Putting 2 DE-K exhaust cams in a DE.. opinions?..
02-20-2004, 02:59 PM
#1
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Putting 2 DE-K exhaust cams in a DE.. opinions?..
There are some KA people out there who have done it and showed gains.. two exhaust cams, (swap the intake cam with an exhaust cam). I wonder if using two DE-K cams since they have bigger lobes on a DE would give any gains?
02-20-2004, 04:38 PM
#2
The only advantage the DE-K cams possess is the exhaust lobes are ever so slightly larger. The intake cams on both engines are identical. Plus both the intake and exhaust valves have more duration in the DE and have more overlap. This has been discussed already and the general consensus is that the MAIN power difference between the 2 engines is the DE-K VI. Without it, you will be disappointed.
In other words, not worth it.
In other words, not worth it.
02-20-2004, 10:42 PM
#4
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Originally Posted by IwANnAMaX96
The only advantage the DE-K cams possess is the exhaust lobes are ever so slightly larger. The intake cams on both engines are identical. Plus both the intake and exhaust valves have more duration in the DE and have more overlap. This has been discussed already and the general consensus is that the MAIN power difference between the 2 engines is the DE-K VI. Without it, you will be disappointed.
In other words, not worth it.
In other words, not worth it.
I did a cam swap on a KA tonight it was pretty easy it only took us about 2 hrs and not ever having done it before.. Just wondering if anyone has any good feedback on trying this?
02-20-2004, 10:52 PM
#5
The KA motor is totally different than the VQ motor.
Requirred
Remove intake (Upper and lower), Remove valve covers, remove all belted accessories, remove passenger side motor mount, remove outer timing chain cover. From there, you will be able to access the cams. Simply removing all the crap will take you more than 2 hrs easily. Look at a weekend to do this project.
Requirred
Remove intake (Upper and lower), Remove valve covers, remove all belted accessories, remove passenger side motor mount, remove outer timing chain cover. From there, you will be able to access the cams. Simply removing all the crap will take you more than 2 hrs easily. Look at a weekend to do this project.
02-20-2004, 11:29 PM
#6
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LOL, swapping cams in an Inline-4 is about a zillion times easier than a V6. Also, there are differences on both cams between the DE and DE-K.
I did a little analysis in the other thread: http://forums.maxima.org/showpost.ph...2&postcount=59
Based on that (assuming I didn't get my numbers reversed), I think it would be worthwhile to try to swap a DE-K exhaust cam onto a DE with the MEVI since it would help with the top-end breathing a lot more. Heck, a DE-K exhaust cam onto a DE intake cam might be worthwhile also.
So long as you can get the cam aligned properly. Wow that would be confusing.
I did a little analysis in the other thread: http://forums.maxima.org/showpost.ph...2&postcount=59
Based on that (assuming I didn't get my numbers reversed), I think it would be worthwhile to try to swap a DE-K exhaust cam onto a DE with the MEVI since it would help with the top-end breathing a lot more. Heck, a DE-K exhaust cam onto a DE intake cam might be worthwhile also.
So long as you can get the cam aligned properly. Wow that would be confusing.
02-21-2004, 04:20 PM
#7
Originally Posted by SteVTEC
LOL, swapping cams in an Inline-4 is about a zillion times easier than a V6. Also, there are differences on both cams between the DE and DE-K.
I did a little analysis in the other thread: http://forums.maxima.org/showpost.ph...2&postcount=59
Based on that (assuming I didn't get my numbers reversed), I think it would be worthwhile to try to swap a DE-K exhaust cam onto a DE with the MEVI since it would help with the top-end breathing a lot more. Heck, a DE-K exhaust cam onto a DE intake cam might be worthwhile also.
So long as you can get the cam aligned properly. Wow that would be confusing.
I did a little analysis in the other thread: http://forums.maxima.org/showpost.ph...2&postcount=59
Based on that (assuming I didn't get my numbers reversed), I think it would be worthwhile to try to swap a DE-K exhaust cam onto a DE with the MEVI since it would help with the top-end breathing a lot more. Heck, a DE-K exhaust cam onto a DE intake cam might be worthwhile also.
So long as you can get the cam aligned properly. Wow that would be confusing.
What I meant by the intake cams being the same is that the intake valves have identical lift. I should've specified. And I don't know where I got those overlap numbers from either.
But as for the DE-K cams having more lift...Won't the fact that they have less duration negate the added lift?? Teach me o wise one...
You're my tech hero
02-21-2004, 04:58 PM
#8
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Originally Posted by IwANnAMaX96
But as for the DE-K cams having more lift...Won't the fact that they have less duration negate the added lift?? Teach me o wise one...
