FSTB..a hype??
08-06-2002, 07:39 AM
#1
Maxima Pilot
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Beaverton, Oregon
Posts: 1,467
FSTB..a hype??
Okay, now that I have your attention...here's the question: no bull, now...exactly what did you or did u not feel when u installed your FSTB?
I installed one on my old Gen4 SE mostly because of the Gen4's flexi-flyer chassis and yes, there was some improvement in chassis rigidity over bumps, harsh roads, etc. That said, I was skeptical of any such noticeable improvement on the Gen5 -because one of the biggest improvement on the Gen5 vs the Gen4 was the chassis stiffness...this is where most (80%)of the added weight of the Gen5 comes from, the chassis.
Even knowing that - but because I have lowering springs and Tokicos which do load the suspension/shock towers more than the OEM springs- I installed a Stillen FSTB last night, drove to work as usual and quite frankly, noticed nada, zippo, zero. That said, most of the roads on my morning commute are good roads but even over some RR tracks, etc...nada, zippo, zero, so...your opinions/observations welcome
I installed one on my old Gen4 SE mostly because of the Gen4's flexi-flyer chassis and yes, there was some improvement in chassis rigidity over bumps, harsh roads, etc. That said, I was skeptical of any such noticeable improvement on the Gen5 -because one of the biggest improvement on the Gen5 vs the Gen4 was the chassis stiffness...this is where most (80%)of the added weight of the Gen5 comes from, the chassis.
Even knowing that - but because I have lowering springs and Tokicos which do load the suspension/shock towers more than the OEM springs- I installed a Stillen FSTB last night, drove to work as usual and quite frankly, noticed nada, zippo, zero. That said, most of the roads on my morning commute are good roads but even over some RR tracks, etc...nada, zippo, zero, so...your opinions/observations welcome
08-06-2002, 07:49 AM
#2
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2001
Posts: 4,968
Re: FSTB..a hype??
Originally posted by Galo
That said, most of the roads on my morning commute are good roads but even over some RR tracks, etc...nada, zippo, zero, so...your opinions/observations welcome
That said, most of the roads on my morning commute are good roads but even over some RR tracks, etc...nada, zippo, zero, so...your opinions/observations welcome
I am fairly certain the benfits of a FSTB would be seen in cornering, not flat (i.e. RR track, etc.) conditions...
08-06-2002, 08:31 AM
#7
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2001
Posts: 778
from what i've gathered the benefits are seen in only one aspect of cornering: the turn-in. so that when you turn the wheel you wouldn't have the same lag of the front strut towers twisting before beginning to turn the car...
08-06-2002, 08:36 AM
#8
I've had my Courtesy FSTB on for almost 5 months and honestly I have never felt any handling improvements on cornering or anything of the sort. It's my only "handling mod", and at first I thought that I had done something wrong, but I had a few friends look at it and they all said I had put it on right, so I guess that's just what it does. Anyways, I hope that when I put on my RSB I can feel a little something more.
08-06-2002, 08:42 AM
#9
Donating Maxima.org Member
Join Date: Aug 2001
Posts: 2,267
I agree, it seems not to do much. Of course, how many of you take quick, hard turns that often? My problem is that my bar touches the hood, so I'm careful about aggressive driving that might cause the bar to flex and put additional pressure on my hood. As it is, I hear a bit of creaking and groaning from the engine bay when I drive aggressively, and I assume it's the FSTB at work or warping my hood. Soon I'm going to replace it with the cheaper trust bar. At least that one's not supposed to rub the hood liner.
08-06-2002, 08:43 AM
#10
FSTB improvement
If you want proof that an FSTB does something, then simply put the bar on and leave one side loosely attached. I ended up doing this because I lost the bolt needed for attachment and I drove the car to Home Depot. On the way I could clearly hear the bar knocking around (it was held so that it wouldn't drop into anything but not clamped down tight). Clearly the bar is doing what it was designed to do (increase the rigidity between the towers). Now if you want to argue the cost analysis that is entirely different. For me it was a cheap, although probably not very significant, improvement.
08-06-2002, 08:59 AM
#11
An FSTB improves high speed turn-ins.
I'm talking 40-45 mph+
Now, if you combine the FSTB, RSB, good springs/shocks and tires, you feel the full effect of the FSTB. If you only have an FSTB, you don't want to do hard high speed turn-ins because you will have problems holding the turn, etc. With everything else on, you can continue through the turns at high speed so doing a high speed turn-in isn't an issue.
Finally, you really have to be in-tune with your car to feel an FSTB. A RSB you feel right away at any speed.
