I did the inevitable! The VE Auto is no longer NA! (Pics inside)
08-31-2007, 07:55 AM
#81
Originally Posted by grey99max
Dude - you just went to nitrous-at-the-track school! And did purdy good, too. Your first pass was very encouraging! 
You also re-discovered some nitrous truths.
0. Spraying at a track is very different than spraying on the street.
1. Nitrous always requires wider/stickier slicks.
2. Normal NA tuning doesn't apply.
3. You have to re-learn how to drive your car.
4. You will encounter weird sh*t happening when you spray.
5. See "0" above.....
Looking at what you said about the night, and skipping your expectations, if you had left the car alone after the first pass, and concentrated on launch and driving, you would have a good baseline to work from, and possibly better times to post up... I don't know what you expected, but you did good on the 50-shot.
Nitrous doesn't really care about ambient conditions, but the NA part does, and so does the driver. Obviously something went wrong when you changed up to a 75-shot, since times went to heck and street-spraying was also bad. Sounds like your nitrous feed is blocked somewhere or the solenoid wasn't working.
I think you tried to do too many things in one evening - I gave that up years ago and just make one change at a time and test the heck out of it until I master it - whatever it is.
When launching w/nitrous, the power hits all at once, so your tires need to be up to the job. I launch with 75-shot and hit the second 75-shot as soon as I'm rolling - so I have traction problems. Think about how much fun that would be for you !! Sticker tires are required. Soak what you got in 50-50% methyl alcohol/VHT juice, let dry overnight.
You don't have anything to feel bad about - so you didn't crack into the 12s on your first time out - so what? How many nitrous Maximas do that? It's not a long list, is it?
Keep at it - but one change at a time.
You also re-discovered some nitrous truths.
0. Spraying at a track is very different than spraying on the street.
1. Nitrous always requires wider/stickier slicks.
2. Normal NA tuning doesn't apply.
3. You have to re-learn how to drive your car.
4. You will encounter weird sh*t happening when you spray.
5. See "0" above.....
Looking at what you said about the night, and skipping your expectations, if you had left the car alone after the first pass, and concentrated on launch and driving, you would have a good baseline to work from, and possibly better times to post up... I don't know what you expected, but you did good on the 50-shot.
Nitrous doesn't really care about ambient conditions, but the NA part does, and so does the driver. Obviously something went wrong when you changed up to a 75-shot, since times went to heck and street-spraying was also bad. Sounds like your nitrous feed is blocked somewhere or the solenoid wasn't working.
I think you tried to do too many things in one evening - I gave that up years ago and just make one change at a time and test the heck out of it until I master it - whatever it is.
When launching w/nitrous, the power hits all at once, so your tires need to be up to the job. I launch with 75-shot and hit the second 75-shot as soon as I'm rolling - so I have traction problems. Think about how much fun that would be for you !! Sticker tires are required. Soak what you got in 50-50% methyl alcohol/VHT juice, let dry overnight.
You don't have anything to feel bad about - so you didn't crack into the 12s on your first time out - so what? How many nitrous Maximas do that? It's not a long list, is it?
Keep at it - but one change at a time.
There is a way to get the 22" slicks to hook up. But I doubt it's possible at my track.
Are you able to get 1.8s or 1.7s? I know you don't have any weight reduction though. I was amazed at how much weight reduction helps the 60 foot. It's so much easier to push an empty grocery cart from 0-10mph than a full one.
08-31-2007, 08:30 AM
#82
Originally Posted by Aaron92SE
Yeah, you're right. I did try to do too much at one time. My objective was not to set new records, but to learn how hard it was to spray on the launch. And boy I learned something last night, that nobody can expect to copy what Jime does, especially on the first time out! I just had to learn the hard way.
There is a way to get the 22" slicks to hook up. But I doubt it's possible at my track.
Are you able to get 1.8s or 1.7s? I know you don't have any weight reduction though. I was amazed at how much weight reduction helps the 60 foot. It's so much easier to push an empty grocery cart from 0-10mph than a full one.
There is a way to get the 22" slicks to hook up. But I doubt it's possible at my track.
Are you able to get 1.8s or 1.7s? I know you don't have any weight reduction though. I was amazed at how much weight reduction helps the 60 foot. It's so much easier to push an empty grocery cart from 0-10mph than a full one.
My best 60' is a 1.9x-something. I have 3300 lb at the line, including the spare tire and jack, so quicker would be a miracle. Running the complete car is personal for me. I did have better/lighter/wider slicks to try, but I broke the motor -again-, so they'll wait until the 3.5 is installed.
It took me months to get prepped for a 100-shot, and I needed JClaw's traction bars to survive that. Then I ran out of traction, so on and on....
Progressive nitrous shots is the way to go, for me. Two stages, one at WOT and the second one whenever I wanted it, with a foot switch. Think about it - if you launch at 50-shot, get through first gear, then go to a second stage in second gear, your tires would hold much better.
Now you can add this to your sig:
08-31-2007, 08:50 AM
#83
Originally Posted by grey99max
You done good, and the car survived. Pretty good night, I'd say. Different, isn't it?
My best 60' is a 1.9x-something. I have 3300 lb at the line, including the spare tire and jack, so quicker would be a miracle. Running the complete car is personal for me. I did have better/lighter/wider slicks to try, but I broke the motor -again-, so they'll wait until the 3.5 is installed.
It took me months to get prepped for a 100-shot, and I needed JClaw's traction bars to survive that. Then I ran out of traction, so on and on....
Progressive nitrous shots is the way to go, for me. Two stages, one at WOT and the second one whenever I wanted it, with a foot switch. Think about it - if you launch at 50-shot, get through first gear, then go to a second stage in second gear, your tires would hold much better.
Now you can add this to your sig:
My best 60' is a 1.9x-something. I have 3300 lb at the line, including the spare tire and jack, so quicker would be a miracle. Running the complete car is personal for me. I did have better/lighter/wider slicks to try, but I broke the motor -again-, so they'll wait until the 3.5 is installed.
It took me months to get prepped for a 100-shot, and I needed JClaw's traction bars to survive that. Then I ran out of traction, so on and on....
Progressive nitrous shots is the way to go, for me. Two stages, one at WOT and the second one whenever I wanted it, with a foot switch. Think about it - if you launch at 50-shot, get through first gear, then go to a second stage in second gear, your tires would hold much better.
Now you can add this to your sig:
There is another 150 lbs of weight reduction mods that I do strictly on track day. Wow! I didn't realize it until I added it all up one at a time. Bumper supports, muffler, alternator, headlight, and rear skinnies.
Thanks for making me feel better and put things into perspective.
By the way, for all those reading. I have timing set at stock, AFR was at 12:1, 93 octane, one step colder plugs (BRK6E-11) gapped to .035", with a 50 shot of nitrous and I STILL saw detonation on my plugs just after my run.
That's why I had to richen things up a bit on my next run. I'd rather get slower times than chance detonation.
I recommend 2 step colder plugs to ANYBODY planning to spray nitrous in a VE30DE, regardless of the shot. Same probably goes for the VQ. Forget what the NX and NOS websites say. They don't know the Maxima. The Maxima doesn't like detonation. Take it from grey, he's been through some motors b/c of it.
It will be SO easy for me to hook up a dual stage! For under $200, I can have that all setup and working.
I've done a lot of reading in old Jime threads. He said that a 35 shot got him low 1.8s, I think the 50 shot barely got him 1.7s, and the 75 shot got him deeper in the 1.7s, and the 150 shot out of the hole got him the best 60' just barely.
