Possible part out....
04-10-2012, 02:14 PM
#81
well it probably happened because timing skipped. The only way to see whether timing is really messed up if you turn it over until it goes to cylinder 1 TDC and see what the timing is then.
Valve lifter clearance is also a think he should have checked.
and that picture does look misaligned.
Valve lifter clearance is also a think he should have checked.
and that picture does look misaligned.
04-10-2012, 02:43 PM
#82
04-11-2012, 08:05 AM
#83
I disagree, that perceived misalignment is normal. There is no adjustment in the alignment of the hydraulic tensioner or actual chain slider. Neither of those components have sloping slots at their fastening points. Its look "off" because the plunger isn't extended. Under pressure, that plunger will stick out about 1" and both plunger and chain guide seat (which moves outs) should be very close to concentric.
BUT, what doesn't look right is the fact that the plunger is almost fully "in" without having a pin (paper clip, pushpin, etc.) that goes in that little hole. That tensioner has a beefy spring that helps keep tension during no-oil conditions (i.e. startup). I recall always having trouble introducing a pin that hole due to that spring. If you remove it, that plunger should jump out. If it doesn't, then that tensionser could be bad, and potentially the culprit for a skipped tooth.
My $.02
BUT, what doesn't look right is the fact that the plunger is almost fully "in" without having a pin (paper clip, pushpin, etc.) that goes in that little hole. That tensioner has a beefy spring that helps keep tension during no-oil conditions (i.e. startup). I recall always having trouble introducing a pin that hole due to that spring. If you remove it, that plunger should jump out. If it doesn't, then that tensionser could be bad, and potentially the culprit for a skipped tooth.
My $.02
04-11-2012, 08:12 AM
#84
BTW, don't remove any of the timing equipment until you have confirmed that you have skipped tooth. You will have to rotate the crank more than a few times to get everything to align. The crank is easier to turn when you don't have spark plugs and when the throttle body is open.
04-11-2012, 11:45 AM
#86
BTW, don't remove any of the timing equipment until you have confirmed that you have skipped tooth. You will have to rotate the crank more than a few times to get everything to align. The crank is easier to turn when you don't have spark plugs and when the throttle body is open.
Thanks for the input, its greatly appreciated!
04-11-2012, 12:52 PM
#87
LOL you funny ... in a dumb way ... but i like that LOL
*raises hand*
i actually cracked mine last year at the track at IFO
but thats after thousands of miles of spraying the **** out of it and abuse 5 nights a week
seems odd though ... def the guy that built it screwed something up
i wouldn't part it out ... you have a nice little panda there ... buy a new motor and slap it in
i actually cracked mine last year at the track at IFO
but thats after thousands of miles of spraying the **** out of it and abuse 5 nights a week
seems odd though ... def the guy that built it screwed something up
i wouldn't part it out ... you have a nice little panda there ... buy a new motor and slap it in
04-11-2012, 12:53 PM
#88
Your comment of "that is not correct" does nothing for the OP. Next time you feel like giving an opinion, at least back it up with a methodical and logical explanation for the perceived mechanical anomaly.
04-11-2012, 05:32 PM
#89
Apparently my long winded explanation still wasn't enough since you still didn't understand that the concentric misalignment in the picture "IS" the way its should be in that state of operation.
Your comment of "that is not correct" does nothing for the OP. Next time you feel like giving an opinion, at least back it up with a methodical and logical explanation for the perceived mechanical anomaly.
Your comment of "that is not correct" does nothing for the OP. Next time you feel like giving an opinion, at least back it up with a methodical and logical explanation for the perceived mechanical anomaly.
04-18-2012, 07:53 AM
#91
A bit of an update.
We checked the timing, everything lined up and the cams were in the correct position so it doesnt appear to be the issue.
Pulled the heads and WOW.
Right now, it could've been due to two different things. Either the valve clearance wasnt correct for that one piston resulting in the valve smacking the pistion until it bent, then puncturing the piston and then finishing off the valves or the valve could have simply broke and the fragments destroyed everything else.
Right now the damage is to that piston, head, and one of the exhaust cams. Looks like when the valve hit the pistion it jarred the cam assembly upward causing it to smack the shim against the cam lobe and bending the shim, and the upward force destroyed the end of the camshaft. So what I previously thought was a piece of a broken cam adapter was actually the end of the camshaft.
THE CARNAGE:
But on another note, I had this come in the other day,...
Its got just under 50k, So the plan is for the Panda to be around for a bit longer.
We checked the timing, everything lined up and the cams were in the correct position so it doesnt appear to be the issue.
Pulled the heads and WOW.
Right now, it could've been due to two different things. Either the valve clearance wasnt correct for that one piston resulting in the valve smacking the pistion until it bent, then puncturing the piston and then finishing off the valves or the valve could have simply broke and the fragments destroyed everything else.
