The electronic fmu will be about $400, and the injectors are $500(guessing) I think I should be good with the right tuning with just 440c, or maybe I can push it up to 550's. Regardless of the fact, im ready to spend money, and im dumping alot of money into this vq35 motor like I said before, I have done the research and I know what it takes. With that electronic fmu, u can set the fuel curve yourself according to the boost, which means im going to have to def tune on a dyno with a wideband. Im just trying to run 15psi, and I think I have the right setup to do that, tell me if im wrong.

Garett GT35R turbo
Hks bov
tial 40mm wastegate
aeromotive electronic fmu
440c or 550c fuel injectors
walbro 255 fuel pump
spec clutch
spec flywheel
greddy 24x12x3 intercooler
greddy emanage ultimate(optional if I can't tune with a super afc and aero fmu)
arp head studs
ferra valves and valve retainers
arias low compression 8:5:1 pistons
crowler rods
aem wideband air/fuel gauge
greddy boost controller
bore and sleeve the block(optional)
Metal head gasket

I might have missed a few things, but this project is going to be big, some may think im bsing and some may say it's worthless without pics, but im trying to keep in on the low and just post pics when the project is done. Some may say im wasting a whole leap of money on my motor, maybe, but I want to so............

I got quoted $2700 to do the custom piping, to install the kit, to put the injectors, fuel pump, pistons, rods, emanage,clutch, flywheel, and everything associated with the setup that needs to be done like oil return lines,fittings,couplers,brakets, he's doing all of that for me, so I don't have to worry about buying that stuff. It's big money, plus I have money set aside for any problems(I know I will run into a few) but watching mardi and pimpjuice I felt I had to go forward with an exclusive project, ssr looked good, but they ran into problems so I felt I will build my own kit. Do you guys think it's worth it, not that it's going to change my mind, just wanted to know what the org thought of it........

 

Your setup is going to run you more than you expect, you never know with turbo, like they said you should have the money before you start your project just in case you run into problems, and if you don't, better not start the project at all. You really think my turbo will be more than your kit(garrett gt35r $1299) it's not going to happen, your going to spend atleast $3000 or you must be getting alot of cheap used parts that will fail and cause you more of a headache........correct me if im wrong.......be ready to spend the money, or don't spend it at all.........

 

Couldn't have said it better.

 

He told me the intake manifold(vq35s) are a little restrictive, remember im doing this setup on a vq35, you have the vq30 so our intake manfilds are different. The person that told me is boosted just like you running 12psi, and he works at nissan so I thought he might know. But he also told me that I can run 12psi on stock internals, with the right fuel, when everyone in there mama knows that vq35's are higher compression than you guys(vq30) and I can't run more than 7psi with the cheap and weak stock rods. So maybe he is lying, I guess I will just have to wait and break the motor in for 1000 miles after the pistons and rods are in and the setup is done, and when getting it tuned set the boost to 15psi, and see what happends. My guess is as good as you guys right know being that it has only been done once to a vq35......

 

I figure I might as well chime in also. For my setup, I spent a little over $3K in parts. This does not include the clutch or gauges. I also did not buy AN fittings, a turbo timer, or things like that. I used high pressure rubber fuel lines and had SS braided oil lines cut and fitted by a local hose shop. I did buy all new parts though, but I found the best deals that I could on things. It took me close to 100 hours to completely install the turbo, including cutting and welding the pipes from misc. bends that I bought. You can do a turbo for under 2K, but very few people have done it reliably. On a side note, you will need to buy a wideband o2 sensor also, which run around $300. Unless you have your car dyno-tuned, running without one of these isn't a good idea.

 

Well actually, I know 3 people personally who are running 9-11psi on stock VQ35s. VQ35 rods are stronger than VQ30 rods are. I don't know where the rumor got started that they are weaker, but I'd like to smack the guy who started that rumor around a bit, because its false. The rod bolts are what is weak on the VQ35, and that becomes an issue when you rev over about 7200rpm, but isn't a powerhandling issue. If you are referring to all those jagoffs who blow up their cars with greddy turbo kits... its the tuning. They try to run higher than what they are tuned for without accounting for it, boom they blow up motors. Most of those guys are FI noobs. They've got more money than knowledge so they have expensive cars and expensive turbo kits, but they don't know that you can't just crank the boost on your E-01 and not blow things up if you aren't tuned appropriately. APS TT kits are 9lbs right out of the box, and there are tens if not hundreds of guys on the Z forums alone who have been running those kits daily for over a year.

