Simple Brake Upgrade
10-28-2010, 06:34 PM
#1
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Birmingham, AL
Posts: 119
Simple Brake Upgrade
I've read so much about various brake calipers, rotors, etc., etc. I feel as if my mind might explode.
Sadly, I cannot afford to get the 13" Cobra BBK. Hopefully I will have the opportunity to get a job in about 2 months that will afford me the money to possibly upgrade to a 2010 or 2011 Maxima in January or so. (fingers crossed!).
Anyway, my front brakes are completely gone. Instead of getting a really cheap, simple brake job I'd like to do a little "mini-upgrade" if possible.
Calipers need to be replaced, so I figured I might as well get Q45 or J30 calipers from RockAuto.com, but without getting huge rotors. I'll also go ahead & get SS brake lines from Tire Rack.
All I need to know are 3 things:
1. I would imagine that if I get calipers from an Infiniti that when I order my SS brake lines I should order them for the corresponding Infiniti, right? Or do I still put my car down as a '98 Max?
2. Same thing but with rotors. Do I order rotors for the Infiniti or will Maxima rotors fit in the Infiniti calipers?
(Would like to get these since they're black like my Max)
http://www.tirerack.com/brakes/brake...8&autoModClar=
3. Which calipers would you guys suggest? Q45 or J30?
If I'm not mistaken, Q45=4 piston & heavier; J30=2 piston & lighter?
I know the first 2 may seem like dumb questions (IDK anything about brakes) & I'm fairly certain of the answer, I just want to make 100% sure. Going with Hawk HPS pads front & rear if anyone was curios or if it's pertinent info. DOT-4 fluid as well. (Suggestions on brand?)
Thanks in advance!
Sadly, I cannot afford to get the 13" Cobra BBK. Hopefully I will have the opportunity to get a job in about 2 months that will afford me the money to possibly upgrade to a 2010 or 2011 Maxima in January or so. (fingers crossed!).
Anyway, my front brakes are completely gone. Instead of getting a really cheap, simple brake job I'd like to do a little "mini-upgrade" if possible.
Calipers need to be replaced, so I figured I might as well get Q45 or J30 calipers from RockAuto.com, but without getting huge rotors. I'll also go ahead & get SS brake lines from Tire Rack.
All I need to know are 3 things:
1. I would imagine that if I get calipers from an Infiniti that when I order my SS brake lines I should order them for the corresponding Infiniti, right? Or do I still put my car down as a '98 Max?
2. Same thing but with rotors. Do I order rotors for the Infiniti or will Maxima rotors fit in the Infiniti calipers?
(Would like to get these since they're black like my Max)
http://www.tirerack.com/brakes/brake...8&autoModClar=
3. Which calipers would you guys suggest? Q45 or J30?
If I'm not mistaken, Q45=4 piston & heavier; J30=2 piston & lighter?
I know the first 2 may seem like dumb questions (IDK anything about brakes) & I'm fairly certain of the answer, I just want to make 100% sure. Going with Hawk HPS pads front & rear if anyone was curios or if it's pertinent info. DOT-4 fluid as well. (Suggestions on brand?)
Thanks in advance!
10-28-2010, 06:44 PM
#2
I think if you get the Q45 calipers you would have to get the Q45 rotors. I'm interested in this as well as it seems my rear calipers are not working at all anymore since I found my rotors rusted to hell.
10-28-2010, 08:17 PM
#7
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Birmingham, AL
Posts: 119
10-28-2010, 08:28 PM
#8
5.5 gen is 2002/2003, the latter half of the 5th generation.
http://forums.maxima.org/4th-generat...s-4th-gen.html
http://forums.maxima.org/4th-generat...s-4th-gen.html
10-28-2010, 09:02 PM
#9
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Birmingham, AL
Posts: 119
5.5 gen is 2002/2003, the latter half of the 5th generation.
http://forums.maxima.org/4th-generat...s-4th-gen.html
http://forums.maxima.org/4th-generat...s-4th-gen.html
I COULD have this done, but I can't tell where he drills the 2 holes in the hub as he only posted an 'after' pic. (Haven't looked a pages 2 & 3 yet)
I am correct in my thinking that the Q45/J30 calipers/rotors are just a direct swap & need no mods like the 5.5 brake swap, right?
