reservations about dropping my car
10-25-2006, 10:10 AM
#1
reservations about dropping my car
I may have mentioned this before but I previously owned a 94 Altima that I had lowered 2 inches. I didn not replace struts, only put in Sprint Springs.
Anyhow, it looked great but it was the $hittiest ride ever. My tires wore quickly, a lot of body roll and I couldn't take a corner faster than 20 MPH to save my life, I was overall disappointed. Now I have a 02 SE and I promised myself I wouldn't drop it. But seeing some of the rides on here make me want to drop it. Also, I was thinking of adding a lip to it and IMO lips look terrible unless the car is appropriately dropped.
Anyhow I read the FAQ and searched a bit. What suggestions do you have on making the drop less painful? I like the look but hate the collateral damage.
There was a 02 dropped SE @ a local dealer that I went previously test drove. I called today b/c I watned to go back in and drive it again. The sales guy I spoke to said the car was garbage and wouldn't have sold it to anyone (even though his ignorant azz did.)
Anyhow, thoughts/advice/suggestions?
Anyhow, it looked great but it was the $hittiest ride ever. My tires wore quickly, a lot of body roll and I couldn't take a corner faster than 20 MPH to save my life, I was overall disappointed. Now I have a 02 SE and I promised myself I wouldn't drop it. But seeing some of the rides on here make me want to drop it. Also, I was thinking of adding a lip to it and IMO lips look terrible unless the car is appropriately dropped.
Anyhow I read the FAQ and searched a bit. What suggestions do you have on making the drop less painful? I like the look but hate the collateral damage.
There was a 02 dropped SE @ a local dealer that I went previously test drove. I called today b/c I watned to go back in and drive it again. The sales guy I spoke to said the car was garbage and wouldn't have sold it to anyone (even though his ignorant azz did.)
Anyhow, thoughts/advice/suggestions?
10-25-2006, 01:10 PM
#4
Supporting Maxima.org Member
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 197
707SE I feel u, but you do have to understand this with any drop u are taking the car out of it's stock specs and can/will cause problems later either control arm probs or like you said quick tire wear probs. I will say this and I am not plugging anyone but I recently bought some Ksports for my girls 02' Maxima SE and had my guys drop it all the way.
Yes the ride was very hard but body roll was almost eliminated, took the sharp turns late one night on the Jackie Robinson here in NYC and the car gripped the turns like nothing, we raised it back up and set the softness to maximum soft. Well needless to say the car still rides a little hard but a tad bit off from stock, the price for these coilover werent bad either. bigups to importcustoms. ok thats a plug.
Yes the ride was very hard but body roll was almost eliminated, took the sharp turns late one night on the Jackie Robinson here in NYC and the car gripped the turns like nothing, we raised it back up and set the softness to maximum soft. Well needless to say the car still rides a little hard but a tad bit off from stock, the price for these coilover werent bad either. bigups to importcustoms. ok thats a plug.
10-25-2006, 01:24 PM
#5
First of all, never listen to a sales person about suspension mods, ever.
Ever ever ever.
As for lowering your car, I think it's safe to say that your old Altima is not necessarily a good indicator of how your Maxima will act when lowered. However, it does bring up a very important point, which is that you should never install lowering springs without better struts. Struts can make the difference between a car that handles properly and one that is worse than stock in every way -- including in terms of tire wear, which is probably what you experienced with your Altima.
It's completely possible that a dropped Max may ride horribly. It may also ride really well. It depends entirely on the combination of springs and struts you choose. Good springs (H&R, Progress, Eibach) and top-quality struts (Tokico Illumina, Koni Yellow) will be a powerhouse combination that you may actually feel rides better than stock. Cheap springs (Dropzone, Tein S-Tech) and stock struts will make you wish you were never born.
Do you have a budget here? How much did you want to drop your car? How important is handling to you?
Ever ever ever.
As for lowering your car, I think it's safe to say that your old Altima is not necessarily a good indicator of how your Maxima will act when lowered. However, it does bring up a very important point, which is that you should never install lowering springs without better struts. Struts can make the difference between a car that handles properly and one that is worse than stock in every way -- including in terms of tire wear, which is probably what you experienced with your Altima.
