Nealoc187

iTrader: (23)

I was on my way home from work tonight at about midnight, and decided to drop by my friends' house... they are twins, one owns a 96 Eclipse GSX and one owns a 95 civic. they were just leaving to go cruising, so i decided to go with them. on the way to the local cruising area, we go on a road that is really good for street racing, that is, safer than most. its a connecting road, that runs between two main streets, but has absolutely no residential traffic, its basically the back entrance to a small mall, and thats all its used for. so at midnight there's zero traffic... we didnt see a single other car. its very smooth pavement, and nice and twisty with long sweeping turns and long straights.

anyhow, we were just tooling along at the posted 35 mph when my friend with the civic decides he wants to speed it up a bit, luckily its 3 lanes wide each direction, and its a boulevard so there is a median between you and oncoming traffic. anyhow we each get in our own lane and the GSX and i promptly dust the civic. GSX and i raced on a straightaway, from 35-80 or 85, i took him by 1 length in that time. he is modded with GReddy exhaust, and an intake of some sort, not sure what brand, and the usual lowering and wheels and such. my mods are listed below, nothing done to the engine.

i have yet to take my maxima to the track, he has taken his GSX however, and has a best time of 15.003.

just thought id share my little race with everyone.

party_boy

a gsx should have been able to dust most of us here. The awd should have given him an edge on turns while the turbo should have kicked in that range...is he experienced in driving stick?

Sonic

His turbocharger could be dying too. My brother's GS-T is actually slower than my car off the line to about 75. Kinda pays off having good low end torque and not having to wait for a turbocharger to spool up on a automatic transmission car.

MaxedOut97SE

The GSX/Talon TSi is not that fast.

Nealoc187

iTrader: (23)

Yes, he's experienced in driving a stick... like i said, 15.003 is his 1/4 mile... thats pretty decent for just exhaust and a filter. as far as AWD in ther turns, we didnt go around any turns at speed, i could just imagine a cop sitting just around one of the turns unnoticed and pegging all 3 of us for 100 in a 40mph zone or whatever the speedlimit is there. anyhow, he's got a boost controller now, but its yet to be installed, he'll soon be able to smoke me very badly...

vmok

My friend's GSX (albiet 1990 1st Gen GSX) has been parked in front of my house for the past month or two, so I occasionally take it out for fun and to move it.

Just recently, she had a lot of new parts installed, including alternator, a new turbo, tune up, new clutch, etc... After the turbos 'wear' out and don't provide boost anymore, these cars are slow, as the compression has been lowered for turbo duty.

The cars' AWD system doesn't help as much as you think in terms of handling (like autoX). It still understeers if the turbo is on boil. However, in long sweepers, it does seem to track well. Off the line, if you drag the clutch, you can you can be on boost from the time the light turns green. The AWD system is awesome at the launch for preventing wheelspin, and these cars redline at 7000 RPM. I chirped the tires ones time in a 1-2 shift. My guess is all 4 wheels chirped as I took an Audi S4 off the line. However, I've read the quickest way to launch (though probably not the best!) is to rev it up to like 5000 and sidestep/dump the clutch and let AWD do it's thing. From a rolling start it'd take about a one-onethousdand count for the boost to peak if he were in the right gear. According to the stock boost gauge, peak boost is somewhere in the 8-12psi range.

My other friend had a 1999 GSX AWD that he ran at Rallies and AutoX and trackdays. He would be able to pull on some Vipers at track days. But then again, he was crazy, running race fuel with about 18-21psi of boost.

-V

ybelm620

I have much respect for those cars. I actually wanted to trade in my max for a '99 GSX, but then i changed my mind. I have a friend that has a '97 GS-T and that car is bad. I mean it can move, i love driving that car. The thing i like most about *** is how close his gears are compared to my maxima. His third gear feels like 1st in mine, with some engine work, and a n upgraded turbo they are dangerous, andi have seen supras and 3000gt VR4's fall to them, so look out.

AntGVR4

Umm.. Sorry your are SOOOOOOOO wrong .....

Nealoc .. if he's running stock boost you still shouldn't be able to beat him ..
STock GSX will run 14.5 .. thas more than enuff to beat a 5speed maxima ..