As far as the intake manifold thing goes, I think that guy is not exactly the best source of info. I wouldn't put much stock into what he's saying.

And your previous post about the 440s vs 550s confused me a little, but you are planning on upping the fuel pressure right? Because you WON'T be able to get 15psi on 440s on stock 4th gen FP, but if 3.5L base FP is higher, you may be able to pull it off. I'd got with the 550s and leave yourself some headroom for the future too, because I doubt you will be happy with 15psi forever. That's a crapload of power, but if you've got a built motor that can handle more than 15psi easily, you are probably gonna wanna try it at some point. It would suck to have already maxed out your injectors and then have to change them yet again because you didn't go large enough in the first place. Trust me... too much is never enough

 

Well I plan on trying to run anywhere from 12-15psi so I misewell do the motor over now, and just build it up now because like you said, I do plan on pushing more boost out in the future.

Im not sure how much FP the vq35's push out, but you mean to tell me if I get a walbro fuel pump, 550c injectors, and greddy emanage ultimate, and aeromototive electronic fmu, I still wont be able to run 15psi? I know my car is a fuel returnless car, so I would have to shell out more money and make a fuel return for my car which would be another $1000 and im trying to save that. I figured the parts that I said above would give me enough leeway to run 15psi, but I could be wrong. If not, i guess im going to have to make a fuel return line after all.......

 

Thanks for the replies guys, especially Neal. I suppose I do need a nose of reality, and "double" isn't seeming so unrealistic now. Oh well, I s'pose there's no use in cutting corners, even if they're safe ones

Oh, and, sorry Mike. No hard feelings if it felt like I was being an @$$ to you

 

No I said that 440's would not work.

I just did a little research for you (but if you wanna build up a turbo max and keep it in one piece you gotta start doin this stuff yourself bro )

Stock 3.5L FP is 51psi, lets call it 56psi with the walbro installed. With a BSFC of .60 (about as low as you want with a turbo car, .60-.65 is what they say to use) and a target max IDC of 80%, you will need injectors with a static flow of 610cc (608 actually) to get 525chp, which is about 450whp (about what you'd be looking at your target 15psi).

Caveat - which I mentioned before, if you raise your FP even more, you can get more flow out of smaller injectors. But you would have to raise your FP to 95PSI to get 440s to support that kind of hp (450whp). 95PSI FP is asking for trouble in a BIG way. Like, almost certain injector failure I'd say. And if an injector fails while you are trying to make 450whp, something else is going to fail too, probably a head gasket, ring land, rod, etc. That's bad, especially if you just dropped $3500 on building that motor.

There are alot of different combinations you could use to get the flow rate needed for 450whp. But alot of those combinations are going to lead you down an expensive and very maddening road. So it all comes down to what you are comfortable doing really. If you are comfortable installing mini-injectors and running insane fuel pressures go for it, but honestly I wouldn't expect a car running 440s and 95psi boosting 15psi to be running for more than a few days or weeks before the motor goes Hiroshima.

 

Well I guess I would have to get 610c's like you said, but what do I do about the FP. Will I be able to raise the fp using the stock fp, with 610c's,walbro fuel pump, electronic fmu? I really don't want to go the fuel return setup because that's going to cost much more bucks, but what other options do I have. Someone told me I am doing everything electronically like: greddy emanage, electronic fmu, but he said im going to have to do it mechanically like: fpr,fuel pump, injectors. Basically what im saying, can I run a raise the fuel pressure enough to handle 15psi on a stock fp? I don't mind with going with big injectors if that's the case, I just don't want my motor to blow.

 

do you know how a returnless fuel pressure system works? Fuel still returns to the tank, it just does not go into the rail. i just recently learned that. if you go with a fpr like aem, using it to make a returnless system is very easy. if not, it is also simple to convert it to a return style system. Also, the 610cc's will cost you as well as something that will be able to handle it. if you go with a smaller injector, you will need more like a cartech/begi or vortech sfmu because you won't have something that fine tune that fuel pressure curve. and thats just the beginning of your problems.

