Badaxxima

Okay, when I leave my car outside in the cold overnight I get this loud (like bad VTC loud) clicking, tapping, spitting noise. It's definitely RPM dependent, only does it for a few seconds immediately after startup. The idle-RPMs drop and the noise stops. It's not related to the tranny or clutch (I don't think, it changes nothing when I mess with either). If I press and release the brake it stops, but I think that's because the RPMs momentarily drop when I press it hard. My idle rockets to 2000RPM for a few seconds also and then drops to around 1500, accompanied by sound stopping. Could it be a cracked exhaust manifold? Oh and I removed the heat shield on my Cat awhile ago when it started rattling, so it ain't that either.

DA-MAX

iTrader: (10)

my guess is worn exhaust studs.....the sound being initially after startup is the clue for me. I'm not 100% though! do a search for "exhaust studs" for more info, I know there are a couple FAQs in there about this common 3rd gen prob!

adamis

I have been getting this recently when I was forced to park my car outside. I could be completly wrong but I always attributed it to the cams not having any oil right at start up. When it's cold the oil is thicker and takes a while to get to the top of the engine. This is why the engine idles at 2000 upon startup, by running faster the oil is moved more quickly to the parts that need them. This is also why it's a good idea to let the car sit for a minute or two after starting it when it's cold.

adamis

I have been getting this recently when I was forced to park my car outside. I could be completly wrong but I always attributed it to the cams not having any oil right at start up. When it's cold the oil is thicker and takes a while to get to the top of the engine. This is why the engine idles at 2000 upon startup, by running faster the oil is moved more quickly to the parts that need them. This is also why it's a good idea to let the car sit for a minute or two after starting it when it's cold.

roadiusmaximus

agreed. i have EXACTLY the same thing...except i already spent the 600 on replacing the exhaust studs. So that problem went away, and now i just get the ticking which sounds exactly the same as busted studs, except louder and only at start up.

john

Badaxxima

I am going to change my oil soon, I'll be sure to get a Nissan filter or other filter with "anti-drainback valve" to maintain oil pressure when the car is off. Hopefully this will solve the problem. Thanks for your help guys.
-Justin

Matt93SE

iTrader: (44)

Most likely the noise is "real" lifter tick, not VTCs or exhaust studs.

reason being, our engines have hydraulic lifters. when the engine is off, the oil seeps out of the lifters (because they're getting old), and so they lose their shape.. (pump oil into them and they get longer- this keeps from having to adjust valves every few years like cars with solid lifters).. blah blah..

but it's because the hydraulic lifters have bled down. when you start the engine and pump oil back into them, the noise goes away.

it's a sign that the engine is getting some wear, but nothing to really be worried about unless it gets to a constant, severe tick. then it's time to replace a valve. shouldn't happen for about 5,000,000 miles though.

Badaxxima

I hope it isn't VTC's, because:
1) They're expensive
2) I don't have them (VG30E)
Just kiddin'

Do you think getting an oil filter with anti-drainback will help though? I was thinking of getting a Nissan, but I know the dealer will be expensive, I don't know that OEM woulb be as good as say, FRAM (what I'm using now) or Mobil 1. Comments?

Matt93SE

iTrader: (44)

if you go aftermarket, pick up a purolator "pure one" filter. problem is the price is about the same as OEM filters.


your problem may or may not go away with the anti-drainback valve in it. (and the purolator filter has them too).

I wouldn't be worried about it, but the noise is annoying. my VG used to do that if I'd leave it parked for a few days..


you also might want to switch to a little thicker oil. if you're using 5w30, switch to 10w30. should help any small leaks you've got too (like the front main seal that leaks on every GXE I've seen)

Bman

Actually ALL filters have anti-drainback valves. Some (like FRAM) just suck donkey-***** and lets the oil drain back down because they leak. This makes for noisy lifters. Get a filter with a good nitrile rubber (or silicone) against metal design, not rubber against cardboard like Fram. I bought a Purolator Pure One for my car but haven't put it in yet (whimped out and got it changed in the winter).