10-28-2010, 09:29 PM
#10
Ah, yes. I saw that but it requires modification & I am simply looking to buy calipers/rotors/pads/SS brake lines, take them to my local Express Oil Change or Xpert Tire & have them installed.
I COULD have this done, but I can't tell where he drills the 2 holes in the hub as he only posted an 'after' pic. (Haven't looked a pages 2 & 3 yet)
I am correct in my thinking that the Q45/J30 calipers/rotors are just a direct swap & need no mods like the 5.5 brake swap, right?
I COULD have this done, but I can't tell where he drills the 2 holes in the hub as he only posted an 'after' pic. (Haven't looked a pages 2 & 3 yet)
I am correct in my thinking that the Q45/J30 calipers/rotors are just a direct swap & need no mods like the 5.5 brake swap, right?
10-29-2010, 07:17 AM
#12
Member who somehow became The President of The SE-L Club
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Join Date: Jun 2001
Posts: 16,033
Why are you upgrading? Are you going to track the car?
Just get some blank rotors and throw the Hawks on there. It's a really nice "upgrade".
Then put more $$$$ in the bank to purchase the car of your dreams later down the road.
Best BANG for your buck right there.
Just get some blank rotors and throw the Hawks on there. It's a really nice "upgrade".
Then put more $$$$ in the bank to purchase the car of your dreams later down the road.
Best BANG for your buck right there.
10-29-2010, 07:34 AM
#13
10-29-2010, 09:03 AM
#14
Here's a write-up from another nissan site on how to install the Q45 brakes. If you want the link to pics and all. PM me
Originally Posted by rustest86
First, why do this over better pads and/or drilled/slotted rotors or 300zx brakes? 300zx brakes will not clear the stock wheels so unless new wheels are also in your budget those are out of the question.
Here's the cost list and tool list.
TOOLS:jack and jack stands1/2" ratchat13/16 socket19mm socket17mm socket14mm socket12mm socket10mm wrench4" angle grinder
COST:$44 used Q45 calipers, pads, and rotors ( i used a digital caliper and measured the rotors and pad so i knew i was getting good ones.)$0.00 machine work on rotors ( they owed me a favor )$56 new rear rotors, pads, and brake fluid$59 new passenger side rear caliper
TOLTAL:$159 for big brake upgrade and new rears for me
of course costs will vary with your area junkyards or if you use new calipers, rotors, and pads. and machine work.
Side by side comparisons of stock vs Q45:
as you can see there are 2 pistons vs the stock 1, the pads have slightly more contact area, and the rotors are thicker. this all translates into more clamping force along with more contact area which also transfers heat better to the rotor and having thicker rotors means more thermal capacity to withstand brake fad and boiling the fluid.
before you can even start the install, the rotors, OEM or aftermarket, need to be milled down 8mm off of the OUTSIDE diameter. this is done so that the rotor clears the caliper and caliper bracket.
to start installing the brakes, first start by lifting the car up and supporting it. next you need to "load" the suspension by jacking up the lower control arm untill the car just starts to lift off of you supports. next remove all the old brake hardware. i left the caliper connected so to not loose any fluid and prevent a mess. when you get everything tore down you should end up with this, now there are 2 options here you can do like me and remove the dust shield completely, or try trimming to clear everything. the only bad thing about trimming is the rotor sit sooo close that there is the posibility of it rubbing.
next you will need a grinder and grind on the lower control arm.
before grinding:
after grinding:
now to the people that question structual integrity about grinding on the control arm, you only need to take off a maximum of 1/16" of material. just enough to clear the rotor. this is also the reason of "LOADING" the suspension so that the control arm is at its closest to the rotor. you will need to grind and check often from full lock to full lock for proper clearances.
after this is done the caliper bracket can be bolted on, use the maxima bolts NOT the Q45/J30 as they are longer and will rub the rotor.