I don't mean to ream you , but there is a lot to learn about fuel setups. once you start piecing all of the components together, drawing yourself some diagrams help, you will start to understand what is needed.

 

oh yeah, and formulas are your friend.

 

I just spoke to SR20DEN about the 5th gen fuel pressure and he said you won't see any rise in fuel pressure with a walbro pump on a 3.5, or at least he didn't so instead of 56psi its going to be 51psi, and your injector requirement is going to go up some more. You can raise fuel pressure safely to a certain extent. What that extent is exactly I don't know because my system doesn't raise fuel pressure, I use large enough injectors to supply all my fuel at stock pressure.

Also keep in mind with the above calculations that I did, 610cc is the minimum size you would want if you want to hit your ~450whp goal according to those calculations. That leaves you no headroom at all. If you decide to up it to 17psi or whatever, you are going to have to change things again (either raise FP, get even bigger injectors, resign yourself to using higher and higher IDC, etc).

 

i'm wondering how everyone thinks that 450whp in a fwd car is streetable.

Neal-don't you turn down the boost for daily use? (or do you use your winter beater)

 

It's streetable in 4th gear I haven't had much occasion to drive the car really I've been working on it 90% of the time, but I don't floor it around town anyways. Pretty much only getting on the highway and if I happen to get a wide open stretch I might give it a blast. The rest of the time I just drive normal.

 

What size injectors are you using to keep your stock fuel pressure and run enough boost to avoid going lean? And how much psi are you running?

Also What about this aeromotive fuel pump?

Aeromotive Eliminator Fuel Pump, P/N 11104

For high horsepower EFI applications making up to: 900 HP - forced air induction 1200 HP - EFI naturally aspirated

If you need a bit more fuel flow than the A1000 can give you, choose the Eliminator to provide more flow under boost conditions. Designed for forced air induction machines running on the street, at the track, or in the water, this pump gives you the unequalled durability of the A1000 pump with about 35% more flow at pressure. Proprietary aerospace composite technology is built into the patent-pending "dual chamber" pumping mechanism.

Pump flow exceeds 650lbs. per hour @ 13.5 Volts and 45 PSI. Inlet port is -12 AN, outlet port is -10 AN. A type II bright dip anodized coating provides a protective, beautiful high luster finish for the pump body and end-caps.

I was checking spgracing.com, and I saw this pump, im pretty sure this pump would raise the fuel pressure a bit better than the walbro, but im not sure how many people have tried it, so I guess I will be the first. I don't plan on going higher than 15psi, infact thats the most I would choose to go, for the time being atleast. Let me know your opinions of this fuel pump guys, im pretty sure this is better than the walbro pump. Basically im dead locked on all the rest of my turbo parts, it seems like this fuel setup is a little more complicated than I thought. Please give me some more info and feedback guys,thanks.........

 

So your saying I can use the aem fpr for my kit to raise the fuel pressure even more? And how easy is it to make a fuel return line, do you know a write up? I planned on going with the 610cc injectors, and using the aeromotive fmu to tune the fuel curve. Any more opinions, im all ears.

 

SR20DEN is the man to talk to about a returnless setup. i have only glanced at his diagram, but the way stephen max explained it last week made me comprehend it a little more. the reason why i said the aem is that it has two inlet ports as well as a gauge port.

basically the fpr is before the fuel rail. the inlets are from the tank=>fuel filter=>inlet port 1 on the FPR=>through the outlet=>Fuel Rail=>inlet part 2 on fpr.

someone correct me if i'm wrong. i know that sr20den's setup includes a t, but i thought this way was similar.

 

okay. i admit, it was a prehatched idea. but the dsm turbo (if big enough) would be a good choice being water cooled. i have since moved from modding a maxima to buying a very small cheap car to work on. thanks for the flames/advice. i am reading the book Maximum boost, and it is very good. i thought of this idea though before i got the book. the main reason for the post though was not the turbo, but what would need to be changed, and to what. for these are things specific to the maxima that i can not necessarily read in books.