah...no one ever listens to me.

 

Having clean oil is also important so chain guides don't wear down, and tesnioners freezeing up.

 

As long as you do your maintenance, your chain should be ok. (Unless you have like 250k on your car) It starts to make noise usually before it goes out. Kinda sounds like a rattle or a tick.

 

At the same time on many cars it may not be worth it to pay the labor to have timing chain (s) replaced. We've already established here that 20k = M3, M5, GS400, 540i, so the price of the repair probably equals a new Toyota Corolla

People have a really false sense of security with a chain vs. belt. Probably nobody here has ever ridden a bicycle, what the **** is this invincible chain deal anyway? It's so amazing how powerful marketing is. Sentra, Civic, Corolla--you gonna just buy the one that has the chain? John Q. Public hasn't bought in...

 

Along with the old 325e having a timing belt, so does the miata. Chains are not the problem here, it is usually the tensioners that go. As for replacement, make sure they do chain and tensioner. If you take good care of the car, shouldn't be a problem. I have 233k miles on my 97 SE and am running the original chain. However, on more expensive cars it is worth the cost IMO to be on the safe side.

 

thanx 4 the replies guys, very helpful...but one last q...is there a way i can find out if the car (the saturn) has a chain or belt? or if i just simply look should i b able to tell?

 

yes, saturn do have a timing chain. my mom owns 2 saturns and that was one of their big selling points, "a more reliable engine with a timing chain instead of timing belt."

 

The chain is supposed to last the life of the engine. Like everyone else said, it's the tensioner that usually comes loose. Changing the chains is supposed to be a PITA.

 

Over time, timing chains will stretch. I have seen this "first hand" while doing head work on an old Toyota I had. Also, nowadays, if a chain/belt breaks, it will not grenade the engine and bend the valves. Most heads are now designed so that the valves have enough clearance to avoid the pistons.

 

Not totally true. Honda still uses interference type engines. Subaru, on the other hand, does not.

 

back in the day (when i first got my license..a like a year and a half ago..), i owned two BMWs..both 325's (2.7L ETA motor..same as 325e)..they're belt driven, i had both the T-belts replaced..you're also supposed to replace the timing belt every 60,000 miles, i was lucky..my second had 131k on the original belt..when it was taken off, the mechanic said he was amazed the car was still running as there were so many missing portions in the belt..i guess it was good that was replaced..the first was just general maintainance.

 

That's why I didn't say all.... There are always a few bad ones in the bunch (if you really consider this a bad thing ).

 

I consider it a bad thing for the people who own them and are too cheap to pay to have them replaced when they're supposed to. They don't understand that when the belt breaks their engine will be destroyed and it will cost them a hell of a lot more in the long run. If the car has a timing belt, I would rather see a non-interference motor in it.

 

I agree with you 100%. People tend to "go about their business" and skip "minor" things (to them ), like replacing the timing belt. I personally hate timing belts and would prefer chains, but, on a large majority of engine designs, that is not an option.

Heck, the worst timing belt I changed was on my '93 Probe GT. Besides having a motor that is "shoe-horned" into an engine compartment, you had to remove the upper motor mount and jack up the engine to replace.

 

What gets me is that the VG30 in the Mercury Villager is not an interference engine because Mercury made Nissan make it that way. If it could have been a non interference engine, then why didn't they make the VG in the Maximas that way?

 

to check if its snaped its simple, open up the oil filler cap and look a the camshaft, have a friend crank the engine while u keep an eye in the cam. if u hear cranking and the cam doesnt spin then congrants the chain is broken and u are royally screwed out of an engine. nost cars usually require a new timing belt every 60K miles some every 30K miles and the operation is usually about $600 but the timing chain is supposed to last a lifetime but it can become loose if extreme amount of power is made in the car and the stock peice is still on there. so dont worry about it.