Hmm.. I didnt even realize how bad this was until I got the full pic up on my computer.





Long story short, First drill attempt was off and ..... ya (pic speaks for itself). I re flattened the center area, re did the center punch, and re drilled. But every time I tried in easy out, it just seemed to shread the stud.

Is there any way I can use a bigger bit and drill the stud remains out and use a heli coil? I dont think even a better easy out set will work at this point = \

 

yeah, you can always helicoil it.

 

What kinda drill bits are you using?

Use Cobalt and you might want to try a reverse drill bit..Carbide bits cut like butter but are quite expensive..

 

was using cobolt 3/8th

 

ooops...You missed..

 

You have my sympathy.

 

 

ouch.....should have used teh weld method

good luck with the rest

 

what is the weld method??

 

http://forums.maxima.org/showpost.ph...8&postcount=11

 

thanks benstoked, i was going to pull that up and throw a link in here, but i had to run out and take care of some errands.

oh noes! you can see my cat-less exhaust in that pic....

 

mm...well as far as welding goes, my capibabilities are limited in that area, only having map gas :P

but seriously, should I use a bigger bit that matches the size of the original stud and just drill all that gunk out? or is it supposed to be larger than the stud to accomadiate for the helicoil?

For the other broken one i'm wondering if i'd have more luck cutting a slot into the top of the broken stud, and using a flat head screwdriver to back it out. Has anyone tried anything like this? (I'm about ready to throw my so called 'easyout' set off a cliff)

 

i lent a member a carbide bit...never saw that again.

 

wasn't me...

 

Man, Smitty-- what a mess! I went through this same pain-in-the--
(well, you get my drift) about a year ago on my VG. Broke an exhaust manifold stud on a cylinder head I had spent a LOT of time hand porting.
I tried all the stuff you have, although I didn't think of the suggestion
benstoked mentioned... (Great idea-- IF you have a Mig or Tig handy).
No such luck here either. I was able to drill a fairly centralized hole in the broken stud, starting with a small bit and working up in diameter. But then the stud puller/easy out snapped off in the remains of the stud.
I got ahold of a carbide/diamond dust grinder from a high-end Dremel MotoTool kit and over the course of four freakin' hours slowly ground
the stub of the easy out out. Got a carbide/cobalt drill bit and finished off
the remains of the stud and was able to pick the remaining threads out of the hole. I didn't realize it at the time, but I had drilled into the water jacket of the head, because I couldn't see directly into the hole with the head still on the engine. Ouch! I wound up having to replace the head and port its replacement. So here's my advice: PULL THE HEAD. Take it to a machine shop, where they can put it under a drill press with a perfectly perpendicular (and centered) shot at the remains of the stud. It's more
work, but it will spare you the grief I went through.

 

[quote=Mack531;6174739]
I tried all the stuff you have, although I didn't think of the suggestion
benstoked mentioned... (Great idea-- IF you have a Mig or Tig handy).
quote]

that who mentioned? i thought he had just directed smitty to what someone else mentioned?

anyways, there is still a possibility of using a heli-coil, but only if you somehow regain the center of the old stud location and go from there....but even still, that off-center hole you drilled may still cause problems

 

eep.. Dare I ask whats involved in pulling the head?

 

Let's see... 92 SE is that a VE? Looks like it in the photos of the exhaust port.
Okay; here's asummary:

