I took out my battery today and noticed for the first time, the stock piping for the ram air wasn't even connected to anything. The bottom hole has no pipe and the end of the piping wasn't connected to the airbox because it keeps falling off with a push. Apparently I've been driving around for 4 months like this, but is this part important at all? Can I just yank it out and leave it off?

 

do maximas have ram air?

 

Sorry guys maximas do not have there own factory ram air setup. Unless i am mistaken that peice of your intake from underneath your battery is manily there just for sound suppresion. Brian

 

I think hes just talking about that scoop in front of the car when you first pop open the hood. I dont think its "True" ram-air, or even ram-air at all.

Correct me if im wrong..

Eric

 

I would actually call it a ram air/cold air type of setup. Air is being pressurized into the scoop from the grill and its cool air from outside, although it is on top of the radiator..

 

You cannot accurately characterize the OEM air intake plenum on a Maxima as a RAM-air setup in any way shape or form.


The intake "scoop" may have the appearance of a ram-air scoop, and to a degree, it could be, if you drove around without a hood on your car.

A ram-air intake by it's very definition must have an unobstructed entry scoop in which air pressure can rise proportionally to vehicle speed in order to achieve a velocity-induced pressurization (> ambient outside air pressure) of the intake charge.

If you look closely at how the scoop meets the hood when the hood is closed, you'll see that the scoop opening is actually obstructed (at the front) from the airflow outside the front of the car - the intake opening actually draws air in from all around the cavity created under the front edge of the hood, above the radiator support.

The rubber seal on the bottom edge of the front of the hood actually prevents any direct outside airflow from getting to the scoop. This design is intended to reduce the likelihood of a water-related engine failure & is common to most passenger cars.

Sorry, no ram-air.



To thread starter:

There's no harm in leaving the intake plumbing off, although your power curve may be a little lumpy and less linear, as intake tuning definitely plays a role in driveability. Also, it will be noisier at WOT. I'd either do an aftermarket, hybrid, OSCAI intake, or return it to stock setup if you're not ready for intake mods.

 

I STUCK AN ERA DETERGENT CAP CLOSED SIDE UP IN THE HOLE. IT FITS PERFECT, BUT JUST TO BE SAFE I PUT A SCREW CLAMP AROUND IT.

 

just leave the damn thing alone before you get your hand chopped off

 

Is this a true "Ram Air" setup? That's my car.

Copy and paste the link

www27.brinkster.com/n3g4tive/fayatteville/DCP_0176.jpg

 

its a ghetto version , but yeah, i guess that could be considered a ram air, or at least give the ram air effect..

 

Wow, someone on the .org that actually knows what they're talking about. Great explanation!

 

I'm sure it breathes MUCH better than a cone inside the engine bay & certainly gets cooler air. Probably some* ram-air effect as well.

*To maximize the ram-air effect, you really need an intake scoop that is wide at the front (to "capture" the greatest volume of air) and that narrows going toward the engine, to increase the velocity + pressure of that air. In your setup, the shape of the cone filter creates a lot of turbulence in the air hitting it , so it can't optimally achieve the ram-air effect.

-But it's definitely better than a stock or HAI/POP setup.

 

hmmm... so do you have any ideas of how to maximize my ram air effect? I want to do some more intake work specifically for the track.

Don't real ram air systems have a filter? That would cause turbulance too.

 

Thanks guys for the input. I'm just going to leave it off for now, or try the detergent cap idea. The scoop is in the way of the (shortened) power wire running from the battery to the alternator, since I cut off the stock power wire harness to adapt to a Stinger battery terminal. I don't care too much about the slight wack in performance right now, since it IS much faster than my old modded altima

 

i dunno about all this RAM air nonsense...but when i looked at it..the front of the hood is blocking any kind of airway the thin intake part of the "ram" may offer. i just took the whole piece out that starts at the end of the hood to the lower half of the stock airbox, threw in a pop in square shaped kNn filter... havnt had any problems with it so far..it sounds better then stock when you WOT but doesnt get annoying loud like a cone filter.. u can notice a small power gain after around 2.5k..(mines a 5spd)..only concern was getting "hotter" air in cuz its now taking in air from the engine bay..but im sure there is better air flow.. i think that is better then getting all that restricted air from the small space u have with that ram thing right behind the hood...personally..i think the only purpose of that ram thing if to reduce intake noise..rememebr maximas were marketed towards the middle aged peoples..they like thier cars quiet.

