i'm doing a VQ35 engine swap into my 2000 maxima, unless otherwise a bad idea from ORGers. i know the procedure and will be bringing it in to my buddy's shop. but my real question is, is it worth it in my 5th gen? i'm looking to make my car into a N/A beast with this VQ35 engine and 5spd tranny. also, my ECU wiring similar to those with the 95-99 ECU wiring? or is it more similar to 02-03. a handful of 4th gens have done it but your cars are lighter. do i have an advantage since i have VI?

 

Unless you have a bad motor in it right now, it would be a waste. The top end of the 3.5 isn't that much better than that of the 3.0. It's the low and mid range torque that makes the 3.5 shine.

The 3.5 that people are putting into the 4th gens also has a VI.

Whether it's worth it is up to you. It's your money. If I were you, I would sell the 2k and get a 4th gen or buy a 5.5gen.

 

you might have a problem with emissions in ca if you put the 3.5 in it. I don't know much about CA emissions testing, but I imagine that putting the 3.5 in it could lead to a major headache.

 

ooh my bad, i'm in MA... i meant cali spec tho. so basically it's a waste. but i can imagine it being faster than the 6spd vq35 since i'm gonna be using my 5spd tranny. would i gain the top end using my VI in the VQ35 swap or will i just be wasting my time and VQ30 motor?

 

You're not gonna see the full advantages of the 3.5 swap unless you swap it in a 4th gen, because 2k2+ ecus run far more timing. Us 4th gen 3.5 guys are basically not seeing the same power levels that 2k2's can. I'm probably only pushing 220whp or so where a 2k2 with my mods (H/I/E, pulley & 15-inch wheels, stock ECU/Rev limiter) would be seeing about 235-240.

That is offset by the smaller wheels and lighter weight (I did 13.6 on street tires, where a 2k2 6-speed would probably need more than H/I/E/pulley to pull a 13.6 on regular all-seasons), but we're not gonna see 250+whp until we get a good intake manifold and a bunch of tuning.

 

If you get a E-manage ultimate, you'll be tearing it up like sr20den. According to sr20den, the 00VI is not superior to that of the 3.5's VI.

 

His IM is, but it's unavailable to us.

 

i was looking forward to this swap... but unfortunately it's not going to be as much of a substantial gain as it would to you 4th genners. anyone know the difference between 5th gen ECU and 5.5 gen ECU?

 

All that can be changed with a different IM. Believe it or not, the 3.5 heads are superior to the 3.0 heads, which means they flow better.I guarantee you that an n/a 3.0 will not come close to 240 WHP without some internal work, when there are 3.5's doing that with bolt-ons.

 

I know the 3.5 heads and IM are superior, esp the 350z IM.

I guess what I should have said was that I can't tell a huge difference on the top end between my 00 5spd w/ y-pipe, intake, and advanced timing on the top end with that of the a stock 6speed 3.5. The low and midrange torque of the 3.5 kicks the 3.0's @ss though.

If you can get 200fwhp w/ the de-k, you're only about 10fwhp short of a stock 6spd 3.5 .

 

I was thinking that a 4th gen w/ the 3.5, if you use the 3.0 ECU and use 87 octane gas. I would think that with the superior head design of the 3.5 and the less advanced timing of the 3.0ECU, there may not be any downsides to using 87 octane.

 

hmm... all this talk makes me wanna do a swap anyways. i know i'll be modding my car N/A and this VQ35 swap will be just the beginning. is the swap the EXACT same procedure for my car as the 4th gen? is there any advantage that i have over the 4th gen?

 

Why not? It is worth it. You will make more power ect..

 

The procedure would pretty much be the same except for the fuel rail. It should be a little easier to swap in the 3.5 in the 2k because of this. If you get the E-manage ultimate, you'll be able to advance the h&ll out of the timing, have an extended rev-limit, and adjust the A/F ratio.

Doing that would make you faster than an 02 6spd.

 

another advantage you have is a slightly better stock clutch and a stronger tranny.