It's completely possible that a dropped Max may ride horribly. It may also ride really well. It depends entirely on the combination of springs and struts you choose. Good springs (H&R, Progress, Eibach) and top-quality struts (Tokico Illumina, Koni Yellow) will be a powerhouse combination that you may actually feel rides better than stock. Cheap springs (Dropzone, Tein S-Tech) and stock struts will make you wish you were never born.
Do you have a budget here? How much did you want to drop your car? How important is handling to you?
10-25-2006, 01:32 PM
#6
I feel your pain. I drive 65 miles a day to work and back and can't deal with driving a rock sled that far every day. I chose tein H techs and KYB gr2's and am very pleased with the look and the comfort of the ride. Just my .02
10-25-2006, 02:34 PM
#7
Originally Posted by d00df00d
First of all, never listen to a sales person about suspension mods, ever.
Ever ever ever.
As for lowering your car, I think it's safe to say that your old Altima is not necessarily a good indicator of how your Maxima will act when lowered. However, it does bring up a very important point, which is that you should never install lowering springs without better struts. Struts can make the difference between a car that handles properly and one that is worse than stock in every way -- including in terms of tire wear, which is probably what you experienced with your Altima.
It's completely possible that a dropped Max may ride horribly. It may also ride really well. It depends entirely on the combination of springs and struts you choose. Good springs (H&R, Progress, Eibach) and top-quality struts (Tokico Illumina, Koni Yellow) will be a powerhouse combination that you may actually feel rides better than stock. Cheap springs (Dropzone, Tein S-Tech) and stock struts will make you wish you were never born.
Do you have a budget here? How much did you want to drop your car? How important is handling to you?
Ever ever ever.
As for lowering your car, I think it's safe to say that your old Altima is not necessarily a good indicator of how your Maxima will act when lowered. However, it does bring up a very important point, which is that you should never install lowering springs without better struts. Struts can make the difference between a car that handles properly and one that is worse than stock in every way -- including in terms of tire wear, which is probably what you experienced with your Altima.
It's completely possible that a dropped Max may ride horribly. It may also ride really well. It depends entirely on the combination of springs and struts you choose. Good springs (H&R, Progress, Eibach) and top-quality struts (Tokico Illumina, Koni Yellow) will be a powerhouse combination that you may actually feel rides better than stock. Cheap springs (Dropzone, Tein S-Tech) and stock struts will make you wish you were never born.
Do you have a budget here? How much did you want to drop your car? How important is handling to you?
I was looking at Housecor's website that showed his drop: http://innerbean.com/housecor/2004_2_28.html
Honestly, that is nearly the perfect look I going after. I believe that drop is about 1.3 in the front, 1.25in the back or vice versa. As you can see, it's not a dramatic drop.
I know I didn't do the Altima drop right. I was younger, never did it before, was strictly concerned with the aggressive look and half assed. The only thing that hasn't changed is completely understanding all that is involved. This site is real helpful though, along with everyone's post.
Anyhow I know better than to expect to lower the car w/o sacraficing ride quality. My #1 concern is ride quality. I will not lower the car if the ride is going to be ragged. The car is far too nice to have a ****ty ride. I would rather wait and save a couple extra months and get quality as oppose to making a hasty buy just to get the look.
Ideally, I'd like to both have the aggressive look of a drop but actually improve the ride quality.
I'm still reading FAQ's and stuff but it's helpful to hear from folks who actually are driving the same car + a drop. So let me know what you think.
10-25-2006, 02:48 PM
#8
Progress is listed as 1.7" front, which more or less matches the numbers shown in that link. That's a pretty significant drop. But the good news is that, unless you drive aggressively on really bumpy roads, you can count on Progress to keep you off the bumpstops while giving you as much ride comfort as possible.
If ride comfort is a priority, though, you have to get Koni Yellows. They are the best dampers you can get, period. They will handle better, ride better, and last longer than anything else. Installing them involves a bit more work and a couple more tools than a straight strut install, but it is MORE than worth it in the end. Tokico Illuminas are a distant second, but still a lot better than anything else under them (and significantly cheaper than the Konis).
BTW, Have you considered Progress coilovers?
If ride comfort is a priority, though, you have to get Koni Yellows. They are the best dampers you can get, period. They will handle better, ride better, and last longer than anything else. Installing them involves a bit more work and a couple more tools than a straight strut install, but it is MORE than worth it in the end. Tokico Illuminas are a distant second, but still a lot better than anything else under them (and significantly cheaper than the Konis).
