Arlight, I was all settled on the Toyo Proxes P4's in 235/45/17 on my stock 17's, even though Toyo lists 7.5" as the minimum width for their 235 Proxes. No surprise - I know many here are running 235's with no issues so I still hadn't completely ruled out the option. Then I read a report by Irish that the closer you get to the MINIMUM tire width for a given rim the better the handling. Can anyone running 235's on their stock 17's comment? I'm also concerned about the additional "appearance" of wheelgap from running a 45 series instead of 50. Anyone have pics to show the difference or at least their own impressions?

The Avon's are getting glowing praise everywhere I look and are a no brainer at the factory size in my eyes. I'll go with these if you talk me out of the Toyo's.

So, can you guys talk me out of one of these options?

Thanks!

Toyo Proxes 4's Love mine.I never had Avon's heard they were good too.

I say go with the Avon Tech i've heard many good reviews about them from other car owners. Everyone knows that the Toyos are good although wear prematurely (imo). Give the Avon's a try so you can let others know since they are cheaper and everyone is always looking for the best bang for the buck.

I going to get some Avon tires again when my Avon ZZ1 tires need to be replace. Good tires. Get them you'll like them. I'am going on my 3rd year with them and no problems.

Actually the Toyo's are around $20 cheaper per tire at toyosforless. And I much prefer the look of the Toyo tread pattern which is both unique and aggressive looking. FWIW, it's just a killer looking tire. You guys have a couple links to threads discussing 235's on factory 17's? I know I've read a few in the past but search isn't helping me much.

I PM'd soonerfan who apparently just picked up a 235 Toyo Proxes setup on this stockers.

HOw are these Toyo tires on the road when it comes to tire noise??? Are they noisy?
I have the Avon M500 (Summer) and they are quiet!!! Really quiet! THey handle great in dry and wet. Very wide too. Looks good.

THe problem with Avon, both 550MS and 500 is that they are HEAVY tires.
225/50/17 weight 29 pounds.
Just to compare, Michelin Pilot Sport A/S is only 24 pounds. Bridgestone tires are 26-27 pounds. ...this extra 4-5 pound per tire.

Correct me if i am wrong, but doesn't a heavy tire slow down your car? Doesn't it increase the gas mileage? What do you think?

A couple notes: The Proxes 4 are the quietest performance a/s tire I've ever owned.

Great wet and dry grip.

Tim, you should drive around the corner and see mine if you think they wear fast...10K miles and they don't show any noticeable wear...and you know how I drive!

+1 on the Toyos, if you can get away with the size.

Yes I do know how you drive
but on that note go with the toyos which you can expect to be good. The avons must have gone up in price because i was considering them ~ 3 months ago since they were pretty cheap at the time in comparison to some of the other tires.

Toyos are proven tires. Not sure the Avons have much info backing them yet. I've heard the Avons are excellent, but there is still limited feedback on them. Toyos are quiet, handle like they are stuck to the road, and don't wear nearly as fast as some would lead you to believe. I'd go with the Toyos if I were you. Just my $.02.

Yeah, go get in line and wait for the Toyos on backorder...

I was torn between the Proxes and another brand, Cooper Zeon ZX2s. I decided to get the Coopers b/c they were a bit cheaper. Here is the thread if you care: http://forums.maxima.org/showthread.php?t=415507

I have them on my '03 with H&Rs and there is a noticable wheel gap but not as bad as if it were stock.

Ahhh, my good bud CCS, but it was well worth the wait and I was in no immediate hurry...

Thanks for the feedback guys. So where are the threads hiding regarding running 235's on 17" stockers? I'd like to see pics of the 235/45's on to see how wheel gap compares and also hear impressions on handling w/ the out of spec width tire.

If anyone can shoot me a link that'd be great.

I don't have the Avon M550's,but thinking about getting them. The only negative thing I've heard about them is that they flatspot when you park them for a few days. That's it.

I'll try to post some pics tonight of the wheel gap. I have 235/45 and H&Rs. It seems like we always do the same thing at the same time. Weird.

Post #79
http://forums.maxima.org/showthread....78#post1503478



Scroll down to wher it has wheel/tire specs and such.

http://www.forums.maxima.org/showthread.php?t=36867

I have the Avon M550's and they are bad azz tires. The tread design in the factory size reminds me of a muscle car.

Isn't anyone here concerned about the weight of the Avons?? They are 29 lbs each for the stock size. Considering that the stock alloy wheels are not really light either..... is it a good idea to put such a heavy tire when you can get different tires that weight 25 lbs or even less?

Does anyone know how much the Toyo's weight?

What do you all think?

This is a good point, and one of the other big reasons I'd prefer the Toyo's. The 235/45/17 Toyos weigh only 24 lbs. vs 29 lbs. for the Avons. This is quite significant when you consider this quote I pulled from Google:

"Tires...are all unsprung weight. One pound of "unsprung" weight is equal to 8 pounds of "sprung" weight...For every 10 pounds of unsprung weight removed you may pick up as much as .01 seconds in quarter mile ET."

