H&R spacers? 15mm - 20mm
06-04-2003, 10:58 AM
#4
I don't think there is any issue with them. But, from what pics I have seen of cars that have em, I don't think you would want to go over 20mm on each side. The 20mms look like they would rub the outer fender lip.
06-04-2003, 12:06 PM
#5
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 173
Originally posted by t56gen3
I don't think there is any issue with them. But, from what pics I have seen of cars that have em, I don't think you would want to go over 20mm on each side. The 20mms look like they would rub the outer fender lip.
I don't think there is any issue with them. But, from what pics I have seen of cars that have em, I don't think you would want to go over 20mm on each side. The 20mms look like they would rub the outer fender lip.
06-04-2003, 12:14 PM
#6
Originally posted by cmr72
So 20mm in the rear ONLY? Or both front & rear WITH stock rims/tires?
So 20mm in the rear ONLY? Or both front & rear WITH stock rims/tires?
06-04-2003, 12:37 PM
#7
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Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 173
Originally posted by t56gen3
I'd say 20mm MAX on the rear. I have never seen anyone put them on the front. The rears are what looks funny tuckin' in so much. I'm thinking about getting the 15mm's myself. Of course, that's just a band aid--the right way to do it is get new wheels!
I'd say 20mm MAX on the rear. I have never seen anyone put them on the front. The rears are what looks funny tuckin' in so much. I'm thinking about getting the 15mm's myself. Of course, that's just a band aid--the right way to do it is get new wheels!
So does anyone know where to buy them? And which model number for the spacers and bolts if not included?
06-04-2003, 12:45 PM
#8
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Join Date: Sep 2001
Posts: 38
http://www.optauto.com/webstore/, they come in pairs of two, check out the H&R website for exact application part numbers, I think 20mm on the back will look sweet
06-04-2003, 01:22 PM
#9
For Sale
06-05-2003, 10:46 AM
#11
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Join Date: Sep 2001
Posts: 38
Final question then should I do 15mm or 20mm? I have H&R springs so car is lowered and my concern is that at 20mm the wheel might rub against that inner fender lip? any of you guys with 20mm spacers please advise on issues that you have seen with 20mm or 15mm? thank you for the input. I will post picks as soon as I get them on, but have to make the decision which ones.....thanks
06-06-2003, 07:16 AM
#16
Maxima Pilot
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Beaverton, Oregon
Posts: 1,467
I'm waiting for my 15mm spacers to arrive
from Germany..they have been on national back-order for two months now.
And I disagree with the comment that this is a band-aid to wheels as the 'real fix' because the issue here is that the front track is fine, it's the rear wheels that are too far inwards thus to cure this problem with wheels you would need wheels with a different offset for the rear wheels versus the fronts.
If you do that, then you could not rotate the tires, BTW.
And I disagree with the comment that this is a band-aid to wheels as the 'real fix' because the issue here is that the front track is fine, it's the rear wheels that are too far inwards thus to cure this problem with wheels you would need wheels with a different offset for the rear wheels versus the fronts.
If you do that, then you could not rotate the tires, BTW.
06-06-2003, 07:26 AM
#17
Just to clear some things up,
- You WILL need to replace your old studs with the H&R studs. Its more work, but fairly easy for those that are mechanically inclined.
- If you have wider then stock wheels/tires and lowered you WILL rub.
- If you expect more traction, forget it, you will just increase understeer if you only increase the rear track.
- If you are doing this for looks fine go for it...
- You WILL need to replace your old studs with the H&R studs. Its more work, but fairly easy for those that are mechanically inclined.
- If you have wider then stock wheels/tires and lowered you WILL rub.
- If you expect more traction, forget it, you will just increase understeer if you only increase the rear track.
- If you are doing this for looks fine go for it...
06-06-2003, 07:58 AM
#19
Member
Join Date: Sep 2001
Posts: 38
Thanks for all that great advice it does help in making a decision!
