Raise rev limit to 7000 rpm or 7200 rpm?
08-06-2003, 06:27 AM
#1
Raise rev limit to 7000 rpm or 7200 rpm?
I'm having JWT program my ecu for 370 cc/min injectors and a Z32 mafs. At the same time they will raise the rev limit. The JWT guy on the phone said it will be raised to 7000 rpm, but I remember seeing here that some people are going with 7200 rpm.
Any reason to stick with 7000 rpm, or should I have them raise it to 7200?
Btw, I do have the mevi.
Any reason to stick with 7000 rpm, or should I have them raise it to 7200?
Btw, I do have the mevi.
08-06-2003, 07:18 AM
#5
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What about a higher rev limiter of 7500 - 7800? Our motors can handle way more than that, if needed, but where would the MEVI actually start to drastically drop off power to make it not worthwhile to rev that high?
08-06-2003, 07:25 AM
#7
Our motor couldn't handle 7800 on the stock valvetrain. 7500 would definately be pushing it. Since hes supercharged he has to worry about overspinning his blower too. Not sure what pulley is being used though. Go with as high as you think you can get away with. I'm having no problems with 7200 on my car. I think only one other person has the 7200 limiter though, I30TMikeD.
08-06-2003, 07:25 AM
#8
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I would get it as high as you can because you control the rev limit with your shift, not them. So just having the higher ceiling would be nice just in case you miss your level once in a while. That way you wont have that embarassing (eh eh eh) when you rev to close to redline.
08-06-2003, 07:30 AM
#9
Originally posted by 96BLUMAX
I would get it as high as you can because you control the rev limit with your shift, not them. So just having the higher ceiling would be nice just in case you miss your level once in a while. That way you wont have that embarassing (eh eh eh) when you rev to close to redline.
I would get it as high as you can because you control the rev limit with your shift, not them. So just having the higher ceiling would be nice just in case you miss your level once in a while. That way you wont have that embarassing (eh eh eh) when you rev to close to redline.
08-06-2003, 07:36 AM
#11
Member who somehow became The President of The SE-L Club
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The older your car gets, the weaker the valve springs become, the more chance of valve float.
Valve float isn't good and could cause severe damage to your engine.
Why chance it?
Valve float isn't good and could cause severe damage to your engine.
Why chance it?
08-06-2003, 07:41 AM
#12
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2001
Posts: 470
I see that the JWT Programming is ideal for our 4Gen Maximas. Does there programming "ONLY" provide a rasied Rev-Limit??? Does it offer any other gains? For example like added torque/hp though-out your power-band. What if you have full exhaust with Ypip and Filter Setup??. Will the Gains be noticeble??? Also, are there any before and after dyno runs with the JWT Programming????
08-06-2003, 07:52 AM
#14
Originally posted by Morfeus17
I see that the JWT Programming is ideal for our 4Gen Maximas. Does there programming "ONLY" provide a rasied Rev-Limit??? Does it offer any other gains? For example like added torque/hp though-out your power-band. What if you have full exhaust with Ypip and Filter Setup??. Will the Gains be noticeble??? Also, are there any before and after dyno runs with the JWT Programming????
I see that the JWT Programming is ideal for our 4Gen Maximas. Does there programming "ONLY" provide a rasied Rev-Limit??? Does it offer any other gains? For example like added torque/hp though-out your power-band. What if you have full exhaust with Ypip and Filter Setup??. Will the Gains be noticeble??? Also, are there any before and after dyno runs with the JWT Programming????
08-06-2003, 08:10 AM
#15
Not DAVEB the parts guy
Join Date: Aug 2000
Posts: 8,555
When I ordered my ECU, I asked for the 7200rpm limiter and Ben was pretty much against it. He'd do it, no questions asked, but he didn't recommend it. He said valve float on the VQ30DE happened anywhere from 7200-7400rpms and 7000rpms gave just enough of a cushion. I went ahead and got the 7000rpm limiter. I know people have used Cartest to determine 1/4 mile with the 7000 and 7200rpm limiter and the data showed the extra 200rpms netted .03 to .05 drop in ET. So it's pretty much not going to be measurable in the 1/4 mile seeing that you're talking about less than .1 seconds. I haven't heard of any problems with the 7200rpms limiters, but seeing that the valvetrain is potentially taxed after 7000rpms, I wasn't going to risk it.
BTW, the ideal MEVI shift points are:
1-2 ~7200rpms
2-3 ~7000rpms
3-4 ~6600rpms
As you can see, only the 1-2 shift requires the 7200rpm limiter for optimal performance.