 

yess! i figured my tranny would be an advantage over the 5.5gen. so overall, the 5th gen is the easiest VQ35 swap for maxima? advancing the timing will result in only using 93+ rating octane? thus better low end torque? and what would you extend your rev limiter if you had any chance? perhaps 8k is too high???

 

am i keeping my '00 fuel rail and swapping over to the VQ35 directly or modifying it to fit perfectly?

 

95-01 Are all return style system. 02+ Are returnless.

 

Hold yer horses tharr bucko. Part of the info he gave you is incorrect. 95-01 uses a return-style setup, like kevlo just said. So it won't be any easier to swap the 3.5 compared to a 4th gen. Secondly, the performance gains won't quite be the same as those that have done 3.5 swaps into 4th gens. If you do the swap with your stock ECU, then there will be the loss of VTC's and that will be more of a hit to the potential performance due to the 5th gens being considerably heavier than most 4th gens. I'd venture to say that mod for mod, the 5.5 gen will be quicker than a 3.5 swapped 5th gen due to the lacking VTC's and the 5.5 gen's shorter gearing until MAYBE you advance the timing to near 3.5 levels or perhaps beyond along with some a/f tweaking.

Oh yea btw, when you advance your ignition timing using a piggy-back computer it will only take effect in open-loop mode. You won't feel the increase cruising around town because during that time the ECU uses a feedback system to determine ignition timing based on load, engine speed, airflow, etc. It takes a pretty aggressive throttle angle (75%-85% IIRC) to get the new ignition timing maps to take effect. This is the same with aftermarket ECU's that advance ignition timing as well.

 

most 4th gen swaps use 4gen ECUs, does this eliminate the VTC as well? i'm looking to have all of 5.5gen quality's in the 3.5 (swapped in 5th gen) with the ability to control the timing and extend the rev limiter with my 5spd tranny, all through getting the Emanage ultimate or some software.

 

Personally I can live with the lack of VTC's. The 3.5 has enough to low end without them so that I cut better 60 foots launching right off idle than 99% of the FWD cars on street tires do at my track.

 

so all swaps lack the VTC??? i wouldn't mind that much of a loss either... consider how much i could gain using my 5spd and more. overall, would be fun to brag about the swap

 

My bad, I thought it was only 95-99 that have return-style fuel rails. VTC would be beneficial for the extra weight of the 2k max, but it wouldn't be that big of a difference. I believe the VTC adds 10% more TQ at 1600rpm and only 3% at 3000rpm. When you're driving it like you stole it, you're only under 3000rpm in 1st gear.

If you want really big gains like the 4th gens had, you need to put your 2k max on a diet. If it could lose 200-300lbs, it would be a lot more competitive. The 3.5 weighs 35lbs less to begin with.

 

what do i do wit my VI after the swap? do people install this or is it a completely different set up. i'll throw on some lightweight wheels and lightweight flywheel. i'm not worried about the VTC. only thing i'm worried is if the 5mt will mate well enough with the VQ35 to compensate for the weight of the 5th gen.

 

Sell the VI to an orger wanting to make their 3.0 have a VI. The 00VI and heads do not flow as well as the 3.5 heads and the 3.5 IM. If you put the 00VI and 3.0 heads on the 3.5 lower, you will not make as much power. It'll be an easier swap though and you'll have a higher compression ratio.

Lightweight wheels and flywheel will not make up the difference. If you got lightweight wheels, flywheel, catback, removed spare, jack, passenger and rear bench seat, get a lightweight battery and you'll be down about 200lbs.

The VQ35 mates up with the 5spd no problem.

 

usually the 3.5 heads and the 3.5 IM come with a VQ35 motor? anyone do the 350z IM???

 

1. Yes
2. No, it's won't fit under the hood.

 

Yes. Using a 4g ECU eliminates the VTC. My point was the loss of VTC will be more apparent in a 5th gen than in a 4th gen.

You won't have ANY of the 5.5 gen's qualities other than the long block. No VTC, no e-gas, no returnless fuel setup etc. You can retain these things, but it'll take much more work. Guys with 3.5 swaps in 4th gens can live with the loss of VTC but it's gonna be more of an issue with a 5th gen due to the extra weight.