Next the inside pad can be installed, but the outside pad needs to be modified to clear the hub. your pad should look like this: you need to grind the lower part with the circle opening to the contor of the pad material. you do not need to grind ANY pad material, just the steel backing. and youll want to end up with this: now bolt the caliper on and bleed the system then move to the other side. i the end it sould look like this:
when i did this i also did new rear pads and rotors to complete the install, which was a good idea as i had 2 frozen slide pins, a bad caliper, and i was missing a clip that held the e-brake cable to the bracket.
DRIVING IMPRESSIONS:OMFG!!!!!!! this thing stops better than my 300zx brake equiped 240sx. my stopping distances dropped by at least 75ft under heavy braking. i also never felt any brake fad when i was bedding in the new brakes. there is more petal movement, but i like it as its easier to modulate them and keep them from locking them up. i also completely flushed the brake system and filled it with DOT-4 fluid. if you could get it i would use DOT 5.1 for a higher boiling point but DOT-4 is good for daily/spirited driving.
also to those who might "NEED" more, you could couple this with drilled/slotted rotors and hawk pads.
if you have any questions post em up and ill answer them.
Here's the cost list and tool list.
TOOLS:jack and jack stands1/2" ratchat13/16 socket19mm socket17mm socket14mm socket12mm socket10mm wrench4" angle grinder
COST:$44 used Q45 calipers, pads, and rotors ( i used a digital caliper and measured the rotors and pad so i knew i was getting good ones.)$0.00 machine work on rotors ( they owed me a favor )$56 new rear rotors, pads, and brake fluid$59 new passenger side rear caliper
TOLTAL:$159 for big brake upgrade and new rears for me
of course costs will vary with your area junkyards or if you use new calipers, rotors, and pads. and machine work.
Side by side comparisons of stock vs Q45:
as you can see there are 2 pistons vs the stock 1, the pads have slightly more contact area, and the rotors are thicker. this all translates into more clamping force along with more contact area which also transfers heat better to the rotor and having thicker rotors means more thermal capacity to withstand brake fad and boiling the fluid.
before you can even start the install, the rotors, OEM or aftermarket, need to be milled down 8mm off of the OUTSIDE diameter. this is done so that the rotor clears the caliper and caliper bracket.
to start installing the brakes, first start by lifting the car up and supporting it. next you need to "load" the suspension by jacking up the lower control arm untill the car just starts to lift off of you supports. next remove all the old brake hardware. i left the caliper connected so to not loose any fluid and prevent a mess. when you get everything tore down you should end up with this, now there are 2 options here you can do like me and remove the dust shield completely, or try trimming to clear everything. the only bad thing about trimming is the rotor sit sooo close that there is the posibility of it rubbing.
next you will need a grinder and grind on the lower control arm.
before grinding:
after grinding:
now to the people that question structual integrity about grinding on the control arm, you only need to take off a maximum of 1/16" of material. just enough to clear the rotor. this is also the reason of "LOADING" the suspension so that the control arm is at its closest to the rotor. you will need to grind and check often from full lock to full lock for proper clearances.
after this is done the caliper bracket can be bolted on, use the maxima bolts NOT the Q45/J30 as they are longer and will rub the rotor.
Next the inside pad can be installed, but the outside pad needs to be modified to clear the hub. your pad should look like this: you need to grind the lower part with the circle opening to the contor of the pad material. you do not need to grind ANY pad material, just the steel backing. and youll want to end up with this: now bolt the caliper on and bleed the system then move to the other side. i the end it sould look like this:
when i did this i also did new rear pads and rotors to complete the install, which was a good idea as i had 2 frozen slide pins, a bad caliper, and i was missing a clip that held the e-brake cable to the bracket.
DRIVING IMPRESSIONS:OMFG!!!!!!! this thing stops better than my 300zx brake equiped 240sx. my stopping distances dropped by at least 75ft under heavy braking. i also never felt any brake fad when i was bedding in the new brakes. there is more petal movement, but i like it as its easier to modulate them and keep them from locking them up. i also completely flushed the brake system and filled it with DOT-4 fluid. if you could get it i would use DOT 5.1 for a higher boiling point but DOT-4 is good for daily/spirited driving.
also to those who might "NEED" more, you could couple this with drilled/slotted rotors and hawk pads.
if you have any questions post em up and ill answer them.
