dmarion

Two innocent people were killed last night on Long Island due to two apparent drag racers who slammed into them while drag racing. The news report this morning showed their car sliced in pieces. Meanwhile, all the occupants of both drag racing cars escaped with minor injuries.

Sometime today or perhaps tonight we'll find out more about the two victims: whether they had children, sisters, brothers, mothers, or fathers. We'll find out what they enjoyed doing the most and how they made an impact on other people's lives. Their family, friends, work collegues, and aquaintences will mourn their passing. Time will help to heal the hurt, but for some closer to these victims, the hurt will never go away.

But the illegal drag racing goes on. No Maximas were involved on this night. But on any given day or night, the next drag racing victim won't care which type of car ended their life 10-, 20-, maybe 30-years earlier than it should have.

What will it take for the DRAG RACING IDIOTS to stop the violence against innocent drivers? What will it take?

Blu

iTrader: (63)

thats a damn shame things that happen like this makes me sick thinking it could happen to my family all because joe blow thinks he has the race won if he stays on a little bit longer and tries to make the light that just turned red thinking its safe all for a KILL but i guess these bastards got a different kind of kill somebodies life I'm up for a race every now and then but i know the limits to take it to and would never race ina populated area sorry to vent but i hate fukin ********s that kill others and they walk away saying **** i fuked up my car but now there gonna pay

hollywood7301

"Oh Dear God, won't someone think of the children?!?"

dmarion, you make a good point, but try not to sound like a farking reactionary/panicky den-mother when doing so.

Hell, I've read books (no joke here, NON-FICTION)where Amish kids drag-race their buggies! Since time began we've had people racing. How many Roman parents told their kids, "Don't chariot race on the streets or outside of Rome. Do it in the coliseum."

...And I'm sure they probably listened.

Fifty years from now, our descendents will shake their heads sadly as they sit on the moon and read about the moon-buggy drag racing gone horribly wrong:

"Three dead, two injured as illegal moon-buggy race ends in crash into side of the Tycho Brahe crater."

As long as people have any kind of control over any kind of personal transportation device, they will race.

I could say "Fark it! It's natural selection!" But it isn't, when something like this happens.

dmarion's right, though.

It is dangerous, and illegal as hell. A lot of us on this forum are guilty of it. Some spend their weeknends crusing and racing. Others will race when they see a good opportunity. I'm guilty of it, as well.

As for idiots, well...

I've noticed even really smart people do really stupid things occasionally. How else would you explain...oh...Battlefield Earth?

ru4real

iTrader: (3)

I'm pretty sure the victims had mothers and fathers.

freeze2k2

I do have the occasional race on the street, usually from a light, and i always shut it down before speeds get in excess of the speed limit. These kids killing people are the same as kids in stolen vehicles trying to out run the cops, they are hitting triple digit speeds in residential areas, they are the idiots.

Tanman

Don't forget, the racers are probably all facing manslaughter charges and 6-15 years of jail time, maybe more. People need to know their limits and the limits of their vehicles.

panman

Here's the article:

http://www.newsday.com/news/local/lo...an%2Dheadlines

dwapenyi

iTrader: (3)

Is it me, or do these crazy drag tragedies ALWAYS seem to happen on Long Island What's up with that?

DW

noflash

Don't give your 17-year-old a Corvette & don't give your 19-year-old a Mercedes. I think age plays a major role here as well. I'm suprised the Corvette kid lived, wasn't too many years ago that Corvettes had the highest death rates of any automobile.

TimW

iTrader: (6)

the kids probably have zero net worth.. but their parents will probably lose alot, the case will probably easily exceed the insurance coverage and defending them from manslaughter charges.

Magellan

We all inherently know that drag racing is a moronic, juvenile and a mindless thing to do. But I have to agree that there will always be drag racing, including some participation from our less-gifted org members, who often make unsupportive excuses for it ("I only race late at night when I'm sure there's no one else around.").

But that doesn't mean we can't do something about it. I've suggested before that we ban all kill stories on this forum or any other post that boasts of street racing, including those brainless responses, e.g., "nice kill" or "congrats". Perhaps, just perhaps in a few cases, it will discourage some of our more impulsive members from racing solely because they wanted to brag and post the results here. It's a matter of setting a standard; something to set us apart from the other automotive forums; a statement that we have values related to safe and responsible driving.