BTW, Have you considered Progress coilovers?
10-25-2006, 04:08 PM
#10
Originally Posted by d00df00d
Progress is listed as 1.7" front, which more or less matches the numbers shown in that link. That's a pretty significant drop. But the good news is that, unless you drive aggressively on really bumpy roads, you can count on Progress to keep you off the bumpstops while giving you as much ride comfort as possible.
If ride comfort is a priority, though, you have to get Koni Yellows. They are the best dampers you can get, period. They will handle better, ride better, and last longer than anything else. Installing them involves a bit more work and a couple more tools than a straight strut install, but it is MORE than worth it in the end. Tokico Illuminas are a distant second, but still a lot better than anything else under them (and significantly cheaper than the Konis).
BTW, Have you considered Progress coilovers?
If ride comfort is a priority, though, you have to get Koni Yellows. They are the best dampers you can get, period. They will handle better, ride better, and last longer than anything else. Installing them involves a bit more work and a couple more tools than a straight strut install, but it is MORE than worth it in the end. Tokico Illuminas are a distant second, but still a lot better than anything else under them (and significantly cheaper than the Konis).
BTW, Have you considered Progress coilovers?
I thought any coil over-setup would be harsher than most/all spring/strut setup? Not to mention the maintenance and having to remove them in the winter? Or have I been misinformed somewhere along the line?
10-25-2006, 04:23 PM
#11
Originally Posted by illlojik
I thought any coil over-setup would be harsher than most/all spring/strut setup? Not to mention the maintenance and having to remove them in the winter? Or have I been misinformed somewhere along the line?
Cornering capability is much better stance is adjustable.
I'm riding slammed with negative preload (to offset the stiffness) and with the dampers at softest setting.
I'm on coilovers mostly because of stance, not cornering (even though I have pretty much all the bolt on suspension mods)
Trust me my friend, ***** up and get coilovers, you won't regret it. Ksports FTW.
10-25-2006, 05:24 PM
#12
Originally Posted by MaxBoost925
Well yeah to be honest Coilovers are HELLA stiffer than any spring/strut combo. But the tradeoff is no comparision.
Cornering capability is much better stance is adjustable.
I'm riding slammed with negative preload (to offset the stiffness) and with the dampers at softest setting.
I'm on coilovers mostly because of stance, not cornering (even though I have pretty much all the bolt on suspension mods)
Trust me my friend, ***** up and get coilovers, you won't regret it. Ksports FTW.
Cornering capability is much better stance is adjustable.
I'm riding slammed with negative preload (to offset the stiffness) and with the dampers at softest setting.
I'm on coilovers mostly because of stance, not cornering (even though I have pretty much all the bolt on suspension mods)
Trust me my friend, ***** up and get coilovers, you won't regret it. Ksports FTW.
Kool. What about concerns about maintenance and allegedly having to swap them out during the winter/snow months?
10-25-2006, 05:44 PM
#13
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Chicago
Posts: 663
Just don't make the mistake I did, Tein S.Techs and KYB GR2's. They were good for the first couple of months and now it feels like I'm riding a horse! I like the stance of the S.Techs but the ride sucks, maybe it's just the kyb's, I will probably switch to Tokico Blues! Peace!
10-25-2006, 06:42 PM
#14
Originally Posted by illlojik
I thought any coil over-setup would be harsher than most/all spring/strut setup? Not to mention the maintenance and having to remove them in the winter? Or have I been misinformed somewhere along the line?
Maintenance... yes. Since they are adjustable, they have parts that can move, which means they have parts that need to be checked and cleaned periodically. Gotta pay to play...
Winter is very hard on most coilovers. But, since the OP is in California, I figured that wouldn't be as much of an issue.
I suggested Progress coilovers because they're the most comfortable, the cheapest to rebuild, and probably the most durable.
Originally Posted by MaxBoost925
I'm riding slammed with negative preload (to offset the stiffness) and with the dampers at softest setting.
10-25-2006, 07:22 PM
#16
That's what I'm talking about. Leaving space isn't the opposite of preload. It doesn't make your ride any smoother. It just reduces your suspension travel and make you more likely to bottom out your dampers and blow them out faster.