 

1) -not sure w/ the existing setup: maybe try experimenting with some sort of ooglie flexible plastic to create a cone-type opening around the base of the filter. (easier to look at than explain)

Think of those thin, plastic collars they put around dogs' necks when they are healing from surgery & are not supposed to lick some part of their body - it looks like a cone. Only instead of the dog's head, imagine your cone filter in the middle. And instead of the dog's body, imagine your Maxima attached.

(YES, it would look extremely ghetto, but anything for speed, right?) I guess it just depends on how much jeering you feel like putting up with at the track. . .)

2) Real RAM air intakes do have a filter, but it's normally downstream of the intake plumbing & RAM/scoop. (It's also usually in the form of a panel filter/similar to our stock setup) and the airflow was engineered from scratch to flow smoothly through the element.

Here, as with many things we try to DIY, you're starting with available parts & reverse engineering something - in hopes that it will create an improvement. Since a cone filter was never designed to be "outside" the car, in the airflow, it's shape is not optimized for that environment/purpose. Is it better than a cone in the engine bay? I'd argue YES. Is it as good as a truly CAD-engineered, airflow dynamics tested RAM-air intake? Not possible.

But, have fun with it!


Fwiw, RAM-air intakes are widely used on the current crop of sportbikes available from (I think) all the Japanese manufacturers, all with significant gains. The motorcycle propeller-heads really have ram-air dialed in. If you're curious, do a web-search for Honda, Suzuki, Yamaha, Kawasaki, + RAM AIR, & read a little more about this "free power."

 

Well I whole-heartedly disagree with you KWheelzSB. While the factory intake scoop isn't exactly a "ram air" setup, it is very effective at what it does, pulling fresh air in thru the grill. The air comes in the grill then up into the intake snorkel. Pull off your grill and you'll see what I'm talking about.

The ram air setup you see today are strictly for show purposes and do little for performance is terms of "ram air". The scoop on the SS and WS6 F-Bodies do draw in air, but they are not ram air even though their advertized as such. A truely functional ram air setup requires that the scoop be mounted in area that creates substainal air pressure so that the air is actually rammed into the intake and at higher than surrounding ambient pressure. A hood scoop located in the central portion of the hood and facing forward, WILL NOT get the pressurized air it needs. The true ram air setups were used in the late 60s and early 70s on muscle cars. Look closely and you'll see that the scoops were mounted backwards to draw air off the pressurized air from the windshield. Only at 60mph+ did these setup become functional and many would open and close in relation to the pressure.

The intake scoop on the Maxima is effective as a cold air intake. The same goes for these ghetto setups you're all talking about, but don't kid yourself into thinking their ram air though.


Dave

 

Aren't the ones from the 60's-70's muscle cars that face the windshield called "cowl-induction"?
I know most newer cars supposed "ram-air" scoops aren't even functional for air inlet anyways. My old buddies '82 Z28 with Cross-fire injection actually did have functional flip up scoops in the half hourglass thing on the hood, that operated off of engine vacuum. They faced forward. Was it more for show or performance, I don't know, but lean towards show.
I think the stock Maxima's "scoop" is functional for cold air. But it is restrictive. I also think it was designed for balance between performance and noise. Any shift towards one will be detrimental to the other. Because of the Maxima's design (throttle body location, etc...), I think that short of going through the hood with a rear-facing scoop (cowl-induction), true ram-air on a Max isn't feasible.

Dave H

 

RAM-air, & other terminology is thrown around loosely to describe any number of designs that may have little or nothing to do with true ram-air. Agreed. The stock intake is effective at what it does. (For what it was designed to do - balance power & noise) Agreed. But it's definitely not a cold-air setup. A "cooler-air" setup, yes. -And it's not only "not exactly a ram-air setup," it's not at all.