1. Raise car and place on jack stands. Drain the engine coolant.
2. Disconnect battery ground and all electrical leads to the head and intake manifold. (Including vacuum lines). Any doubts about where everything goes
or plugs in, take a picture, draw a diagram or label and tape each lead. Keep
your nuts and bolts in 6" X 6" zip lock bags with a tag in each one noting where they went on the engine.
3. The intake will have several cables to remove. Disconnect them with as little change in adjustment as possible.
4. Loosen both ends and disconnect EGR tube from EGR valve.
5. Remove stainless wire clip from fuel injectors with a sharp object and needle nose pliers. Disconnect injector plugs; save clips in a ziplock.
6. Loosen and disconnect serpentine belt system to allow removal of AC compressor
and bracket from head, (or power steering pump if it's the backside head). If removed carefully, you can avoid disconnecting the AC lines or PS lines and use some
small rope to tie these items out of the way. Minimize flexing of hoses and fittings where possible.
7. Remove intake hose from throttlebody; leave throttlebody attached to upper intake manifold.
8. Remove spark plug/coil units from one or both heads depending on head to be worked on.
9. Remove upper intake manifold allen bolts. Partially release each bolt in sequence (from center out in a crossover pattern), then loosen all fully. Remove upper intake
plenum. Partially release lower plenum allen bolts in a similar fashion.
10. Remove lower intake plenum.
11. Partially release exhaust manifold nuts in factory-recommended pattern, then release all. By loosening or removing lower exhaust headers, manifolds can be removed from heads. You may need to work from above and below engine bay on this.
12. Pull valve covers.
13. Loosen timing chain components to allow disengagement of chain to cams so you can remove head. You'll have to remove the timing cover and probably a number of pulleys to accomplish that.
14. Partially release head/allen bolts in factory recommended sequence-- (not sure on the pattern) then fully loosen all and remove head. Care must be taken while prying the intake manifold sections and heads loose that their mounting surfaces are not damaged.
15. Buy a complete head & intake manifold gasket set for reassembly.
16. Let the machineshop extract the broken stud.
17. Reassemble engine in reverse order of the above.

You're talking a couple of days of work, and I recommend getting a good service manual to guide the finer points of engine disassembly and reassembling the pieces in the proper manner and torqued in the proper sequence and to the correct specification. The above outline is not intended as legal advice. Check with a factory service qualified representative or factory service manual to be sure.

You will need an assortment of tools, most notably a torque wrench and the appropriately sized allen bolt socket. Some bolt/nuts particularly the exhaust manifold to header flange nuts will probably require a breaker bar and application of WD-40 penetrating oil.

Good Luck!

 

No need to remove the head. For you it might be simple work but for someone like smitty they don't have nearly the experience you do.

The most hed have to do is remove the crossmember or remove the whole engine at the most. But he really just needs a little help in the form of a welder or better tools.

I'm going to remove my engine when I do my studs but I also have a transmission input shaft bearing to fix, rear main seal, and I'm going to clean and paint a bunch of stuff and replace all the gaskets on the engine. And with all that stuff to do I'm just going to pull the engine/tranny together.

~Alex

 

This is true, I really do appreciate you help Mack, but I'm not skilled enough (yet) do do everything in that writeup to seperate the head.

I've already got the crossmember off, which helps alot. Im guessing my easy out set is threaded too much, as it just ended up shreading the first stud I tried to tap out.

I'll get some helicoils this weekend, and read up on using them, and make an attempt at drilling the whole stud remains out and using the coil for inserting a new stud.

The one other broken stud (seen in top picture) is the one closest to the passenger side, and theres a brake line or something that runs across there making it difficult to get a drill centered on that area.

I'm wondering if i'd have better luck using a really thin rotary tool to cut a slot into the top of the broken stud, so I could back it out with a screwdriver?

 

Yes, that does work, (cutting a slot, etc.) provided that you can get to the outer
end of the broken stud without damaging the head. Otherwise you'll be notching the mating surface for the exhaust manifold too, producing a potential exhaust leak. (Just like the broken stud). Dremel makes a number of really thin carborundum abrasive discs that mount on the end of a small shaft. Ideally, you would use the Dremel Moto Tool. A regular electric drill can work too, it's just a little harder to squeeze into
position. If the broken stud is on the front side of the block, you can always remove your radiator to give you a few more inches... It is also possible to lower the entire drive train as I think Alex suggests, as long as you release the top end of power steering high pressure line where it connects just aft of the right strut tower, and the engine wire harness clip attached to that same tower just forward and below the
PS fitting. The PS fluid return line may also need disconnection. Be mindful of the
AC hoses too. Always support the drive train with a proper lift from above and brace with jack stands while under the car! BE SAFE.