Right now the damage is to that piston, head, and one of the exhaust cams. Looks like when the valve hit the pistion it jarred the cam assembly upward causing it to smack the shim against the cam lobe and bending the shim, and the upward force destroyed the end of the camshaft. So what I previously thought was a piece of a broken cam adapter was actually the end of the camshaft.
THE CARNAGE:
But on another note, I had this come in the other day,...
Its got just under 50k, So the plan is for the Panda to be around for a bit longer.
04-18-2012, 10:48 AM
#94
@Flava
man you should take some more artsy pics or photoshop those pics a little and those would be frame worthy. Don't think i came across damage like this on the forum yet.
Good luck with your new engine build! Get the rev ups with properly specd adapters
too bad you didn't wanna do the 3.5 swap!
man you should take some more artsy pics or photoshop those pics a little and those would be frame worthy. Don't think i came across damage like this on the forum yet.
Good luck with your new engine build! Get the rev ups with properly specd adapters
too bad you didn't wanna do the 3.5 swap!
04-18-2012, 11:51 AM
#95
@Flava
man you should take some more artsy pics or photoshop those pics a little and those would be frame worthy. Don't think i came across damage like this on the forum yet.
Good luck with your new engine build! Get the rev ups with properly specd adapters too bad you didn't wanna do the 3.5 swap!
man you should take some more artsy pics or photoshop those pics a little and those would be frame worthy. Don't think i came across damage like this on the forum yet.
Good luck with your new engine build! Get the rev ups with properly specd adapters
too bad you didn't wanna do the 3.5 swap!The donor motor will get the HR valve springs and HR headbolts and due to all the metal I found in the pan I purchased another 3.5 oil pump. Actually went with the Rev Up pump.
Sad to see the carnage.
05-17-2012, 09:44 AM
#98
Update for those that care,
Panda should be up and running soon.
As I stated before, Ive already aquired a replacement motor with 45k.
Dropped it off with Stephen Max and he has completed the installement of the HR valve springs, HR head bolts and the Rev Up oil pump.
THANK YOU STEPHEN!
Jim Wolf has my ECU and injectors and hopefully they can get it tuned soon. Ive had some issues with the injectors being used and have gone back and forth with them a few times.
Once time allows I will be dropping the motor in, spare time is a bit scarce right now. I fly out to DC for a week, come back and go right back out of town for the weekend to attend my daughters soccer tournament. Following week I fly out to Baltimore and then who knows, hopefully I can get the motor in before anything else pops up.
If so, the plan is to drive on the JWT tune and if time/cash allows have it fine tuned with the EU later. Im wanting to dyno it with the JWT tune once its running just to see where my power level is at running just that tune.
Fingers crossed I dont run into anymore unforseen issues.
Panda should be up and running soon.
As I stated before, Ive already aquired a replacement motor with 45k.
Dropped it off with Stephen Max and he has completed the installement of the HR valve springs, HR head bolts and the Rev Up oil pump.
THANK YOU STEPHEN!
Jim Wolf has my ECU and injectors and hopefully they can get it tuned soon. Ive had some issues with the injectors being used and have gone back and forth with them a few times.
Once time allows I will be dropping the motor in, spare time is a bit scarce right now. I fly out to DC for a week, come back and go right back out of town for the weekend to attend my daughters soccer tournament. Following week I fly out to Baltimore and then who knows, hopefully I can get the motor in before anything else pops up.
If so, the plan is to drive on the JWT tune and if time/cash allows have it fine tuned with the EU later. Im wanting to dyno it with the JWT tune once its running just to see where my power level is at running just that tune.
Fingers crossed I dont run into anymore unforseen issues.
GL
07-18-2012, 05:15 PM
#108
Havent had much time at all with my daughter soccer games plus my own but I dropped in the motor last weekend. Just need to hook everything back up, put the radiator in and install the SCer. Hopefully it will be running by this weekend.
08-31-2012, 08:05 AM
#113
Meh, its running but it appears I have some grounding issues.
Had problems with the starter so I put power and ground directly to it, it turned over right away and ran pretty smooth although it was really rich. CEL came on, checked codes MAF, and some EGRC stuff, all of wich ground in the same area as the starter.
I havent touched it since. I literally have had no time, and its getting depressing. My daughter plays soccer, as well as myself. Shes had multiple games every weekend and I have mine on Fri/Saturdays.
She only has one game this weekend, and its a holiday weekend so I plan to work on it Sun/Mon.
But with Hurricane Isaac, Ive been pretty busy at work and am on call this weekend so we shall see how that goes.
Had problems with the starter so I put power and ground directly to it, it turned over right away and ran pretty smooth although it was really rich. CEL came on, checked codes MAF, and some EGRC stuff, all of wich ground in the same area as the starter.
I havent touched it since. I literally have had no time, and its getting depressing. My daughter plays soccer, as well as myself. Shes had multiple games every weekend and I have mine on Fri/Saturdays.
She only has one game this weekend, and its a holiday weekend so I plan to work on it Sun/Mon.
But with Hurricane Isaac, Ive been pretty busy at work and am on call this weekend so we shall see how that goes.
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