But I think anything higher than a 50 shot, he was spinning the 22" MT slicks he had. A 35 or 50 shot is all that is needed to get awesome 60 foot times. A dual stage is in my future. But not until I master the 50 and/or 75 shot at the track first!
Grey, are you running the 23x6 M&Hs? Have you zip tied your front springs?
I will probably also put hard platic boat rollers on a spare set of rear struts I have. Those will be easy to swap out on track day. That's what Jime did. Suspension goes a LONG ways with gaining traction. Slicks aren't the magical answer to all your traction problems. They are just the beginning!
08-31-2007, 09:49 AM
#84
Originally Posted by Aaron92SE
Haha yeah. I guess I can add that to my sig.
That's why I had to richen things up a bit on my next run. I'd rather get slower times than chance detonation.
It will be SO easy for me to hook up a dual stage! For under $200, I can have that all setup and working.
Grey, are you running the 23x6 M&Hs? Have you zip tied your front springs?
That's why I had to richen things up a bit on my next run. I'd rather get slower times than chance detonation.
It will be SO easy for me to hook up a dual stage! For under $200, I can have that all setup and working.
Grey, are you running the 23x6 M&Hs? Have you zip tied your front springs?
Yeah, a dual stage is easy enough to get into - kinda like getting married. I use a floor box (single-gang shallow box) with four pushbutton switches wired in parallel to trigger the second stage. It's right under my left foot, but won't fire the second stage unless I'm at WOT.
My suspension is pretty tight - Tokico Illuminas springs and adjustable struts, set to "5" for the day. I have four rubber blocks in the rear to pick it up a bit, and use some blocks in the front to dial-in the angle of the slicks. Very tight on the track, and drives well on the street.
I've got 255/50/16 and 225/50/15 DRs, M&H 23/8.5/15 and Hoosier 23/12/15 slicks all mounted. The M&Hs get most of the track use - haven't tried the Hoosiers yet.
Car looks like this with Hoosiers:
"it's always something"
08-31-2007, 03:45 PM
#85
Originally Posted by grey99max
Use race gas instead of just richening the mixture - the right race gas supresses preignition and detontation - there is more to gas than just octane. Sunoco 104 or VP Racing Street Blaze 103 works for me.
Yeah, a dual stage is easy enough to get into - kinda like getting married. I use a floor box (single-gang shallow box) with four pushbutton switches wired in parallel to trigger the second stage. It's right under my left foot, but won't fire the second stage unless I'm at WOT.
My suspension is pretty tight - Tokico Illuminas springs and adjustable struts, set to "5" for the day. I have four rubber blocks in the rear to pick it up a bit, and use some blocks in the front to dial-in the angle of the slicks. Very tight on the track, and drives well on the street.
I've got 255/50/16 and 225/50/15 DRs, M&H 23/8.5/15 and Hoosier 23/12/15 slicks all mounted. The M&Hs get most of the track use - haven't tried the Hoosiers yet.
Car looks like this with Hoosiers:
....
"it's always something"
Yeah, a dual stage is easy enough to get into - kinda like getting married. I use a floor box (single-gang shallow box) with four pushbutton switches wired in parallel to trigger the second stage. It's right under my left foot, but won't fire the second stage unless I'm at WOT.
My suspension is pretty tight - Tokico Illuminas springs and adjustable struts, set to "5" for the day. I have four rubber blocks in the rear to pick it up a bit, and use some blocks in the front to dial-in the angle of the slicks. Very tight on the track, and drives well on the street.
I've got 255/50/16 and 225/50/15 DRs, M&H 23/8.5/15 and Hoosier 23/12/15 slicks all mounted. The M&Hs get most of the track use - haven't tried the Hoosiers yet.
Car looks like this with Hoosiers:
....
"it's always something"
I will definitely use race gas next time I go. You're right, other than just octane rating, most race fuels, especially leaded fuels, have a much better anti-detonation capabilities.
Well, I just undid my nitrous feed line, opened the bottle and blew out any garbage that might have been in there. Then, I installed my 50 shot jets back in there. Guess what?
Now with lower bottle pressure, it's now running a bit leaner for a given bottle pressure! That means some part of the nitrous line was partially clogged. And the 50 shot hits MUCH MUCH harder than it did before!
So, I pulled back in the driveway, put in the 75 shot and did a pull with lower bottle pressure than I had at the track. It ran a leaner than I was use to (about 12:1 instead of 10.5:1 like it did at the track last night). The 75 shot is INSANELY fast! It was NOTHING like this at the track last night!
I could not believe it! With the 50 shot on, I engaged it from a 20mph roll and it broke the tires lose all the way until 40mph. It NEVER did that before! Also, with the 75 shot from a 20mph roll, it smoked the tires until deep into 2nd gear (about 50mph). There was definitely something clogged at the track!
The 50 shot feels so much better than it did before, I'd like to think I would have ran better last night. But I can't speculate! Future timeslips will settle all of my guesswork. But when I put in the 75 shot last night and ran 14.1 and 14.3, it was definitely clogged pretty badly. And on the way home from the track last night, I did a quick 2nd gear spray and NOTHING. My AFR instantly read RICH. So it was fully clogged then.
Also, before I tested the nitrous today, I put a s***hoscope to each solenoid and they each clicked the same.
I never knew a 50 shot can feel like that on the street! And the 75 shot is when it gets to be an instant kick in the nuts!
I am going to wait until mid/late Oct before I hit the track again. I still want to take my time and prep everything the way I want it.Also, one more thought before I go. After racing last night for the first time with nitrous, I found out how hard it is to run down the track with 15psi in the slicks, trying to keep it in the grooves, and trying to keep one eye on your wideband AFR gauge. With that stand, the AFR safety switch will be hooked up before my next track visit.
Oh yeah, Grey, do you have any 15" racing wheels you want to sell? I am interested in getting any 15" wheel wider than 6" so I can remount my 22" MT slicks on a wide wheel.
08-31-2007, 08:02 PM
#86
Originally Posted by Aaron92SE
AWESOME buddy! Nice pic!
I will definitely use race gas next time I go. You're right, other than just octane rating, most race fuels, especially leaded fuels, have a much better anti-detonation capabilities.
Well, I just undid my nitrous feed line, opened the bottle and blew out any garbage that might have been in there. Then, I installed my 50 shot jets back in there. Guess what?
Now with lower bottle pressure, it's now running a bit leaner for a given bottle pressure! That means some part of the nitrous line was partially clogged. And the 50 shot hits MUCH MUCH harder than it did before!
So, I pulled back in the driveway, put in the 75 shot and did a pull with lower bottle pressure than I had at the track. It ran a leaner than I was use to (about 12:1 instead of 10.5:1 like it did at the track last night). The 75 shot is INSANELY fast! It was NOTHING like this at the track last night!
I could not believe it! With the 50 shot on, I engaged it from a 20mph roll and it broke the tires lose all the way until 40mph. It NEVER did that before! Also, with the 75 shot from a 20mph roll, it smoked the tires until deep into 2nd gear (about 50mph). There was definitely something clogged at the track!
The 50 shot feels so much better than it did before, I'd like to think I would have ran better last night. But I can't speculate! Future timeslips will settle all of my guesswork. But when I put in the 75 shot last night and ran 14.1 and 14.3, it was definitely clogged pretty badly. And on the way home from the track last night, I did a quick 2nd gear spray and NOTHING. My AFR instantly read RICH. So it was fully clogged then.
Also, before I tested the nitrous today, I put a s***hoscope to each solenoid and they each clicked the same.
