Installed cheap 4th gen STS today
04-02-2005, 11:32 AM
#1
Installed cheap 4th gen STS today
Izzys post about the Stillen STS fitting the 89-01 Maxima got me to thinking what the difference was.
I decided to get the cheapest shifter I could find so I woudnt be out much if it didnt work.
I found a cheap shifter on eBay for $20 (aluminum...says nismo on it but there is no way its a nismo piece) so I decided to use it.
Well it comes in and immediately I know why it will not work for a 3rd gen. It doesnt come with the bearings or housing (like the stillen, B&M, Courtesy etc.) and the ball is smaller than a 3rd gen. There isnt a way to get the lower bearing off of the 3rd gen shifter without destroying it so I though I would just try a 4th gen upper piece.
I went to the junk yard and they didnt have any manual 4th gens but they had one 95 200SX 5spd (same shifter as a 4th gen) so I take the shifter and all the parts out and the owner gave them to me (I have done a lot of business with him and he is a friend so he cuts me breaks like that sometimes).
I get them home and take the shifter socket (FSM calls it a control lever socket) off and the bearings around the ball (they are a split design instead of solid like ours). I notice that the spacing for the bolts are slightly different...I mean off by just a tiny amount...so I take a drill bit that was just bigger than the holes and drill them out. The bearing holder then went right into place and was tight (didnt drill too large a hole).
next I put the shifter in, put the bearings on (of course using new grease) and then put the shifter socket in place and bolted everything back together.
The shifter feels basically like the stock one did but the throws are sooo short.
I didnt drive it much because I didnt put the heat shield back on (have to bang it out some) but all in all it felt normal except for the throws (no notchety feeling as some describe). Then again the gear lube I have in my transmission is cheap and has a little ratchety feel when cold anyway. I am going to put amsiol or redline in one day but for now what I have is fine.
So anyway that was my adventure. I say that the courtesy, B&M and others that have the built in shifter bearing/socket will work just fine if you drill out the mounting holes. Or you can always do like I did and spend $30 total including shipping (well you would probably have to pay for the shifter socket and bearings) to have a STS.
Now the only con I have with it is the angle of the lever doesnt come back quite as far as the factory. I have short arms and this is a problem for me to shift in comfort. I may take it out and bend it slightly but gonna keep it as is to see how comfortable it is with normal driving.
***edit***
I forgot to mention that the shifter parts I used would cost around $30 new from the dealer. The bearings were $6 (need 2...actually just one but its in halves) and the shifter socket is around $12. I called to get pricing before I went to the junk yard. So it wouldnt be worth it to pay $30 for this shifter and another $30 for parts to make it work. I would get a nicer shifter before I did that.
I decided to get the cheapest shifter I could find so I woudnt be out much if it didnt work.
I found a cheap shifter on eBay for $20 (aluminum...says nismo on it but there is no way its a nismo piece) so I decided to use it.
Well it comes in and immediately I know why it will not work for a 3rd gen. It doesnt come with the bearings or housing (like the stillen, B&M, Courtesy etc.) and the ball is smaller than a 3rd gen. There isnt a way to get the lower bearing off of the 3rd gen shifter without destroying it so I though I would just try a 4th gen upper piece.
I went to the junk yard and they didnt have any manual 4th gens but they had one 95 200SX 5spd (same shifter as a 4th gen) so I take the shifter and all the parts out and the owner gave them to me (I have done a lot of business with him and he is a friend so he cuts me breaks like that sometimes).
I get them home and take the shifter socket (FSM calls it a control lever socket) off and the bearings around the ball (they are a split design instead of solid like ours). I notice that the spacing for the bolts are slightly different...I mean off by just a tiny amount...so I take a drill bit that was just bigger than the holes and drill them out. The bearing holder then went right into place and was tight (didnt drill too large a hole).
next I put the shifter in, put the bearings on (of course using new grease) and then put the shifter socket in place and bolted everything back together.
The shifter feels basically like the stock one did but the throws are sooo short.
I didnt drive it much because I didnt put the heat shield back on (have to bang it out some) but all in all it felt normal except for the throws (no notchety feeling as some describe). Then again the gear lube I have in my transmission is cheap and has a little ratchety feel when cold anyway. I am going to put amsiol or redline in one day but for now what I have is fine.