And don't tell me it won't work. We only have to save one life someday to declare success.

dwapenyi

iTrader: (3)

Like noflash said, just don't give kids the keys to $50-$70K cars with mad hp. You could achieve a whole lot more with just those steps. Sheesh. A brand new Vette. When I was 17, my parents gave me a Chevy Citation, with that killer IRON DUKE 4 banger. Yeah, right, iron duke. I wasn't gettig into trouble wih that anytime soon.

DW

Foglght

I don't really wanna talk about chariot races, but there is a valid point there. If anybody reades car and driver a couple of months ago about the cracker jack box license, it ties right into this. We hardly ask anything of 15 and 16 year olds before getting their license, and potentially giving them a deadly weapon to cruise missile the streets. Hey i am so glad i got my license when i was 16. It opened up my world so i could "get things done". On the same token....I race SCCA, and I've been racing since I was 17. I used to work for Skip Barber, and had countless hours in their cars on track, at the skid pad, and on the autocross. Thats great for me, but it doesn't do anything for the 16 or 17 year old kid who just doesn't care. Much more training would be so beneficial to the country and the auto saftey industry, but still you have the few that are going to ruin it for the many.

Then again i wonder. If the maximum speed limit on the freeway is only 70 (in michigan). Why do they make cars they go way past that?

noflash

BUT! We are all here to enjoy our Maximas b/c they are fast and because we want to make them faster - right? How many members do you think are only driving fast on the track - ZERO.

AND, I've caught you on this b/f Mag - you used to drag in old-school Porsches! And that was before safety was ever an issue!

FINALLY, banning anything is never an answer! God bless America!

Magellan

But we as forum members have no control over that. The point I was making is that we can, through our moderators and with Jambo's approval, decide to band any offensive and potentially destructive thread, including those that encourage street racing.

TimW

iTrader: (6)

Thats not why I'm here

Many.. actually, they just autocross and drag. No street.

True.. we have Speeding Contest tickets and license revokation that will hopefully wise kids up before they kill.. then of course their are the manslaughter charges hanging over street racing. I think we have that covered.

Pmp-n8a

Cause of revenue....duhhhh

if they really wanted to keep people from speeding they would set a national standard of 65 mph and create a law requiring all cars be equipped with speed limiters set at 65

but from the sound of it...this might be breaking consumer laws???
i dunno

TimW

iTrader: (6)

I couldnt tell you where my speed limiter is.. or if I have one.

Magellan

Yes, I used to race my Porsche back in my youth. So what's your point? Does that make the current racers any less stupid than I was? Does that guarantee no harm will come to innocents now just because it was a matter of luck that I didn't kill anyone back then? No, it just means that I stopped before my luck ran out. And I'm trying to encourage others to stop before their luck runs out.

hollywood7301

I agree with you, Magellan.

But it will never farking happen.

I'm not saying that we couldn't make a difference. But look at it like this: Look at the vaunted muscle cars of the sixties. Those things made tons of power, but how much of that power was actually transferred to the wheel? Not nearly as much as the current crop of high-powered sports cars.

The recent incarnations of the Camaro SS, Firebird WS-6 and Mustang Cobra blow away anything that came from the "Golden" Era of muscle cars. That's just an example, and I'm not including any of the import performers (real ones, not modded-out Civics...ha!).

But rich kids have always had nice/"fast" cars.

The problem is now some of those kids are in control of cars that are more. More powerful. More faster. More potential for causing some serious damage.

What to do? I don't know. But some of the knee-jerk reactionary statements that inevitably occur on threads like this aren't the way to go.

To be old and wise, one must first be young and stupid, I suppose.

Jeff92se

iTrader: (82)

Of course this was a tragedy. And of course there is no way you can win an argument to condone street racing. But like it or not, street racing occurs and will probably occur as long as there are cars on the road. You can only try to be as carefull as you can.

But IMHO, if I had a choice to avoid all the street racers out there and all the drunk drivers out there, I would probably live longer if I avoided the drunk drivers first.