10-29-2010, 09:49 AM
#15
its been clarified that 'advance' blanks and brembos are damn near the same, so just a set of blanks (turned rotors) and hawk pads and you're fine. you could buy my 5th gen front brakes so i can go to the 6th gen 
10-29-2010, 07:29 PM
#17
So basically its not a straight forward install and requires grinding of the rotors and other components. I think just like I he is looking for a straight forward or at least almost straight forward install. Any other suggestions?
10-29-2010, 10:23 PM
#18
Heres the thing,
Q45 rotors are the same depth as cobra, so thats why people go with them, however the cobra studs must be redrilled by a machiniest to maxima studs, then, it also needs a relocation bracket.
I got my q45 + cobra + ss lines for $300 on the .org, however when i got them, one of the rotors was sieized, so I had to spend another $100 on new rotors, and then like $10 on spray paint on them. But now my car has no problem stopping with the 20" rims that would not be stopped by me stock setup in the front.
Q45 rotors are the same depth as cobra, so thats why people go with them, however the cobra studs must be redrilled by a machiniest to maxima studs, then, it also needs a relocation bracket.
I got my q45 + cobra + ss lines for $300 on the .org, however when i got them, one of the rotors was sieized, so I had to spend another $100 on new rotors, and then like $10 on spray paint on them. But now my car has no problem stopping with the 20" rims that would not be stopped by me stock setup in the front.
10-29-2010, 10:43 PM
#19
IMO i would wait until i have the money, and just do 300z 4 piston mono block calipers. i doubt there will be any difference in using Q45 calipers, they use the same sliding pin setup like the maxima, the Q45 calipers just have 2 pistons instead of 1
10-30-2010, 08:37 AM
#22
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 17
When I had to replace my rotors and pads I searched on Ebay and got a great deal of a set of 4. Been 3 years and 60k still holding up strong. Heres a link check it out!
http://cgi.ebay.ca/Nissan-Maxima-Dri...item27b117c424
http://cgi.ebay.ca/Nissan-Maxima-Dri...item27b117c424
10-30-2010, 03:50 PM
#23
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 469
Can you lock up your tires? If so, don't waste your money.
I get a little red in the face when I see threads about brake upgrades. Braking power is limited by available tractive force - your tires can only supply so much deceleration, and if you can exceed that with your current brake package, you cannot reduce stopping distance or "power" without upgrading your tires.
Chances are, you can in your current brake configuration lock your tires or activate your ABS - unless you're running some sort of very heavy wheel/tire combo, the factory brake package should overwhelm the tractive ability of the tires. In that case, the only thing an upgrade will do is allow you prolonged sessions of heavy braking without fade, which only matters if you have your car on a track. Even an autocross won't heat your brakes up enough to make them fade.
The long and short of it is, if, with your current brake setup, you can lock your tires or activate your ABS, you cannot reduce your stopping distance. It is physically impossible. There's no reason to upgrade your brake system - buy new tires, replace your lines, whatever, but upgrading your calipers, rotors, and pads will not help you.
I get a little red in the face when I see threads about brake upgrades. Braking power is limited by available tractive force - your tires can only supply so much deceleration, and if you can exceed that with your current brake package, you cannot reduce stopping distance or "power" without upgrading your tires.
Chances are, you can in your current brake configuration lock your tires or activate your ABS - unless you're running some sort of very heavy wheel/tire combo, the factory brake package should overwhelm the tractive ability of the tires. In that case, the only thing an upgrade will do is allow you prolonged sessions of heavy braking without fade, which only matters if you have your car on a track. Even an autocross won't heat your brakes up enough to make them fade.
The long and short of it is, if, with your current brake setup, you can lock your tires or activate your ABS, you cannot reduce your stopping distance. It is physically impossible. There's no reason to upgrade your brake system - buy new tires, replace your lines, whatever, but upgrading your calipers, rotors, and pads will not help you.
10-30-2010, 09:58 PM
#24
The long and short of it is, if, with your current brake setup, you can lock your tires or activate your ABS, you cannot reduce your stopping distance. It is physically impossible. There's no reason to upgrade your brake system - buy new tires, replace your lines, whatever, but upgrading your calipers, rotors, and pads will not help you.
