Rear strut is shifted out of place...pics
07-06-2009, 09:12 AM
#1
Rear Strut is shifted out of place...Pics and Video
Over the last 3-4 days I developed a slight squeak from the rear passenger strut that progressed to a loud and almost constant squeaking. Greased things down, no change.
Decided to look at the upper strut mounts in the trunk and this is what I found...
Left side, car on ground
Right Side, car on ground
Right Side, wheel on jackstand, after I tried to move strut back into place
I had the Illuminas and H-techs installed about 4months ago. New mounts were also installed. From day one there was a SLIGHT rubbing sound that was barely noticeable even if you tried to listen for it. With the car jacked up there is some play at the top of the strut tower.
So whats going on here?
Decided to look at the upper strut mounts in the trunk and this is what I found...
Left side, car on ground
Right Side, car on ground
Right Side, wheel on jackstand, after I tried to move strut back into place
I had the Illuminas and H-techs installed about 4months ago. New mounts were also installed. From day one there was a SLIGHT rubbing sound that was barely noticeable even if you tried to listen for it. With the car jacked up there is some play at the top of the strut tower.
So whats going on here?
Last edited by mannetti21; 07-06-2009 at 03:39 PM.
07-06-2009, 11:17 AM
#5
Have the place that installed them look at whats going on. Then again its your word against theirs how you drive your car since you've left. It clearly looks like the mount is not centered and shifted. Maybe never put in correctly if you've heard it since day 1. Thats something else you can use for your case.
07-06-2009, 12:12 PM
#6
This blows, no time to deal with this garbage. I put the car back on the ground and for the time being it appears centered. However, if I push the trunk and get the car bouncing up and down, I can hear the play somewhere in/near the mount.
How unsafe is it to drive with this? The guy who installed them is about 45min-1hr away, highway speeds.
Also, if I don't end up driving back to him, any idea of what I'm gonna get charged for labor to have a shop get things straightened out?
How unsafe is it to drive with this? The guy who installed them is about 45min-1hr away, highway speeds.
Also, if I don't end up driving back to him, any idea of what I'm gonna get charged for labor to have a shop get things straightened out?
07-06-2009, 12:28 PM
#7
If I was you read up on a few springs/strut installs on here and try to do it yourself, it's not that hard and for just the rear I dont think it'd take under an hour if done correctly.. It's just been 3-4 month since the instal so i dont think you f your mounts up unless ur do 30 over speed bumps.. however you said you dont have the time so idk.
A shop usually is gonna jip you for this. From what i know it's 200 to instal them. They're gonna rip you. it's a simple process, just takes a while with a ratchet, even faster with air tools.
A shop usually is gonna jip you for this. From what i know it's 200 to instal them. They're gonna rip you. it's a simple process, just takes a while with a ratchet, even faster with air tools.
07-06-2009, 12:35 PM
#8
The top hat or bracket assembly is bolted down onto the spring and strut by the center flanged nut, which goes onto the top of the piston. So that means if the two studs bolted down to the car are still in place, the top hat should not move. Ever. If the piston is moving around, that seems to me that the top hat has broken off from the studs at some point, which is how the piston and consequently, the rest of the strut/spring assembly can move around.
Look at this picture, the top hat nut should be bolted down to the middle of these pieces. I can't think of any other way in which the middle can move independently from the top hat like in those pictures.
Picture of rear strut assembly, note the top hat and how it looks in relation to the piston and the two studs:
That's what it seems like to me, based on what I can tell from the pictures.
Look at this picture, the top hat nut should be bolted down to the middle of these pieces. I can't think of any other way in which the middle can move independently from the top hat like in those pictures.
Picture of rear strut assembly, note the top hat and how it looks in relation to the piston and the two studs:
That's what it seems like to me, based on what I can tell from the pictures.
Last edited by Puppetmaster; 07-06-2009 at 12:39 PM.
07-06-2009, 12:42 PM
#9
The top hat or bracket assembly is bolted down onto the spring and strut by the center flanged nut, which goes onto the top of the piston. So that means if the two studs bolted down to the car are still in place, the top hat should not move. Ever. If the top hat is moving around, that seems to me that the top hat has broken off from the studs at some point, which is how the piston and consequently, the rest of the strut/spring assembly can move around.
Look at this picture, the top hat nut should be bolted down to the middle of these pieces. I can't think of any other way in which the middle can move independently from the top hat like in those pictures.
Picture of rear strut assembly:
That's what it seems like to me, based on what I can tell from the pictures.
Look at this picture, the top hat nut should be bolted down to the middle of these pieces. I can't think of any other way in which the middle can move independently from the top hat like in those pictures.
Picture of rear strut assembly:
That's what it seems like to me, based on what I can tell from the pictures.
So does this mean that the strut mount itself has broken?
As in the metal cracked and is no longer held in place by the bolts? I would think that the symptoms would be much worse if this was the case. It wasn't easy to move back into place, as if it was completely snapped off. And besides the loud squeaking, which I assume was rubbing, I didn't notice any effect on the stiffness of the suspension when driving.