Therefore, the 5 lbs. saved with the Toyo's equates to the elimination of 160 lbs. of sprung weight! (5 lbs. x 4 wheels x 8) Significant. This is basically the equivalent of removing a passenger from the car. Wow.

Also, to those running 235 on the stock 17's: Did you have any trouble finding a shop to install them? Just wondering if they're concerned about the liability of installing out of spec rubber.

Thanks for the links. I'd read those, and to sum them up, the 235's should be safe as long as they're properly inflated. However, Dunlop explains that running the improper width of rim can place the flex point on the wrong position of the tire here: http://www.dunloptire.com/care/widthRatio.html

Hard to say how much the small difference in width could contribute to additional heat or risk of failure. The Avon's are quite wide shouldered for a 225 with a width of 9.1" inflated on a 7" rim versus the Toyo's approximate width of 9.3" inflated on a 7" rim (Toyo site lists 9.4" width on 8" rim - should be slightly lower width on a narrower 7" rim per tirerack). So the actual difference in width between the two tires when installed is only around .2". I just can't decide if it's worth the risk.

None. I bought off spec Fuzions at a local Firestone shop. The guy asked me if I was sure that's what I wanted to do and I told him yes, other people are doing it w/out problems. No other questions asked.

Also, it looks like the Proxes are rated quite poorly for snow traction judging by the reviews I've read. Can any owners here chime in? Here in KS we don't get much, but I need basic capability.

i would also like an answer for this question

This is a good thread because these two are also my final two choices and right now leaning towards Toyo Proxes 4 because of unsprung weight. The difference in weight is about .1 sec at the track and I want to lower my time not add to it. I was also interested in the snow traction since I am close to purchasing new tires. Any info? Thanks.

no replies?

I went with the Avons in 225/50/17 and have had them for around 2 weeks now. These are excellent tires. Shockingly, and I mean shockingly quiet. My Max sounds like a luxury car now. They're so quiet on the highway I listen to my CDs at 17 instead of 20 now. Also, they have a slightly softer sidewall than the stock blowtenza which produces a little more sidewall flex on extreme corners but produces a much better ride. Expansion joints are now muted and smooth. Much less harshness is transmitted into the cabin - I had a minor buzz and rattle or two that cropped up on rougher roads with the Potenzas and I haven't heard them once in the last 2 weeks since I slapped on the Avons. Wet traction is AMAZING. We've had a ton of rain the last 2 weeks and I just can't tell it's raining. Traction in the wet is identical to dry. I can do a hard launch from the light in the rain and the tires act like there's no water on the ground! What a step up! In a hard rain on the highway many were doing 50 while I rolled comfortably at 70. Straight line launches hook up much better in the dry than the old Potenzas as well.

The Avons appear wider than the Potenzas and look quite meaty from behind. They have an attractive tread pattern though the sidewall is a bit busy for my taste.

In the negatives, they are heavier than the Potenzas and on the initial drive out of the shop I thought I could detect a slight sluggishness from the additional weight. Perhaps this is in my head since I was conciously looking for it. I haven't noticed this feeling since the first couple days. Perhaps the smoother, quieter ride and reduced harshness made the car feel slightly slower. Nonetheless, this is splitting hairs, but if you're racing or doing autocross, I'd go w/ the Toyo's. However, for everyday life I'm loving these Avons. I was concerned about the Toyo's out of spec size, poorer snow traction, increased wheel gap, and choppier ride caused by the lower sidewall, so I don't regret picking up the Avon's. Two different tires for different purposes/people. Pick your priorities!

Thanks for the detailed update. I've been looking for tires as well, and have been quite swayed toward the Avons. Despite the great reputation of the Toyos in regards to performance, the Avons are a more practical tire for my daily commuter. But because the Avon brand is new to me, frankly I'm a little concerned about their reliability, especially since I occasionally have my 3yr old in the back seat. I noticed on the other Avon thread that a couple members have had serious issues. Although I'm not sure if the tires were entirely at fault, I'm wondering if the heavier weight of the Avons has anything to do with the 'shimmy' or 'out-of-balance' problems mentioned. From what I've read, increased unsprung weight (in this case tires,wheels,spindles,susp arms,etc.) will cause the shocks/springs to work harder. Assuming that your shocks were kind of worn out, could a heavier tire/wheel setup cause similar problems?

Housecor: I just followed your how-to on installing Illuminas. Thanks to your write-up it was a cinch!

Sorry to got OT, but I have a quick question about tire size. The stock tire size on my I35 is 215/55/17 (while 5.5gen guys have 225/50/17) and everyone in the 5th gen forum seems to favor 235/45/17 as replacement. I did the tire size comparison using the calculator on 1010tires.com and the 235s would be 3.9% too fast on the speedometer (compared to 215s). So is the Tirerack recommended tire size of 235/50/17 better?