10-31-2010, 10:50 AM
#25
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 469
Agreed. That's why I said "which only matters if you have your car on a track."
Fact is, though, Maximae are not great track cars, so I'm assuming the OP doesn't take his out. For street use, upgrading your brakes is a waste of money and potentially hazardous if you're modifying factory components (eg re-drilling brake rotors, fabricating custom mounts, etc). You'll have more money in your pockets and be absolutely no worse off - potentially better off, in fact - if you just replace your pads and rotors with high-quality, durable components.
Fact is, though, Maximae are not great track cars, so I'm assuming the OP doesn't take his out. For street use, upgrading your brakes is a waste of money and potentially hazardous if you're modifying factory components (eg re-drilling brake rotors, fabricating custom mounts, etc). You'll have more money in your pockets and be absolutely no worse off - potentially better off, in fact - if you just replace your pads and rotors with high-quality, durable components.
10-31-2010, 11:45 AM
#26
Agreed. That's why I said "which only matters if you have your car on a track."
Fact is, though, Maximae are not great track cars, so I'm assuming the OP doesn't take his out. For street use, upgrading your brakes is a waste of money and potentially hazardous if you're modifying factory components (eg re-drilling brake rotors, fabricating custom mounts, etc). You'll have more money in your pockets and be absolutely no worse off - potentially better off, in fact - if you just replace your pads and rotors with high-quality, durable components.
Fact is, though, Maximae are not great track cars, so I'm assuming the OP doesn't take his out. For street use, upgrading your brakes is a waste of money and potentially hazardous if you're modifying factory components (eg re-drilling brake rotors, fabricating custom mounts, etc). You'll have more money in your pockets and be absolutely no worse off - potentially better off, in fact - if you just replace your pads and rotors with high-quality, durable components.
10-31-2010, 09:00 PM
#28
My whole point of upgrading is because my rear calipers are seized and don't grip the rotors anymore. SO I might as well upgrade to something better in the process of replacing them especially since the snow is coming.
11-01-2010, 05:22 AM
#29
a ton of what you posted in your original post is inaccurate and a lot of your questions are answered multiple times on the forum. I'm not going to go searching the posts for you because I don't have time right now but I know it's there because I've personally posted it. search my username for brake related posts if you want to. I've made a bunch of posts about mixing and matching calipers and rotors and what not (because I've done a ton of it, probably had 6 different combinations of calipers and rotors on my maximas).
Q45 calipers are 2 piston just like J30 calipers are and they weigh the same and are dimensionally identical, and they all use the same brake lines as a maxima. the only common brake caliper upgrade that uses different lines are the 300zx calipers. I'm surprised you aren't clear on this with all the reading you said you'd done, because this info is posted in hundreds of places on this forum and is basically common knowledge. you need to do some more research before you even think about tearing in to your brakes.
that said, if you aren't tracking the car or doing really high speed blasts on the highway where oversize rotors are needed to act as heat sinks, all this crap you're considering is a waste of money and time for you. the biggest single upgrade you can make to your brakes is quality pads and a brake fluid flush and maybe a new set of $12 rubber lines (absolutely no need for SS lines if you are not running the car on a track).
Q45 calipers are 2 piston just like J30 calipers are and they weigh the same and are dimensionally identical, and they all use the same brake lines as a maxima. the only common brake caliper upgrade that uses different lines are the 300zx calipers. I'm surprised you aren't clear on this with all the reading you said you'd done, because this info is posted in hundreds of places on this forum and is basically common knowledge. you need to do some more research before you even think about tearing in to your brakes.
that said, if you aren't tracking the car or doing really high speed blasts on the highway where oversize rotors are needed to act as heat sinks, all this crap you're considering is a waste of money and time for you. the biggest single upgrade you can make to your brakes is quality pads and a brake fluid flush and maybe a new set of $12 rubber lines (absolutely no need for SS lines if you are not running the car on a track).
12-27-2010, 08:58 PM
#30
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Birmingham, AL
Posts: 119
Yeah, so anyway, I went with Brembo plains & Hawk Performance Ceramic on the front & will do the same but with Hawk HPS pads on the rear as they don't seem to make PCs for the rear. Still haven't installed as Rock Auto called me today to tell me that they do not have the powder coated Bendix calipers in stock I have to choose something else. This sucks because my car is Super Black & that would have looked better than steele/rust behind the 350Z rims.
