00SEMAX19

iTrader: (4)

Sorry about yelling Mr. Catts. One thing I noticed about these headers and Y-pipe I purchased is the Y-pipe doesn't loop around like the stock Y-pipe and yours, The outlet goes strait back to the cat. What diamiter piping do you use? Another question I have is what average gains do you see with your headers and y-pipe and nothing else done? Or does anybody know what any of the others produce? I'm doing this as sortof just a test thing to see if I can get gains like or near the name brand stuff.

00MaxSE

iTrader: (25)

I hope I can afford these over the summer. Sounds like they're gonna be good.

Teufelhunden

iTrader: (8)

i wont say anything until i see some numbers... they might turn out to be ok...

00SEMAX19

iTrader: (4)

No replies yet cattman? Well my headers showed today. The header pipes are shorter than I pictured but the y-pipe looks nice. I'm fairly happy with the quality but not impressed. All the welds look good and strong, just not as pretty as I would like. The tubing is clean and looks like they should flow well.

My dyno run got canceled last week so it's going in this wed. So I should be installing them by thurs and doing a after dyno the following wed. Hopefully for me I see good gains but I will be sure to let all of you know if these are garbage or if it's a good purchase.

I still would like to know if anybody has before and after results from any other brand so I have some good numbers to compare these with.

Oh ya, and if they are garbage I probly will be getting the cattman headers

fishpony

iTrader: (2)

cool can't wait to see the results.

Cattman

iTrader: (77)

Keeping in mind that now we'll be talking about two Cattman header designs, the NZ version that we've been selling up to now, and the version we'll be making soon in the US. The new version builds on the old, but there will be some changes; since it doesn't exist yet there's no point in speculating how it will perform.

We've tested our headers and a number of our customers have, on various static dynos and the track - and on 3.0 and 3.5 engines, naturally aspirated and supercharged. When we have dynos done, we make sure they can provide tabular output - tables of numbers rather than graphs (I can create graphs from tables, but I can't pull the numbers I need from a graph). DynoJet dynos have their flaws, but they produce roughly comparable results and you can come away from the test with a very compact datafile that can be viewed on their free run viewer (which is one of the neatest free software programs you can get).

The dynojet runviewer has a function for exporting the tabular data in files that can be imported to Excel. If you've got all the data points you can calculate the most important numbers for comparing before-mod and after-mod runs, which most dyno outputs don't even include - the average HP and TQ figures (over whatever rpm range you want to calculate).

Send me an email direct and I'll be glad to send you the before and after dyno run on an 02 VQ that I discuss below. With this excel file you can check those #s and also see what is required to properly compare dyno runs.

When you look at the results, keep in mind that they are clearly understated because the before run was with a Cattman Performance y-pipe, not a stock one. I don't have a VQ35DE dyno test that begins with a stock y-pipe.

Looking at the entire dyno runs, average HP increased by 14.1 and TQ by 15.6 (8%) between 2400-6600 rpm. Looking at the racing power range of 4000-6600 rpm, the average power increase was 18.4 HP and 18.1 ft/lbs of torque (9.2%). If you're not used to comparing average power figures these may not mean much, but both sets of #s indicate strong across-the-rpm range power increases, not brief power spikes. Peak torque in the before run was 221.1 ft.lbs at 3650 rpm (the after run was 228.5 at that rpm), the headers pushed that peak up to 4650 rpm, at 233.9 (the before run was 214 at that rpm).

Strongest HP and TQ differences were between 5k-6k. Average hp gain was 22.4, TQ was 21.7 (11%). Maximum difference was 29hp and 27.4 ft/lbs at 5600 rpm.

Anyway, when you do your dyno test, make sure you come away with some useful data - here are my suggestions:

#1, make sure that they have the dyno machine set at the proper altitude, and the same for BOTH runs. Oldest trick in the book is for the operator to bump up the altitude on the computer before the "after" run so that the SAE correction for altitude artificially raises the power figures. I've seen this done to give the customer what they want, or to artificially rate a particular part. There was a well-known performance company in Southern California that got caught using this trick to show their parts off at a Maxima event a few years ago.

#2 Try to do both dyno sessions on the same day, or on two consecutive days. Let at least 5 pulls each time (before and after), or 4 at the very least - 3 doesn't cut it because after you knock out the hottest and coldest runs, you've only got one data point, which is statistically worthless. Make sure the operator is beginning and ending the runs at a consistent rpm points. When they vary by hundreds of rpm from run to run it makes the comparison more difficult and proves without a doubt that the technician operating the dyno has no business doing so.