I never knew a 50 shot can feel like that on the street! And the 75 shot is when it gets to be an instant kick in the nuts! I am going to wait until mid/late Oct before I hit the track again. I still want to take my time and prep everything the way I want it.
Also, one more thought before I go. After racing last night for the first time with nitrous, I found out how hard it is to run down the track with 15psi in the slicks, trying to keep it in the grooves, and trying to keep one eye on your wideband AFR gauge. With that stand, the AFR safety switch will be hooked up before my next track visit.
Oh yeah, Grey, do you have any 15" racing wheels you want to sell? I am interested in getting any 15" wheel wider than 6" so I can remount my 22" MT slicks on a wide wheel.
I will definitely use race gas next time I go. You're right, other than just octane rating, most race fuels, especially leaded fuels, have a much better anti-detonation capabilities.
Well, I just undid my nitrous feed line, opened the bottle and blew out any garbage that might have been in there. Then, I installed my 50 shot jets back in there. Guess what?
Now with lower bottle pressure, it's now running a bit leaner for a given bottle pressure! That means some part of the nitrous line was partially clogged. And the 50 shot hits MUCH MUCH harder than it did before!
So, I pulled back in the driveway, put in the 75 shot and did a pull with lower bottle pressure than I had at the track. It ran a leaner than I was use to (about 12:1 instead of 10.5:1 like it did at the track last night). The 75 shot is INSANELY fast! It was NOTHING like this at the track last night!
I could not believe it! With the 50 shot on, I engaged it from a 20mph roll and it broke the tires lose all the way until 40mph. It NEVER did that before! Also, with the 75 shot from a 20mph roll, it smoked the tires until deep into 2nd gear (about 50mph). There was definitely something clogged at the track!
The 50 shot feels so much better than it did before, I'd like to think I would have ran better last night. But I can't speculate! Future timeslips will settle all of my guesswork. But when I put in the 75 shot last night and ran 14.1 and 14.3, it was definitely clogged pretty badly. And on the way home from the track last night, I did a quick 2nd gear spray and NOTHING. My AFR instantly read RICH. So it was fully clogged then.
Also, before I tested the nitrous today, I put a s***hoscope to each solenoid and they each clicked the same.
I never knew a 50 shot can feel like that on the street! And the 75 shot is when it gets to be an instant kick in the nuts!
I am going to wait until mid/late Oct before I hit the track again. I still want to take my time and prep everything the way I want it.Also, one more thought before I go. After racing last night for the first time with nitrous, I found out how hard it is to run down the track with 15psi in the slicks, trying to keep it in the grooves, and trying to keep one eye on your wideband AFR gauge. With that stand, the AFR safety switch will be hooked up before my next track visit.
Oh yeah, Grey, do you have any 15" racing wheels you want to sell? I am interested in getting any 15" wheel wider than 6" so I can remount my 22" MT slicks on a wide wheel.
The race gases I mentioned aren't leaded, either - but are excellent protection for higher shots. Most of what i'm preachin' 'bout is doing stuff that comes in handy when you "up the shot". The right fuel and plugs let you raise the shot and not worry about the bad stuff happening. They are a good habit to get into when spraying.
Sounds like you got your first nitrous problem nailed. Keep in mind that the -4AN line isn't big enough when you get to 125-150 shot. Think about your surprise when you got the 75-shot to work right - then imagine how I felt spraying a 150-shot on the highway through my "Alaska pipeline" -6AN line - now that pulled a LOT harder than the -4AN line would allow. Think breaking loose the big DRs at 80 mph and sliding out of the lane!
Things happen much faster when you put down more power - especially with nitrous, since it's either ON or OFF. That's why the two stages. Actually, I have all the stuff for 3 stages, but now that's gotta wait, since my last 3.0 went BOOM.
Nope, I don't have any spare wide 15" wheels - the 15x10" MT ET Drags wheels in the photo cost $105 each, new, from a regional distributor as surplus inventory. Hoosier slicks were $80/pair shipped, used, from eBay. I'm cheap.
Summit has these pretty cheap, in different sizes:
http://store.summitracing.com/partde...5&autoview=sku
Those MT slicks should be on 8" rims.
Glad to hear you got some problems behind you. One step at a time. You'll get there a lot quicker than most of us nitrous users did.
.
08-31-2007, 08:44 PM
#87
Originally Posted by grey99max
Cool.
The race gases I mentioned aren't leaded, either - but are excellent protection for higher shots. Most of what i'm preachin' 'bout is doing stuff that comes in handy when you "up the shot". The right fuel and plugs let you raise the shot and not worry about the bad stuff happening. They are a good habit to get into when spraying.
Sounds like you got your first nitrous problem nailed. Keep in mind that the -4AN line isn't big enough when you get to 125-150 shot. Think about your surprise when you got the 75-shot to work right - then imagine how I felt spraying a 150-shot on the highway through my "Alaska pipeline" -6AN line - now that pulled a LOT harder than the -4AN line would allow. Think breaking loose the big DRs at 80 mph and sliding out of the lane!
Things happen much faster when you put down more power - especially with nitrous, since it's either ON or OFF. That's why the two stages. Actually, I have all the stuff for 3 stages, but now that's gotta wait, since my last 3.0 went BOOM.
Nope, I don't have any spare wide 15" wheels - the 15x10" MT ET Drags wheels in the photo cost $105 each, new, from a regional distributor as surplus inventory. Hoosier slicks were $80/pair shipped, used, from eBay. I'm cheap.
Summit has these pretty cheap, in different sizes:
http://store.summitracing.com/partde...5&autoview=sku
Those MT slicks should be on 8" rims.
Glad to hear you got some problems behind you. One step at a time. You'll get there a lot quicker than most of us nitrous users did.
.
The race gases I mentioned aren't leaded, either - but are excellent protection for higher shots. Most of what i'm preachin' 'bout is doing stuff that comes in handy when you "up the shot". The right fuel and plugs let you raise the shot and not worry about the bad stuff happening. They are a good habit to get into when spraying.
Sounds like you got your first nitrous problem nailed. Keep in mind that the -4AN line isn't big enough when you get to 125-150 shot. Think about your surprise when you got the 75-shot to work right - then imagine how I felt spraying a 150-shot on the highway through my "Alaska pipeline" -6AN line - now that pulled a LOT harder than the -4AN line would allow. Think breaking loose the big DRs at 80 mph and sliding out of the lane!
Things happen much faster when you put down more power - especially with nitrous, since it's either ON or OFF. That's why the two stages. Actually, I have all the stuff for 3 stages, but now that's gotta wait, since my last 3.0 went BOOM.
Nope, I don't have any spare wide 15" wheels - the 15x10" MT ET Drags wheels in the photo cost $105 each, new, from a regional distributor as surplus inventory. Hoosier slicks were $80/pair shipped, used, from eBay. I'm cheap.
Summit has these pretty cheap, in different sizes:
http://store.summitracing.com/partde...5&autoview=sku
Those MT slicks should be on 8" rims.
Glad to hear you got some problems behind you. One step at a time. You'll get there a lot quicker than most of us nitrous users did.
.
Yes, the MT slicks I have will be so much more useful if they were on 15x8 wheels, which is perfect for them. I will easily gain 1.5" on contact patch by going with a wide wheel!!! 1.5" in a LOT! With the 15x6 wheels I have, if I took a pic of the part of the slick that's actually touching the ground, you would laugh.