Trying to decide between Raybestos & Beck/Arnley calipers now. Guess I'll paint the myself or something.
As far as being able to lock up my tires (I STILL haven't checked under the hood to see if I have ABS....I doubt it) I'm pretty sure if I wanted to I could. If you mean am I locking up my tires on a somewhat consistent basis, no. Tires are fairly new & I don't even have my 350Z rims on right now that have Bridgestone Pole Posistion Potenza RE960 A/S with less than 5k on the rears. Reason for this is they have no front tires & I'm saving up for some Continental Extreme Contact DWS (Maybe just DWs). So having good tires is not a problem in this situation.
01-20-2011, 12:01 PM
#31
Holy crap my head hurts from this thread.
So let me get this straight nobody makes a dual piston caliper that is bolt on? ( And by that I mean the caliper/rotor without milling some off the rotor)
Who does everyone get their brembo blanks through? And who sells HIGH quality (4000psi tested) SS brake lines? I'd like to upgrade my brake lines and am willing to pay a good amount as long as they are tested and made in the USA. This isn't something I want to cheap out on.
And where does everyone buy their pads from? Any other recommendations other than hawk? I have a set on my other car and I'm not terribly impressed. And I have slotted rotors, dual piston calipers, new fluid and SS lines.
So let me get this straight nobody makes a dual piston caliper that is bolt on? ( And by that I mean the caliper/rotor without milling some off the rotor)
Who does everyone get their brembo blanks through? And who sells HIGH quality (4000psi tested) SS brake lines? I'd like to upgrade my brake lines and am willing to pay a good amount as long as they are tested and made in the USA. This isn't something I want to cheap out on.
And where does everyone buy their pads from? Any other recommendations other than hawk? I have a set on my other car and I'm not terribly impressed. And I have slotted rotors, dual piston calipers, new fluid and SS lines.
01-21-2011, 02:19 AM
#34
01-21-2011, 03:59 AM
#35
Can you lock up your tires? If so, don't waste your money.
I get a little red in the face when I see threads about brake upgrades. Braking power is limited by available tractive force - your tires can only supply so much deceleration, and if you can exceed that with your current brake package, you cannot reduce stopping distance or "power" without upgrading your tires.
Chances are, you can in your current brake configuration lock your tires or activate your ABS - unless you're running some sort of very heavy wheel/tire combo, the factory brake package should overwhelm the tractive ability of the tires. In that case, the only thing an upgrade will do is allow you prolonged sessions of heavy braking without fade, which only matters if you have your car on a track. Even an autocross won't heat your brakes up enough to make them fade.
The long and short of it is, if, with your current brake setup, you can lock your tires or activate your ABS, you cannot reduce your stopping distance. It is physically impossible. There's no reason to upgrade your brake system - buy new tires, replace your lines, whatever, but upgrading your calipers, rotors, and pads will not help you.
I get a little red in the face when I see threads about brake upgrades. Braking power is limited by available tractive force - your tires can only supply so much deceleration, and if you can exceed that with your current brake package, you cannot reduce stopping distance or "power" without upgrading your tires.
Chances are, you can in your current brake configuration lock your tires or activate your ABS - unless you're running some sort of very heavy wheel/tire combo, the factory brake package should overwhelm the tractive ability of the tires. In that case, the only thing an upgrade will do is allow you prolonged sessions of heavy braking without fade, which only matters if you have your car on a track. Even an autocross won't heat your brakes up enough to make them fade.
The long and short of it is, if, with your current brake setup, you can lock your tires or activate your ABS, you cannot reduce your stopping distance. It is physically impossible. There's no reason to upgrade your brake system - buy new tires, replace your lines, whatever, but upgrading your calipers, rotors, and pads will not help you.
I agree fully. i used cheap rotors (slabs of metal heatsink) axxis ceramic pads and DOT5.1 fluid. I couldn't be happier.
if you experience fade with this setup on normal streets SLOW DOWN there are other people on the roads you are putting at risk.
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