Dr.Monkey1313

Hey everyone,

I need new struts on my car and am not looking to break the bank or spend a lot of time with this. I am just looking for new struts to be installed by a garage this weekend.

Can I just go to the local garage and get Monroe or any struts they sell put on the car and have a decent ride? I am just looking for a ride equiv. to when the car was new.

Also, should I go ahead and get new springs put on as well? Again, I would just be getting whatever springs they sell at the garage I go to. Nothing fancy.

Any help with this would be greatly appreciated. I will probably go tomorrow morning to have this done.

Thanks and have a great weekend everyone!!!

falconey

iTrader: (2)

You won't need new springs and yes if you're looking for oem equivalent then I'd think the Monroe struts/shocks should suit you just fine.

Dr.Monkey1313

Thanks Falconey. I really appreciate the info. Just out of curiosity, why would I not need new springs? I have almost 160K on my car and the struts in the rear are starting to leak.

Do springs last forever? (not trying to be a smart ***)

Just curious. Thanks again!

MetaOrbit

iTrader: (19)

The springs probably won't need to be replaced unless you think they're sagging or worn out or something to that effect. Springs are generally fine for a very long time.

So if you have some reason to be in doubt about your springs, go ahead and replace them when you do your struts. There's no extra labor involved as the old spring has to come off anyway when the strut is replaced.

falconey

iTrader: (2)

^^^basically what Meta just said.
springs are highly durable...rarely do they need to be replaced.

Dr.Monkey1313

Cool! Thanks guys. As always, I really appreciate the help.

Oh, real quick. What would be some signs that my springs were sagging or not good anymore. Are there obvious signs to look for?

Thanks.

i30ds

iTrader: (8)

Doc, since they are going to be in there, you should have them replace the bump stops/ boots and front strut bearings.

Dr.Monkey1313

i30Ds: I am looking in the Haynes Maxima book for the bump stops/ boots and front strut bearings, but I 'find those terms listed in there. Can you explain to me what these things are so when I go in tomorrow, I half way sound like I know what I am talking about? LOL

Also, why should I get these replaced at the same time as the Struts? Just curious.

The 96 I30's only have struts all around right? We don't have shocks, right?

{-_-}

iTrader: (2)

shocks in the front, struts in the back. that's how it works.

you should get these replaced because you're already in there... what if you replace the struts and shocks and then the other misc. parts break 1000 miles later... you're gonna need to replace it then and you'll waste more time and money.

edit: you have over 1000 posts here and you don't know this?

MetaOrbit

iTrader: (19)

Uhhhh. No, it's 4 struts all around.

i30ds

iTrader: (8)

The digram should be in the haynes suspension section. Basically, the boot protects the piston portion of the strut. It has a bump stop integrated into it to prevent the suspension from bottoming out. You should have the rubber boots replaced so they protect the new struts... at your milage your boots are probably non existant. The front bearings are located in the strut mount on the top of the front strut. These bearings are known for creating a God awful amount of racket when they go bad... and at your milage I'd put money on that they have. Since ALL this has to come out, it only makes sense that you replace the stuff so you complete they job right the first time. There are other part that I would replace in addition to the front strut bearings and the boots, but those two are the only critical items.

i30ds

iTrader: (8)

You obviously dont know what you are talking about.

Pyrophilus

Bump stops are exactly what they say they are. If your struts are worn, most likely you have bottomed out your struts numerous times. You really can't "see" if the bump stops have been "bumped" in a strut. If you have shocks, you have separate coil spring/bump stop, so one can see if you've bottomed out. I just did my 01 pathfinder at 60kmi, and although I've never seemingly bottomed out, there were clear signs of suspension bottoming out

http://thekims.homeip.net/shocks/
This isn't a strut, but first picture is a sign of bottoming out.

Anyway, your bump stop takes alot of abuse. You should replace it. You should also get new boots, because if your struts are leaking, then the they are old, and boots are equally old. If they aren't torn yet, they will soon. Boots keep dirt/moisture off the shaft, which prolongs life of the strut.

Strut bearings are VERY important. My '92 Maxima had its struts replaced at dealer twice since car was new. Dealer never replaced the bearings. When bearings die, they tend to make rattling sounds.

