IceY2K1

iTrader: (3)

Now that's funny!

IceY2K1

iTrader: (3)

I agree to a point, but it also allows others who can't afford to pay retail $1850-1900 the same great product for $1500-1600.

That also ELIMINATES competition and thus is an indirect way of forcing a "price floor" on your product, which is BAD FOR THE CONSUMER AND ILLEGAL IN SOME MARKETS. I understand this is to help distinguish your product from cheaper ones, but at the cost of my $$$$.

What am I sacrificing? Warranty?

What? We are ordering it over the internet and installing it ourselves. It is the same product and I doubt it's warranty applies if I install it myself and something goes wrong. That's why the rebuild kit is an awesome idea.

Where do I contact? How? I'm glad you're willing, since most companys/distributors won't talk or deal with individuals.

Again, you MUST realize we are not going to drive to Pauls shop to have these installed. It's just not possible. The benefits of buying from him are the same as if I buy from a NON-"Authorized Dealer".

I thank you, but clearly this was not due to Maxima owners, since this kit just became available. What warranty? What proper install? A "price reperesentative" does not make a product higher quality or better just because it costs more for a consumer to buy.

IceY2K1

iTrader: (3)

I didn't bash you for trying a GB, I just told you JIC was here and SLAMMING the door shut, so a GB was not going to happen.

Right. However, you do notify the manufacturer aka Stillen and he eliminates the deal. Alex from Southwest Autoworks can confirm this and there are SEVERAL other deals members have put together that have been "anonymously" killed. I'm not saying you did them all, but you were around at the time.

That's NOT your job, but you seem to think it is. We pay the price.

I thank you for helping out.

Again, that's not good enough for me and why I will and have bought elsewhere. I can not afford to make "large orders at one time" and must spread my mods out over time. I doubt it's enough to be considered a "regular" customer.

I have and will continue to do so.

This fact CLEARLY shows in your dealings with this board and is why you do far less business than you could. I wish it wasn't that way, because this board can make it much more appealing for both you and us.

Avalon Racing

On your comments -

We are on this forum all the time although we do not have time for a lot of posts.

Regular customers along with big order customers do get price advantages.

True - I did have a call awhile ago with Alex at SouthWest and we both agreed to stay within our contractual guidelines.

We are not watchdogs for manufacturers. I'm to busy for that. The Manufacturers watch these forums.

I and/or my company have no say with any manufactuer to stop a deal. To think we have that power is funny.

We are though Stillen's largest dealer in the Nissan market.


We will still honor our statements that we can beat any advertised or quoted prices from Authorized dealers - period.

As for warranties - only authorized dealers can quickly resolve warranty issues.

End of thread

deezo

iTrader: (3)

I deleted the thread because JIC said something about them not doing group buys.

Sprint

iTrader: (10)

Hogan had a body kit group deal ended also... this was last year some time.. i think he also lost his Stillen Authorized License too

Colonel

Thats called business, last time I checked. By forcing distributors to sell "no lower" is a certain type of price fixing. Competition is in the buyers best interest, which is what this thread is really about.

Seeing that most people have local shops install or do it themselves, what else is going to be "lost"? How would customer get "better customer service and have less problems"? When was the last time you looked for XXX product, found it for $XXX dollars. Then found it elsewhere for $XXX + $500 and decided that even though you are doing it yourself you will pay the extra $500? I highly doubt you would.

Not all people live in "areas" that are accessible to have this type of "selling structure" work. And why should internet shops be after a dealer? They are in fact, by defination, a dealer. A dealer "sells" correct?

Sounds like a way to try and always know whats going on.

Why does the playing field have to be level? So people derive profits from slight margins and large sales. Other prefer to sell a few units at a distinct markup. So why are is there attempts to "control" that?

If the corp hdqrtrs is making the "base" dollars necessary to produce, market and sell, why do people care how profit is achieved from market to market...shop to shop?

Shouldnt that be left to the consumer to decide? If a customer wants specific knowledge and installation expertiese, they know to get the product from an "authorized" INSTALLER. If they just want the product, they should get from an "authorized" DEALER.


There are no issues to that. But lets look at this realistically. This is more about maintaining and trying to expand profits versus customer service.

There should be no customer service issues currently, right? Warranty is only if something FAILED due to construction of the product, NOT faulty or improper install. And there should be no problems backing up that warranty if the person has a reciept and falls in the guidelines of the warranty clause written by the company.

Faulty installs are a product of ineptitude, poor decision making OR poor installation instructions that are written to vaguely to apply to the "broad" spectrum of the product line than the "specific" of the current product in hand.