Last edited by mannetti21; 07-06-2009 at 12:47 PM.
07-06-2009, 12:50 PM
#10
I'm thinking more likely the studs themselves broke off from the top hat, so the strut assembly itself is fine, but just moving about. But would the studs stay in the holes if that were the case? I think it's possible. Is that something you can check yourself? Just jack the car up, remove the wheel, and you should be able to see what things look like from beneath the studs.
07-06-2009, 01:04 PM
#11
i'm going to take a wild guess and say the replacement mount wasn't OEM right?
when the car is off the ground (suspension hanging) take a pry bar/screwdriver and see if you can shift that center bolt. if it's loose then i recommend getting it fixed really soon. if it's tight but still moves then you're on borrowed time w/ it.
who installed the struts? these the studs don't really break unless someone didn't tighten the studs and the impact and driving broke them.
when the car is off the ground (suspension hanging) take a pry bar/screwdriver and see if you can shift that center bolt. if it's loose then i recommend getting it fixed really soon. if it's tight but still moves then you're on borrowed time w/ it.
who installed the struts? these the studs don't really break unless someone didn't tighten the studs and the impact and driving broke them.
Last edited by DanNY; 07-06-2009 at 01:07 PM.
07-06-2009, 01:05 PM
#12
Unfortunately my jack broke about 20mins ago when I was doing all this (AND my right HID fog ballast went out, when it rains it pours I guess), so i can't get it back up right now to look from the underside.
But I'm holding the old strut mount in my hand with the plastic ring and bump stop...what I'm starting to wonder is if the center bolt on the actual strut is not tight enough. It seems like if that were loose, the plastic cap on top of the bump stop could manage to become unseated in the mount, and cause the shift that I'm seeing from inside the trunk.
I wish I paid more attention when these were being installed, but is there any way that would be possible? Does that center nut on the strut even act to tighten the area that I'm talking about?
But I'm holding the old strut mount in my hand with the plastic ring and bump stop...what I'm starting to wonder is if the center bolt on the actual strut is not tight enough. It seems like if that were loose, the plastic cap on top of the bump stop could manage to become unseated in the mount, and cause the shift that I'm seeing from inside the trunk.
I wish I paid more attention when these were being installed, but is there any way that would be possible? Does that center nut on the strut even act to tighten the area that I'm talking about?
07-06-2009, 01:08 PM
#14
I'm thinking more likely the studs themselves broke off from the top hat, so the strut assembly itself is fine, but just moving about. But would the studs stay in the holes if that were the case? I think it's possible. Is that something you can check yourself? Just jack the car up, remove the wheel, and you should be able to see what things look like from beneath the studs.
07-06-2009, 01:11 PM
#15
Jeff aka burnurass just told me that if the center nut on the top hat isn't tight, that is possible as well. I just didn't think there was enough play in the hole going through the top hat for that to be possible.
07-06-2009, 01:13 PM
#16
Unfortunately my jack broke about 20mins ago when I was doing all this (AND my right HID fog ballast went out, when it rains it pours I guess), so i can't get it back up right now to look from the underside.
But I'm holding the old strut mount in my hand with the plastic ring and bump stop...what I'm starting to wonder is if the center bolt on the actual strut is not tight enough. It seems like if that were loose, the plastic cap on top of the bump stop could manage to become unseated in the mount, and cause the shift that I'm seeing from inside the trunk.
I wish I paid more attention when these were being installed, but is there any way that would be possible? Does that center nut on the strut even act to tighten the area that I'm talking about?
But I'm holding the old strut mount in my hand with the plastic ring and bump stop...what I'm starting to wonder is if the center bolt on the actual strut is not tight enough. It seems like if that were loose, the plastic cap on top of the bump stop could manage to become unseated in the mount, and cause the shift that I'm seeing from inside the trunk.
I wish I paid more attention when these were being installed, but is there any way that would be possible? Does that center nut on the strut even act to tighten the area that I'm talking about?
07-06-2009, 01:13 PM
#17
Good point, haha. But if only one stud is broken, wouldn't the other one still hold the entire thing in place so that the center doesn't move? Best thing to do now is for the OP to just check it and post back the findings, or take it someplace where they can get the car in the air to look at it.
07-06-2009, 01:15 PM
#18
yep it's the center nut not tight enough...look at the difference between the left and right.
the good strut got a lot of thread showing. the bad one is not as much. sound like you'll need a new strut and mount...unless you can rethread the strut..(assuming damage is not as bad).
ugh...just noticed the cap on the bad one. ok well measure the thread length and go from there.
the good strut got a lot of thread showing. the bad one is not as much. sound like you'll need a new strut and mount...unless you can rethread the strut..(assuming damage is not as bad).
ugh...just noticed the cap on the bad one. ok well measure the thread length and go from there.