If you want a truly "back to factory original" ride and your strut is leaking, you will need to replace not only struts, but the bearing, bumpstop, and boots. Probably do not need to replace strut mounts because they can get pricey. I just replaced mine because I was doing the job and I didn't have to pay for labor. Chances are, if shop is telling you that you NEED to replace the mounts (with no real good reason), be weary.

You should always ask for the old strut hardware (it's law in most states for shops to fork over old pieces). Struts and boots are very visible, but if the shop does not replace the bearing and the bump stop, you will never know...

What do these look like?

Bearing:
In the 2001 pathfinder, the strut bearing looks just like a normal metal bearing. In the 1992 Maxima, it is bearing made of two thin gray plastic discs that rotate around each other. In 2000 I30t, it was also a normal "metal bearing". Ditto for a '99 Civic

Bump stop:
In all the cars described, it was just a REALLY THICK washer looking metal.

This way at least the shop won't be able to give you a piece of a carrot and tell you that's the used bump stop...

Dr.Monkey1313

Hey thanks a bunch everyone!!! I really do appreciate your help with this. I am off to the shop to get this done. Wish me luck.

???: Now I see why you only have 191 posts on here. Lets keep it that way...

phenryiv1

iTrader: (19)

If they try to charge you an arm and a leg, contact me. I can install them for you for a LOT less than most shops will charge, and you can most likely get the parts cheaper on the internet. I can also tell you what "small" parts you need and help you find them.

I have done 10-15 4th gens, including my own, which I did 4-5 times (trying different setups).

Pyrophilus

Dr.Monkey, you might want to take advantage of this and watch (or help, even if you are paying him). You can learn how to do it.

It's rather easy to change struts. It seems really hard, but there isn't much to it.

First time I did one, it took over and hour per side, because no one was showing me how to do it. I've done, '97 civic, '92 max, '00 I30t, and '01 Pathfinder. After all those, the pathfinder takes about 30-40 min (using ALL handtools).

You can buy inexpensive spring compressor (the death-trap brand as some folks here called it), and set of good craftsman metric socket wrench for same price as taking it to a shop. Knowing strut installation saved me so much money. Good thing is, if you have someone like phenryiv1 show you, at least they can stress where you need to be careful (like you can take your head off if you are STUPID with the coilspring).

Local goodyear charges $750 per front set. I got KYB's for less than $200 set and metric socket wrench is $50-$60. I got spring compressors on ebay for $8 (I use two sets), and a generic torque wrench for $10. Heck even if you don't have jackstands and decent jack, you can get cheapy set for $40-$60.

flthere

iTrader: (2)

cool doc .. u always seem to strike the right chord

Not to digress, but i got few questions . Is there any way to guesstimate the no. of miles on the struts, I don't know how many miles they have been thru as I bought the car when it had 96k miles and now I have 118,000 miles (hit the mark just an hour ago). The boots on the front are torn and hear 'keech keech' sounds sometimes. I know it's time for replacements but those hundreds of threads in 4th gen confuse me a lottt on what to choose. I feel I'm in a boat, especially on some overbridges on I-294. On one side, I'm inclined to lower, but don't want to sacrifice the comfort ... still thinkin .......

Saw a set of stock struts with 25k miles for sale (local pickup) for $40 .. don't know if i can buy them either Even Monroe don't come cheap, they are like 20 bux less than GR2s. Illuminas are definitely costly but guess they are worth it.

phenryiv1

iTrader: (19)

I have slowly assembled the tools over time. I used to do the work in exchange for tools and a small amount of cash. If you want for me to do yours, Dr. Monkey, it will be WAY cheaper than any shop quote that I have heard. You can do struts and labor and come out way ahead on this- it will save you more than enough to cover the cost of new springs, if you decide to go that route. I have never heard of springs wearing out unless you live and drive in the rust belt, and even then it is very rare. If you are not lowering it, I would not bother replacing the springs.