But it held all motor, but not even close to holding even on a poorly functioning 50 shot. I wonder how much those Summit wheels weigh. I am a cheap perfectionist, so I hope to find a really light wheel, but for cheap at the same time. Also, I sprayed tonight and it seemed to be richer than normal for a given bottle pressure. I will see if it continues. If it does, I may have gotten a very bad fill from my guy with lots of crap in it. It was a new guy this time and I completely forgot to ask if he uses an inline filter.
With the 75 shot in 2nd gear, the tires aren't even close to thinking about breaking lose. But all through 1st? haha That's fun!
With all the information you are providing in this thread alone, it will be a good read for future searchers. I know the info Jime has posted over 5 years ago has proven beneficial for me today. I will continue to bump this thread as I make progress in my nitrous project so others will know the exact problems I have had to overcome.
09-01-2007, 09:20 AM
#89
Originally Posted by Aaron92SE
It's nice to know you felt a good gain from switching feedline sizes. The guy at Dynotune said by upgrading to a 6an feedline will hurt you unless you are over a 200 shot. You just proved that statement wrong.
Yes, the MT slicks I have will be so much more useful if they were on 15x8 wheels, which is perfect for them. I will easily gain 1.5" on contact patch by going with a wide wheel!!! 1.5" in a LOT! With the 15x6 wheels I have, if I took a pic of the part of the slick that's actually touching the ground, you would laugh. But it held all motor, but not even close to holding even on a poorly functioning 50 shot. I wonder how much those Summit wheels weigh. I am a cheap perfectionist, so I hope to find a really light wheel, but for cheap at the same time.
Also, I sprayed tonight and it seemed to be richer than normal for a given bottle pressure. I will see if it continues. If it does, I may have gotten a very bad fill from my guy with lots of crap in it. It was a new guy this time and I completely forgot to ask if he uses an inline filter.
With the 75 shot in 2nd gear, the tires aren't even close to thinking about breaking lose. But all through 1st? haha That's fun!
With all the information you are providing in this thread alone, it will be a good read for future searchers. I know the info Jime has posted over 5 years ago has proven beneficial for me today. I will continue to bump this thread as I make progress in my nitrous project so others will know the exact problems I have had to overcome.
Yes, the MT slicks I have will be so much more useful if they were on 15x8 wheels, which is perfect for them. I will easily gain 1.5" on contact patch by going with a wide wheel!!! 1.5" in a LOT! With the 15x6 wheels I have, if I took a pic of the part of the slick that's actually touching the ground, you would laugh.
But it held all motor, but not even close to holding even on a poorly functioning 50 shot. I wonder how much those Summit wheels weigh. I am a cheap perfectionist, so I hope to find a really light wheel, but for cheap at the same time. Also, I sprayed tonight and it seemed to be richer than normal for a given bottle pressure. I will see if it continues. If it does, I may have gotten a very bad fill from my guy with lots of crap in it. It was a new guy this time and I completely forgot to ask if he uses an inline filter.
With the 75 shot in 2nd gear, the tires aren't even close to thinking about breaking lose. But all through 1st? haha That's fun!
With all the information you are providing in this thread alone, it will be a good read for future searchers. I know the info Jime has posted over 5 years ago has proven beneficial for me today. I will continue to bump this thread as I make progress in my nitrous project so others will know the exact problems I have had to overcome.
Wheels - the Summit wheel is 27lbs, I think, and most all steel wheels are comparable in weight. Wide alloy wheels are much lighter, and my M/T ET Drags are 18lbs each, but not so cheap. I use the American Racing 15x8 Outlaw II wheel for the M&H slicks, and they are a little heavier but can be purchased for around $80 on-line. ION also makes a comparable wheel. If you get an alloy wheel, and they are all intended for rear-wheel use, get one with no more than 4" backspacing and the most offset you can find - over 50mm. Clearance can be a problem on the front hub...
You can buy an in-line N2O filter for a few bucks, you know. Install it right at the nitrous solenoid. It sounds like you should do that.
If your tires on your lightened car will hold a 75-shot in second gear, then you may be ready for a second stage. You could start with a 50-50 combination and go from there. Probably shouldn't launch with a 75-shot and those tires - you'd just melt a hole in the pavement. I never liked the idea of a progressive controller - all those pulsing solenoids and fixed timers - bah - solenoids and relays for me!
Editorial comment:
Streetz used to have some advice in his sig about advice on nitrous - basically, don't listen to anybody's opinions. He's right. Everything I have put in this thread and others is based on my personal experiences, along with observations. I don't claim to be an expert, just have lots of scars and photos from the experiences. And a pretty quick 3300lb 3.0 automatic Maxima.
You also do the same thing, I notice - you provide details of what you tried and the outcomes of those tests. Better tires/wheels and two stages and you can bust into the 12s. Take videos.
09-01-2007, 02:06 PM
#90
Originally Posted by grey99max
It does take a longer purge to flush my 6AN line, because it is larger inside and is 16' long, from the trunk to the front. I was looking for the reason that my top-end power just faded away at the track, and so I took the 4AN line loose at both ends and tried to blow through it - not much happened. It's really restrictive, so I bought a NX -6AN Race Hose (three-layers) and you can blow through that one like a garden hose! It's my Alaskan pipeline.
Wheels - the Summit wheel is 27lbs, I think, and most all steel wheels are comparable in weight. Wide alloy wheels are much lighter, and my M/T ET Drags are 18lbs each, but not so cheap. I use the American Racing 15x8 Outlaw II wheel for the M&H slicks, and they are a little heavier but can be purchased for around $80 on-line. ION also makes a comparable wheel. If you get an alloy wheel, and they are all intended for rear-wheel use, get one with no more than 4" backspacing and the most offset you can find - over 50mm. Clearance can be a problem on the front hub...
You can buy an in-line N2O filter for a few bucks, you know. Install it right at the nitrous solenoid. It sounds like you should do that.
If your tires on your lightened car will hold a 75-shot in second gear, then you may be ready for a second stage. You could start with a 50-50 combination and go from there. Probably shouldn't launch with a 75-shot and those tires - you'd just melt a hole in the pavement. I never liked the idea of a progressive controller - all those pulsing solenoids and fixed timers - bah - solenoids and relays for me!
Editorial comment:
Streetz used to have some advice in his sig about advice on nitrous - basically, don't listen to anybody's opinions. He's right. Everything I have put in this thread and others is based on my personal experiences, along with observations. I don't claim to be an expert, just have lots of scars and photos from the experiences. And a pretty quick 3300lb 3.0 automatic Maxima.
You also do the same thing, I notice - you provide details of what you tried and the outcomes of those tests. Better tires/wheels and two stages and you can bust into the 12s. Take videos.
Wheels - the Summit wheel is 27lbs, I think, and most all steel wheels are comparable in weight. Wide alloy wheels are much lighter, and my M/T ET Drags are 18lbs each, but not so cheap. I use the American Racing 15x8 Outlaw II wheel for the M&H slicks, and they are a little heavier but can be purchased for around $80 on-line. ION also makes a comparable wheel. If you get an alloy wheel, and they are all intended for rear-wheel use, get one with no more than 4" backspacing and the most offset you can find - over 50mm. Clearance can be a problem on the front hub...
You can buy an in-line N2O filter for a few bucks, you know. Install it right at the nitrous solenoid. It sounds like you should do that.
If your tires on your lightened car will hold a 75-shot in second gear, then you may be ready for a second stage. You could start with a 50-50 combination and go from there. Probably shouldn't launch with a 75-shot and those tires - you'd just melt a hole in the pavement. I never liked the idea of a progressive controller - all those pulsing solenoids and fixed timers - bah - solenoids and relays for me!