#3 whatever brand of dyno machine they're using, insist that you get the run files on disk. I've been in dyno shops that didn't even know where to find the run files and/or how to save them to disk, so make sure they're with the program and can give you what you need before you even strap the car down. Don't let them hand you printed tables instead of the data on disk. Take a floppy with you because they probably won't have one and you can't count on anyone's promises to send them by email. Finally, note that the only way you can tell if the altitude settings have been tampered with is to have the run files. I don't know about other brands, but we've discovered that kind of cheating in DynoJet runfiles and that's why some dyno shops will try to avoid giving them out.

[I'm not trying to give dyno shops a bad name, but its true that a lot of them don't know how to operate or maintain their machines properly or the intentionally manipulate the results to give their customers what they want. All the advice in #1-3 is based on my direct experience.]

#4 Once you've got all the data, make sure the runs you pull from each set for comparison are comparable. Throw out the highest (and lowest) of each set and compare the second highest or middle runs.

Oh yeah, I'm a little older than some of you guys, but nobody needs to call me Mr. Catts, that's my Dad's name.

Brian C Catts
Cattman Performance

Cattman

iTrader: (77)

I wouldn't expect the performance to be "garbage". I guess I'd expect them to perform about like the Stillen headers that they resemble. Maybe a little better, I can see one improvement over the Stillen design.

BCC

PHSINVENT

iTrader: (1)

Anyone know what happened to stillen's failed y-pipe /header design? We picked up the stone mountain y and headers a week ago and the construction is average. It appears like this could be another case of bees in a can. The inside of the flex is starting to seperate and I've heard that other sets had some welding globs on the inside. Basically they are chinese and we all get what we pay for. If you plan on keeping your maxima through it's life span then I wouldn't suggest getting these. Go with the cattman if you want a good quality american product instead of these shady chinese ones. We just bought them because maybe they are a cheap bang for your buck. Very curious to see some dyno results since the stone mountain guys have no clue what these things are even going to do to our cars. I'd just consider them disposable mods for the price. We are in the middle of repainting a 2002 with motochrome so we won't be able to install them for about 3 weeks.

PearlWhtMaX2000

iTrader: (5)

cant wait to see the dyno runs

NiZMo1o1

iTrader: (45)

You get what you pay for. But dont blame *Chinese* for anything. In China the average workers gets $100 bucks a MONTH. These products that are being copied are people that are in the US market trying to get a deal overseas to make a copy of what a *stillen header* This is the reason Why You have OBX , SS auto. or any of those items. They come from the same warehouse being purchase by each company 1000 items a time and then being stamp with a Name and copyright. Please Dont blame *Chinese* for anything. They are being told what they do to keep business and food on there plates and family.If you are CHEAP then thats what you get. Pay the Price and you get whats been R & R. Sure Stillen has there flaws and a Price to pay for.. Where as Cattman is building a repubutation and a name for themself. I just felt I had to vent because of the term *Chinese* was used in a matter that I dont think should have been used if you werent CHEAP or maybe even did your own research.

PHSINVENT

iTrader: (1)

You need to make another trip back over to china and see the food on their plates. You act like they are starving. It's not what you describe, their way of life is quickly approaching ours. Anyways, their products are all junk and that's all there is to it.

NiZMo1o1

iTrader: (45)

theres still areas that arent as rich as the US.. just being curious are you any Asian nationiatly at all? this topic was about Ebay headers and I still live by ***YOU GET WHAT YOU PAID FOR *** .. the way you came off is using the word CHINESE and Shady toghter seems like you have something against a Chinese person? Maybe this Chinese dude sold you a product and that you got played because It wasnt what you paid for? (Then he was a good hustler)you said your ride is being done up ? so ifs a show quialty Car im sure you would rather have parts to show that are name brand anyways.

In any case I would like to see Dyno #s even with Copy or "shady" Products. Btw if all our products are junk explain why your on a Computer that has parts made by China or any Asian market. enough said Now back to our regular Scheldule Topic...

dizmax96

iTrader: (2)

werd.. dont hate on chinese people.. you make it seem like chinese people workin in factories are makin the big bucks.. riight.. they have enough to get by.. and yes, Im Vietnamese.. China isnt so different from Vietnam.. im sure your pair of Nikes or Pumas were made in China or Vietnam.. sorry the quality is real "junky".. but you bought them anyway because they look good..