If he gets a boost controller.. well lets just say it'll be fast

Ant

MaxedOut97SE

I'm sooooooo wrong?? OK, that's why I've walked them before.

Nealoc187

iTrader: (23)

I've NEVER EVER seen a GSX/TSi AWD run even CLOSE to 14.5 stock. published numbers for them are 15.2, and yes, i've seen ALOT run at the track, stock and otherwise. i suppose that on SOME day, with PERFECT conditions, someone has probably done it... but it is BY NO MEANS normal.

anyways, we happened to race again tonight. we just got on the highway and both decided to open 'em up, and lo and behold... we were dead even, and i do mean DEAD even, until i smacked the governor at 118mph. so i figure that last night must have been a fluke, and i must have made a quicker shift than him or something. because neither of us pulled an inch on the other tonight. oh yeah, and by this time we had smoked his twin brother's civic and at the same time gotten roasted by our other friends new WRX.. WRX had probably 75 feet on us by the time we reached 118mph and i had to shut it down because my car is lame and has a governor.

GTRBlkMax97

iTrader: (1)

But again Austin I was in the car, and you only went passed him after 2nd gear. Just stating the facts, but you know Rich's car is alot faster than a stock turbo talon or GSX, it is one of the mutants

CoolMax

iTrader: (7)

BOOST!
When he turns it up..goodbye.

MaxedOut97SE

Jon, I smoked him, and you know it. We raced three times and I didn't just walk him, I had him by like 5 car lengths. Take you out of the car and I bet I would have taken him by about 3.

GTRBlkMax97

iTrader: (1)

but he did beat you to 60 mph, I know you ripped his *** after 60 though,

MaxedOut97SE

Yeah, I'll give him that, but remember my front bumper was at his front door, so it wasn't by that much. IF he didn't have AWD, I would have taken him down low as well as up top.
Oh and Jon I need my carpet cleaner back.

GTRBlkMax97

iTrader: (1)

F#CK YOU AND YOUR CARPET CLEANER,
j/k
yea I will try to remember when i get off work to go get it. I will just come by your place later on tonight and give it to you.
I get off work at 8:00 so just give me a call at about 9 or so

MaxedOut97SE

yeah but did u fix the part that you broke? Don't bring me back something broken...

AntGVR4

You walked a GSX ?
I'm not gonna argue with you because I've seen at least 3 stock GSX/TSI run between 14.5-14.7 BONE STOCK

don't believe me .. here check the numbers yourself
www.nj.dsm.org

if you walked a GSX with just a STillen catback then your max is sumtin else ... I don't think you are in my area cause if you were i'm sure i'd have a nubmer of DSM guys lined up to show you wut i'm talkin about

Ant

Dave B

I don't understand why everyone is so sure the GSX will take us out. I have yet to be beaten by a 2nd gen DSM AWD. Unfortunately I haven't had the chance to run any turbo FWD and/or 1st gen DSMs. The 3 AWD DSMs I've beaten had mods to a degree, but I don't know what they truely did to their turbos. The ONLY advantage a mostly stock GSX has over us is the ability to get off the line like a *****. After that, it's 210hp in a AWD and heavy car (3300lbs) starts to take it's toll on the topend. Every single AWD DSM I've raced got walked after 60mph. I usually put 2-3 cars on them by 90mph.

The only 2nd gen DSM I know of that is a beast here in Kansas City is Bryan Hs (he used to own a 14 second 92 SE). His Eclipse has a fairly built motor and drivetrain. His car uses a "stand alone" ECU (ie laptop) and has the "super" 16G turbo. At first, he could only get 14.5s@95mph out of the car, however with a little tuning he was into the 12.7s@107mph. Remember though, this is a "built" car. It's not near as easy to hit reliable 12s and low 13s in these DSMs. As far as I know, Bryan is the quickest DSM at KCIR. The last time I saw him run, he was with about 4 other DSMs. I believe 3 of them were FWD turbos and one was a AWD. The FWDs weren't remotely close to 14s. Just something to think about when everyone says they are easy mid 14 second cars.