As far as my car I have H&R Springs, so the whip is lowered and I do have aftermarket wheels but they are the same size as original wheels. I did some measurements and the gap between my wheel and inner fender is 22.25mm, so potentialy the 20mm would be fine but with only 2.2mm to spare, that might rub, I think I will go with 15mm since my car is lowered and I shouldn't see any rubbing.
And yes I am only doing this for looks, thanks for the advice
As far as my car I have H&R Springs, so the whip is lowered and I do have aftermarket wheels but they are the same size as original wheels. I did some measurements and the gap between my wheel and inner fender is 22.25mm, so potentialy the 20mm would be fine but with only 2.2mm to spare, that might rub, I think I will go with 15mm since my car is lowered and I shouldn't see any rubbing.
And yes I am only doing this for looks, thanks for the advice
06-06-2003, 08:05 AM
#20
Re: Hey Sam....you're definitely not a poseur so
Originally posted by Galo
I'm curious about ur last comment about the rear spacers increasing understeer...why would that be the case?
I'm curious about ur last comment about the rear spacers increasing understeer...why would that be the case?
All things being equal, a wider track will increase traction. Just doing the back where we already have more then the front will just exacerbate the problem.
06-06-2003, 08:23 AM
#21
Re: I'm waiting for my 15mm spacers to arrive
Originally posted by Galo
from Germany..they have been on national back-order for two months now.
And I disagree with the comment that this is a band-aid to wheels as the 'real fix' because the issue here is that the front track is fine, it's the rear wheels that are too far inwards thus to cure this problem with wheels you would need wheels with a different offset for the rear wheels versus the fronts.
If you do that, then you could not rotate the tires, BTW.
from Germany..they have been on national back-order for two months now.
And I disagree with the comment that this is a band-aid to wheels as the 'real fix' because the issue here is that the front track is fine, it's the rear wheels that are too far inwards thus to cure this problem with wheels you would need wheels with a different offset for the rear wheels versus the fronts.
If you do that, then you could not rotate the tires, BTW.
Heh--it's your car.
06-06-2003, 08:23 AM
#22
Maxima Pilot
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Beaverton, Oregon
Posts: 1,467
Sam...yeah..I'm with u but...
would'nt the wider track also have the effect of lowering roll center, therefore making the tires work a wee bit harder, hence less understeer? That's what was in my head when I looked at your post...
Still
Still
06-06-2003, 08:32 AM
#23
Maxima Pilot
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Beaverton, Oregon
Posts: 1,467
T-Gen..yes, I think the fronts are fine as they
are, hence why I'm not looking to fix the problem via rims but by equalizing the look front-to-rear...
And BTW, if you get a rim offset enough to fix this 'tucked in' look in the rear, you're going to be loading the hub and everything else with close to the same load as you would with the spacers. The spacers will still create a bit more load, than rime, but not much more because the centerline of the rims would still have to be 15-20 mms farther outboard from the hub as they would be with stock rims...
That said, I too am concerned about the increased load I will be placing on the hub, rear bearings, etc, which is one of the reasons I'm going only with 15mm spacers versus what seems to be prevalent here which is either the 20 or 25mm spacers.
And BTW, if you get a rim offset enough to fix this 'tucked in' look in the rear, you're going to be loading the hub and everything else with close to the same load as you would with the spacers. The spacers will still create a bit more load, than rime, but not much more because the centerline of the rims would still have to be 15-20 mms farther outboard from the hub as they would be with stock rims...
That said, I too am concerned about the increased load I will be placing on the hub, rear bearings, etc, which is one of the reasons I'm going only with 15mm spacers versus what seems to be prevalent here which is either the 20 or 25mm spacers.
06-06-2003, 08:34 AM
#24
Re: Sam...yeah..I'm with u but...
I'm no chassis engineer so I could be wrong but I don't think track dimensions affect the roll center. Norm Peterson (where are you) could explain this better.
But as a general rule of thumb increasing front track will reduce understeer logically increasing oversteer and vise versa.
here is something I found to back it up.
http://www.quartermidgets.com/techst...ech.html#track
But as a general rule of thumb increasing front track will reduce understeer logically increasing oversteer and vise versa.
here is something I found to back it up.
http://www.quartermidgets.com/techst...ech.html#track
Originally posted by Galo
would'nt the wider track also have the effect of lowering roll center, therefore making the tires work a wee bit harder, hence less understeer? That's what was in my head when I looked at your post...