Customers should know that if they do not purchase first hand from somewhere that complications can and most likely occur.

You mention that "internet ******" mess things up. Well my question is that if they are not "authorized", how are they getting so much product from your company and selling it?

This response is not to flame, but to take from a different point of view. This is VERY similiar to gas pricing. But I assume when companies just fluctuate and control price w/out real reason it doesnt bother YOU the consumer?

Sprint

iTrader: (10)

"Avalon Shady Business tactics" on the news at 10 .. tune in

mmsmannyc

Hello, i'm Neil Newman, of Millennium Motorsports, President of Millennium Motorsports. I've been notified of the situation in this forum, and like JIC registered to do what they have to do, I now have registered. Today I wanna talk about the business, cars, well cars are my life, I was born into the world of cars, my father raised me that way, and i push on. I am in a family of business sensed people. I started Millennium Motorsports in March of 2000. I drove an 88 MX-6 turbo, very fast, but custom everything, couldn't find parts for nothing, and the one's i did find, way too much money, nobody in the market cared about doing a nice car,they cared about making a large profit, and then they cared about the car, well me, i'm different, i still have to think about profit, cause i have to live, eat, survive, etc. But I am dedicated to making fine autos, machines, and i don't have to kill him with price to do so. So, my thing is I do go after these wack *** shops beating people in the head with pricing, yet most of the time i leave them alone, like whatever. But now i hear that they are not just wack *** shops, but their a bunch of little snitching azz girls. I did not set up a Group deal, a person simply said they wanted the best price, i said get a bunch of sales and i'll give you all the same great price. I am not an Authorized JIC dealer, Yet I know way more about their suspensions then half their Authorized Distributors, so you can shove that TECH crap you know where. I would like to make a challenge Mr. AvalonRacing dude. your so cool, (avalonracing) shouldn't you be selling toyota parts. You build your best Max, and i'll build my best Max, in the name of CARS. And we'll post up specs. And see what the people of this forum feel, the people who keep you [edit]*******[/edit] in business. I don't even wanna say anymore, do what you have to do Mister, and i'll show and prove that you know didly of what it means to be in this business. Later [edit]*****[/edit], and to the fellow members here, i'm sorry this all went down, and here at Millennium Motorsoports we do the best we can to give you good pricing, and we're not even Authorized Distributors of much, we just ball with the big boys for the love of cars. When I do become Authorized Distributor of many many products, I promise AvalonRacing will pack up and haul azz.

Sprint

iTrader: (10)

heating up...

Colonel

Understatement of the week!

MaxRPM

iTrader: (1)

[edit]Personal attacks are NOT necessary![/edit]

Sprint

iTrader: (10)

an Avalon Customer?

mmsmannyc

thank you SprintMax sir, great moderator with such great knowledge sir. i think he is an Avalon customer. So where's mister Avalon himself

92 SE-R 02 SE

carnal_c30

iTrader: (38)

the Maxima market isnt exactly like the Supra market

we KNOW the JICs can be had for ALOT less than is listed ~1900~ is insane
its just a shame that our aftermarket is not as vigorous as other car makes and that we dont get much choice and competition

I personally appreciate the work that you guys do, but hell 1900 dont make a difference to me, I'm not buying your coilovers even though I love them- theres no way I can justify it to myself when I have other options out there

and personally I'm one of the big spenders with alot of retardedly expensive goodies on my car- but 1900 for JICs is just crap I buy expensive stuff, but I dont like to be ripped a new one on every purchase

IceY2K1

iTrader: (3)

I like the challenge idea, but PLEASE lets keep this as a 'friendly' dialog.

Thanks,

Alex

Blu

iTrader: (63)

Jeff92se

iTrader: (82)

You see the problem. Places like Avalon who are authorized dist of various things sign contracts with makers to sell their product. That means selling within certain prices. Now when you have an unauthorized dist undercutting the authorized vendors, it creates problems.
Supposively, when you buy from an authorized dist, you are not only paying for the product but any service and technical help associated with that product. And they should be the direct link for warrany issues. Now if you buy from an unauthorized dealer, you should assume you are on your own for any warranty/service or technical questions(unless they agree to help but you should assume they wouldn't). Also manufacturers may require a receipt from an authorized dealer for warranty issues or your warranty is void. I don't know if this is the case here but it's common in other industries.
Now installing these products is not the same as "properly setting up" the product. You don't just install and go. As I understand it, you should probably corner weight the car to get the loads even on all wheels. This is on top of ride height/suspension geometry considerations and shock valving considerations(if they are adj also). An authorized dealer SHOULD be set up to handle this.
Now, as you can tell, there IS room to move on these items(or else you wouldn't have unauthorized dealers undercutting here), but in theory the price differences are due to the level of service that is implied in the purchase price.
I want stuff for cheap too but you can't really fault authorized dealers informing the maker to unauthorized sales. Sometimes dealers have to get training or maybe spend $ to become authorized? Or do they have to commit to floor space to agree to do xxx amount of advertising?? That costs money too.
As for killing other group deals. Well I don't know about that one. Sounds kinda picky in some ways but I really don't have enough proof to comment.