1) I've had my grill off many times and done plenty 'o mods and maintenance (intake + all else, when all else fails). I'm comfortable with my original comments about the path of the airflow to the intake snorkle and I stand by them. Again, Nissan didn't design the intake snorkle to take air directly in from outside the car, because that invites the possibility of water being introduced into the intake on the same path. Airflow enters the engine bay through the grille, but then must be drawn upwards toward the hoodline to the snorkel opening by the vacuum effect of the intake. Outside air enters the engine bay via the grill, but it's not a direct shot to the snorkel. Please, take a closer look for yourself and you'll see what I'm talking about. The top/inside edge opening of the grille is definitely below the bottom edge of the snorkel opening. Additionally, the rubber seal on the bottom edge of the hood prevents water (or air) from entering the intake directly from outside when the hood is closed.

2) I neither suggested that anyone could cobble together a fully effective "efficent" ram-air system with anything anyone's talking about here, nor that they should confuse it with a properly engineered design. That's why I referred to the effort as "reverse-engineering" using "available" parts. This is nothing more than tinkering based upon theory. Something car nuts have been doing for generations, just for the fun of it. Btw, I'm not confused at all about what a true ram-air induction system is and how it functions. RU?

3) It was "cowl-induction" (as featured, for example on the 1969 Camaro), not RAM-air induction on vehicles of the era you mentioned. And the reason the companies pioneered cowl-induction instead of a forward-facing scoop? Simple. For the same reason the Maxima's intake snorkel is not directly exposed to the airflow outside the car: because automakers DON'T BUILD DESIGNS FOR PRODUCTION VEHICLES THAT CAN EASILY ALLOW WATER TO GET INTO THE COMBUSTION CHAMBER. It's a liability they're not willing to risk.

4) Re: your remark: "A hood scoop located in the central portion of the hood and facing forward, WILL NOT get the pressurized air it needs."

Sorry, but I whole-heartedly disagree with you here. FACT: A forward-facing hood scoop of the proper design and location on a hood (generalizing here: not suggesting anyone cut up their Maxima hood) WILL ACHIEVE (+) pressure above ambient air pressure on a vehicle in motion. That pressure will increase as the vehicle's velocity increases. Look at drag boats, look at funny cars, look at turbine-powered hydroplane race boats. All use forward-facing intake scoops. All the tuners/tech people in these and other racing syndicates will tell you they realize horsepower gains from pressurized airflow (> ambient air pressure) at speed, due to these forward-facing scoop designs.

Are you suggesting they're all wrong? I'm afraid the laws of physics are on their side.


PS: Again, I refer anyone interested in learning more about true RAM-air induction to the motorcycle industry, which is currently making effective (CAD-designed, dyno-proven) use of RAM-air induction in many available motorcycle models. Outside of racing, there aren't many good examples of production automobiles using the actual technology.

 

heres my setup. Cant say if theres much performance increase but it does its job of drawing more air under the hood which is a good thing


http://images.cardomain.com/installs...60_36_full.jpg

 

That looks really effective but maybe smoother tubing would help even more.

 

That is definitely a ghetto version. Why don't you design a scoop that goes behind the filter element to force more air into the filter... that would make it more "ram air."
-Robert

 

I see what you're saying. Like a cone that goes around a dog head. Hmm... I can do that. It would look WAY MORE ghetto than ever before, but it'll work.

 

The hoodscoops you're refering to sit 1+ feet above car/boat. They're nothing like the 2-inch scoops you see on factory cars. Apples to oranges, IMO.


Dave

 

Please include your design specifics when making claims in the future. (OEM, custom, 2-inch scoop, unlimited, whatever)

Your broad claim was simply "A hood scoop located in the central portion of the hood and facing forward will not. . ."

(I wish I were all-knowing, but The Amazing Kreskin, I'm not).

Fwiw, I agree with you on the fact that there isn't a production automobile I'm aware of that makes significant use of true ram-air induction. That's why imho, this debate shouldn't be limited strictly to what Detroit has come up with & using that as a basis to discount the potential of this concept - I think there's plenty of room for tuners, customizers, racers & DIY-ers to apply it in effective ways - just as the racing community and motorcycle engineering teams have.

I think we sorta had a communication breakdown: I'm arguing for the value/potential of this proven concept, while you're arguing the ineffectiveness of specific, available designs. (We agree on that one. Most automobile ram-air designs suck! -Because they're not true ram-air!)

Cheers,
-K-

http://www.amazingkreskin.com/