Still
would'nt the wider track also have the effect of lowering roll center, therefore making the tires work a wee bit harder, hence less understeer? That's what was in my head when I looked at your post...
Still
06-06-2003, 08:36 AM
#25
Re: T-Gen..yes, I think the fronts are fine as they
Originally posted by Galo
are, hence why I'm not looking to fix the problem via rims but by equalizing the look front-to-rear...
And BTW, if you get a rim offset enough to fix this 'tucked in' look in the rear, you're going to be loading the hub and everything else with close to the same load as you would with the spacers. The spacers will still create a bit more load, than rime, but not much more because the centerline of the rims would still have to be 15-20 mms farther outboard from the hub as they would be with stock rims...
That said, I too am concerned about the increased load I will be placing on the hub, rear bearings, etc, which is one of the reasons I'm going only with 15mm spacers versus what seems to be prevalent here which is either the 20 or 25mm spacers.
are, hence why I'm not looking to fix the problem via rims but by equalizing the look front-to-rear...
And BTW, if you get a rim offset enough to fix this 'tucked in' look in the rear, you're going to be loading the hub and everything else with close to the same load as you would with the spacers. The spacers will still create a bit more load, than rime, but not much more because the centerline of the rims would still have to be 15-20 mms farther outboard from the hub as they would be with stock rims...
That said, I too am concerned about the increased load I will be placing on the hub, rear bearings, etc, which is one of the reasons I'm going only with 15mm spacers versus what seems to be prevalent here which is either the 20 or 25mm spacers.
I'm done. Good luck.
06-06-2003, 08:49 AM
#26
Re: Re: T-Gen..yes, I think the fronts are fine as they
Not with the H&R spacers, the load is carried at the hub and not the studs, which is the way it should be and how most modern wheels work.
Originally posted by t56gen3
That's just it--ur not placing so much more load on the hub/bearing/axle, ur placing more load on the lugs themselves---they will be the first to expire under duress. Argue with me all you want, but I've seen lugs break before with 1/8 and 1/4 inch spacers, and you will be adding 1.5-2cm worth---just take it into consideration.
I'm done. Good luck.
That's just it--ur not placing so much more load on the hub/bearing/axle, ur placing more load on the lugs themselves---they will be the first to expire under duress. Argue with me all you want, but I've seen lugs break before with 1/8 and 1/4 inch spacers, and you will be adding 1.5-2cm worth---just take it into consideration.
I'm done. Good luck.
06-06-2003, 09:10 AM
#28
I've added my H&R Spacer install pictures to my website.
http://members.rogers.com/maxrpm1/spacers.htm
These are the 20mm spacers and the longer studs were also supplied, DO NOT use these without the stud.
The H&R Kit is top notch and I haven't had a problem. Please note that I raised my suspension for the winter.
[EDIT} Please note, like most quality wheels the spacers are hub centric and do not put a load on the studs. This is the way it should be, the HUB carries the load and the studs/nuts hold you wheels.
Will there be an increase on your wheel bearings? Yes, but how much I don't know. Bigger wheels will do the same, I have yet to have a problem with the spacers in the winter and bigger wheels in the summer and I track my car 3-4 time a month which puts more load on them then you ever will on the street.
http://members.rogers.com/maxrpm1/spacers.htm
These are the 20mm spacers and the longer studs were also supplied, DO NOT use these without the stud.
The H&R Kit is top notch and I haven't had a problem. Please note that I raised my suspension for the winter.
[EDIT} Please note, like most quality wheels the spacers are hub centric and do not put a load on the studs. This is the way it should be, the HUB carries the load and the studs/nuts hold you wheels.
Will there be an increase on your wheel bearings? Yes, but how much I don't know. Bigger wheels will do the same, I have yet to have a problem with the spacers in the winter and bigger wheels in the summer and I track my car 3-4 time a month which puts more load on them then you ever will on the street.
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