Originally Posted by SteVTEC
VQ30DE
Intake Valve Open: 3 BTDC
Intake Valve Close: 49 ABDC
Intake Valve Duration: 232
Valve Lift: Nominal
===
Exhaust Valve Open: 49 BBDC
Exhaust Valve Close: 3 ATDC
Exhaust Valve Duration: 232
Valve Lift: Nominal
VQ30DE-K
Intake Valve Open: 3 BTDC
Intake Valve Close: 41 ABDC
Intake Valve Duration: 224
Valve Lift: Nominal
===
Exhaust Valve Open: 49 BBDC
Exhaust Valve Close: 3 ATDC
Exhaust Valve Duration: 232
Valve Lift: Nominal + 0.525mm
Intake Valve Open: 3 BTDC
Intake Valve Close: 49 ABDC
Intake Valve Duration: 232
Valve Lift: Nominal
===
Exhaust Valve Open: 49 BBDC
Exhaust Valve Close: 3 ATDC
Exhaust Valve Duration: 232
Valve Lift: Nominal
VQ30DE-K
Intake Valve Open: 3 BTDC
Intake Valve Close: 41 ABDC
Intake Valve Duration: 224
Valve Lift: Nominal
===
Exhaust Valve Open: 49 BBDC
Exhaust Valve Close: 3 ATDC
Exhaust Valve Duration: 232
Valve Lift: Nominal + 0.525mm
Does anybody know the actual valve lift specs of the DE or DE-K cams? What the FSM gave is the entire height of the cam including lobe which is not the actual valve lift. I'm sure somebody here knows this. I should probably also try searching.
02-21-2004, 06:33 PM
#9
Originally Posted by SteVTEC
Only the DE-K intake cam has less duration.
You wouldn't want to swap a DE-K intake cam onto a DE. The thing of interest is the exhaust cam which has equal duration (232*) but slightly more lift. Swapping a DE-K/exhaust onto a DE/exhaust would be interesting to see, especially with the MEVI, or even "reverse" swapping it onto the intake side if you can figure that out. If the KA guys have done that successfully then there's no reason it can't be done on a VQ.
Does anybody know the actual valve lift specs of the DE or DE-K cams? What the FSM gave is the entire height of the cam including lobe which is not the actual valve lift. I'm sure somebody here knows this. I should probably also try searching.
You wouldn't want to swap a DE-K intake cam onto a DE. The thing of interest is the exhaust cam which has equal duration (232*) but slightly more lift. Swapping a DE-K/exhaust onto a DE/exhaust would be interesting to see, especially with the MEVI, or even "reverse" swapping it onto the intake side if you can figure that out. If the KA guys have done that successfully then there's no reason it can't be done on a VQ.
Does anybody know the actual valve lift specs of the DE or DE-K cams? What the FSM gave is the entire height of the cam including lobe which is not the actual valve lift. I'm sure somebody here knows this. I should probably also try searching.
What do you think?
02-21-2004, 06:59 PM
#10
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The JWTs are way more aggressive - no comparison. I can tell that having heard a few without even knowing the specs. Any factory cam these days is going to be pretty mild due to emissions and economy concerns. For reference, back in the musclecar era (60's to about '72) a lot of the engines back then ran maybe 260-280* duration cams stock, some even 300* or more, with crazy amounts of lift and 11:1 or even 13:1 compression. These little 232's are real dinky compared to back then or any aftermarket cams today.
02-21-2004, 07:30 PM
#11
Originally Posted by SteVTEC
Only the DE-K intake cam has less duration.
You wouldn't want to swap a DE-K intake cam onto a DE. The thing of interest is the exhaust cam which has equal duration (232*) but slightly more lift. Swapping a DE-K/exhaust onto a DE/exhaust would be interesting to see, especially with the MEVI, or even "reverse" swapping it onto the intake side if you can figure that out. If the KA guys have done that successfully then there's no reason it can't be done on a VQ.
Does anybody know the actual valve lift specs of the DE or DE-K cams? What the FSM gave is the entire height of the cam including lobe which is not the actual valve lift. I'm sure somebody here knows this. I should probably also try searching.
You wouldn't want to swap a DE-K intake cam onto a DE. The thing of interest is the exhaust cam which has equal duration (232*) but slightly more lift. Swapping a DE-K/exhaust onto a DE/exhaust would be interesting to see, especially with the MEVI, or even "reverse" swapping it onto the intake side if you can figure that out. If the KA guys have done that successfully then there's no reason it can't be done on a VQ.
Does anybody know the actual valve lift specs of the DE or DE-K cams? What the FSM gave is the entire height of the cam including lobe which is not the actual valve lift. I'm sure somebody here knows this. I should probably also try searching.
Edit: Ok I found it. It was a posting my Mardigrasmax...
02-21-2004, 08:40 PM
#12
Also if its worth anything I ran a simulation on Dyno2000 and it showed some tiny high rpm HP gains if you use VQ30DE-K exhaust cams in a VQ30DE motor. However using both VQ30DE-K intake and exhaust cams on a VQ30DE showed some decent gains on TQ but some loss of power on the top end, if thats true maybe the power loss is negated by the DE-K dual runner manifold. 
Steve does this work at all with your theory?
Steve does this work at all with your theory?
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