Trust me.
Trust me.
10-25-2006, 09:14 PM
#18
Originally Posted by MaxBoost925
Well the point is this, the bottom line -
Get coilovers, call it a day. That's if you want to lower it AND get super cornering performance.
Get coilovers, call it a day. That's if you want to lower it AND get super cornering performance.
Also, with coilovers you can adjust the height of the drop right?
10-25-2006, 09:16 PM
#19
Originally Posted by 707SE
So get coilovers in addition to new struts/springs, or if I get coilovers I just have to get new struts because the spring is the coil over the strut?
Also, with coilovers you can adjust the height of the drop right?
Also, with coilovers you can adjust the height of the drop right?
They are direct replacements of the stock unit, they include the Shock/Spring/Strut all in one easy to use unit.
Ride height and stiffness can all be adjusted as opposed to the traditional MacPhereson layout.
10-26-2006, 08:43 AM
#20
Dont get coilovers if you want reliability, or a comfortable ride. If your ok with dealing with more maintenece, paying more money, and having a harsher ride in the quest for ride height adjustment and some better cornering performance than go with the coilovers. This is how its broken down.. and I dont care what other people say
Coilovers
Pros: height adjustability, superior cornering given everything else is the same(Only if set up properly, which few people do, you cant just slap them on and go)
Cons: less reliable (way more maintenence and tuning involved), much more expensive than spring/strut combo, Harsher ride (this can be fixed with perfect valving but rarely is)
Spring/strut combo
Pros: Much more reliable (you prob wont ever have to think about them again), they ride much better on avg than coilovers, increased cornering ability over stock, given eveything else is the same, they are much cheaper than coilovers.
Cons: none really other than a firmer ride than stock but still no where near as bad as coilovers.
Dont waste your time getting springs unless your gonna get struts too or your ride will be just as ****ty as your altima's was
After learning more about the limits of the suspension design on the maximas... I dont even see why people shell out the money for coilovers (in terms of performance) the car still wont handle that great so its kinda pointless.
Coilovers
Pros: height adjustability, superior cornering given everything else is the same(Only if set up properly, which few people do, you cant just slap them on and go)
Cons: less reliable (way more maintenence and tuning involved), much more expensive than spring/strut combo, Harsher ride (this can be fixed with perfect valving but rarely is)
Spring/strut combo
Pros: Much more reliable (you prob wont ever have to think about them again), they ride much better on avg than coilovers, increased cornering ability over stock, given eveything else is the same, they are much cheaper than coilovers.
Cons: none really other than a firmer ride than stock but still no where near as bad as coilovers.
Dont waste your time getting springs unless your gonna get struts too or your ride will be just as ****ty as your altima's was
After learning more about the limits of the suspension design on the maximas... I dont even see why people shell out the money for coilovers (in terms of performance) the car still wont handle that great so its kinda pointless.
10-26-2006, 09:14 AM
#21
I don't think anyone touched on this...but you should get an alignment after you lower a car to prevent wierd tire wear.
I have tein SS coilovers and cannot be HAPPIER with the setup/ride.
I have tein SS coilovers and cannot be HAPPIER with the setup/ride.
10-26-2006, 09:38 AM
#22
Originally Posted by burnurass
I don't think anyone touched on this...but you should get an alignment after you lower a car to prevent wierd tire wear.
I have tein SS coilovers and cannot be HAPPIER with the setup/ride.
I have tein SS coilovers and cannot be HAPPIER with the setup/ride.
10-26-2006, 09:41 AM
#23
Originally Posted by sciff5
good call but I didnt really think that was nessecary to say... I kinda thought that getting an alignment afterwards was obvious but some people may not know
10-26-2006, 09:43 AM
#24
What sciff5 said is fair in general terms, but it grossly underestimates the advantages and exaggerates the disadvantages of coilovers.
I always refer to Spaniard's opinion. He road races and autocrosses his Maxima, and went from Eibachs and Konis -- i.e. the best springs and the best dampers available -- to Ksport coilovers. He said very clearly that going from Eibachs/Konis to Ksports was a bigger leap than going from stock SE suspension to Eibachs and Konis -- and that was without corner weighting, and before he even had the Ksports properly dialed in!