If you ever decide to take your car to the track (road track, not 1/4 mile), you can push your car hard and feel all the components hard at work. I was just at the track yesterday and the difference is phenomenal.
Axel
I'm talking 40-45 mph+
Now, if you combine the FSTB, RSB, good springs/shocks and tires, you feel the full effect of the FSTB. If you only have an FSTB, you don't want to do hard high speed turn-ins because you will have problems holding the turn, etc. With everything else on, you can continue through the turns at high speed so doing a high speed turn-in isn't an issue.
Finally, you really have to be in-tune with your car to feel an FSTB. A RSB you feel right away at any speed.
If you ever decide to take your car to the track (road track, not 1/4 mile), you can push your car hard and feel all the components hard at work. I was just at the track yesterday and the difference is phenomenal.
Axel
08-06-2002, 12:58 PM
#12
I agree with what Axel said. I put in my FSTB and RSB at the same time, so I don't know how each one feels independently. I can clearly feel the RSB at work though, and I think having them both together just makes it better overall. Kind of like getting an intake and exhaust, not just one or the other.
08-06-2002, 01:11 PM
#13
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2001
Posts: 1,279
how can u guys expect a huge handling improvement if u still have stock suspension? the strut tower bar doesnt change out ur springs and shocks. ur car if still stock will still be slushy but on incline truns u can or should be able to feel a difference. it is a upgrade that will only help alot if ur car has aftermarket suspension.
will
will
08-06-2002, 01:42 PM
#14
I hated the feel at turning of the 2K2 when I first got this Max.
Nothing like my '96. I got the bar and it feels much better -especially at sharp 10-20 mph where you power out in comparison to w/o.
A rear would complete it but if you need to feel it's better - take a turn sharp enough at 40-45 to where you really feel some G's.
Then take it off and do it - the whole car feels like it's going to tip. Maybe it's mental but I don't think so - it just feels "flatter" around tight turns. W/O suspension work and a rear, I dont't think it's going to get as flat as I like. But I drove it after taking it off to find real bolts for it - disgusted me. I couldn't get it back on fast enough. "Tighter" is the word that comes to mind for me - and tighter is good (clean those minds)!
Shaydz
Nothing like my '96. I got the bar and it feels much better -especially at sharp 10-20 mph where you power out in comparison to w/o.
A rear would complete it but if you need to feel it's better - take a turn sharp enough at 40-45 to where you really feel some G's.
Then take it off and do it - the whole car feels like it's going to tip. Maybe it's mental but I don't think so - it just feels "flatter" around tight turns. W/O suspension work and a rear, I dont't think it's going to get as flat as I like. But I drove it after taking it off to find real bolts for it - disgusted me. I couldn't get it back on fast enough. "Tighter" is the word that comes to mind for me - and tighter is good (clean those minds)!
Shaydz
08-06-2002, 02:04 PM
#15
Originally posted by Tanman
I agree, it seems not to do much. Of course, how many of you take quick, hard turns that often? My problem is that my bar touches the hood, so I'm careful about aggressive driving that might cause the bar to flex and put additional pressure on my hood. As it is, I hear a bit of creaking and groaning from the engine bay when I drive aggressively, and I assume it's the FSTB at work or warping my hood. Soon I'm going to replace it with the cheaper trust bar. At least that one's not supposed to rub the hood liner.
I agree, it seems not to do much. Of course, how many of you take quick, hard turns that often? My problem is that my bar touches the hood, so I'm careful about aggressive driving that might cause the bar to flex and put additional pressure on my hood. As it is, I hear a bit of creaking and groaning from the engine bay when I drive aggressively, and I assume it's the FSTB at work or warping my hood. Soon I'm going to replace it with the cheaper trust bar. At least that one's not supposed to rub the hood liner.
08-06-2002, 02:18 PM
#16
Donating Maxima.org Member
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 673
I have noticed (with my Vibrant) that the response is faster. To test this, I had my friend drive it before I put it on, and then after and asked him if he noticed any differences. He said not with speed or cornering, but with response to the wheel.
08-06-2002, 06:41 PM
#17
Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2000
Posts: 722
Originally posted by JBWhitley
I have noticed (with my Vibrant) that the response is faster. To test this, I had my friend drive it before I put it on, and then after and asked him if he noticed any differences. He said not with speed or cornering, but with response to the wheel.
I have noticed (with my Vibrant) that the response is faster. To test this, I had my friend drive it before I put it on, and then after and asked him if he noticed any differences. He said not with speed or cornering, but with response to the wheel.
08-06-2002, 07:23 PM
#18
Supporting Maxima.org Member
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 1,489
I put one on last week, but it was sitting too close to the throttle body so I took it off 24 hours later. I always used to think Strut bars were mostly hype, and when I gave it a good whirl the next morning after install and it felt ok.