Last edited by DanNY; 07-06-2009 at 01:18 PM.
07-06-2009, 01:17 PM
#19
I've actually noticed the "sawing" motion when I was pushing up and down on the trunk. It wasn't dramatic, but It was enough that I noticed it. Doesn't look like the other side moves as much.
I'm gonna go take another look at things and drive it a little to see what happens. Will post back shortly.
edit: Will measure thread length with caps removed.
I'm gonna go take another look at things and drive it a little to see what happens. Will post back shortly.
edit: Will measure thread length with caps removed.
Last edited by mannetti21; 07-06-2009 at 01:19 PM.
07-06-2009, 01:20 PM
#20
I've actually noticed the "sawing" motion when I was pushing up and down on the trunk. It wasn't dramatic, but It was enough that I noticed it. Doesn't look like the other side moves as much.
I'm gonna go take another look at things and drive it a little to see what happens. Will post back shortly.
I'm gonna go take another look at things and drive it a little to see what happens. Will post back shortly.
it'll still be crooked but it won't do more damage.
07-06-2009, 01:23 PM
#21
About how tight should that nut be? It doesn't take much force to twist it tighter.
FSM says 15-18in-lb....translation to real world approximation in absence of torque wrench?
FSM says 15-18in-lb....translation to real world approximation in absence of torque wrench?
Last edited by mannetti21; 07-06-2009 at 01:31 PM.
07-06-2009, 01:38 PM
#22
for me it's a few zips of the impact...so it's tough to say with a ratchet.
at this point go as tight as you can...there's not much you have left there.
07-06-2009, 02:22 PM
#23
Didn't make it halfway down the road before I turned around. Sounds 10x worse like the entire strut is just rattling around.
Well, I tightened the two mount bolts as tight as I could go with a combo wrench, and I tightened the center nut a little more also, but it doesn't feel like it is getting any tighter...however, it doesn't have that tight-loose-tight feel of stripped threads.
FWIW, the tension of the center nuts on both left and right struts feels about the same.
Borrowed a neighbors jack, took the wheel off and things seem to be in place. I grabbed the spring and tried to shake it around...bad news. At first it seems tight, but as soon as I leaned my elbow on the top of the rotor and applied some downward force, the strut/spring will rattle around while tugging at it. It goes left, right, backwards, forwards, and even up and down. I would guess about 1/8-1/4in of play going up and down. I can take a video if it would help explain it better.
Any new ideas before I take it in to a shop? I'd like to have a good idea of whats wrong so I don't get ripped.
Well, I tightened the two mount bolts as tight as I could go with a combo wrench, and I tightened the center nut a little more also, but it doesn't feel like it is getting any tighter...however, it doesn't have that tight-loose-tight feel of stripped threads.
FWIW, the tension of the center nuts on both left and right struts feels about the same.
Borrowed a neighbors jack, took the wheel off and things seem to be in place. I grabbed the spring and tried to shake it around...bad news. At first it seems tight, but as soon as I leaned my elbow on the top of the rotor and applied some downward force, the strut/spring will rattle around while tugging at it. It goes left, right, backwards, forwards, and even up and down. I would guess about 1/8-1/4in of play going up and down. I can take a video if it would help explain it better.
Any new ideas before I take it in to a shop? I'd like to have a good idea of whats wrong so I don't get ripped.
Last edited by mannetti21; 07-06-2009 at 03:33 PM.
07-06-2009, 06:34 PM
#28
07-06-2009, 09:11 PM
#31
I'm gonna make my way to the closest shop in the AM, not gonna risk driving an hour back to the guy who installed them.
07-07-2009, 06:37 AM
#32
Lined up the strut, drove it less than 3miles to the shop. Checked the top of the strut tower again, and sure enough it has shifted up against the tower again. I'm scared of what this is gonna cost me. Just keeping my fingers crossed that I don't have to replace a 2month old illumina
07-07-2009, 07:37 AM
#34
Lined up the strut, drove it less than 3miles to the shop. Checked the top of the strut tower again, and sure enough it has shifted up against the tower again. I'm scared of what this is gonna cost me. Just keeping my fingers crossed that I don't have to replace a 2month old illumina
strut mount and rubber stuff
worse case...
add - new strut
BTW you might want to pony up for a new strut boot too.
07-07-2009, 07:42 AM
#35
Found the problem...strut mount broke. The opening on the mount somehow scraped away enough to let the bump stop pop through. The bump stop was getting slced and now has a gash 1/4 of the way through it. Luckily the strut is fine. I'm hoping the mount was the problem and not the effect of another more serious problem
Will post pics when I get home.
Will post pics when I get home.
07-07-2009, 09:01 AM
#39
There is still some creaking/squeaking going on, which is how this whole thing started in the first place. So I'm worried that its going to happen again. They said everything else looks fine...what else could be causing this?
07-07-2009, 09:17 AM
#40
http://www.shiftice.com/suspension_noises.html