Editorial comment:
Streetz used to have some advice in his sig about advice on nitrous - basically, don't listen to anybody's opinions. He's right. Everything I have put in this thread and others is based on my personal experiences, along with observations. I don't claim to be an expert, just have lots of scars and photos from the experiences. And a pretty quick 3300lb 3.0 automatic Maxima.
You also do the same thing, I notice - you provide details of what you tried and the outcomes of those tests. Better tires/wheels and two stages and you can bust into the 12s. Take videos.
But yeah, I know I can get a nitrous filter. I didn't think I needed one. Just today, I ran rich again with the 75 shot at my normal bottle pressure and it didn't pull as hard as it did yesterday. The only reason I don't have a nitrous filter yet is most people seem to stay away from them. I guess it could possibly hurt performance of the nitrous. Even the guy at Dynotune said he didn't like them. But he failed to give me a good answer as to why.
I also plan to shorten my feedline soon. I have 16' coiled up behind my driver's seat. All I need is no more than 10'.
The inconsistancy of my nitrous kit might be solved by getting a purge. So we'll see what happens when I get one. But inconsistancy isn't solved by doing a 3 second 2nd gear pull first. I do another pull and it's still feels the same. The initial quarter of a second of the first pull is the only difference, that is probably the air in the lines. If a purge doesn't fix it, I am going to mount the bottle in the middle of where my rear seat use to be. That way, it will be parallel to the car like it's suppose to be.
As for wheels, I think I'll stay away from steelies. The Millenia wheels I have now are 11lbs each. I can get 15x7 Kosei wheels or 15x7 Slipstreams and they are about 13-14lbs each. The 22" MT slicks recommend a 15x7 wheel, but a wheel one inch wider will definitely still work. It should be better.
I am still looking for a light and cheap 15x8 wheel just in case if I want to upgrade to a larger slick one day.
Do you ever spin the tires with just a 75 shot in 2nd gear? If you do with VLSD, then there might be something wrong with my setup.
09-01-2007, 02:57 PM
#91
Originally Posted by Aaron92SE
I didn't realize Jime used a progressive controller with the 150 shot. I thought I remember him saying he liked the normal dual stage better than the Maximizer. Not sure.
But yeah, I know I can get a nitrous filter. I didn't think I needed one. Just today, I ran rich again with the 75 shot at my normal bottle pressure and it didn't pull as hard as it did yesterday. The only reason I don't have a nitrous filter yet is most people seem to stay away from them. I guess it could possibly hurt performance of the nitrous. Even the guy at Dynotune said he didn't like them. But he failed to give me a good answer as to why.
I also plan to shorten my feedline soon. I have 16' coiled up behind my driver's seat. All I need is no more than 10'.
The inconsistency of my nitrous kit might be solved by getting a purge. So we'll see what happens when I get one. But inconsistancy isn't solved by doing a 3 second 2nd gear pull first. I do another pull and it's still feels the same. The initial quarter of a second of the first pull is the only difference, that is probably the air in the lines. If a purge doesn't fix it, I am going to mount the bottle in the middle of where my rear seat use to be. That way, it will be parallel to the car like it's suppose to be.
As for wheels, I think I'll stay away from steelies. The Millenia wheels I have now are 11lbs each. I can get 15x7 Kosei wheels or 15x7 Slipstreams and they are about 13-14lbs each. The 22" MT slicks recommend a 15x7 wheel, but a wheel one inch wider will definitely still work. It should be better.
I am still looking for a light and cheap 15x8 wheel just in case if I want to upgrade to a larger slick one day.
Do you ever spin the tires with just a 75 shot in 2nd gear? If you do with VLSD, then there might be something wrong with my setup.
But yeah, I know I can get a nitrous filter. I didn't think I needed one. Just today, I ran rich again with the 75 shot at my normal bottle pressure and it didn't pull as hard as it did yesterday. The only reason I don't have a nitrous filter yet is most people seem to stay away from them. I guess it could possibly hurt performance of the nitrous. Even the guy at Dynotune said he didn't like them. But he failed to give me a good answer as to why.
I also plan to shorten my feedline soon. I have 16' coiled up behind my driver's seat. All I need is no more than 10'.
The inconsistency of my nitrous kit might be solved by getting a purge. So we'll see what happens when I get one. But inconsistancy isn't solved by doing a 3 second 2nd gear pull first. I do another pull and it's still feels the same. The initial quarter of a second of the first pull is the only difference, that is probably the air in the lines. If a purge doesn't fix it, I am going to mount the bottle in the middle of where my rear seat use to be. That way, it will be parallel to the car like it's suppose to be.
As for wheels, I think I'll stay away from steelies. The Millenia wheels I have now are 11lbs each. I can get 15x7 Kosei wheels or 15x7 Slipstreams and they are about 13-14lbs each. The 22" MT slicks recommend a 15x7 wheel, but a wheel one inch wider will definitely still work. It should be better.
I am still looking for a light and cheap 15x8 wheel just in case if I want to upgrade to a larger slick one day.
Do you ever spin the tires with just a 75 shot in 2nd gear? If you do with VLSD, then there might be something wrong with my setup.
You can get the nitrous filters in a couple of sizes... a good one is a stainless screen inside an in-line adapter. It sounds like you need to do something, if you are having inconsistent results when spraying. Not good.
My car would spin the begeezus out of the slicks in first gear, at 75-shot, then spin them going into second gear with the Shift_fast controller shifting. I never really did many single-shot passes - just went into using the 2-stage setup. Now that setup would spin some slicks. Those 15" M&Hs with 8.5" on the ground spent a lot of time spinning and occasionally drifting around my lane. Fun.
09-01-2007, 03:20 PM
#92
Originally Posted by grey99max
I know Jime was a big user of the Maximizer, after he figured it out for his setup. I think he eventually sold it when he went to NA.
You can get the nitrous filters in a couple of sizes... a good one is a stainless screen inside an in-line adapter. It sounds like you need to do something, if you are having inconsistent results when spraying. Not good.
My car would spin the begeezus out of the slicks in first gear, at 75-shot, then spin them going into second gear with the Shift_fast controller shifting. I never really did many single-shot passes - just went into using the 2-stage setup. Now that setup would spin some slicks. Those 15" M&Hs with 8.5" on the ground spent a lot of time spinning and occasionally drifting around my lane. Fun.
You can get the nitrous filters in a couple of sizes... a good one is a stainless screen inside an in-line adapter. It sounds like you need to do something, if you are having inconsistent results when spraying. Not good.
My car would spin the begeezus out of the slicks in first gear, at 75-shot, then spin them going into second gear with the Shift_fast controller shifting. I never really did many single-shot passes - just went into using the 2-stage setup. Now that setup would spin some slicks. Those 15" M&Hs with 8.5" on the ground spent a lot of time spinning and occasionally drifting around my lane. Fun.
Have you ever sprayed a 75 shot on street tires from a 2nd gear roll? Do they ever think about breaking lose on the street?
Right now, on the street, the 75 shot activated above 20mph might break the tires lose a tiny bit. Sometimes it doesn't. That is my inconsistancy. But the tires always break lose during the 1-2 shift. They do that all motor. But I'm curious if you can break the tires lose at anytime in 2nd gear on street tires from a roll.
Dan at Dynotune claims that their shots are rated for HP at the crank. NX claims at the wheels I think. I asked him about the sizing of the nitrous jets they have compared to the sizes that NX offers. He didn't really know.
For a 75 shot, the Dynotune kit recommends a .042" nitrous jet. For an NX 75 shot, they recommend a .041" nitrous jet.
Now does that mean the Dynotune jet will flow more at a given pressure?