The next day after I took it off, I took the same corner hard and I could feel a difference is response. The car seemed to let go on the corner quicker where with the FSTB it held the corner tighter.
It is not a mirracle worker, but I did feel a difference AFTER removing the bar.
The next day after I took it off, I took the same corner hard and I could feel a difference is response. The car seemed to let go on the corner quicker where with the FSTB it held the corner tighter.
It is not a mirracle worker, but I did feel a difference AFTER removing the bar.
08-06-2002, 08:25 PM
#19
Member
Join Date: Jul 2002
Posts: 95
It works
Had mine on for 5 days now. I drive very rural and twisty roads to work so I always had to watch some of my cornering even at 30-40 mph because the car would lean a lot and have a lot of play in the turn. I will just say that now I don't even pay attention to the turns it really help the front end a lot. Will install my addco RSB tommorrow.
P.S. For people having problems with clearence try spreading the bar out a little by unscrewing he ends a little.
P.S. For people having problems with clearence try spreading the bar out a little by unscrewing he ends a little.
08-06-2002, 08:33 PM
#20
Re: FSTB..a hype??
the fstb was one of the last thing i did regarding suspension. i had my car dropped and rsb before the fstb.
i felt.....NOTHING. i just figured because i had everything else first, but i don't know....
i got the one from courtesy and it cost $69. doesn't look as nice as the stillen one, but it doesn't hurt as much when i think about the fact that i can't feel any difference....
kafene.
i felt.....NOTHING. i just figured because i had everything else first, but i don't know....
i got the one from courtesy and it cost $69. doesn't look as nice as the stillen one, but it doesn't hurt as much when i think about the fact that i can't feel any difference....
kafene.
08-06-2002, 09:31 PM
#21
Member
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Northern California
Posts: 158
Re: FSTB..a hype??
Originally posted by Galo
I installed a Stillen FSTB last night, drove to work as usual and quite frankly, noticed nada, zippo, zero. That said, most of the roads on my morning commute are good roads but even over some RR tracks, etc...nada, zippo, zero, so...your opinions/observations welcome
I installed a Stillen FSTB last night, drove to work as usual and quite frankly, noticed nada, zippo, zero. That said, most of the roads on my morning commute are good roads but even over some RR tracks, etc...nada, zippo, zero, so...your opinions/observations welcome
I spend 95% of my time on freeways, most of my cornering is on the on/off ramps or swerving to miss some moron that wants to be in my lane. I can't say with any confidence that the FSTB makes that much difference.
08-07-2002, 06:00 AM
#22
to be honest i dind't really feel a difference. then agin i had not drvien my car for a while prior to installing the fstb, i think i was working on it or something. however since i bought it, ppl say it works and it's there, i'll trust it.. i have an unique looking strut bar, here are links to the pic of em'. (i got them overseas)
http://images.cardomain.com/installs...98_11_full.jpg
and
http://images.cardomain.com/installs...798_9_full.jpg
http://images.cardomain.com/installs...98_11_full.jpg
and
http://images.cardomain.com/installs...798_9_full.jpg
08-07-2002, 06:13 AM
#23
Originally posted by mingo
to be honest i dind't really feel a difference. then agin i had not drvien my car for a while prior to installing the fstb, i think i was working on it or something. however since i bought it, ppl say it works and it's there, i'll trust it.. i have an unique looking strut bar, here are links to the pic of em'. (i got them overseas)
http://images.cardomain.com/installs...98_11_full.jpg
and
http://images.cardomain.com/installs...798_9_full.jpg
to be honest i dind't really feel a difference. then agin i had not drvien my car for a while prior to installing the fstb, i think i was working on it or something. however since i bought it, ppl say it works and it's there, i'll trust it.. i have an unique looking strut bar, here are links to the pic of em'. (i got them overseas)
http://images.cardomain.com/installs...98_11_full.jpg
and
http://images.cardomain.com/installs...798_9_full.jpg
Although functionally it wouldn't be any improvement over what we have available around here, but Wow, it looks great.
Shaydz
08-07-2002, 06:15 AM
#24
Originally posted by Shaydz
That is very nice looking! Are they available over the net?
Although functionally it wouldn't be any improvement over what we have available around here, but Wow, it looks great.
Shaydz
That is very nice looking! Are they available over the net?
Although functionally it wouldn't be any improvement over what we have available around here, but Wow, it looks great.
Shaydz
08-07-2002, 06:27 AM
#25
Supporting Maxima.org Member
Join Date: Sep 2000
Posts: 2,038
You guys are crazy!