Concerning ride quality, other 4th genners who have ridden on the infamous (and repordedly very comfortable) Eibach/Illumina combo and Ksport or D2 coilovers have said that the ride is slightly harsher but significantly more controlled. Which one is "better" is a matter of taste. Many more have come from setups like Tein S-Tech springs with AGX struts and said that the ride with Ksports or D2s was better in every way.
Given that, and given the fact that Progress and Tein Basic coilovers are known to be significantly more comfortable (and maintenance-free) than Ksport or D2 coilovers with handling that is almost as good or better, it's not that much of a stretch to recommend coilovers.
One big con to spring/strut combos that was also not mentioned is that both the springs and the dampers will be off-the-shelf parts designed to work with a range of setups. That means that no matter what you do, the ride/handling ratio will not be as good as it will be with properly set up coilovers.
If the OP is looking for a 1.7" front/1.25" rear drop, and if there is room in his budget, Progress coilovers would be an excellent choice.
I always refer to Spaniard's opinion. He road races and autocrosses his Maxima, and went from Eibachs and Konis -- i.e. the best springs and the best dampers available -- to Ksport coilovers. He said very clearly that going from Eibachs/Konis to Ksports was a bigger leap than going from stock SE suspension to Eibachs and Konis -- and that was without corner weighting, and before he even had the Ksports properly dialed in!
Concerning ride quality, other 4th genners who have ridden on the infamous (and repordedly very comfortable) Eibach/Illumina combo and Ksport or D2 coilovers have said that the ride is slightly harsher but significantly more controlled. Which one is "better" is a matter of taste. Many more have come from setups like Tein S-Tech springs with AGX struts and said that the ride with Ksports or D2s was better in every way.
Given that, and given the fact that Progress and Tein Basic coilovers are known to be significantly more comfortable (and maintenance-free) than Ksport or D2 coilovers with handling that is almost as good or better, it's not that much of a stretch to recommend coilovers.
One big con to spring/strut combos that was also not mentioned is that both the springs and the dampers will be off-the-shelf parts designed to work with a range of setups. That means that no matter what you do, the ride/handling ratio will not be as good as it will be with properly set up coilovers.
If the OP is looking for a 1.7" front/1.25" rear drop, and if there is room in his budget, Progress coilovers would be an excellent choice.
10-26-2006, 09:50 AM
#25
Originally Posted by burnurass
I have tein SS coilovers and cannot be HAPPIER with the setup/ride.
10-26-2006, 10:05 AM
#26
Originally Posted by d00df00d
What sciff5 said is fair in general terms, but it grossly underestimates the advantages and exaggerates the disadvantages of coilovers.
I always refer to Spaniard's opinion. He road races and autocrosses his Maxima, and went from Eibachs and Konis -- i.e. the best springs and the best dampers available -- to Ksport coilovers. He said very clearly that going from Eibachs/Konis to Ksports was a bigger leap than going from stock SE suspension to Eibachs and Konis -- and that was without corner weighting, and before he even had the Ksports properly dialed in!
Concerning ride quality, other 4th genners who have ridden on the infamous (and repordedly very comfortable) Eibach/Illumina combo and Ksport or D2 coilovers have said that the ride is slightly harsher but significantly more controlled. Which one is "better" is a matter of taste. Many more have come from setups like Tein S-Tech springs with AGX struts and said that the ride with Ksports or D2s was better in every way.
Given that, and given the fact that Progress and Tein Basic coilovers are known to be significantly more comfortable (and maintenance-free) than Ksport or D2 coilovers with handling that is almost as good or better, it's not that much of a stretch to recommend coilovers.
One big con to spring/strut combos that was also not mentioned is that both the springs and the dampers will be off-the-shelf parts designed to work with a range of setups. That means that no matter what you do, the ride/handling ratio will not be as good as it will be with properly set up coilovers.
If the OP is looking for a 1.7" front/1.25" rear drop, and if there is room in his budget, Progress coilovers would be an excellent choice.
I always refer to Spaniard's opinion. He road races and autocrosses his Maxima, and went from Eibachs and Konis -- i.e. the best springs and the best dampers available -- to Ksport coilovers. He said very clearly that going from Eibachs/Konis to Ksports was a bigger leap than going from stock SE suspension to Eibachs and Konis -- and that was without corner weighting, and before he even had the Ksports properly dialed in!