Dave

TurboTalon1

Does the real brushed aluminum dash kit add 50HP? Does a 6" exhaust tip add 25HP? I dont have a problem with most of you guys, but the guy up top saying an Eclipse/Talon GSX/GST is not fast? This guy is full of &$%*&*^%^. Go ahead and put ricer on the tag dude. Your thread is on DSMTALK.COM and providing much laughter, your Maxima is a nice looking car, but you are not going to take a GST/G
SX. Dream on dude.

theslik1

You need to come out my way and get an education in DSM's. Any GS-T/GSX with your intake/exhaust mods and comparable driver WILL embarass you. The car and/or driver you were racing must have been malfunctioning. Consider yourself extremely fortunate to have gotten that "kill". I hope you took a picture, 'cause it probably will never happen again (unless you race an NT)

BTW, stop by DSMTalk.com and witness the merryment at your expense!

Later...

MaxedOut97SE

Full of &$%*&*^%^???!!?? Ok, first of all, I don't give a f**k what you or anyone else thinks or says, I said a GSX/Talon is not that fast cause they really aren't. I'm not going to take a GST/GSX?? Well, I have. Yeah, he got me off the line cause of his AWD, but after 60 it was over. I had 5 car lengths on him by 80. Second, don't come on this forum and try to talk smack. But since you did, how about this: You can take your piece of sh*t, ugly, unrefined, unreliable Eclipse/Talon and go elsewhere. Don't blow your engine on the way!!!!!!!

MaxedOut97SE

No thanks, I don't waste my time looking at Mistubishi sh*t. And for your information, this race occured when I didn't have any mods. I guess I should have added that too.

theslik1

Whoa dude...that vein in your head is about to burst!

Like I said before, please enjoy your "kill".
It's a once in a lifetime achievement for a Maxima owner!


Seriously though, any stock GS-T/GSX in good tune and with a competent driver should beat your Maxima every time, stoplight-to-stoplight, 0-60, or 1/4 mile (even with your mods).

12-13 second 1/4 mile DSM's are not "built" cars as has been stated in this thread, and aren't all that rare. They have upgraded turbos, intakes, and exhaust, and better fuel pumps to support the added HP. Most are reliable daily drivers and remarkably tolerant of abuse.

Lastly, most DSM owners have relatively open minds when it comes to other makes and models (except Rustangs of course). Horsepower comes in many different and interesting forms...

93Tsi

Ok first of all Id like to say that im not here to start a war. I simply registered to eduacatesome of you guys unfamiliar with DSM's. First of all, in stock trim, a turbo dsm should run anywhere from 14.8-15.2. I know thats not that fast, but the beauty of DSM's is their ease of modding. Add a turbo-back exhaust and boost control with a k&n and you're a very low 14 sec. car if not high 13. Add a fuel pump and upper intercooler piping and you're an easy 13.4-13.7. So far thats about 1000 dollars in mods and you have a killer street car. Next you upgrade the turbo($600) and get a fuel computer and you have a high 12 sec. car. You will see a lot of DSM's with this level of mods. Now, about high 12 sec. DSM's being built, HAHA. The stock engine is capable of holding around 475 horsepower. Oh and if the person decides to keep modding, you better watch out. Ive seen quite a few low 11 sec. STREET talons and even saw a 10.2 talon that looked very streetable. Oh BTW, the fastest DSm's are now pushing 8 seconds and I just saw a tube frame race talon run 8.5@ almost 160.

93Tsi

Oh ya, i forgot to say that those 8 sec. cars are still the same engine that came with the car, but those ones are "built".