 

ya, its actually the rear im working on. I've got a total of 4 blocks and 3 scissor lifts supporting everything. While I was down here I found out my motor mounts needed replaced, so I'm putting it all back together with new mounts (F+R crossmember) when I get the manifold sorted out and put back on.

Nonetheless, thanks you all your good advice

 

I've done plenty of work on the max myself but something like this is something I'd pay to have done unless engine is out. I paid 200 bucks to have all 18 studs done and all gaskets replaced. best 200 bucks ever. Thats not including parts though

Man dude...I feel bad for you...probably had a good chance of getting some cheap muffler shop "weld" those studs out like mine but you're in too far now

 

wow man $200.. Dam, I shoulda just drove the thing to Chicago and had your shop fix it.

When the car was still my Dad's, he paid an evil mechanic from hell about $900 (mostly labour) to take a week to have the front manifold done (which had 1 broken stud, and another broke while he was getting it off)

Turns out the jackass used the same studs, im pretty sure the same gasket, and replaced the broken ones with bolts, yet somehow thankfully 2 years later theres still no leak.

(he also replaced the cat for another $300, but failed to warn us that he was going to cut off the factory bolt-on flanges, and weld on a dinky little universal one that I dont even think is big enough for a DOHC engine based on my last emissions test.)

after that experience coupled with my $600 spent at another A+ shop - (see: Hungry Oil Pan thread) ,

I'm not very fond of paying for labour on something that dosent involve direct engine work or major tools I dont have, especially when the shops, seem very reputatable and friendly, but still do a sh***y job.


Anyhow, last month when I took the car to get quotes on doing just the rear manifold. i got quotes between $500-700

I figured I'd rather do the rear myself as at least half the labour charge is just getting the manifold off, which to me wasnt hard at all, just timely. I could also do other necessary work at the same time (motor mounts, etc). I need the car for school, and dont have much money to spare. I also knew I needed to fix alot more than just the manifold, and I could tackle alot of it at once while just paying for parts (thx automar).

From what i've seen in the few months since being on here, is getting parts, or decent labour prices in Canada, is way harder than the United States.
(my dad once paid $500 to have 1 of the FRONT injectors replaced on the max, granted that was at Nissan)

anyhow, back to my prediciment. Im planning to drill and retap the messed hole to an m10 and use a new y-pipe stud, which still fits through the manifold. For some reason you can only get helicoils for spark plugs in this strange country. I cant even find metric drill bits here,(let alone left hand ones) which is really stupid since metric is Canada's main system of measurement. Ya, I may end up tapping it for 3/8" studs if my M10 tap dosent work.

 

hey, we used good bolts on mine....will work just fine, was much easier and looks better

 

damn dude, I could've traded some labor for some medications yesterday. Got out of the hospital after 5 days being there and I spent $110 on 7 pills and $26 on 21 pills totalling $136!!!! bet you could've gotten that cheaper for me.

Good luck with your studs. That mechanic was a rip off btw, 900 is what the dealer price PARTS AND LABOR. My local dealer quoted me 700 bucks.

 

Aye, I know it was a ripoff. The cut-throat was leaving the car there to have the job done without a signed labour quote beforehand. If I knew then what I now now about cars, I wouldnt have let my Dad take it there. I still cant get over the $500 Nissan charged him to swap one front injector.. Damn!

Anyhow, I hope you're allright after your hospital stay! I see the clever tradeoff. It would be nice if the price difference was due to the US having a government funded auto labour plan , but I guess its just the population difference that probably makes it cheaper there.

As per pills, I've paid a fair bit for meds here too as they're not covered unless you have a private plan. (only direct health care is covered). I also stalk up on generic zantac and over the counter meds, whenever I visit the US. Batteries as well! Energizers and Duracells are at least 60% cheaper there.

anyhow im getting off topic.

Tomorrow I'm gonna see if I can chop a spring guide tool my dad has in the basement so It will fit under the car and let me drill the M10 hole dead center.

(yes I should have done that in the first place)

 

LOL I know, but mixing bolts with studs? and not replacing the unbroken ones, is the difference that ticked me off.

 

the new ones will break the unbroken ones