I think it must just be where you drive.
IMO, the FTSB is well worth the money. Of course, it is not a miracle product by any means (but then mine cost only $69).
On my drive to work each day, I go through what is best described as almost an S curve draped over a hill with the middle of the S at the peak of the hill. The difference with the FTSB both going into and coming out of the turns at high speeds is substantial. It kept the car flatter, improved turn-in and control.
Well worth the investment.
IMO, the FTSB is well worth the money. Of course, it is not a miracle product by any means (but then mine cost only $69).
On my drive to work each day, I go through what is best described as almost an S curve draped over a hill with the middle of the S at the peak of the hill. The difference with the FTSB both going into and coming out of the turns at high speeds is substantial. It kept the car flatter, improved turn-in and control.
Well worth the investment.
08-07-2002, 06:31 AM
#26
Re: You guys are crazy!
Originally posted by Max_Gator
I think it must just be where you drive.
IMO, the FTSB is well worth the money. Of course, it is not a miracle product by any means (but then mine cost only $69).
On my drive to work each day, I go through what is best described as almost an S curve draped over a hill with the middle of the S at the peak of the hill. The difference with the FTSB both going into and coming out of the turns at high speeds is substantial. It kept the car flatter, improved turn-in and control.
Well worth the investment.
I think it must just be where you drive.
IMO, the FTSB is well worth the money. Of course, it is not a miracle product by any means (but then mine cost only $69).
On my drive to work each day, I go through what is best described as almost an S curve draped over a hill with the middle of the S at the peak of the hill. The difference with the FTSB both going into and coming out of the turns at high speeds is substantial. It kept the car flatter, improved turn-in and control.
Well worth the investment.
08-07-2002, 09:26 AM
#27
I didn't think I could feel the difference either. But the other day I drove my dad's I35 (practically identical to mine in every way - EXCEPT no FSTB) on the highway and the car felt much "looser" or wobbly during lane changes and long sweepers.
That kinda made me realize that the bar is making a difference.
John
That kinda made me realize that the bar is making a difference.
John
08-07-2002, 10:34 AM
#28
Supporting Maxima.org Member
Join Date: Sep 2000
Posts: 2,038
Re: Re: You guys are crazy!
Originally posted by mingo
i used to live in the hills where the curves go through every single alphabet including "S." and as a few members on the board know already, i do drive hard, i autocross too.. i'm confident enough to say tha ti would feel a difference if i were to take my fstb off now, but i dont' feel the need to test something that i've already bought, because if i dont' feel a difference i'de feel somewhat unhappy for spending the very little money i did and lugging those two oversized boxes all over the streets of taiwan and the airport.
i used to live in the hills where the curves go through every single alphabet including "S." and as a few members on the board know already, i do drive hard, i autocross too.. i'm confident enough to say tha ti would feel a difference if i were to take my fstb off now, but i dont' feel the need to test something that i've already bought, because if i dont' feel a difference i'de feel somewhat unhappy for spending the very little money i did and lugging those two oversized boxes all over the streets of taiwan and the airport.
08-07-2002, 10:39 AM
#29
Re: Re: Re: You guys are crazy!
Originally posted by Max_Gator
I guess that means that you think it does make a difference, right?
I guess that means that you think it does make a difference, right?
08-07-2002, 11:17 AM
#30
Maxima Pilot
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Beaverton, Oregon
Posts: 1,467
Well, like asu 174 said, at least it looks
phat!
I'm glad to see that some folks have felt some improvement...I havent but then again I might if I drive the car sportingly, which I dont have a chance to do in my daily commute.
And -snide comments to the contrary- I do have a sensitive butt, to mechanical things, at least. And do NOT go beyond that, okay?
I'm glad to see that some folks have felt some improvement...I havent but then again I might if I drive the car sportingly, which I dont have a chance to do in my daily commute.
And -snide comments to the contrary- I do have a sensitive butt, to mechanical things, at least. And do NOT go beyond that, okay?
08-07-2002, 12:25 PM
#31
Old Fuddy Duddy
Join Date: Feb 2001
Posts: 2,712
Originally posted by maxman00
did you mount the bar directly on the black spacers, or did you remove them? I too have the courtesy bar on my 2k max and noticed when I mounted it on the black spacers that there was a good amount of hood contact. to remedy this, I took off the spacers and all seems fine.
did you mount the bar directly on the black spacers, or did you remove them? I too have the courtesy bar on my 2k max and noticed when I mounted it on the black spacers that there was a good amount of hood contact. to remedy this, I took off the spacers and all seems fine.
I am still looking around for a better one. A used Stillen or maybe gamble with a custommaxima.com one. Maybe.
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