So anyway that was my adventure. I say that the courtesy, B&M and others that have the built in shifter bearing/socket will work just fine if you drill out the mounting holes. Or you can always do like I did and spend $30 total including shipping (well you would probably have to pay for the shifter socket and bearings) to have a STS.
Now the only con I have with it is the angle of the lever doesnt come back quite as far as the factory. I have short arms and this is a problem for me to shift in comfort. I may take it out and bend it slightly but gonna keep it as is to see how comfortable it is with normal driving.
***edit***
I forgot to mention that the shifter parts I used would cost around $30 new from the dealer. The bearings were $6 (need 2...actually just one but its in halves) and the shifter socket is around $12. I called to get pricing before I went to the junk yard. So it wouldnt be worth it to pay $30 for this shifter and another $30 for parts to make it work. I would get a nicer shifter before I did that.
04-02-2005, 12:59 PM
#3
Originally Posted by subs1000w
not bad for a days work what do you think the ball is made out of compared to the stocker and let us know if it tightens up on hot days after about 15-20 min of driving
well on this cheap one its aluminum coated with nickel to help with friction.
I will let you know after driving it for a while though. It may tighten up like others have talked about.
I think the biggest thing to take away from this is that you can use the 4th gen shifter from courtesy (B&M copy from what I understand) since it has the bearings and housing built onto it for $70 and get a much better quality shifter than the pace setter for the same price.
04-02-2005, 02:44 PM
#4
bent the heatshield and installed it (got it perfect the first time...doesnt hit the shifter or converter) so I could go on a good drive. I drove for about 30 min and the shifter didnt seem to tighten up much. I really didnt notice much difference but it may have tightened up slightly but it still felt fine when shifting.
I did use good quality Amsoil synthetic grease on it though. This shifter I got uses bearings at the point where it meets the control rod. You can take those out and use the factory bushings though but I figured I would try the bearings out.
The only thing I noticed I didnt care too much for was the shifter got hotter than I expected. This is probably normal since its so close to the converter now and it wasnt burning hot but it was noticebly warm.
anyway all in all decent STS for $30 isnt too bad and I was able to curb my curiousity by trying it.
I did use good quality Amsoil synthetic grease on it though. This shifter I got uses bearings at the point where it meets the control rod. You can take those out and use the factory bushings though but I figured I would try the bearings out.
The only thing I noticed I didnt care too much for was the shifter got hotter than I expected. This is probably normal since its so close to the converter now and it wasnt burning hot but it was noticebly warm.
anyway all in all decent STS for $30 isnt too bad and I was able to curb my curiousity by trying it.
04-02-2005, 02:57 PM
#5
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Location: Miami, FL. / Indianapolis, IN.
Posts: 2,614
Originally Posted by awsm66
bent the heatshield and installed it (got it perfect the first time...doesnt hit the shifter or converter) so I could go on a good drive. I drove for about 30 min and the shifter didnt seem to tighten up much. I really didnt notice much difference but it may have tightened up slightly but it still felt fine when shifting.
I did use good quality Amsoil synthetic grease on it though. This shifter I got uses bearings at the point where it meets the control rod. You can take those out and use the factory bushings though but I figured I would try the bearings out.
The only thing I noticed I didnt care too much for was the shifter got hotter than I expected. This is probably normal since its so close to the converter now and it wasnt burning hot but it was noticebly warm.
anyway all in all decent STS for $30 isnt too bad and I was able to curb my curiousity by trying it.
I did use good quality Amsoil synthetic grease on it though. This shifter I got uses bearings at the point where it meets the control rod. You can take those out and use the factory bushings though but I figured I would try the bearings out.
The only thing I noticed I didnt care too much for was the shifter got hotter than I expected. This is probably normal since its so close to the converter now and it wasnt burning hot but it was noticebly warm.
anyway all in all decent STS for $30 isnt too bad and I was able to curb my curiousity by trying it.
good now fab one up for me.
04-02-2005, 03:18 PM
#6
Originally Posted by GRNMAXDMON
good now fab one up for me.
hehe I will get some pics after I take it back out to put the new rubber boot on the bottom. I am always in a hurry to see if something is going to work so I dont get pics.
I will fab you one up just as soon as I get those HUD parts
lol.
04-02-2005, 03:28 PM
#7
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Originally Posted by awsm66
hehe I will get some pics after I take it back out to put the new rubber boot on the bottom. I am always in a hurry to see if something is going to work so I dont get pics.