Dave
BTW, the ideal MEVI shift points are:
1-2 ~7200rpms
2-3 ~7000rpms
3-4 ~6600rpms
As you can see, only the 1-2 shift requires the 7200rpm limiter for optimal performance.
Dave
08-06-2003, 08:21 AM
#16
Originally posted by Nealoc187
Our motor couldn't handle 7800 on the stock valvetrain. 7500 would definately be pushing it. Since hes supercharged he has to worry about overspinning his blower too. Not sure what pulley is being used though. Go with as high as you think you can get away with. I'm having no problems with 7200 on my car. I think only one other person has the 7200 limiter though, I30TMikeD.
Our motor couldn't handle 7800 on the stock valvetrain. 7500 would definately be pushing it. Since hes supercharged he has to worry about overspinning his blower too. Not sure what pulley is being used though. Go with as high as you think you can get away with. I'm having no problems with 7200 on my car. I think only one other person has the 7200 limiter though, I30TMikeD.
I'll be using a 3" pulley, which will put the blower at just under 50000 rpm at 7000 crank rpm. Vortech lists 50 krpm as the blower limit, but there's some built in headroom according to Mardigrasmax. But from what people are saying about valve float with older engines (mine's got 135k miles) I think I'll play it safe at 7000 rpm.
08-06-2003, 08:32 AM
#17
Originally posted by Morfeus17
I see that the JWT Programming is ideal for our 4Gen Maximas. Does there programming "ONLY" provide a rasied Rev-Limit??? Does it offer any other gains? For example like added torque/hp though-out your power-band. What if you have full exhaust with Ypip and Filter Setup??. Will the Gains be noticeble??? Also, are there any before and after dyno runs with the JWT Programming????
I see that the JWT Programming is ideal for our 4Gen Maximas. Does there programming "ONLY" provide a rasied Rev-Limit??? Does it offer any other gains? For example like added torque/hp though-out your power-band. What if you have full exhaust with Ypip and Filter Setup??. Will the Gains be noticeble??? Also, are there any before and after dyno runs with the JWT Programming????
granted my dynos are for a NA car. word on the street is with the JWT SC program ECU and 370cc injectors, you will have a beast on your hands.
--Paul
08-06-2003, 08:55 AM
#18
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2001
Posts: 470
No this is not the first, but I would like to see dynos. And I'm not saying your wrong, but if your right, this is a Mod worth doing.
I guess the search feature is not running, if you have links that would be great. And post your results when you do yours. Thanks.
I guess the search feature is not running, if you have links that would be great. And post your results when you do yours. Thanks.
Originally posted by Nealoc187
Just curious if this the first thread about ECUs you've ever read. People that have them LOVE THEM and it's not only because of the raised rev limiter. It feels like it felt when you added your y pipe for the first time. Yes there are before and after dynos, Requin6 has one. I'm doing one this saturday.
Just curious if this the first thread about ECUs you've ever read. People that have them LOVE THEM and it's not only because of the raised rev limiter. It feels like it felt when you added your y pipe for the first time. Yes there are before and after dynos, Requin6 has one. I'm doing one this saturday.
08-06-2003, 08:55 AM
#19
Originally posted by Stephen Max
Brodaiga has a 7200 rpm rev limit, too.
I'll be using a 3" pulley, which will put the blower at just under 50000 rpm at 7000 crank rpm. Vortech lists 50 krpm as the blower limit, but there's some built in headroom according to Mardigrasmax. But from what people are saying about valve float with older engines (mine's got 135k miles) I think I'll play it safe at 7000 rpm.
Brodaiga has a 7200 rpm rev limit, too.
I'll be using a 3" pulley, which will put the blower at just under 50000 rpm at 7000 crank rpm. Vortech lists 50 krpm as the blower limit, but there's some built in headroom according to Mardigrasmax. But from what people are saying about valve float with older engines (mine's got 135k miles) I think I'll play it safe at 7000 rpm.
I'm sure with the SC and tuning you can make power as high as you feel safe running the blower, especially with the VI.-hype
08-06-2003, 09:06 AM
#21
no rev limit would mean, we could pass 8k, the racing vq30 makes 400hp at 8500 i think(maybe8k) and the one nissan is testing makes 450 hp at 8500 rpm, only if we could have those engines
08-06-2003, 09:10 AM
#22
Originally posted by xHypex
If you do decide you have more blower rpm JWT can also provide you with new valve springs I'm sure with the SC and tuning you can make power as high as you feel safe running the blower, especially with the VI.