chinaonnitrous1

iTrader: (12)

I..am...so..lost..i dont really know whats going on...or who to throw my money at. I just want coilovers. Thoes Tein ones seem a little easier to get...without 203984023894 people yelling prices..and shops yelling at each other...what a MESS. I just want to lower my car dammit, and carve corners. Somoene let me know..when this blows over. My american express will be waiting..

IceY2K1

iTrader: (3)

Very very well said!

Those are great points. However, I don't care to pay for JICs advertising space at a shop, training/service setting them up, or a warranty. Pauls prices are NOT the real issue here, it's his pricing tactics as shown by his customers:


I just want the product at an affordable price, because I have to install it myself, pay to have a different shop align/setup everything, and then play with the settings myself. If that doesn't work and I break them, I know I'm on my own. However, the risk is worth $300+ savings.

ICULookN

iTrader: (3)

I thought we had a capitalist economy where competion is for our benefit. I guess the Soviets were right with there socialist economy with price fixing based on some members here.

JIC USA

Wow, this forum is nasty. To clear some stuff up, Paul didn't notify me of this at all. The whole thread was closed before he had even heard of it. Nobody requested that it be closed at all. As far as accusations of him closing any Stillen deals, Stillen actively trolls the boards themselves. Stillen does not do group buys and it is in their dealer contracts that they not be done. Paul plays by the rules his vendors set. When a dealer gets nailed by their vendor for breaking the rules, how is that Paul's fault? Paul just offers great prices and service for those that get left out in the cold by a failed group buy! How's that saying go? I think it is this: Arguing on the internet is like the special olympics, no matter who wins, you are still retarded. Buy from whoever takes care of your needs, whether it be price, service, or availability, the consumer will ultimately choose who to buy from. Calling each other names does nothing but make you lose credability and amplify your perceived retardation

Jeff92se: Your wisdom is vast!

Sprint

iTrader: (10)

how do we know you are not Paul posting under a differnet name

guess who's account this is?

http://forums.maxima.org/member.php?...fo&userid=2999

IceY2K1

iTrader: (3)

That's the point.

You don't want the hassle, so go with Paul. That is why he is still here doing business. He is dependable, knowledgeable, ready to take your money, and deliver the product as stated. People are willing to accept his price and feel it's worthwhile.

Others like myself would rather have a CHOICE and would like Paul to deal with his customers how he does and to leave us to judge for ourselves what is the "better" deal. No advice necessary.

He has his prices shown on his website, therefore there is NO NEED for him to defend anything.

Maximax2

I know a bunch of people have already slammed this guy, but this may be the dumbest post I've ever read.

Does the word "capitalism" sound at all familiar to you? Welcome to open market competition...

Sure! Everyone's profit margins would look better, revenue would go up - excellent. Oh wait...it's the consumer that has to pay for all this. Oh, and BTW - "blanket policies..." Now wouldn't that be illegal...?

And that would be their problem. In many cases, you do indeed get what you pay for. But...see above comment about CAPITALISM!

Please...either agree to sell your product openly, or restrict distribution to your own organization and control it that way. You're still getting PAID for the products everyone buys, right?

As in "guys, don't trash everyone's margins - we can all make lots of money if we keep prices high!!"

Man - how freakin' lame can you get

JIC USA

Well, if you do a search on my IP address you will find that I am in CA, not the east coast like Paul. If anyone has any questions about JIC products, please feel free to email me at Kevin@JIC-Magic.com

mmsmannyc

ummm... #4. (JIC USA DEALER TERMS ANDS CONDITIONS OF SALE) JIC USA dealers cannot promote "Wholesale to public" pricing. There is no need to lower your profit margin.

IceY2K1

iTrader: (3)

Just to be fair, if Paul or JIC would like to make any final replies to posts they didn't respond to yet, PLEASE email me and I will post them for you.