I will fab you one up just as soon as I get those HUD parts lol.
I will fab you one up just as soon as I get those HUD parts
lol.d'oh!!! i would of thought u would have forgotten about the HUD. j/k. im still on the hunt for the main control unit. i have everything else but the main control unit. once i get that part i will let u know as soon as possible.
04-02-2005, 07:27 PM
#9
Originally Posted by Akuma2001
Does this mean that I can go on ebay and buy a 4th gen short shifter that includes all the parts and it will fit?
As I said earlier...
Originally Posted by awsm66
I think the biggest thing to take away from this is that you can use the 4th gen shifter from courtesy (B&M copy from what I understand) since it has the bearings and housing built onto it for $70 and get a much better quality shifter than the pace setter for the same price.
I don’t see why it wouldn’t work. You just have to drill the holes a little bigger for the shifter housing the rest should be fine.
Just don’t blame me if it doesn’t work because my only experience is with this cheap one and the 4th gen mounting parts.
I have experimented all I am going to on this...you or someone else can experiment on the more expensive ones
04-03-2005, 05:26 PM
#10
ok here are a few pics of the shifter and 4th gen mount and bearings. These are pics after everthing is installed. I just went out there and took the cover and dust boot off so I could get some quick pics.
That little rubber piece is to help keep the boot up since the shifter is thinner than the factory one the little stopper built onto the shifter isnt big enough to hold the boot up...or at least not high enough.
That little rubber piece is to help keep the boot up since the shifter is thinner than the factory one the little stopper built onto the shifter isnt big enough to hold the boot up...or at least not high enough.
04-03-2005, 05:45 PM
#11
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2001
Posts: 1,764
nice pics..
Im getting jasons used SMC and going to "rebuild" it
take some material off the pivot ball to prevent it from expanding too much and replace the bushings... i was told 50% of the shifters feel is in the install, any truth to it?
awsm66- what type of grease did you use on that shifter? thats not white lyth.. right?.
-do you think i could get better bushings for the other parts of the shifter? like the support rod/shift rod? they sell a shifter bushing kits for sentras i think.. maybe ill give that a wirl too.. im also replacing the return spring and that rubber shifter mount.
Im getting jasons used SMC and going to "rebuild" it
take some material off the pivot ball to prevent it from expanding too much and replace the bushings... i was told 50% of the shifters feel is in the install, any truth to it?
awsm66- what type of grease did you use on that shifter? thats not white lyth.. right?.
-do you think i could get better bushings for the other parts of the shifter? like the support rod/shift rod? they sell a shifter bushing kits for sentras i think.. maybe ill give that a wirl too.. im also replacing the return spring and that rubber shifter mount.
04-03-2005, 05:54 PM
#13
Originally Posted by ChrisCheezer
nice pics..
awsm66- what type of grease did you use on that shifter? thats not white lyth.. right?.
awsm66- what type of grease did you use on that shifter? thats not white lyth.. right?.
Originally Posted by awsm66
I did use good quality Amsoil synthetic grease on it though.
04-04-2005, 11:51 AM
#15
Originally Posted by ChrisCheezer
nice pics..
Im getting jasons used SMC and going to "rebuild" it
take some material off the pivot ball to prevent it from expanding too much and replace the bushings... i was told 50% of the shifters feel is in the install, any truth to it?
awsm66- what type of grease did you use on that shifter? thats not white lyth.. right?.
-do you think i could get better bushings for the other parts of the shifter? like the support rod/shift rod? they sell a shifter bushing kits for sentras i think.. maybe ill give that a wirl too.. im also replacing the return spring and that rubber shifter mount.
Im getting jasons used SMC and going to "rebuild" it
take some material off the pivot ball to prevent it from expanding too much and replace the bushings... i was told 50% of the shifters feel is in the install, any truth to it?
awsm66- what type of grease did you use on that shifter? thats not white lyth.. right?.
-do you think i could get better bushings for the other parts of the shifter? like the support rod/shift rod? they sell a shifter bushing kits for sentras i think.. maybe ill give that a wirl too.. im also replacing the return spring and that rubber shifter mount.
The ball bearings in this STS may hold up better than the factory piece to heat...then again it may not.