Concerning ride quality, other 4th genners who have ridden on the infamous (and repordedly very comfortable) Eibach/Illumina combo and Ksport or D2 coilovers have said that the ride is slightly harsher but significantly more controlled. Which one is "better" is a matter of taste. Many more have come from setups like Tein S-Tech springs with AGX struts and said that the ride with Ksports or D2s was better in every way.
Given that, and given the fact that Progress and Tein Basic coilovers are known to be significantly more comfortable (and maintenance-free) than Ksport or D2 coilovers with handling that is almost as good or better, it's not that much of a stretch to recommend coilovers.
One big con to spring/strut combos that was also not mentioned is that both the springs and the dampers will be off-the-shelf parts designed to work with a range of setups. That means that no matter what you do, the ride/handling ratio will not be as good as it will be with properly set up coilovers.
If the OP is looking for a 1.7" front/1.25" rear drop, and if there is room in his budget, Progress coilovers would be an excellent choice.
Let me add one thing. The advantages in terms of handling when it comes to coilovers compared to spring/strut combo are dependant on how well you adjust the coilovers. If you adjust them well, they do offer much better handling.
But I think most of the people who say coilovers are much better than a spring/strut combo regardless of how they are setup are being thrown off by the firm responsive feel coilovers give because they use linear springs, and they eliminate the rubber peice near the top hat. A lot of people think they have a car that handles much better because the linear springs deffinatly give a much more precise feel on initial turn in, making it feel quicker in sharp transitions. Which is deff where my car is lacking partially because the progressive nature of the spring has some play in it.. it takes some compression before it stiffens up which doesnt give the feel of razor sharp handling.
+1 on your personal preferences determining what you find harsh.
I'm putting coilovers on my weekend/race/project car most likely (so dont think I am hating on all coilovers).. but its a weekend car and I want it to perform at its absolute maximum so I dont care if it rattles my teeth out
10-26-2006, 11:30 AM
#27
if your worried about comfort, go with H&Rs with illuminas, they offer the best ride quality and handling, but only thing is the drop isnt agressive and the back seems to be a little lower than the front. thats the only reason keeping me from getting H&Rs. if the front had .2 more drop, i would def buy them.
10-26-2006, 11:36 AM
#28
Originally Posted by MaxBoost925
Well it differs from person to person, I should take a ride in a Tein 5th gen, and you should take a ride in a Ksport 5th gen
Ksports were def. rougher than the Tein's...
djfrestl went from K sports to progress / illumina's and is EXTREMELY happy with the switch.
It all depends on how the roads are and where you live, etc. EASIEST way is to find someone local that has a lowered maxima and go for a drive. everyone's opinion is different.
10-26-2006, 12:38 PM
#29
When you do find someone with a lowered Maxima, make sure it is the same generation (4th vs. 5th vs. 5.5 vs. 6th) as yours, is running a very similar wheel/tire combo, and has one of the suspension setups you're considering.
10-26-2006, 09:50 PM
#30
Originally Posted by d00df00d
When you do find someone with a lowered Maxima, make sure it is the same generation (4th vs. 5th vs. 5.5 vs. 6th) as yours, is running a very similar wheel/tire combo, and has one of the suspension setups you're considering.
Anyhow since I want to make sure I do this right the first time, this is a mod that is approximately 6-10 months away from being saved for. So between now and then hopefully I can find a Max dropped like what I'm aiming for a see how it rides.
10-27-2006, 12:28 AM
#31
Originally Posted by d00df00d
When you do find someone with a lowered Maxima, make sure it is the same generation (4th vs. 5th vs. 5.5 vs. 6th) as yours, is running a very similar wheel/tire combo, and has one of the suspension setups you're considering.
+1 wheel and tire combo make a much larger difference than a lot of people think
10-27-2006, 12:35 AM
#32
Originally Posted by sciff5
+1 wheel and tire combo make a much larger difference than a lot of people think
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
Lakersallday24
6th Generation Maxima (2004-2008)
10
06-16-2019 01:35 AM
MaximaDrvr
7th Generation Maxima (2009-2015)
16
08-19-2015 08:20 PM
altome15
7th Generation Maxima (2009-2015)
5
08-10-2015 07:05 PM