09-01-2007, 03:22 PM
#93
Originally Posted by Aaron92SE
I didn't realize Jime used a progressive controller with the 150 shot. I thought I remember him saying he liked the normal dual stage better than the Maximizer. Not sure.
oh yeah and it can also control a dual stage setup also and bring the 2nd at whatever time or rpm you want
I also plan to shorten my feedline soon. I have 16' coiled up behind my driver's seat. All I need is no more than 10'.
09-01-2007, 03:44 PM
#94
Originally Posted by t6378tp
the shorter line should help and do not forget your blow down tube
What about my blow tube? I already have one.
09-01-2007, 04:18 PM
#95
I've done a little bit more research. I can't find any real supporting information that proves that NX jets show wheel HP.
For instance, a .042" jet is going to always be .042" in size regardless of brand, correct?
So the term, 35, 50 and 75 shot should be used very loosely since it does not determine how much power you're putting down. What matters is the actual nitrous jet size you are using.
Anybody, please jump in if this sounds incorrect in any way.
For instance, a .042" jet is going to always be .042" in size regardless of brand, correct?
So the term, 35, 50 and 75 shot should be used very loosely since it does not determine how much power you're putting down. What matters is the actual nitrous jet size you are using.
Anybody, please jump in if this sounds incorrect in any way.
09-01-2007, 05:27 PM
#96
Originally Posted by Aaron92SE
The shorter line should decrease the amount of air in the lines and will waste less nitrous.
What about my blow tube? I already have one.
What about my blow tube? I already have one.
09-01-2007, 09:03 PM
#97
Originally Posted by Aaron92SE
I'm getting a filter immediately.
Have you ever sprayed a 75 shot on street tires from a 2nd gear roll? Do they ever think about breaking lose on the street?
Right now, on the street, the 75 shot activated above 20mph might break the tires lose a tiny bit. Sometimes it doesn't. That is my inconsistancy. But the tires always break lose during the 1-2 shift. They do that all motor. But I'm curious if you can break the tires lose at anytime in 2nd gear on street tires from a roll.
Dan at Dynotune claims that their shots are rated for HP at the crank. NX claims at the wheels I think. I asked him about the sizing of the nitrous jets they have compared to the sizes that NX offers. He didn't really know.
For a 75 shot, the Dynotune kit recommends a .042" nitrous jet. For an NX 75 shot, they recommend a .041" nitrous jet.
Now does that mean the Dynotune jet will flow more at a given
pressure?
Have you ever sprayed a 75 shot on street tires from a 2nd gear roll? Do they ever think about breaking lose on the street?
Right now, on the street, the 75 shot activated above 20mph might break the tires lose a tiny bit. Sometimes it doesn't. That is my inconsistancy. But the tires always break lose during the 1-2 shift. They do that all motor. But I'm curious if you can break the tires lose at anytime in 2nd gear on street tires from a roll.
Dan at Dynotune claims that their shots are rated for HP at the crank. NX claims at the wheels I think. I asked him about the sizing of the nitrous jets they have compared to the sizes that NX offers. He didn't really know.
For a 75 shot, the Dynotune kit recommends a .042" nitrous jet. For an NX 75 shot, they recommend a .041" nitrous jet.
Now does that mean the Dynotune jet will flow more at a given
pressure?
Spraying with street tires? No way - street tires go up in smoke in any gear, and I'm referring to BFG TA-Gforce 225/50/16 tires on ASA 16x7.5" wheels. Even the BFG DRs 255/50/16 (9.7" on the ground) won't hold well on the street. As of last fall, I can't use the DRs on the track anymore, either. ETs go up by a second or so when I try.
To quote NX:
"Q. How much of a horsepower increase can I expect from a nitrous system?
A. All NX systems make within 2% of their claimed horsepower, if you jet the system for 50 horsepower then you can expect no less than 49 horsepower, but usually a few more than the rated amount."
No mention of how the HP is measured - crank or wheel HP from the NX home page FAQs. ??? Interesting - I thought I remembered NX claiming wheel horsepower before. Google time...
Nitrous jets can flow differently, depending on the design (NX or NOS format) but I don't know any more about jet flows vs declared size. NX is rated between 900-1050 psi. Don't know about the others' nitrous pressures...
09-02-2007, 03:27 PM
#100
Originally Posted by absoundlab
good spark plug write up grey do you only use those plugs at the track or can you keep them in and use them on the road?
I guess a spark is all you really need - this hot and cold ranges stuff doesn't seem to make a difference in normal driving. ????
09-02-2007, 03:46 PM
#101
Originally Posted by grey99max
A filter can't hurt - is it possible you have a kink in the hose?? Try the blow-through thing - maybe you're not passing enough gas here.
Spraying with street tires? No way - street tires go up in smoke in any gear, and I'm referring to BFG TA-Gforce 225/50/16 tires on ASA 16x7.5" wheels. Even the BFG DRs 255/50/16 (9.7" on the ground) won't hold well on the street. As of last fall, I can't use the DRs on the track anymore, either. ETs go up by a second or so when I try.
Spraying with street tires? No way - street tires go up in smoke in any gear, and I'm referring to BFG TA-Gforce 225/50/16 tires on ASA 16x7.5" wheels. Even the BFG DRs 255/50/16 (9.7" on the ground) won't hold well on the street. As of last fall, I can't use the DRs on the track anymore, either. ETs go up by a second or so when I try.
But I am only talking about the 75 shot. Are you telling me you can spin the street tires and/or DRs WITH THE 75 SHOT in 2nd or 3rd gear?
If you can spin the DRs with ONLY a 75 shot from a 50mph roll in 2nd gear, then there is DEFINITELY something wrong with my nitrous!
I have two step colder plugs I plan to install tomorrow. Until then, I won't spray the 75 shot again. I plan to install the plugs and sidegap them and do some dyno runs. I will start with stock timing and see if I can get it to detonate with the 75 shot in hot weather. Then I'll try to advance the base timing 1-2 degrees at a time until I see detonation on the plugs after a run. I doubt I will be able to advance the timing much before I see speckles on the insulator.
It's been SO long since I drove my car with stock timing. I know exactly why I feel a wierd surge, even when the bottle is full. With stock timing, the VE sucks! Take one ride on my car and you'll agree. Without nitrous, the car is very slow and the powerband isn't smooth at all. Today, I advanced the timing by 5 degrees and it's SO much more powerful NA. Easily over 4 tenths in the 1/4 mile just b/c of having 20* instead of 15*. Of course, I won't spray with advanced timing until I have it tuned properly.
09-02-2007, 04:09 PM
#102
Originally Posted by Aaron92SE
Can you please be more specific about street tire traction? You said that while spraying on street tires, the tires spin no matter which gear. I am assuming you are referring to your 150 shot since you said you can spin them in 3rd gear.
But I am only talking about the 75 shot. Are you telling me you can spin the street tires and/or DRs WITH THE 75 SHOT in 2nd or 3rd gear?
If you can spin the DRs with ONLY a 75 shot from a 50mph roll in 2nd gear, then there is DEFINITELY something wrong with my nitrous!
I have two step colder plugs I plan to install tomorrow. Until then, I won't spray the 75 shot again. I plan to install the plugs and sidegap them and do some dyno runs. I will start with stock timing and see if I can get it to detonate with the 75 shot in hot weather. Then I'll try to advance the base timing 1-2 degrees at a time until I see detonation on the plugs after a run. I doubt I will be able to advance the timing much before I see speckles on the insulator.