-hype
If you do decide you have more blower rpm JWT can also provide you with new valve springs
I'm sure with the SC and tuning you can make power as high as you feel safe running the blower, especially with the VI.-hype
The problem with overspinning the blower is you very quickly get away from the efficiency island and into compressor surge territory. At 50 krpm the V1 is already just outside the 65% island and since the VQ engine is considerably smaller than what the V1 was designed for, the intersection of intake cfm and blower speed is very close to the surge line. I really don't see how Mardi gets away with overreving the blower as much as he does without using some sort of charge air cooling. The J&S must be saving his butt bigtime.
Anyway, by the time you start thinking about a built engine and intercooler, you might as well go turbo.
08-06-2003, 09:12 AM
#23
Well I should wrap this up before I start to ramble.
Join Date: Feb 2003
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Originally posted by kevlo911
no rev limit would mean, we could pass 8k, the racing vq30 makes 400hp at 8500 i think(maybe8k) and the one nissan is testing makes 450 hp at 8500 rpm, only if we could have those engines
no rev limit would mean, we could pass 8k, the racing vq30 makes 400hp at 8500 i think(maybe8k) and the one nissan is testing makes 450 hp at 8500 rpm, only if we could have those engines
And where did you Get this Information from, If you don't mind asking..........
08-06-2003, 09:12 AM
#24
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Originally posted by xHypex
If you do decide you have more blower rpm JWT can also provide you with new valve springs I'm sure with the SC and tuning you can make power as high as you feel safe running the blower, especially with the VI.
-hype
If you do decide you have more blower rpm JWT can also provide you with new valve springs
I'm sure with the SC and tuning you can make power as high as you feel safe running the blower, especially with the VI.-hype
But for an NA motor, with MEVI, there's got to be a safe ground above 7200RPM still. Theoretically, where would the MEVI start to drop off in power?
08-06-2003, 09:14 AM
#25
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2001
Posts: 470
Wow. Thats good enough for me to get mine done. So I should just get the N/A programming. They would assume you have Y-pipe options installed already. Thanks for the dyno chart.
Originally posted by Requin6
here you go...
granted my dynos are for a NA car. word on the street is with the JWT SC program ECU and 370cc injectors, you will have a beast on your hands.
--Paul
here you go...
granted my dynos are for a NA car. word on the street is with the JWT SC program ECU and 370cc injectors, you will have a beast on your hands.
--Paul
08-06-2003, 09:16 AM
#26
Originally posted by Stephen Max
mmmmmmm built engine
The problem with overspinning the blower is you very quickly get away from the efficiency island and into compressor surge territory. At 50 krpm the V1 is already just outside the 65% island and since the VQ engine is considerably smaller than what the V1 was designed for, the intersection of intake cfm and blower speed is very close to the surge line. I really don't see how Mardi gets away with overreving the blower as much as he does without using some sort of charge air cooling. The J&S must be saving his butt bigtime.
Anyway, by the time you start thinking about a built engine and intercooler, you might as well go turbo.
mmmmmmm built engine
The problem with overspinning the blower is you very quickly get away from the efficiency island and into compressor surge territory. At 50 krpm the V1 is already just outside the 65% island and since the VQ engine is considerably smaller than what the V1 was designed for, the intersection of intake cfm and blower speed is very close to the surge line. I really don't see how Mardi gets away with overreving the blower as much as he does without using some sort of charge air cooling. The J&S must be saving his butt bigtime.
Anyway, by the time you start thinking about a built engine and intercooler, you might as well go turbo.
I have no idea what your budget/goals are like, but regardless it's always fun to build.-hype
08-06-2003, 09:32 AM
#27
Originally posted by CystumMax
And where did you Get this Information from, If you don't mind asking..........
And where did you Get this Information from, If you don't mind asking..........
http://www.telefonicaworldseries.com...h/technic.html
http://www.telefonicaworldseries.com...h/news/n71.htm
http://www.opentelefonica.com/contenidoe.htm
Quote from the site:
"The aerodynamics are highly efficent using ground effects (as with Champ cars), combined with the excellent Nissan Maxima V6 engine, offering a maximum power of 410 CV at 8.500 rpm, give to this Single Seater an extraordinary balance that will allow the young and talented drivers to experience the feelings, requirements and situations close to the most important world car racing event: the Formula One."
08-06-2003, 09:49 AM
#28
Moderator who thinks he is better than us with his I30
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Originally posted by Morfeus17
Wow. Thats good enough for me to get mine done. So I should just get the N/A programming. They would assume you have Y-pipe options installed already. Thanks for the dyno chart.