DrVolkl

Ugh. You know, people who are using CELL PHONES while driving are KILLING A LOT MORE PEOPLE! JUST DOESN'T GET THE PRESS! There's no story...you can't get people all upset about it cause EVERYONE is on their friggin cell phone. But, take a couple young PUNKS in FAST cars and lets spill it all over the country. COME ON PEOPLE...RELAX.

I'm not saying it's right, but it's nothing to get excited over either. It's like talking about Shark attacks vs how many people die from surguries gone bad. One's gonna get all the press...so lets go kill all the sharks and keep getting our face lifts!

I feel sorry for anyone who is killed by someone elses stupidity...but if we're going to yap about street racers, who kill a whole lot less people than cell phone users, we had better start addressing other habits as well.

BTW- I don't street race, and I think it's stupid, but I am guilty of quick accelerations and onramp/offramp antics.

dwapenyi

iTrader: (3)

Damn good point.

DW

TimW

iTrader: (6)

Yeah.. but this isnt a cell phone enthusiast board... and we dont post stories about how 'my Nokia killed this Sprint PCS phone last night'

noflash

You don't enjoy driving spirited? You don't mod your car to increase its limits?

Quote:

Many.. actually, they just autocross and drag. No street.

How many here don't use their max as a daily driver?

AND Magi-babe! It's BAN not BAND and it FASCIST! I know it's not a democratic forum, but where will it end? Maybe we should ban discussions on mods so there is no liability for someone voiding their warranty.

AND what the hell do you think I mean bringin up your drag-racing days? If someone told you to slow down or you're gonna kill someone (and I'll bet they did) did you? So show some empathy to those who enjoy using what they paid for. I don't drag and I stay as far away from teenagers w/ HP as I can, but I'm not gonna wrap myself up in a Crown Vic and go the speed limit (should we ban discussion on Valentine?).

Jeff92se

iTrader: (82)

But people who drive maximas, use phones. And since this is an internet club, it's probably more likely that the maxima owners here have phones and other techy gadgets. I am going to have to say that cell phone use is responsible for much more damage than street racing is. I would also have to say, drunk drivers are also responsible for much more damage than street racers are. I'm not saying street racing is not a problem, but when put in perspective, it's not as big a problem as some other things. ie.. why say "stop street racing" when your efforts would be better served by saying, "stop using your cell phone when driving" or "stop operating an SUV too large for you to handle" etc...

noflash

...and how many people wear their seatbelts?

Magellan

Your analogies escape me. I don’t recall any threads on this forum bragging about the use of cell
phones while driving, or driving a Maxima in shark infested waters, or the bad results from
surgeries resulting from driving a Maxima.

But we do have many threads, including today, about street racing Maximas. And at the risk of
repeating myself for those that refuse to understand my point, we cannot eliminate street racing. I
know it can’t be done. How many times do I have to say it? But we can refuse to endorse it by
banning or ignoring those threads that brag about it on this forum. Yes, it’s a small gesture that
may not work, but I feel it’s worth a try.

Jeff92se

iTrader: (82)

I understand your point but I think you are missing another. Yes street racing is bad. But in the big picture, there are much worse things even in the realm of driving an automobile. ie.. drunk drivers, cell phone users, general inattention. Wouldn't you agree that if you got some statistics regarding damage caused by each offense, street racing would probably fall near the bottom? Are you equally as offended to cell phone users and make-up appliers as well?

nice95GLE

I believe the only answer is driving school.

This might song a little off but if there is a nation wide law stating that anyone wanting a drivers license must past a 6-month course on driving I believe this will lower driving related deaths. Think about it; Doctors, Lawyers, Pilots, even security guards have to go school to become licensed. I don't understand why the only thing needed to get a drivers license is BS written exam and a 5 min road test . This should be a regular course with exams, Homework, the whole nine; and until you get a passing grade you cannot take the road test.

And as for the one with licenses, they will have one year to take and pass the course or their licenses will be revolved.

CAN'T PASS THE CLASS CAN'T DRIVE

Magellan

The point is we already prohibit offensive posts such as flame wars, and we certainly don’t consider that fascist. If you don’t think that a thread boasting about a street race is offensive then there’s nothing more I can say.

ChillWill2000

I wonder what benz the other kid was in to be racing the Vette???

It must have been an AMG because any regular benz the race would have been over before it started.

