Check it out:




Pathy VTC on the left, VQ30 timing gear on the right.


The timing chains, tensioning equipment and gears (other than the intake VTCs) are identical to the VQ30 stuff, too.

 

whaaa!!

Nice find!

 

So does this mean adjustable cam gears?

 

It means you can use the Pathfinder VTCs on a VQ35 with a VQ30 ecu. You could control the VTCs with an rpm switch. The downside is that the Pathfinder VTC moves the cam only 24 degrees compared to 35 degrees for the Maxima and 350Z VTC.

 

Very interesting find. Keep em coming Steve.

 

That's way better then NOTHING like the current VQ35 swaps.

So, you're saying the RPM switch would control the oil pressure via the intake valve timing control solenoid valve? I'd bet you could program the additional injector maps in eManage/SMTx to vary the cam timing for the low/mid range and then in the high speed range.

Plus, you could run MUCH larger cams without too much overlap causing idling issues or near as much torque loss in the low RPM.

Awesome find Stephen...now get it to work~!

 

Nice find Stephen, this answers a theory I had with the Gen 1 VQ35 Pathys.

 

One problem is that if you advance/retard the VTC it (edit: MIGHT) change the cam signal and if its to much the 4th gen ECU will throw a 0101 code. Whenever Ive gotten this code in ghost or CEL Ive always lost a bit of power.

However it is possible to shift the VTC and mess with crank timing via SMT-6/7 in direct proportion to the cam signal change and not throw codes. You can theoretically use the SMT-6/7 to control the VTC solenoids using the fuel injector mapping. A variaton of this theory was going to be my winter project but im to broke to pursue any of this.

 

Did you deliberately put the "Mechanics of Composite Materials" book next to them in the pic to make yourself look smarter? J/K

Awesome info for future swappers.

 

You may have just found the Rosetta Stone.

Are you going to use this part or may I study it for a couple of days?

The RPM switch thing is an idea I previously had. But Joe and I came to a conclusion that there is a much better way.

 

The timing apparatus is possibly independant of the cam timing on this device. Just like the exhaust drive sprocket.

 

Thats what im hoping for, if it is were golden.

 

A little bit too obvious, eh?

 

I'm not going to use it in the near future. I'd like to keep it for possible future use, but I could loan it to you. PM me your address.

 

Now thats funny!

 

Was it a joke? I don't get it.

 

Not a joke, just an amusing analagy.

 

Kind of nerd humor...but witty I must say.

 

I noticed that the 2k3-2k4 Pathfinder reads it's cams a little differently than the 2k1-2k2 PF.

 

once again

 

Whoa, this is an old thread, but news to me. Any developments on this mod? It sounds promising.

 

get it to work and post results.can't wait to see if it works.We are preparing a 3.5 swap this week-end...maybe gonna wait until your post results to do the swap.Keep up the good work!!!

 

Better not wait. I don't know if anybody is investigating this any further. I certainly don't have the time anymore.

The issues involved are with the outer timing case. The Pathy VTCs won't fit under the VQ30 timing case (which has the cam position sensor where you need it), and the Maxima VQ35 timing case does not have a cam position sensor location (the cam pos sensors on the VQ35 are on the backside of the cylinder heads). The Pathy timing case won't work because it does not have provisions for the passenger side engine mount.

 

Lend it to SR20DEN, (not that you won't be able to get it to work but he's all over this I think!!)

 

Hmm...so maybe modifying a Pathy timing case to have said provisions could work? It would be a slight pain, but not too much of one.

 

i believe 98seblackmax has found that the maxima passenger motor mount WILL bolt to the pathy covers .
but a problum is the CPS spot on the pathy cover like stephen said and another problum joe has told me is the pathy AC/PS and alternater are in differnet spots on the cover

 

I was talking to a nissan tech buddy of mine about this. Serious welding/modification is needed to adapt the timing case to the maxima vq35 accessories. Almost more worth it to rewire, unless you can get the timing cover to work relatively easily.

 

The Pathy timing covers bolt right up to the VQ30 block and heads.They would also work on VQ35 block and heads as well. Obviously if we had RWD cars it would be very easy to swap this motor.

Here's the problems, everyone get your imagination caps on.

The three large holes for the passenger side motor mount match up. First problem is that the bosses on the Pathy timing cover where the FWD motor mount would go are different heights. I haven't taken accurate measurements but you would either need to grind the bosses, use spacers, or some kind of adaptor bracket to make a FWD motor mount work.

Once the engine is bolted into the chassis there are more problems to concour. The Pathy timing cover extends very far it would come close or touch the passenger side axle. You would need to grind off this extra material and be careful not to go too far or the cover will be useless.

The power steering pump mount we have on FWD VQ timing covers doesn't exist on the pathy covers. So you would need to fab up a bracket or ditch the power steering for a good workout for your arms. My option would be to fab up an electric PS system. This summer we will be installing one on a Maxima.

The location for the Pathy belt tensioner is the spot where the Maxima's passenger side axle is. Where the Maxima tensioner goes nothing lines up. So you would have to make another bracket to fit the tensioner and the alternator. Or if you know a good TIG welder you might be able to fab something up. Luckliy our A/C compressor bolts to the oil pan and that along with the Maxima crank pulley can be used as a guide for the rest of the adaptor bracket setup.