 

yeah i hear that. i was thinking of this swap so i can gain more power than a 3.5 6mt without buying one, beacuse this is my first car and i wanna stick with it for a while. but if this swap isn't going to give me the sufficient amount of power for the amount of work being done, i'll just stick with my motor prolly. plus, there's only 65k on my motor now.

 

Jime got his Automatic 2k2's weight down to 2870 lbs, which is only about 20-30 lbs more than my car. It it were 5-speed, it would weight about the same as mine.

Of course, I could easily get my weight down to 2700, and still have sound deadening, full interior, etc., but I'm lazy and have taken very little out yet -- still, it is certainly possible to significantly reduce the weight of 5th gens to sub 3000 territory. I think SR20DEN's 6MT weighted like 2900-2950 when he ran 12.85@108.

 

Well there ya go. To see the gains in performance that 4th gen guys are seeing you'd have to do some weight reduction, but at least you know it's possible

Just to clarify, i wasn't saying the 3.5 wouldn't make your car any faster. It certainly will.

 

my question is, are the gains going to be enough to actually do the swap? if it's enough to get a significant amount of power over my 5th gen, i'm gonna do the swap. it's pretty much plug n play.

how much heavier is a 5th gen rollin chassis than a 4th gen?

 

The gains will be significant. Is it worth it? That's a question only you can answer. It's your time and money. Without mods, a 6spd 3.5 will have 10-15hp/tq more than you. VTC would help quite a bit with your weight, but that problem can be overcome by putting the max on a diet.

It's not plug and play like a honda swap would be. You need to fiddle with the fuel rail, take the cams out and drill the dowel holes, transfer over the timing cases and put in the cam spacers. Then you need to fiddle with the wiring as well if you want to use the 3.5 injectors.

 

The general rule of thumbs is that you can expect your car to be around 1 second quicker in the 1/4 mile, at least with 4th gens. That's similar to the gains with a stillen V2 supercharger with stock pulley.

And as for the weight difference, 5th gens are approximately 200 lbs heavier than 4G. This of course depends on trim level, rims, etc.

 

I would say it would shave off .5sec off the 1/4 mile on a 2k. I would say that on a 4th gen, quite a bit of the ~1 second reduction in the 1/4 mile is due to the 3.5 having a VI while the vq30de did not. Basically, .5sec is due to the larger displacement and .5sec being due to having a VI.

 

You're oversimplifying it wayyy too much. There are too many variables to just say this is responsible for that, and that is responsible for this. The VI's on 3.0's REALLY boost power power past 5000 RPM. The 3.5 VI opens up much earlier, before 4000 RPM. Apples and oranges...

 

I have my VI open all the time, and my low end torque is still superb..

 

No one was talking about low-end torque...

 

Nope. The 2k2 IM's "VI" does nothing for the 1/4 mile, because it only optimizes low end before 4000, and you're always above 4k when you race. My 1/4 mile times went from 15.0 to 13.6 on street tires with VQ35, PS/AC removal, and H/I/E.

The 2k2 Intake Manifold is almost as sh*tty as the USIM 4th gen 3.0. It peaks around 5600 and drops off hard after 6000-6200. I've still got the 6.5k rev limit and stock ecu so my car is the 3.5 Litre equivalent of of a H/I/E 3.0 4th gen 5-speed. Most H/I/E 5sp run mid to high 14s.

JUST putting a 3.5 with absolutely no other mods will shave a full second off the 1/4 mile of a 4th gen, and probably a half second, maybe .6 off a 2k's times, so it's cheaper as well as more reliable than a SC kit, but once you change the pulley things change. There is no ".5 for displacement and .5 for VI". It's 1 second for displacement, better heads and more aggressive cams, and a few more tenths if you do other mods at the same time.

No switchover, same rev limit, just bigger nuts under the hood, simple as that.

 

according to SR20den, the 02VI is better than the 00VI.