Check this out: http://www.scuderiaciriani.com/rx7/oil_filter_study/

I read this and got what seems like the best filter there. Some worry it's too restrictive, but I have faith they know better than that! Some people put great stock in OEM filters but don't know (or ignore) the fact that some big company like Purolator or Wix or (shudder) Fram, etc. makes OEM filters for the car company. A certain Motocraft (Ford) filter line is actually the Pure One, but they didn't have a matching model, so I got the real deal for $10 Cdn (about $6-7 US), which is no biggie if you think about it.

Besides these filters look SWEET! Find a place that sells these and just take a look at one. Not that you can really see it down there though...

matt1sd

i had the same problem. i got an engine flush at a valvoline instant oil change, and it took care of the problem. it also quieted the engine at idle. i cant remember how much it was. like $60, i dont know. but it worked. i think its worth it.

Badaxxima

Interesting. What all fluids are exchanged during an engine flush? I'm guessing they're clearing out all the sludge/grime/crap that has built up and maybe coolant too.

Bman

"Engine flush" usually refers to adding this solvent stuff (you can buy it in stores) into the oil, letting it idle for a while, and then draining the oil and replacing it. Nothing super special you can't do at home AFAIK.

Badaxxima

Do you just add it in the oil fill tube? What exactly is it called? I'd like to try it since I'm going to change my oil soon. Also, what is AFAIK?

Bman

Yes and they're sold with all the engine additives and cleaners. Just pick one that looks reputable I guess. They're called "Engine Flush" or something like that. Hard to mistake them.

AFAIK is net speak for "As Far As I Know"

Now if only I could figure out what the heck this "DPW " thing I see sometimes is...

Badaxxima

Ditto on that...
Thanks too BTW.

matt1sd

i think the engine flush that i was talking about at the oil change place is better, because they use certain "test-proven" chemicals, and i think there is also various steps in adding the chemicals to the car. but really all they do is drain the oil and run the stuff through and idle the car for a while. i think it works better that store-bought products. but thats just my opinion.

jkiser

I think Matt93SE's response in on track. I just finished rebuilding the upper end of my 92SE and rebuilt the VTC sprockets (lots cheaper than replacing).

I have 176,000 miles on the car so while I was in there, I measured all of the outside diameters on the lifters (called hydraulic actuators). All were within new specs. I was very careful to keep them submersed in oil and purge the air when re-installing them (if you don't they'll make noise). End result....I eliminated all of my valve noise except the noise you described at start-up on very cold evenings. On warm nights, no noise at all on start-up.

This car has had Mobil 1 oil since day 1 and there wasn't a bit of sludge anywhere, so I'm sure it's not a sludge issue. All cylinders still had healthy cross-hatch and compression was within spec. Made a believer out of me.

I'm guessing there may be enough wear inside the hydraulic actuator to let the level drop a bit and make some noise before the level returns to spec. If that's the case, should be no real harm long term.

J

Badaxxima

Wow...
Thank you.

Shadow1198

iTrader: (1)

I got the same problem too. Sounds like the lifters. The problem is basically that the lifters don't have any oil on startup and it takes a couple seconds for them to get lubricated. I forget the cause of this problem but I don't think it is serious.

PDubs

I kept getting a noise like this too. Added some oil and it went away.

jkiser

I'm on board with your advice on this subject. Another question though...

One solution I've considered is to switch engine oil weights. I currently use a 10W-30 engine oil. If I switched to a heavier weight, say a 15W-50, then perhaps I'll get less oil "drainage" from the lifters when the car has shut down.

In this case, when the car is warm, I'd have a 50 weight oil rather than 30 weight and maybe the lifter will retain more oil.

The downside is on start-up. Then, instead of a 10 weight oil when it's cold, I'd have a 15 weight. So, it might move oil up slower to replenish the lifter. I'd only do this with a synthetic so that it would still flow well at low temps.

Any thoughts?

J

Badaxxima

I'm switchin' from 5W-30 to 10W-30. I'll see how that turns out. Also, I've used a FRAM oil filter the last three times I've changed it, which is about when I first noticed the sound. Hmmmm...