PHSINVENT

iTrader: (1)

You guys need a tissue?

gameover03

i guess racism, prejudices and stereotypes still remain in america..and if ur gonna dis chinese and asians..u and everybody on this org drives an asian automobile..so asian products can't be that bad...

ChromeSE5

iTrader: (3)

i think you guys are taking the "chinese" word out of context. He never said anything about Chinese people. What he is stating is equivilent to "american" cars are unreliable. When people say that, no one is blaming John Smith for a defective car.

irish44j

iTrader: (38)

exactly

stop getting so excited people. I think Irish food sucks, but certainly don't think Ireland or Irish people in general suck

Quality of products is not necessarily the measure of the people who build them. Are we to say that all canadians products suck just because people have had problems with Budget y-pipes (yes, they are Canadian)? My wife's old VW was a POS....I guess all Germans are terrible engineers and build poor-quality things.

I think if you guys looked REALLY hard, you could find some OEM parts on our beloved maximas that were made in China too...not to mention your Playstation, your shoes, your in-car electronics, etc etc.

And when you say China, are you talking about the Peoples' Republic of China (PRC), or the "other" China (i.e. Taiwan, which is "technically" part of the PRC according to most of the world, even if it is largely independent in reality - I might note that I consider Taiwan it's own country, and not part of the PRC myself.)

The bottom line is: although there are some good products for cheap out there, they are the exception rather than the rule. In terms of car parts, more often than not you'll get what you pay for.....

Morgan06

iTrader: (17)

first- motostorm has always answered my questions when i had them, and they are a bunch of good dudes over there. dont get loud with people that support the maxima community, f*ckers. we already don't have enough options as it is- which is the whole underlying emphasis of this thread.

second- yes the quality isn't top notch, its right around the $300 range- who would have thought? but this company didnt eye up some bends and weld it together. they bootleg another's design, manufacture it quicker, and ultimately cut corners. it doesn't mean they are garbage, or that they won't perform well. i'm putting my money on these headers as an equal producer of extra power with extra flaws that come along for the ride. if you've got any confidence in metal working, fabrication, or machining- you should be able to correct any problems that arise. thats my plan, im down for a set of cheap and fixable headers soon as my funds permit.

IWNTMORHP!!

iTrader: (5)

ok, back to the topic...as others have tried, for the price like brett said, they are worth a shot at trying out. maybe they are garbage, may be not, but the quality control is lacking from what i can tell. if someone were to pay me 100/mo, i'd probably be blowing welds through the stainless tube too! the flex section on my friends y pipe from stone looks pretty cheap, and not nearly as quality as WS even. as a note to what lux said, if you can find your way around a plasma cutter and a welder, you could fix yourself up pretty good for just a little coin. i am very interested in the results. hurry up and dyno!

NiZMo1o1

iTrader: (45)

for some reason this post takes me back to a time when I was more immature and love traveling to state to state to visit other asian affiliated friend's get about more than 100 of of them and knock on your door.

(My best friend is still Simon's Glock and hollow points).

Maybe you need a tissue to wipe your @$$$... now before you start mocking about shady Chinese products.. your the IDOIT that bought them. there is no way around buying products from ASIA. GEE sorry K sport and D2s were made overseas.. sorry Nissan skylines, HKS brand line was from China.. we SO SOOORRRYY Mr PHSINVENT ... since your sterotyping..Im assuming your 30,live with your mom in country side Ohio ..and probally never seen the city life.



ok enough of this BS retared internet drama *she said ..he said BS*
I just want to see Dyno charts from these So called copy products to show theres is an increase in performance so MrPHSINVENT can have a cow about his cheap ones rusting on him.

Puppetmaster

iTrader: (48)

Highly unnecessary here... like already said, you've blown this way out of proportion.

I'm gonna give Brett and his guys the benefit of the doubt here and assume that they bought em for R&D purposes. They know what they're doing and they've provided the .org great support and resources in the past, and many here know that its not easy to get people to cater to the Maxima market. I have to add that they've done a great job on getting us UDPs at a more reasonable price than the Unorthodox ones, sure there may be growing pains and there will always be issues, but at least they're trying. I got mine several weeks ago and haven't had the time to install it, but it looks great.

Puppetmaster

iTrader: (48)

Btw, great point there....

PrinzII

iTrader: (2)

Let's keep this post on the topic of headers. If I see one attack after this point, this thread is closed and the originator of the attack will be .