TimW

iTrader: (6)

but we arent talking about 'the big picture'. Sure there are bigger fish to fry.. that doesnt make it any better... or more justified

Magellan

Please understand that I’m not trying to address the big picture of all the bad things that happen
to drivers. I want to stay focused on one, just one, small aspect of unsafe driving that perhaps we
can do something about in this forum. We have no control over all that other stuff. Expanding
my thoughts to “Well, what about this? And what about that?” seems to be an stretching attempt
to make my idea seem silly. Perhaps it is, but I can always make myself look silly on my own.

Jeff92se

iTrader: (82)

Well I just needed to know where you were coming from. As long as I know that, then please proceed.

jjs

is that the underlying sentiment on this, regardless of the vocal position, is that it is not a good idea to street race. It is dangerous, it is not necessary, etc.

Like has been said...who gives a crap about the 'yeah but what about' and 'more people dies from' statements made in futile attempts to cloud the bottom line that it is not a good idea.

What I can't fathom is how many members of this org either have already agreed that racing on the street should not be done, or those who can't really argue their way out and reluctantly admit it...individuals from both camps are guilty of later jumping on 'kill posts' with smilies, 'way to go's', 'nice kills', etc. Pick a song and sing it!!

Dan4614

dmarian,
This is obviously sad, but could you possibly have polarized the story any more??? I mean, sh*t, "violence against innocent drivers"? -- you make it sound like street racers go out with the intent of kill families.

I race on the freeway and the streets because there is no other place to go. If I were rich I would be open road racing legally in Nevada but I'm not. Mabey if the there were sanctioned places where we could street and freeway race we would, but that's just not happening. Young kids with fast cars will ALWAYS race, so why do parents and polititions stick their heads up their a$ses and pretend like it can just be stopped with some stupid adds and slogans. It's just like the "war on drugs." Did the war on drugs work? NO, because because people are going to do drugs regardless of the laws...JUST LIKE STREET RACING!

hollywood7301

You know, it's the same thing everywhere.

Big fireball crash, a couple of innocent people killed, some teen meat-heads in a 'Vette and a Benz are to blame.

Who here DID NOT know someone in high school that was killed or killed themselves because of something similar to this? Raise your hands.

Not to trivalize this, but it's almost like a rite of passage. Granted, one that I would have been happy to miss, but...

New drivers + fast cars + testosterone + poor judgement = Sh*t hitting fan.

jjs

OK, some items here...'intent to kill families'...maybe not exactly, but they certainly don't drive safely so as to keep them alive.

'I race on the freeway and the streets because there is no other place to go.' Oh that's a good one! Do you explode pipe bombs (another illegal activity) on the freeway and streets 'cuz you have nowhere else to go?

'If I were rich I would be open road racing legally in Nevada but I'm not. Mabey if the there were sanctioned places where we could street and freeway race we would, but that's just not happening.' Maybe true, but that doesn't mean you can do whatever you want whereever you want simply because you can't afford to do it where it is accepted.

'Young kids with fast cars will ALWAYS race, so why do parents and polititions stick their heads up their a$ses and pretend like it can just be stopped with some stupid adds and slogans. It's just like the "war on drugs." Did the war on drugs work? NO, because because people are going to do drugs regardless of the laws...JUST LIKE STREET RACING!' This makes a whole lot of sense...why don't we just chuck all ethics and social structure down the toilet? Drugs are illegal for a reason. Racing is illegal for a reason. Just because some people defy those laws does not make them any less valid. Addicts die and sometimes kill to make a score, racers die in accidents and sometimes kill in doing so pursuing 'a kill story'...

I would like to see which side of the fence you would be on if later tonight one of your family was scraped off the street or sponged out of a car due to morons racing around 'cuz they didn't have anywhere else to do it'.

TimW

iTrader: (6)

back in the early 70's, no big deal.. what you killed somebody? hey, quit that.

Just like in some states, 20mph over will get you arrested. Soon enough, the penalties will be so stiff, you'd be crazy to street race. Another 5 years, you'll probably get attempted murder for cutting someone off. Just a matter of time.

Statistically, its only a matter of time til something tragic happens to someone we know. And the reprocusions and sense of loss will outweight the "but hey its a fact of life, whatya gonna do" attitude. After that, I'm sure 'Street Racing = Bad' post wont be so hotly debated.