91tsiofcdsm

Ok i am not here to bs the maxima owners, becasue i really dont know what your cars can do.... i will tell you what my car and cars in general can do....to start of i have a 91 (1st gen) talon tsi frontwheeldrive and of course 5 speed. it first ran it stock at 15.001. when i let my friends drive it... and he is a good driver.. my best at that time was a 15.4. i eventually got it down to 15.2. this is bone stock with 101,000 miles... then i got boost control air flow mods and air filter and ran 14.9 running around 15psi, stupid guage is metric so its hard to tell. and this is still when i rip my tires and spin.... then i got porting done and since then i have been aroun 14.7-14.8. Finally tonight i learn how to launch my car (of course with worn down tires)and get a 2.3 60ft and run 14.3. tongiht i also ran a 14.5 and a couple 14.6's so i am still learning how to drive it...... Now tell me with only boost control, free airflow mods and a k&n filter, and port work on the turbo and manifold, a total about of $180 of stuff at most (thanx for who helped me port my stuff), to tell me that 14.3@99.52mph isnt fast? espcially for not even having an aftermarket exaust? please. i have the time slip to show you.... please dont tell me our cars are slow. it must be the drivers being slow. and i am friends with 93tsi who has run what he told you, everything is truth, oh yeh and htat 8.5 tube chassis talon is dave buschurs talon. and yes its still the 4 banger engine in there just suped up and ready for the horse it has. i am sure some of you heard of him, he is right here in ohio. and the guy who rebuilt my tranny john shepard, has a car running in 10's i think. but please the engine that these cars came with are considered one of the best engines to hold the boost and horsepower. and nonetheless fastest. dont tell me they arent fast cars. the car is only as good as the driver.

Nitrox

Hey, I live in Philadelphia and I own a '90 DSM FWD. There wasn't much done to this car except for a few siple bolt-ons, with stock turbo of course and a whooping 147,000 miles on the odometer. I'm not sure how fast Maximas are, but I'd love to find out. If anyone here interested, please reply and we can set up a friendly race.

A little friendly wager wouldn't hurt either

Car With No Name

I'm not getting involved in this back and forth talk about who's car is better,....but the last time I was at the track I saw a 1st gen car run and it looked very stock. Everyone watching laughed as the loud bangs exited the exhaust 3 or 4 times at the line. A launch and 1st and 2nd looked like a mess,...some were still laughing,....but when he hit third gear and pulled away like no tomorrow....it got real quiet. Then the time came thru at the traps....a very low 11 second run. It was the biggest sleeper 10 second car I have ever seen.

Nobody here is ******* those cars...hell...I have been wooped by one that I found out later had 250 to the tires...it's all relative

AntGVR4

Thank you DSM guys for proving my point

YES, i do drive a maxima but i also hang around alot with the NJ DSM club .... i know a decent amount about their cars and what they will do at the track and on the street...

I don't mean to insult any maxima guys but you can't compare the two

DaveB: you have one of the faster maxima's ... but if you add up the amount you've spent on mods and put that into a 2nd gen DSM then you will see wut they can do...

it takes at most 2g's to upgrade a turbo and add all the extra goodies necessary to make a 2nd gen a low 13's car ...

Ant

RICOiz704

All I know is that I got a video of an older Eclispe literally walking a Type R...and if Nissan didnt shape up and find me my 4thgen 5sp SE for a good price I almost ended up in a Talon Tsi that's fast as all hell....but I love my max but at the same time respect other vehicles....but owners are another story....but Im am glad I did get the Max cause even tho the Talon was fast as all hell, it stayed in the shop....but that could be an isolated insident who know's....but Im glad I ended up with what I did.....

MaxedOut97SE

Ok, here's how it is. I'm not saying that my car will out run every GSX/Talon on the road; all I am saying is that I smoked a 95 5spd Talon TSi AWD, in excellent condition, driven by a close friend of mine who definately knows how to drive a 5spd, he's a hell of a driver. He claims his car is faster than stock, he has beaten a handful of GSX's. This race took place when my car had NO mods. We took off, and my front bumper was at his front door until about 60 MPH. As soon as my car hit 3rd gear it was over. You DSM guys need to understand that a 5spd Maxima has some pretty darn good top end. Anyway, we raced all the way to 115, and by that point I had 5-7 car lengths on him. We raced 2 more times after that and I won, by 5-7 car lengths each time. To be honest, I thought I was gonna get smoked. I was just like "What the hell, let's see how bad I get beat." But to our amazement the Max won every time. So please don't come on here telling me I can't beat a DSM because I have.

91tsiofcdsm

i am saying if he is such a good driver and his car is in such good shape why did it run so "good" in the 1/4 being awd and everything...??

vmok

Me thinks how good the DSM cars launch depends on how much you're willing to beat them... (I'm referencing to a '90 Talon Tsi AWD with 150,000 miles and a recently rebuilt factory turbo I drive occasionally.)