Dr.Monkey1313

phenryiv1: Thanks a lot for the offer. I really appreciate it and will contact you in the future with anything that needs replacing before I go to the shop, but I had it done today at NTB, and while I only have one arm and one leg left, the car drives like a freekin dream! I swear I wish I had done this a long time ago!!! There is such a difference in the ride and controll and everything now with the new struts.

I know I said it before, but I really do appreciate all of the help on the org. Thank you all for your knowledge, and offers to help me out. You guys are great!

Have a great day!

phenryiv1

iTrader: (19)

Just so that I know, what did they charge you, and what all did they do/replace?

i30ds

iTrader: (8)

Why dont you just get some tokico blues then?

i30ds

iTrader: (8)

A suspension job is not that hard on this car at all... The only special tool you need is a spring compressor. I did the suspension on mine and on my friends 96 I30...

flthere

iTrader: (2)

thx i30ds ... at this time i'm lookin at blues only as i already read some things bad abt KYB in cold weather, be it agx or gr's. In performancepeddler.com, the price for fronts only cost abt $256 for illuminas and $180 for blues.

last 2 questions, keepin in mind i prefer comfort slightly over handling. (i guess any new struts viz., illuminas or blues, will get me better handling than that i'm experiencing in my boat now)

1. First thing I wanted to know when I browsed this site http://maxmods.dyndns.org/index.php?MaximaSprings is to know what are the advantages of lowering springs besides the looks.

2. In case i want to lower with H&Rs later, will the blues be good with them ??

That is all and ur answer(s) will enable to place order immediately for Tokicos. I think I've seen enuf of boat ride.

Thank you soo much.

Doc, what did ya finally get ???

i30ds

iTrader: (8)

If you decide to drop expect a mild decrease in comfort, but the look is well worth it. Keep in mind if your suspension is really aged, even a slightly stiffer set up will feel 110% better. Also, the blues are not appropriate for lowering either... So if you want to drop, better get the illuminas.

I have illuminas set on 3f/4r with ce springs and I absolutely love the combo.

NewLoveI30

Lowering springs are shorter and stiffer than the stock springs. This does a few things:

The increased stiffnes allows for less body roll in the corners which makes handeling much crisper and more controled. You will also get more feedback from the road telling you exactly what is going on with the tires.

The lowering of the car's center of gravity will allow you to take corners faster and without nearly as much drama or sweat as the cushy stock setup.

Ride will definately be stiffer, but you wont bounce around nearly as much, so I think the ride is actually better... This is coming from someone with Eibach springs (stiff), and Illuminas set on 5/5 (stiffest setting).

My suspension is definately the best mod I've done yet. Puts a smile on my face evey time I get behind the wheel.

phenryiv1

iTrader: (19)

Blues (which are really called Tokico HPs) are fine for H&R. I ran them with no problems. Any lower or stiffer of a spring and you might need more, but for H&Rs or Tein H-techs, I would feel fine using the Blues. IF the cost is not much different on either end (or ovarall), then I would get the Illuminas for the virtually guaranteed comfort and performance, btu if you ar not a hard driver, the HPs will suit you. On my last suspension setup I ran Illuminas only in the rear (due to the poor rear suspension travel) and they were butter.

i30ds

iTrader: (8)

Damn... 5/5. When I first put on the illuminas, I set it to 5/5 and hit 287 for a lenghty drive. On the highway it was great... especially for high speed lane changes... baby hungged the road and drove like it was on rails. But, as soon as I got back into town, driving over train tracks and the generally sh!tty roads of Boulder was murder. Rode stiff as a fuccing board. The car would just pound right through the ruff, tuff, and dangerous.

i30ds

iTrader: (8)

I was under the impression that since the blues were basically oem replacements (slightly stiffer) that they were not suited for dropping. CE does sell a kit that comes with the hps and their 1.5'' drop springs though... adn if you ran them with no problems...

phenryiv1

iTrader: (19)

HPs are an "OEM Replacement" in their fit and ride quality, but what that really means is that a non-enthusiast will not really feel a difference in the HPs v. stock (SE/T) struts with the OEM springs. Their valving is reputed to be slightly more tight than OEM, though the housings are virtually identical.