Wow. Thats good enough for me to get mine done. So I should just get the N/A programming. They would assume you have Y-pipe options installed already. Thanks for the dyno chart.
08-06-2003, 09:51 AM
#29
Well I should wrap this up before I start to ramble.
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 1,830
Originally posted by kevlo911
i don't mind
http://www.telefonicaworldseries.com...h/technic.html
http://www.telefonicaworldseries.com...h/news/n71.htm
http://www.opentelefonica.com/contenidoe.htm
Quote from the site:
"The aerodynamics are highly efficent using ground effects (as with Champ cars), combined with the excellent Nissan Maxima V6 engine, offering a maximum power of 410 CV at 8.500 rpm, give to this Single Seater an extraordinary balance that will allow the young and talented drivers to experience the feelings, requirements and situations close to the most important world car racing event: the Formula One."
i don't mind
http://www.telefonicaworldseries.com...h/technic.html
http://www.telefonicaworldseries.com...h/news/n71.htm
http://www.opentelefonica.com/contenidoe.htm
Quote from the site:
"The aerodynamics are highly efficent using ground effects (as with Champ cars), combined with the excellent Nissan Maxima V6 engine, offering a maximum power of 410 CV at 8.500 rpm, give to this Single Seater an extraordinary balance that will allow the young and talented drivers to experience the feelings, requirements and situations close to the most important world car racing event: the Formula One."
Now I Like to see a picture of that Engine....
08-06-2003, 10:13 AM
#30
Originally posted by CystumMax
Now I Like to see a picture of that Engine....
Now I Like to see a picture of that Engine....
but here http://www.telefonicaworldseries.com...sh/news/n9.htm
08-06-2003, 10:18 AM
#31
Well I should wrap this up before I start to ramble.
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 1,830
Originally posted by kevlo911
now your starting to push it
but here http://www.telefonicaworldseries.com...sh/news/n9.htm
now your starting to push it
but here http://www.telefonicaworldseries.com...sh/news/n9.htm
I like to see the VQ30 Engine modified to do 410 HP...THis picture shows two blocks it could be from anything......
08-06-2003, 10:43 AM
#32
Originally posted by I30tMikeD
People keep talking about the ECU being programed to your mods. Jim wolf never asked me what I had done to the car besides if I was NA or not. I don't think it matter what you have done to your car unless your running boost or nitrous. They said it did not even matter that I had the VI. The way I understand it is that it's a standard adjustment they to for all NA applications.
People keep talking about the ECU being programed to your mods. Jim wolf never asked me what I had done to the car besides if I was NA or not. I don't think it matter what you have done to your car unless your running boost or nitrous. They said it did not even matter that I had the VI. The way I understand it is that it's a standard adjustment they to for all NA applications.
08-06-2003, 11:34 AM
#33
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Originally posted by Morfeus17
Wow. Thats good enough for me to get mine done. So I should just get the N/A programming. They would assume you have Y-pipe options installed already. Thanks for the dyno chart.
Wow. Thats good enough for me to get mine done. So I should just get the N/A programming. They would assume you have Y-pipe options installed already. Thanks for the dyno chart.
I will be ordering my ECU next week. I wonder if we can get a better rate for ordering as a group...
Isn't avalon racing cheaper for the ECU than JWT directly?
08-06-2003, 01:24 PM
#36
Originally posted by Stephen Max
I think I'll play it safe at 7000 rpm.
I think I'll play it safe at 7000 rpm.
If I got the 7200rpm limit, I could always shift at 7000rpm, but if I got the 7000rpm limit, I could never shift at 7200rpm.
08-06-2003, 01:29 PM
#37
Originally posted by ejj
Steve, my thinking would be this:
If I got the 7200rpm limit, I could always shift at 7000rpm, but if I got the 7000rpm limit, I could never shift at 7200rpm.
Steve, my thinking would be this:
If I got the 7200rpm limit, I could always shift at 7000rpm, but if I got the 7000rpm limit, I could never shift at 7200rpm.
08-06-2003, 01:32 PM
#38
Originally posted by Stephen Max
Yeah, good point, Eric. Dave B makes good recommendations about shift points for a NA Maxima, but when you're supercharged, the higher the shift rpm the better. Hmmmm.
Yeah, good point, Eric. Dave B makes good recommendations about shift points for a NA Maxima, but when you're supercharged, the higher the shift rpm the better. Hmmmm.
Besides, worst case you'll need a new engine. Then you can build it to handle even higher RPM!