The B&M (and clones) is a nice design because it appears to use a bronse or brass bushing which will not really vary with temp and cause good shifter movement most of the time.
This is just my theory though so who knows.
also on the grease...Turns out it was regular grease I put on the shifter ball. I just assumed it was the Amsoil because when I picked up my gun there was a brand new tube of Amsoil grease sitting right by it. I was thinking I had 2 tubes of the Amsoil grease but I was wrong (or the other one went missing)...it’s been quite a while since I bought these. I just went out to change the tube since I ran out and when I opened the Amsoil tube I noticed it was red so I pulled the old tube out and sure enough it was regular cheap grease (coastal brand).
I am curious now if the shift will be even smoother with the Amsoil grease in there...probably will not make a difference but I will see. I will know in a couple of days when my lower dust boot comes in and I change everything.
I was going to wait until I took everything out to change the boot before updating the thread but didn’t want someone to see that is a different color than Amsoil and think I am purposely lying to everyone.
The good Amsoil grease I am "going" to use is (from the front of the tube) high temp, Multi purpose, synthetic, lithium complex, grease, EP fortified-NLGI No.1.
as for using other bushings...It depends...I know the 200 I got the other parts from had a different size screw and bushing so it wouldnt work with the 3rd gen without modification (and then maybe not at all).
04-09-2005, 03:12 PM
#16
well I promised more pics when I got the shifter apart to do some maint.
I took it out today, cleaned all the bearings up, bent the shifter just a tad to put it where I like it and relubed and installed. While I was at it I took the whole control rod out so I could clean and regrease the front part where it connects to the transmission.
I must say the shift is basically like stock imo and for the money I am very pleased. One day I may buy a Stillen or just a B&M but for now this will work just fine.
Here are the pics I have.
This is a pic of all the 4th gen parts
This is a pic of the shifter in and the bottom dust boot on
This is a pic of the bearing surround slid into place past the ball
This is a pic of the bearings installed around the ball (minus the clips that hold it on...I dont have a pic of the rings in for some reason)
I took it out today, cleaned all the bearings up, bent the shifter just a tad to put it where I like it and relubed and installed. While I was at it I took the whole control rod out so I could clean and regrease the front part where it connects to the transmission.
I must say the shift is basically like stock imo and for the money I am very pleased. One day I may buy a Stillen or just a B&M but for now this will work just fine.
Here are the pics I have.
This is a pic of all the 4th gen parts
This is a pic of the shifter in and the bottom dust boot on
This is a pic of the bearing surround slid into place past the ball
This is a pic of the bearings installed around the ball (minus the clips that hold it on...I dont have a pic of the rings in for some reason)
04-09-2005, 03:13 PM
#17
This is a pic of the bearing surround pushed up over the bearings and the top plate put in place over the bearing surround.
and finally this is a pic of it back together and the inner (3rd gen) dust boot installed.
Hope someone gets some use out of this info.
and finally this is a pic of it back together and the inner (3rd gen) dust boot installed.
Hope someone gets some use out of this info.
04-09-2005, 09:18 PM
#19
Originally Posted by subs1000w
good info i may try this before bucking up for a stillen
you say all the parts in the 1st pic except the shifter are from 200sx which should be easier to find in a juck yard with a 5spd then a 4th gen
you say all the parts in the 1st pic except the shifter are from 200sx which should be easier to find in a juck yard with a 5spd then a 4th gen
Yeah here is a list of cars that supposedly use the same shifter-
* NISSAN 91-94 SENTRA
* NISSAN 95-01 SENTRA
* NISSAN 95-98 200SX
* NISSAN 93-97 ALTIMA
* NISSAN 98-01 ALTIMA
* NISSAN 95-99 MAXIMA
* NISSAN 00-01 MAXIMA
* NISSAN 90-94 PULSAR GTiR
* INFINITI 91-01 G20
* INFINITI 96-99 I30
I dont know about all of them but the 200 I got mine off of was a 95.
I dont know that it would be any better than a pacesetter but know mine feels pretty much stock.
I really only went this cheap because I didnt know what would work. Honestly since I know a 5th gen shifter would work I think I would go for one of the B&M knockoffs since they have the housing and all.
Still for $32 shipped I got a pretty nice STS.
***edit***
the bolt and nut in the picture is actually the 3rd gen piece. The 200 had a different bolt.
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