The VQ30 oil pans I have bolt up to the Pathy covers and they seem like they seal the crank pulley gasket ok. You would have to use a Maxima crank pulley and oil pans in order to fit the crank sensor.

Now if you want to use VQ30 Maxima heads your SOL cause there is no oil feed lines in VQ30 heads for CVTCs. You could add the lines. The machinist I went to said it's possible (anything is possible with money) but on a Maxima.org budget it's not going to happen. Another option is to seal up the oil feed line in the Pathy inner cover and do an external oil feed line with an oil filter adaptor LS/VTEC swap style. You would have to feed the line and split it near the valve covers. Then feed each line into the Pathy main camshaft bearing cap thru the bolt hole for the valve cover. The Pathy bearing caps bolt up to VQ30/VQ35 heads. This is the only way that I can imagine to get into the bearing cap without interfering with the CVTC solenoids or the camshafts. From then you would have to make a small pipe bend up into the oil feed hole for the CVTC and use the VQ30 cam tensioners. Of course if you use VQ35 heads the oil feed lines will all bolt up internaly, making yet another strong argument for the use of VQ35 heads and block.

Ok well now the engine will run, has all the ancilliries, and has an oil feed for CVTCs. Now the real hard part begins.

There is no easy way to generate the CVTC signal and have proper feedback from the engine. A simple RPM switch will not work on CVTCs. The Pathy timing cover houses the cam position sensor and has a sensor for both banks of the engine for CVTC feedback. Since the cam signal does not change with the operation of the CVTC, my suggestion would be to run the '01 Pathfinder ECU in parallel with the '95 Maxima ECU. The Pathfinder ECU has the same signals as the VQ30 ECUs and can generate the proper CVTC signals and get proper feedback. The '95 Maxima has the least amount of emissons and gives very few CELs, one reason why I want to keep using my '95 ECU. Then use the two ECUs in conjunction with Emanage/Vmanage to modify CVTC signals as needed. And that IMHO is how you can get CVTC to work on a Maxima with a 4th gen ECU.

Maybe later on if you guys are nice I will post some pics of this frankenstien engine.

 

What are the chances we can use all VQ35 timing parts and a Pathy ECU? Then only have CVTC for the few degrees less, but something is better than nothing and it would simplify the swap.

 

Where would the Pathfinder ECU get the cam position sensor reading from?

 

For all the trouble, might as well have done a straight up 2k2 ECU swap IMO.

 

The 2002 engine uses totally different sensors and won't work with Pathy ECU.

Another option would be if you could weld on the Pathy CVTC stuff onto FWD timing covers, but that's just as crazy.

So far easiest option is to swap the 2002 ECU and full VQ35, I couldn't pass emissons with it so I won't be able to do that. Hell I don't see it passing with the other setups either...

 

Why wouldn't you pass emissions. I remember reading a thread a while back that if you have an engine swap then you can get a certificate saying it is swapped and then they will tail pipe sniff you for emissions from then on.

 

In Massachusetts for '96 and newer cars there is no sniff testing. The car HAS to pass OBD-2 with no CELs and all systems have to be at "ready". The newer the ECU the more stuff it has that can go wrong. It's also alot harder to fool than the older ones. Also I don't want to swap in the emission equipment of a 2002 Maxima. Even then there is still no guarentee it will work without throwing a code.

 

The thread JClaw, Nismo, and I had going a while back (created by me) gave tons of clues as to how to make a CEL and codeless full 3.5 swap.

 

Any word on the readiness testing? CELs are one thing but system readiness is another.

Like I said earlier the most easiest solution for CVTC is to swap the entire VQ35 engine and ECU. Mechanical wise it's bolt on, it's just wiring for the swap.

Just keep in mind Im still on the fence for any of this at this point, I got this Pathy engine for almost nothing because they couldn't get it to turn over. I did it to check the feasibility of this swap and bolted whatever fit together then visualized the rest.

I do wiring and electronics for a living so Im not afraid of it, just passing emissons every two years is what scares me

 

I am using a 2K3 ecu, all my SRTs show as ready and I have no codes/CELs.

Up here they do tail pipe e-testing for all cars. i have to get mine done sometime in the next 2 months and I have no concerns.

 

You should make a kit of your wiring to sell so that others can do full 3.5 and ecu swap.

 

He's already done enough. There's a ton of info already posted concerning the full swap that nobody bothers to read. If he decides to do it, it's his prerogative, but he reserves the right to do otherwise for whatever reason..

 

I do not have the time or want the liability issues associated with that.
All it takes is one bad connection and the engine will not start. There would be a lot of finger pointing going on as to whose fault it is.

I have given a lot of information to several people on here who are currently moving forward with their full swaps. I am always available to answer questions as they move along.

These people know that the wiring you have to add in to the car is only one part. There is a lot of "hacking" of the existing factory harnesses that has to be done. You cannot provide that part in kit form.

Also, I prefer the understanding aspect of what you are doing. (ie. how the wiring of the car is changing and what systems it is affecting) If you just blindly start cutting and install a harness kit, you will be screwed if the engine does not start and you have to troubleshoot.