Also, Tokico even warranties the HPs down to a certain level of drop. I BELIEVE that it is 1.7 inches of drop. Prior to the Tein H-Techs, nothing else offered this minimal of a drop other than the H&Rs, which is why people were not recommended to use the HPs on a drop. If you look back, you will see that about 90% of HP users were on H&Rs for the longest time.

Now with the H-Techs also falling within the warrantied drop, there is a better chance of having the struts warrantied in the event of failure.

Like I said, I ran them myself. I sold the struts and the following user also ran them for at least a year w/o problems. He and I both ended up with different drops and adjustable struts, but I would be comfortable running HPs and H-techs (or H&Rs, if I liked the drop) on my next A32, or on my wife's A33.

i30ds

iTrader: (8)

Cool, thanks for the clarification.

flthere

iTrader: (2)

Thanks for your help. I'm not a hard driver. Now one last question. From performancepeddler.com, the prices of each front strut is:

Blues (HP): $90 and Illuminas: $128 per front strut.
GR2: $66 per front strut.

Are the blues worth that xtra $24 per strut ?!?

I saw many ppl running on GR2 and lowered with H&R on this org and I presume GR2 are also good to go with H&Rs if n when I get interested in lowering the car in future, right ?

One lingering question on my mind is how good the stock springs are and will be. They have seen 118k miles so far.

Thanks again !

NewLoveI30

Springs are not something that will normally wear out. I would only replace if my car were sagging or sitting funny, or to drop it In other words, your springs are probably fine.

I dont have any experience with the GR2's. Only stock, illuminas, and Koni's on my last car. The illuminas are definately the best.

MetaOrbit

iTrader: (19)

From my personal experience...I can't stand KYB GR-2s. I don't know if I can give a fair assessment though - I had them paired with Tein S-Tech springs which are crap as far as I'm concerned.

Let's just say that when I had that setup the car bounced like a civic with torched springs.

phenryiv1

iTrader: (19)

Stock struts are probably getting close to the end of their life cycle, but the springs should be fine as long as you do not live in the rust belt.

Regarding the use of the GR2 struts, they get more stiff in the winter (or any cold weather), so if it gets cold where you live, I would stick with the Tokicos. I have experienced the AGX getting stiff on my own car, and I would not buy AGX struts again.

flthere

iTrader: (2)

thanks henry for the clarification, i have made up my mind on getting the Tokico HP blues from performancepeddler.com ...

just making list of other things needed ... dust boots, front strut mounts, strut bearings ... i guess that is it ... found the cheapest prices on them to be $36, $70, $40 respectively so far ... still hunting for lowest prices

phenryiv1

iTrader: (19)

Not all of that is necessary.

flthere

iTrader: (2)

Hi Pat,

I don't know for sure, but I did read many threads in 4th gen, also heard from i30ds once that it is better to replace those misc. stuff while changing the struts as even those things would have seen good no. of miles ... 118k in my case ... i'm still plowing thru the other threads that were talkin abt control arms and all on which i couldn't make head or tail of !

Whatever it is, I'm dead sure on getting the HP blues ... thx all

i30ds

iTrader: (8)

The only reason for not replacing the bump stop/ boot and the front mount bearings is if you were on some sort extremely tight budget. After 118K miles, I can only imagine that your dust boots are badly ripped apart. So those are a must. Since the entire unit must be completely disassembled, you might as well replace the front strut bearings too. Even if they are not making any noise now, with 118K, they are probably not far from it. You would really kick yourself in the @ss if 10K after getting new struts, the bearings started making noise (and it is a God awful amount) every single time you hit a tiny bump or crack in the pavement.

phenryiv1

iTrader: (19)

Why replace the strut mounts? THey are metal, and while subject to stress fractures under extreme usage, they are normally subjected only to linear forces (straight up and down motion). If there were lateral force against the studs, I would say replace them (such as in the case of crazy alignment in the past), but absent that, you can re-use them.

I have also reused strut bearings on several occasions. I took them apart and repacked them with white lithium grease. 30K and going strong on a few of them. The bearings are expensive for what they are. I would put the extra $ into the KYB boots and the best suspension components that you can justify.

phenryiv1

iTrader: (19)

Was that for the SB108 and SB103 boots from KYB?