It's been SO long since I drove my car with stock timing. I know exactly why I feel a wierd surge, even when the bottle is full. With stock timing, the VE sucks! Take one ride on my car and you'll agree. Without nitrous, the car is very slow and the powerband isn't smooth at all. Today, I advanced the timing by 5 degrees and it's SO much more powerful NA. Easily over 4 tenths in the 1/4 mile just b/c of having 20* instead of 15*. Of course, I won't spray with advanced timing until I have it tuned properly.
But I am only talking about the 75 shot. Are you telling me you can spin the street tires and/or DRs WITH THE 75 SHOT in 2nd or 3rd gear?
If you can spin the DRs with ONLY a 75 shot from a 50mph roll in 2nd gear, then there is DEFINITELY something wrong with my nitrous!
I have two step colder plugs I plan to install tomorrow. Until then, I won't spray the 75 shot again. I plan to install the plugs and sidegap them and do some dyno runs. I will start with stock timing and see if I can get it to detonate with the 75 shot in hot weather. Then I'll try to advance the base timing 1-2 degrees at a time until I see detonation on the plugs after a run. I doubt I will be able to advance the timing much before I see speckles on the insulator.
It's been SO long since I drove my car with stock timing. I know exactly why I feel a wierd surge, even when the bottle is full. With stock timing, the VE sucks! Take one ride on my car and you'll agree. Without nitrous, the car is very slow and the powerband isn't smooth at all. Today, I advanced the timing by 5 degrees and it's SO much more powerful NA. Easily over 4 tenths in the 1/4 mile just b/c of having 20* instead of 15*. Of course, I won't spray with advanced timing until I have it tuned properly.
"If you can spin the DRs with ONLY a 75 shot from a 50mph roll in 2nd gear, then there is DEFINITELY something wrong with my nitrous!" Yes, I can, with the pipeline.
Why don't you try some pure race fuel? The stuff is made to inhibit preignition and detonation when using nitrous. I use a stock '99 ECU which has, I believe, 17* of advance, and I had no problems. Look up VP Racing Street Blaze 103 or Sunoco 104 octane and read the specs. Either one is a nitrous racers' dream.
Then you can throw in more advance and survive the experience. That's my experience. And cut the grounds and side-gap the plugs. In another week, you'll sound like me. Heh.
09-02-2007, 04:22 PM
#103
Originally Posted by grey99max
"If you can spin the DRs with ONLY a 75 shot from a 50mph roll in 2nd gear, then there is DEFINITELY something wrong with my nitrous!" Yes, I can, with the pipeline.
I plan to use that specifically for track days with higher nitrous shots.I am tuning my 75 shot to handle pump fuel right now. I will make another program strictly for 114 octane fuel in the coming few weeks.
Do you remember if you were able to break your tires lose from a 50mph roll in 2nd gear with the 4an feedline? I am trying to get an idea if my nitrous is performing like it should.
09-02-2007, 08:08 PM
#104
Originally Posted by Aaron92SE
I know what race fuel is used for. I plan to use that specifically for track days with higher nitrous shots.
I am tuning my 75 shot to handle pump fuel right now. I will make another program strictly for 114 octane fuel in the coming few weeks.
Do you remember if you were able to break your tires lose from a 50mph roll in 2nd gear with the 4an feedline? I am trying to get an idea if my nitrous is performing like it should.
I plan to use that specifically for track days with higher nitrous shots.I am tuning my 75 shot to handle pump fuel right now. I will make another program strictly for 114 octane fuel in the coming few weeks.
Do you remember if you were able to break your tires lose from a 50mph roll in 2nd gear with the 4an feedline? I am trying to get an idea if my nitrous is performing like it should.
Sorry - I don't remember that one ever happening... I try to avoid uncontrolled tire spinning while spraying on the street...
Does this mean you are focusing on the 75-shot now? Didn't take long, did it? About seven days.. The stuff is addictive.
.
09-02-2007, 08:21 PM
#105
Originally Posted by grey99max
OK - so I like to repeat myself a few times...
Sorry - I don't remember that one ever happening... I try to avoid uncontrolled tire spinning while spraying on the street...
Does this mean you are focusing on the 75-shot now? Didn't take long, did it? About seven days.. The stuff is addictive.
.
Sorry - I don't remember that one ever happening... I try to avoid uncontrolled tire spinning while spraying on the street...
Does this mean you are focusing on the 75-shot now? Didn't take long, did it? About seven days.. The stuff is addictive.
.
I just wanted to make sure you weren't saying you could spin the tires from a 2nd gear roll with a 75 shot with 4an feedline. B/c if you could, then I have MAJOR problems with my setup since I should have more traction problems than you just due to me being lighter and not having DRs on the street.
So, with a 75 shot with 6an feedline, you have 2nd gear traction problems? But with 75 shot w/ 4an feedline, you don't remember ever being able to spin them in 2nd?
If a larger feedline has such a HUGE gain, then why do nitrous companies claim there is no reason to upgrade until you are running an insanely large shot? Dynotune said 200+ and someone on a forum said NX told them the 6an isn't needed until 400+ shot. If there is a gain to be had on a 75 shot, then I might as well upgrade the line now.
09-02-2007, 08:54 PM
#106
Originally Posted by Aaron92SE
Of course I try to have traction too, but as I mentioned above, I am only trying to find out if my nitrous system is performing up to par.
I just wanted to make sure you weren't saying you could spin the tires from a 2nd gear roll with a 75 shot with 4an feedline. B/c if you could, then I have MAJOR problems with my setup since I should have more traction problems than you just due to me being lighter and not having DRs on the street.
So, with a 75 shot with 6an feedline, you have 2nd gear traction problems? But with 75 shot w/ 4an feedline, you don't remember ever being able to spin them in 2nd?
If a larger feedline has such a HUGE gain, then why do nitrous companies claim there is no reason to upgrade until you are running an insanely large shot? Dynotune said 200+ and someone on a forum said NX told them the 6an isn't needed until 400+ shot. If there is a gain to be had on a 75 shot, then I might as well upgrade the line now.
I just wanted to make sure you weren't saying you could spin the tires from a 2nd gear roll with a 75 shot with 4an feedline. B/c if you could, then I have MAJOR problems with my setup since I should have more traction problems than you just due to me being lighter and not having DRs on the street.
So, with a 75 shot with 6an feedline, you have 2nd gear traction problems? But with 75 shot w/ 4an feedline, you don't remember ever being able to spin them in 2nd?
If a larger feedline has such a HUGE gain, then why do nitrous companies claim there is no reason to upgrade until you are running an insanely large shot? Dynotune said 200+ and someone on a forum said NX told them the 6an isn't needed until 400+ shot. If there is a gain to be had on a 75 shot, then I might as well upgrade the line now.
I'm quite sure I gained a lot of top-end power with the 6AN pipeline. A 16' 4AN line can't supply my 150-shot drain. The difference is - dramatic - but I broke the car before I could document it. If you read my older threads, I think I mentioned that. Remember, for that last season, on the track, I was spraying a 75-shot just to launch and was into the second 75-shot in the middle of first gear. I sure can't do that on the street - with any tires I've ever tried.
If Dynotune says 200+ and NX's forum says 400+, well then it must be true - whichever one you choose.
I choose my own experiences, like race gas and cut-ground plugs and coil-booster power supplies and 3" exhaust. Stuff that works for me.
09-02-2007, 08:57 PM
#107
Originally Posted by grey99max
"So, with a 75 shot with 6an feedline, you have 2nd gear traction problems? But with 75 shot w/ 4an feedline, you don't remember ever being able to spin them in 2nd?" Correct. I've been spraying for - ? three years ?- and hit the tracks hard. I sure don't remember everything that happened, especially when messing around on the street.... One or two visits per week add up, plus all the street "tuning".