If you launch normal, then get on it, there'll be some turbo lag (kinda bogs a big), then it'll build quick in first gear. If you get close to redline and get a real good shift in, you can chirp into second gear.

However, if you drag the clutch to get started keeping the revs up, the DSM cars have quite good acceleration right off the line. I don't think they're top end cars, but then again, the Max isn't a top end car either.

The DSM cars have what looks to be a 7000rpm redline, but they sound REALLY course above like 4500rpm. I know the one I drive may need a u-joint or something soon, as you can hear and feel a clunk when you're getting back on the power.

If you really want to launch on one, try revving it up to like 5000 then dropping the clutch and letting the AWD do it's thing. The key is keeping the turbo on boil and boost up, which may require feathering the clutch.

In contrast, with the Max, I can typically start off normally, letting go of the clutch while watching the other car outta my peripheral vision, seeing if they jump. If I see them jump, I simply roll on/mash the gas and try to get the optimal 8% or so wheel spin, get as close to redline as I can without hitting the rev limiter, and dropping it into second, and hear the tires figtht for traction again.

Therefore, I believe at the drag strip, the DSM cars stock on stock will probably edge out the Max, while on the street, the Max will probably edge out a DSM car...

-V

btw, I was in the Talon the other day, and pulled up next to a new Audi S4 with no plates. I admit, he had 3 people in the car and I was riding solo. I had feeling he wanted to show off his new car, so I dragged the clutch on the Talon while taking off, saw him jump, and got on the gas while feathering the clutch. Through first gear, it was almost dead heat, with his front bumper staing with my driver's door. However, when I hit 2nd gear in the Talon, I chirped and pulled, and he dropped back a bit. By this time, I was doing about 70 in a 50mph zone and let off. He let off too. I'm still stoked how I chirped into second, in an AWD car!!!

93Tsi

You're right, the AWD talon/eclipse is not a top end car, but the FWD turbo pulls like a ***** from a roll. Id be surprised if a stock Maxima could even come close to hanging with a FWD turbo from a roll.

MaxedOut97SE

I forgot to tell you that he revved his car and dumped the clutch, he let the AWD do it's thing.

vmok

Haven't driven a FWD, but the AWD Turbo, in 5th from 45-80 or so pulls pretty nice... the turbo definitley makes the car feel like it has a bigger engine than it does.

The clutch drop on the AWD does help it launch, but only if he doesn't bog it. He might not have been shifting optimally too, as the engine sounds like it's going to fall apart above 5000rpm or so. Keeping slightly on the gas and slightly feathering the clutch into second gear seems to give it slightly more acceration and the turbo on spool than just dropping it into second.

I haven't run against myself in these two cars, so I don't know which one would be quicker. I do know I launched hard in the AWD DSM car in the rain and the thing threw me into the seat... surprised the hell outta me.

-V

GTRBlkMax97

iTrader: (1)

Well in regards to this, when I had my 1996 SE 5-speed and my best friend had his 1995 Talon Turbo FWD, that was a dead even race everytime, the only thing that determined who would win was who had the better launch, we raced everyday all day long and it was me than him then me then him, all the time but I would kick his *** after 80mph, that is until I got my tranny replace and he walked on me above 70mph cause the tranny was brand damn new and wasn't broken in well.

93Tsi

Isnt the GT-R a skyline? If so, why do you have the badge on your car?

GTRBlkMax97

iTrader: (1)

Ok first off why would you care? did I somehow offend you by the statement I made above? I could get my boy on this board to tell you the same thing but that would be a waste of my time. but if you want me to be a A$$HOLE ABOUT THIS FINE, what was it you had said above about not being here to start a war and to educating us? Let me educate you on a little something, let me know when your car has 200,000 miles on it (oh wait it'll be dead and gone by then, but if not) and I will let you know when I do and we will see who smokes who, and who just smokes, ok
and for the answer to your question above-
Because that logo alone looks better than your car so it makes mine look better and not to mention how much better my car looks than yours stock off the asembly line
Got Mopar? what a joke