I'm quite sure I gained a lot of top-end power with the 6AN pipeline. A 16' 4AN line can't supply my 150-shot drain. The difference is - dramatic - but I broke the car before I could document it. If you read my older threads, I think I mentioned that.
If Dynotune says 200+ and NX's forum says 400+, well then it must be true - whichever one you choose.
I choose my own experiences, like race gas and cut-ground plugs and coil-booster power supplies and 3" exhaust. Works for me.
I'm quite sure I gained a lot of top-end power with the 6AN pipeline. A 16' 4AN line can't supply my 150-shot drain. The difference is - dramatic - but I broke the car before I could document it. If you read my older threads, I think I mentioned that.
If Dynotune says 200+ and NX's forum says 400+, well then it must be true - whichever one you choose.
I choose my own experiences, like race gas and cut-ground plugs and coil-booster power supplies and 3" exhaust. Works for me.
09-03-2007, 12:12 AM
#109
Why not wait for a dyno aaron n see what ur nitrous is putting out. I was just like you when i first started with nitrous, was never sure how the car was running, one day felt weak, another day felt insane, it was just random as far as butt dyno. I went to a dynojet with 50shot, and gained exacly 50hp. So just wait for the dyno..
09-03-2007, 08:02 AM
#110
Originally Posted by streetzlegend
Why not wait for a dyno aaron n see what ur nitrous is putting out. I was just like you when i first started with nitrous, was never sure how the car was running, one day felt weak, another day felt insane, it was just random as far as butt dyno. I went to a dynojet with 50shot, and gained exacly 50hp. So just wait for the dyno..
I just haven't had time.But you say you gained exactly 50whp with a 50 shot? A 50 shot jet for NX is .035". I have heard other people say they gained the exact wheel HP for the NX jet they installed. I wonder why that is!
Here is a good link comparing all the different nozzles:
http://centralfloridastreetcars.com/nozzleshootout.html
You'll see that with a 150 shot of nitrous, the NX Shark only did about 120rwhp. The NOS and Dynotune jets were in the same ballpark too.
So if you saw a 50whp gain with a .035" jet, then that is really good.
I am probably going to dyno my setup today. I'll make sure to post results.
09-03-2007, 08:09 AM
#111
Originally Posted by SonicDust187
I am 5spd in I had no problem hooking in 2nd gear from a roll with 75 shot. But they were on the verge of loosing it.
09-03-2007, 09:28 AM
#113
I don't know how low you have previously gone with your air pressure in your slicks, but I've found 15 is way too high. I run my slicks at 11.5psi and found that worked the best. Anything lower than 11.0 and my traps started to go down noticeably, but there was no difference in trap speed going from 15 to 11.5 (I usually start them around 14-15psi and then drop in 1psi increments each run as I get a feel for what the track can hold, but each time I went, I found 11.5psi to be where I liked it so after about 150 runs on slicks I had a good idea of what I like to use).
09-03-2007, 10:35 AM
#114
Originally Posted by Nealoc187
I don't know how low you have previously gone with your air pressure in your slicks, but I've found 15 is way too high. I run my slicks at 11.5psi and found that worked the best. Anything lower than 11.0 and my traps started to go down noticeably, but there was no difference in trap speed going from 15 to 11.5 (I usually start them around 14-15psi and then drop in 1psi increments each run as I get a feel for what the track can hold, but each time I went, I found 11.5psi to be where I liked it so after about 150 runs on slicks I had a good idea of what I like to use).
I might be able to go 12psi on these slicks, but that's as low as you want to go with these tiny 22" slicks.
And from changing the pressure from 20psi to 15psi, my traps suffered by 2mph. But then again, my car was running inconsistant that day.
About the slipstreams, that's what I had my eye on. But, I didn't find 15x8 slipstreams in 5x114.3. I looked at the machiii website and didn't see them. I'll keep looking. Thanks.
09-03-2007, 11:55 AM
#115
lol no I use 26" slicks, my next ones will probably be 27s actually. 22s with the power my car makes I'd be shifting into 5th at 1000' probably...
15x8" 5x114.3s are listed on the Rota Wheels website and I've seen them on ebay from time to time - they might just be rare enough that most wheel places don't bother to list them.
15x8" 5x114.3s are listed on the Rota Wheels website and I've seen them on ebay from time to time - they might just be rare enough that most wheel places don't bother to list them.
09-03-2007, 12:01 PM
#116
Originally Posted by Nealoc187
lol no I use 26" slicks, my next ones will probably be 27s actually. 22s with the power my car makes I'd be shifting into 5th at 1000' probably...
15x8" 5x114.3s are listed on the Rota Wheels website and I've seen them on ebay from time to time - they might just be rare enough that most wheel places don't bother to list them.
15x8" 5x114.3s are listed on the Rota Wheels website and I've seen them on ebay from time to time - they might just be rare enough that most wheel places don't bother to list them.
Thanks Neal. 15x8 Rotas are much cheaper than the Kosei wheels.
09-04-2007, 09:39 AM
#118
Originally Posted by DandyMax
Wow Aaron went nitrous..
Takin' the easy way out are ya?... er .. I mean, congratulations...
I can certainly understand the need for more speed. 13 flat is dog slow to me.
Takin' the easy way out are ya?... er .. I mean, congratulations...
I can certainly understand the need for more speed. 13 flat is dog slow to me.
After that, I will try to see what I can do on a race fuel program tuned for just a 75 shot.
I thought it was time for me to do something, especially with my new business NWP Engineering. It looks good to have some impressive 1/4 mile times on your project car.
And my turbo goal is so far away, so I went the easy way and got nitrous for right now. I will always have nitrous, but hopefully the turbo will be added within the next couple years.
09-04-2007, 10:01 AM
#119
Yeah I'm just givin' you a hard time Aaron, I understand why you did it, especially with the business. (is that going well? hope so).
To each his own though, you'll never see nitrous on my car.
As a side OT note I'm 95% ready to fire up my new DEK-based setup, in the next day or 2 it will be running, so as soon as the clutch breaks in I'm going to the track to chase my long awaited 12's.
To each his own though, you'll never see nitrous on my car.
As a side OT note I'm 95% ready to fire up my new DEK-based setup, in the next day or 2 it will be running, so as soon as the clutch breaks in I'm going to the track to chase my long awaited 12's.
09-04-2007, 10:19 AM
#120
Originally Posted by DandyMax
Yeah I'm just givin' you a hard time Aaron, I understand why you did it, especially with the business. (is that going well? hope so).
To each his own though, you'll never see nitrous on my car.
As a side OT note I'm 95% ready to fire up my new DEK-based setup, in the next day or 2 it will be running, so as soon as the clutch breaks in I'm going to the track to chase my long awaited 12's.
To each his own though, you'll never see nitrous on my car.
As a side OT note I'm 95% ready to fire up my new DEK-based setup, in the next day or 2 it will be running, so as soon as the clutch breaks in I'm going to the track to chase my long awaited 12's.
The business is going just fine. I'm sponsoring a huge Maxima meet in Miami at the end of Sept. That should be fun!
To get those 12s, just make sure you run with the same or better density altitude as you did before. You might have to wait until the weather gets a little cooler. With my 13.7, I ran in 55 degrees, which was pretty good since it gave me a -601' DA. I remember the first time I busted a 14 second run. That was done in -1500' DA! I wish I can repeat those conditions again!